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I've just ordered and heard that CC pre-orders have already been delivered. After a 20 year hiatus since the last guide and 13 years since work began on it how does the new guide shape up? Would be good to hear feedback from anyone who owns/has seen a copy.
I'm hoping there is some stuff in there that gets me enthused about Swanage again as a Ruckle epic, the lack of good routes at my grade that I haven't done and general risk aversion brought on by parenthood has seen my Swanage enthusiasm sink to an all time low.
I'm hoping there is some stuff in there that gets me enthused about Swanage again as a Ruckle epic, the lack of good routes at my grade that I haven't done and general risk aversion brought on by parenthood has seen my Swanage enthusiasm sink to an all time low.
In reply to The Ivanator:
I'm eagerly looking forward to it myself but the CC web site is somewhat coy as to its actual status....
I'm eagerly looking forward to it myself but the CC web site is somewhat coy as to its actual status....
In reply to GrahamD:
It is 'in stock' at Cordee, so should be in shops over the next few days.
That said, I haven't received mine yet - hopefully it'll arrive today (otherwise maybe it is all a myth!).
It is 'in stock' at Cordee, so should be in shops over the next few days.
That said, I haven't received mine yet - hopefully it'll arrive today (otherwise maybe it is all a myth!).
In reply to Rob Greenwood - UKC:
I haven't had mine yet, and I am one of the authors (and the postman has visited today).
I haven't had mine yet, and I am one of the authors (and the postman has visited today).
Post edited at 09:42
In reply to The Ivanator:
Give it a few more days and half the climbs will probably have fallen down.
> ... If we can wait 20 years a few more days won't hurt.
Give it a few more days and half the climbs will probably have fallen down.
1
In reply to EddInaBox:
As long as Billy Pigg, Elysium and Behemoth stay put I'll be happy
> Give it a few more days and half the climbs will probably have fallen down.
As long as Billy Pigg, Elysium and Behemoth stay put I'll be happy
In reply to The Ivanator:
My copy has just arrived, first impressions are very good. I'll have a better look once the working day is over and post a few thoughts over the weekend.
Great effort to Steve, Scott and the rest of the guidebook team for putting this together. Swanage is one of the unsung gems of British rock, over the past few years I've made regular visits and am always amazed by both the quality (although sometimes not of the rock), the adventure and the absence of people actually climbing there - it's off so many people's radar...
Hopefully this guide will put it higher up people's list of priorities.
My copy has just arrived, first impressions are very good. I'll have a better look once the working day is over and post a few thoughts over the weekend.
Great effort to Steve, Scott and the rest of the guidebook team for putting this together. Swanage is one of the unsung gems of British rock, over the past few years I've made regular visits and am always amazed by both the quality (although sometimes not of the rock), the adventure and the absence of people actually climbing there - it's off so many people's radar...
Hopefully this guide will put it higher up people's list of priorities.
In reply to Rob Greenwood - UKC:
Thanks for the post - for some years the odds on the appearance of mermaids in the Ruckle was running at shorter odds than the manifestation of the CC guide!
Looking forward to getting mine and do appreciate that lots of quality work has been put in by a great team of local activists.
Thanks for the post - for some years the odds on the appearance of mermaids in the Ruckle was running at shorter odds than the manifestation of the CC guide!
Looking forward to getting mine and do appreciate that lots of quality work has been put in by a great team of local activists.
In reply to The Ivanator:
If you get the guide Ivan you've gotta get back on the ruckle
Should see you down there - I'll be the old bloke struggling up something at the top of my game
If you get the guide Ivan you've gotta get back on the ruckle
Should see you down there - I'll be the old bloke struggling up something at the top of my game
Post edited at 16:07
In reply to Ciderslider:
Yup, for sure ...start back gently with something familiar I reckon, it's been too long.
Yup, for sure ...start back gently with something familiar I reckon, it's been too long.
In reply to Rob Greenwood - UKC:
I love the ruckle, so many quality climbs and I have never seen anyone else there. Real top quality crag. Always people at Subluminal though, can't get my head around why anyone would choose Subluminal over anything else!
Anyway, I'm getting one on order!
I love the ruckle, so many quality climbs and I have never seen anyone else there. Real top quality crag. Always people at Subluminal though, can't get my head around why anyone would choose Subluminal over anything else!
Anyway, I'm getting one on order!
In reply to Cheese Monkey:
Straightforward access? Solid rock? Low Grades? Easy to escape from? Clean finishes?
Chris
> I love the ruckle, so many quality climbs and I have never seen anyone else there. Real top quality crag. Always people at Subluminal though, can't get my head around why anyone would choose Subluminal over anything else!
Straightforward access? Solid rock? Low Grades? Easy to escape from? Clean finishes?
Chris
In reply to Chris Craggs:
And a few sketchy routes if they are the top of your grade and only in the starting years of your apprenticeship.
That said, I think Swanage is ace. I may even have a sneaky look at the new guide and see if I need another on top of the rock fax one, which so far has occupied my days fine. Maybe I'll go esoteric swanage for the next bit of adventure.
And a few sketchy routes if they are the top of your grade and only in the starting years of your apprenticeship.
That said, I think Swanage is ace. I may even have a sneaky look at the new guide and see if I need another on top of the rock fax one, which so far has occupied my days fine. Maybe I'll go esoteric swanage for the next bit of adventure.
In reply to Chris Craggs:
I know Chris, what's there to like about that?!?!
Give me the Ruckle any day
> Straightforward access? Solid rock? Low Grades? Easy to escape from? Clean finishes?
I know Chris, what's there to like about that?!?!
Give me the Ruckle any day
In reply to Chris Craggs:
Exactly! Where's the fun in that!?! Ruckle- either multipitch or long lonely single pitch, committing, very intimidating, chance of drowning, exciting finishes, exciting routes, curious rock in places, easy access IMO too. Oh and generally great gear. Fantastic! You can keep Subluminal
Exactly! Where's the fun in that!?! Ruckle- either multipitch or long lonely single pitch, committing, very intimidating, chance of drowning, exciting finishes, exciting routes, curious rock in places, easy access IMO too. Oh and generally great gear. Fantastic! You can keep Subluminal
In reply to Kevster:
Yup, I'm looking forward to decent topos of St. Aldhelms, Slippery Ledge, Winspit Lower Tier, Seacombe and Tilly Whim ...always up for a dose of esoterica.
Yup, I'm looking forward to decent topos of St. Aldhelms, Slippery Ledge, Winspit Lower Tier, Seacombe and Tilly Whim ...always up for a dose of esoterica.
In reply to Ciderslider:
These star hunting glory boys know no shame. Just you wait I'll trick you into St. Aldhelms yet!
> As long as Billy Pigg, Elysium and Behemoth stay put I'll be happy
These star hunting glory boys know no shame. Just you wait I'll trick you into St. Aldhelms yet!
1
In reply to The Ivanator:
Ivan, although we've only met briefly I think like most people on here you realise what a daft old obsessive I am
Having said that I've had my eye on Elysium for some considerable time now and if (when) i get it I shall be straight off to the Square and Compass to work my way through the cider menu.
Having started out my climbing a couple of years ago at Subluminal I think it's brilliant for people wanting their first taste of Swanage (although the routes seem to pack it in right from the moment you step off the ground).
Although now I'm starting to get the hang of things I just love the adventure of the ruckle !!!! But I can understand why a lot of people steer well clear - you always have the fear and it seems like everything wants to murder you
I had a good year in 2014 - bagging a few routes that I never thought I 'd be good enough for - but I think if I manage a proper (Ruckle) E1 I'll finally feel worthy.
Ivan, although we've only met briefly I think like most people on here you realise what a daft old obsessive I am
Having said that I've had my eye on Elysium for some considerable time now and if (when) i get it I shall be straight off to the Square and Compass to work my way through the cider menu.
Having started out my climbing a couple of years ago at Subluminal I think it's brilliant for people wanting their first taste of Swanage (although the routes seem to pack it in right from the moment you step off the ground).
Although now I'm starting to get the hang of things I just love the adventure of the ruckle !!!! But I can understand why a lot of people steer well clear - you always have the fear and it seems like everything wants to murder you
I had a good year in 2014 - bagging a few routes that I never thought I 'd be good enough for - but I think if I manage a proper (Ruckle) E1 I'll finally feel worthy.
Post edited at 09:07
In reply to Chris Craggs:
Convenience culture.
> Straightforward access? Solid rock? Low Grades? Easy to escape from? Clean finishes?
> Chris
Convenience culture.
In reply to The Ivanator:
Get in there !!!!! I love you mr postman !!!!! I wanna go to swanage - nearly did a small sex wee when i saw the picture of Elysium
In the new pembroke style - very nice !!!!
Get in there !!!!! I love you mr postman !!!!! I wanna go to swanage - nearly did a small sex wee when i saw the picture of Elysium
In the new pembroke style - very nice !!!!
In reply to Ciderslider:
nearly did a small sex wee when i saw the picture of Elysium
Save that for the crux - but not if I'm belaying!
nearly did a small sex wee when i saw the picture of Elysium
Save that for the crux - but not if I'm belaying!
In reply to The Ivanator:
Mine just arrived (late post in deepest Hampshire) looks fantastic - I do feel the Swanage spark rekindling!
Mine just arrived (late post in deepest Hampshire) looks fantastic - I do feel the Swanage spark rekindling!
In reply to Pylon King Against Capit@lism:
Well you say that and it's partly true but, if people really wanted convenience, they could drive a little further to Portland, forget the west side and just stick to The Cuttings and nearby bits. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.
Like it or not, many folk are intimidated by Swanage (just as others are inspired by it). And Subluminal gives an introduction/less demanding playground. Again, there's nothing wrong with that.
Nevertheless some of the routes at Subluminal demand steadiness. And if you drop stuff (e.g. your rope) in the sea, going in for it can prove to be a really bad idea. The place requires respect.
Mick
> Convenience culture.
Well you say that and it's partly true but, if people really wanted convenience, they could drive a little further to Portland, forget the west side and just stick to The Cuttings and nearby bits. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.
Like it or not, many folk are intimidated by Swanage (just as others are inspired by it). And Subluminal gives an introduction/less demanding playground. Again, there's nothing wrong with that.
Nevertheless some of the routes at Subluminal demand steadiness. And if you drop stuff (e.g. your rope) in the sea, going in for it can prove to be a really bad idea. The place requires respect.
Mick
1
In reply to Ciderslider:
That's what guidebook writers want to hear!
Mick
> It's a really good guide, makes you wanna get straight down on the ruckle
That's what guidebook writers want to hear!
Mick
1
In reply to The Ivanator:
Just to note, I think the photo for topo of the Razor Blade Smile area was taken before the winter storms of last year.
Just to note, I think the photo for topo of the Razor Blade Smile area was taken before the winter storms of last year.
In reply to David Coley:
You're right David. Same for Tatra.
At some point an addendum will be put on the cc website for Razor Blade Smile and any other rockfall not noted in the new guide. Should all be covered in the log books on here too.
Thanks for the kind comments so far everyone
You're right David. Same for Tatra.
At some point an addendum will be put on the cc website for Razor Blade Smile and any other rockfall not noted in the new guide. Should all be covered in the log books on here too.
Thanks for the kind comments so far everyone
Post edited at 09:51
In reply to Pylon King Against Capit@lism:
Hmm... sometimes one wonders with you, PK (AC). But hey, not worth falling out over.
Anyway I'm more than happy to stick up for Subluminalites. May that fabled Swanage sun shine down on all and the new guidebook's gradings seem less harsh than of yore.
Mick
> I was being rather tongue in cheek.
Hmm... sometimes one wonders with you, PK (AC). But hey, not worth falling out over.
Anyway I'm more than happy to stick up for Subluminalites. May that fabled Swanage sun shine down on all and the new guidebook's gradings seem less harsh than of yore.
Mick
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In reply to Mick Ward:
The first time I ever climbed at Subluminal I was hit by 7 (I was counting!) enormous plumes of freezing cold spray while belaying my mate - initially on Freya, then when he started hesitating I basically ordered him to get his arse up Second Corner as fast as possible before hypothermia set in. (Did I mention it was February?) Convenience climbing was not quite how I would have described it at the time...
Rick
PS guess that's another guidebook I need to buy - haven't been to Swanage for ages
The first time I ever climbed at Subluminal I was hit by 7 (I was counting!) enormous plumes of freezing cold spray while belaying my mate - initially on Freya, then when he started hesitating I basically ordered him to get his arse up Second Corner as fast as possible before hypothermia set in. (Did I mention it was February?) Convenience climbing was not quite how I would have described it at the time...
Rick
PS guess that's another guidebook I need to buy - haven't been to Swanage for ages
1
In reply to The Ivanator:
Subluminal is certainly not easy when you first start out, and is a step up for a lot of climbers who are maybe newish or haven't been to Swanage before. I personally think that it's a great intro to Swanage, and guides you in fairly gently - also there are usually very helpful climbers there to help you out with route finding etc. Also a lot of the routes are no pushovers.
I think unless you are quite experienced 'The Ruckle" is a serious undertaking which could lead to all sorts of problems for climbers who are maybe new to the whole Swanage/sea cliff thing - there's also a major issue with working out exactly where the routes are, and where to abb in, which if you cock it up could lead to major problems. There's also the fact that once you go in you've got to get yourself out (one way or other).
It seems like only five minutes ago that I had my first taste of the ruckle, and was lucky enough to have had a far more experienced climber hold my hand.
Only now do I feel that I'm starting to feel like I should be down there, and certainly don't feel in any way dismissive when I look across at the crowds at Subluminal - I'm sure they are having just as much fun - in fact I know they are
Subluminal is certainly not easy when you first start out, and is a step up for a lot of climbers who are maybe newish or haven't been to Swanage before. I personally think that it's a great intro to Swanage, and guides you in fairly gently - also there are usually very helpful climbers there to help you out with route finding etc. Also a lot of the routes are no pushovers.
I think unless you are quite experienced 'The Ruckle" is a serious undertaking which could lead to all sorts of problems for climbers who are maybe new to the whole Swanage/sea cliff thing - there's also a major issue with working out exactly where the routes are, and where to abb in, which if you cock it up could lead to major problems. There's also the fact that once you go in you've got to get yourself out (one way or other).
It seems like only five minutes ago that I had my first taste of the ruckle, and was lucky enough to have had a far more experienced climber hold my hand.
Only now do I feel that I'm starting to feel like I should be down there, and certainly don't feel in any way dismissive when I look across at the crowds at Subluminal - I'm sure they are having just as much fun - in fact I know they are
In reply to Rick Sewards:
Ahh yeh climbing on sub in Feb - soaking wet and very choppy - I remember a couple of years ago my mate Ian being totally engulfed by a massive wave as he was crossing the bad step - thankfully he'd chosen to be belayed
Ahh yeh climbing on sub in Feb - soaking wet and very choppy - I remember a couple of years ago my mate Ian being totally engulfed by a massive wave as he was crossing the bad step - thankfully he'd chosen to be belayed
In reply to Mick Ward:
I seem to remember following you up a couple of very inconvenient routes at Sub Mick - very lacking in gear 8-)
I seem to remember following you up a couple of very inconvenient routes at Sub Mick - very lacking in gear 8-)
In reply to The Ivanator:
Can't believe though that Slip Road at Sub has now been demoted to HS - anywhere else VS - I know it's only a couple of moves - great guide though, and well done to all involved.
Can't believe though that Slip Road at Sub has now been demoted to HS - anywhere else VS - I know it's only a couple of moves - great guide though, and well done to all involved.
In reply to Ciderslider:
Airy Legs is another that has a pretty cheeky crux for the Hard Severe it gets in the new guide - as you say VS anywhere else. Some grade differences with the Rockfax are entirely understandable though, Coral Prison down from VS to HS is well justified.
I'm really looking forward to getting down to Swanage again, need to find a partner who shares my enthusiasm for esoterica though to tick a few hidden gems that weren't on my radar before. These are definitely on this year's VS ticklist now: Toby's Revenge (VS 4c), Punish None (not in Logbooks),Beyond Burma (VS 4b), Lasteen (not in Logbooks), Lost Souls (not in Logbooks), Orphic Power (not in Logbooks), High Tide and Green Grass (VS 5a), Form a Queue (VS 4c).
Airy Legs is another that has a pretty cheeky crux for the Hard Severe it gets in the new guide - as you say VS anywhere else. Some grade differences with the Rockfax are entirely understandable though, Coral Prison down from VS to HS is well justified.
I'm really looking forward to getting down to Swanage again, need to find a partner who shares my enthusiasm for esoterica though to tick a few hidden gems that weren't on my radar before. These are definitely on this year's VS ticklist now: Toby's Revenge (VS 4c), Punish None (not in Logbooks),Beyond Burma (VS 4b), Lasteen (not in Logbooks), Lost Souls (not in Logbooks), Orphic Power (not in Logbooks), High Tide and Green Grass (VS 5a), Form a Queue (VS 4c).
Post edited at 18:47
In reply to Ciderslider:
Could this summer be the first time people have ever queued for a Ruckle route?!
Could this summer be the first time people have ever queued for a Ruckle route?!
In reply to jezb1:
I very much doubt it Jez, unless you make a guest appearance - now there's something I'd queue for
I very much doubt it Jez, unless you make a guest appearance - now there's something I'd queue for
In reply to jezb1:
I've only climbed there a few times but can remember seeing (short) queues, but I guess in the 1970s there were less routes in the guidebook to choose from
I've only climbed there a few times but can remember seeing (short) queues, but I guess in the 1970s there were less routes in the guidebook to choose from
In reply to Ciderslider:
Well I do need to tick Elysium, it's the only route I never lead while I lived in Swanage that still gets me psyched.
Well I do need to tick Elysium, it's the only route I never lead while I lived in Swanage that still gets me psyched.
1
In reply to jezb1:
Yeh it does look like an awesome route - I've been saving it for some time now (as when I lead it I want to do it some form of style and not have an epic on it).
I feel that my climbing is more or less up to it now, so as soon as we get some decent weather I'll be down there - just need a good day and hopefully it will be mine - a Swanage E1would for me be the absolute biz
Yeh it does look like an awesome route - I've been saving it for some time now (as when I lead it I want to do it some form of style and not have an epic on it).
I feel that my climbing is more or less up to it now, so as soon as we get some decent weather I'll be down there - just need a good day and hopefully it will be mine - a Swanage E1would for me be the absolute biz
Post edited at 13:14
In reply to Ciderslider:
Sure you'll cruise it, followed a mate up it yeeeeaaaaars ago. It'd almost be like an onsight with my memory.
Sure you'll cruise it, followed a mate up it yeeeeaaaaars ago. It'd almost be like an onsight with my memory.
In reply to GrahamD:
It was a bit tongue in cheek... I lived in Swanage for about four years and climbed on the Ruckle every now and then. I think it's fair to say it's normally fairly quiet...
It was a bit tongue in cheek... I lived in Swanage for about four years and climbed on the Ruckle every now and then. I think it's fair to say it's normally fairly quiet...
In reply to Ciderslider:
I actually did fall off Slip Road ...had just done a couple of big routes in the Ruckle, decided to grab a Sub route on the way out only to find my arms were too knackered to make the crux pull at the first attempt - top nut ripped and I met my much lighter belayer about 2 feet from the deck! ...the ledge is always a worry at Sub (and lesson learned re. ground anchors).
The jams on the Airy Legs crux felt bomber to me, but it is a bonafide 4c section of climbing.
I've had to switch plans a couple of times on the Ruckle due to busy routes, but never seen it anything approaching busy.
Anyway the main delight of the new guide is the way it opens up some unexplored sections of Swanage, the CC guide is hardly a must for the Elysium's, Behemoths etc. but seems a must for Seacombe, Sutton, Slippery Ledge, Winspit Sea Walls, it looks like there is plenty of fun to be had in these venues (I've played on the Aquanaut Buttress DWS, visited Slippery Ledge and dipped in the lower wall at Winspit before, but now have plenty of new targets).
I actually did fall off Slip Road ...had just done a couple of big routes in the Ruckle, decided to grab a Sub route on the way out only to find my arms were too knackered to make the crux pull at the first attempt - top nut ripped and I met my much lighter belayer about 2 feet from the deck! ...the ledge is always a worry at Sub (and lesson learned re. ground anchors).
The jams on the Airy Legs crux felt bomber to me, but it is a bonafide 4c section of climbing.
I've had to switch plans a couple of times on the Ruckle due to busy routes, but never seen it anything approaching busy.
Anyway the main delight of the new guide is the way it opens up some unexplored sections of Swanage, the CC guide is hardly a must for the Elysium's, Behemoths etc. but seems a must for Seacombe, Sutton, Slippery Ledge, Winspit Sea Walls, it looks like there is plenty of fun to be had in these venues (I've played on the Aquanaut Buttress DWS, visited Slippery Ledge and dipped in the lower wall at Winspit before, but now have plenty of new targets).
In reply to The Ivanator:
Slip Road (VS 4c)
Total b@stard ! It was my first VS lead, I remember it fondly - spent about 20 mins under the small bulge fannying about went out a couple of times but didn't fully commit - then finally went and didn't have the beans - ripped gear and ended up just above the ledge with a cut leg and wounded pride. Went down a week later and shot up it so fast I can't remember how I did it. It's a great route but full on for HS, I personally think it's harder than Spreadeagle (VS 5a).
Slip Road (VS 4c)
Total b@stard ! It was my first VS lead, I remember it fondly - spent about 20 mins under the small bulge fannying about went out a couple of times but didn't fully commit - then finally went and didn't have the beans - ripped gear and ended up just above the ledge with a cut leg and wounded pride. Went down a week later and shot up it so fast I can't remember how I did it. It's a great route but full on for HS, I personally think it's harder than Spreadeagle (VS 5a).
1
In reply to The Ivanator:
My copy popped through the letterbox this morning and landed on the mat with a pleasantly satisfying thud. Had my nose in it all afternoon. It's a thing of beauty, it really is. And having Scott on the front cover just feels so right.
Roll on summer...
Mick
My copy popped through the letterbox this morning and landed on the mat with a pleasantly satisfying thud. Had my nose in it all afternoon. It's a thing of beauty, it really is. And having Scott on the front cover just feels so right.
Roll on summer...
Mick
1
> Roll on summer...
> Mick
I wonder if the CC will have sent me a copy by then?
In reply to scott titt:
If you haven't got one by the launch, I'll give you mine!
'Greater love hath no man
than he gives his sarnies to his mates...'
Mick
If you haven't got one by the launch, I'll give you mine!
'Greater love hath no man
than he gives his sarnies to his mates...'
Mick
1
In reply to Mick Ward:
The cover shot is one of the best on any British guide, such a photogenic route, it looks outrageous for HS, but is festooned with some of the greatest jugs known to mankind.
Never mind summer, roll on a dry weekend and I'm there. The Gallery at Seacombe and Winspit Sea Walls look fun. I might wait for a warmer days to do Lasteen at Hedbury (another amazing photo in the guide), but that looks an incredible line.
The cover shot is one of the best on any British guide, such a photogenic route, it looks outrageous for HS, but is festooned with some of the greatest jugs known to mankind.
Never mind summer, roll on a dry weekend and I'm there. The Gallery at Seacombe and Winspit Sea Walls look fun. I might wait for a warmer days to do Lasteen at Hedbury (another amazing photo in the guide), but that looks an incredible line.
In reply to The Ivanator:
>The cover shot is one of the best on any British guide
I wouldn't go that far; not a patch on Lleyn or Cloggy.
Still, fine effort Steve et al. Looked lovely in the pub tonight.
What's dangerous about the Gypsy belay, then? I didn't notice.
And why the hell have you downgraded my first 7a to 6c+?!
jcm
>The cover shot is one of the best on any British guide
I wouldn't go that far; not a patch on Lleyn or Cloggy.
Still, fine effort Steve et al. Looked lovely in the pub tonight.
What's dangerous about the Gypsy belay, then? I didn't notice.
And why the hell have you downgraded my first 7a to 6c+?!
jcm
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:
Peppercorn Rate? Well it is, isn't it?? Only joking! It was ages ago; I can't remember.
Have just discovered I've lost the guidebook somewhere in the house. That didn't take long...
Mick
> And why the hell have you downgraded my first 7a to 6c+?!
Peppercorn Rate? Well it is, isn't it?? Only joking! It was ages ago; I can't remember.
Have just discovered I've lost the guidebook somewhere in the house. That didn't take long...
Mick
In reply to The Ivanator:
You've just turned a sh1tty day into a great one. Thanks Ivan.
> The cover shot is one of the best on any British guide, such a photogenic route, it looks outrageous for HS, but is festooned with some of the greatest jugs known to mankind.
You've just turned a sh1tty day into a great one. Thanks Ivan.
In reply to Mick Ward:
not too big/heavy to carry around I hope !
> My copy popped through the letterbox this morning and landed on the mat with a pleasantly satisfying thud.
not too big/heavy to carry around I hope !
In reply to Jim Hamilton:
Well I'm not as strong as I used to be. But no, it's very neat and compact and relatively light (given the stupendous amount of information in it). An ideal size for taking down with you.
Memo to self: don't ab in again without the guidebook, do the wrong route entirely and get the full five-star Swanage top-out experience of shuddering horror on a little-travelled route. (I guess we've all been there at some time or another.)
Mick
Well I'm not as strong as I used to be. But no, it's very neat and compact and relatively light (given the stupendous amount of information in it). An ideal size for taking down with you.
Memo to self: don't ab in again without the guidebook, do the wrong route entirely and get the full five-star Swanage top-out experience of shuddering horror on a little-travelled route. (I guess we've all been there at some time or another.)
Mick
In reply to Max factor:
Hi Max, it's Wall Street on Cormorant - mega classic, along with Quality Street.
Mick
Hi Max, it's Wall Street on Cormorant - mega classic, along with Quality Street.
Mick
In reply to Mick Ward:
Thanks Mick, done quality street a few times, great route. Kind of suspected it might be the one next to it.
Thanks Mick, done quality street a few times, great route. Kind of suspected it might be the one next to it.
In reply to Mick Ward:
Abbing in without the guide book......at Swanage !!! Then climbing the wrong route ..... Mick, and I thought you were a pro makes me feel a whole lot better
Abbing in without the guide book......at Swanage !!! Then climbing the wrong route ..... Mick, and I thought you were a pro makes me feel a whole lot better
In reply to Ciderslider:
Well I think it was actually my partner who forgot it (but hey, I'll take the blame) and choose the route ("This must be it!") Once bigger than you'd like bits started coming down, I was pretty sure we weren't on a classic - but were in for a classic Swanage experience. And so it proved.
Went back with someone else who abbed in without a climbing rope! ("Err... haven't you forgotten something?") What the hell... it's all good fun.
Mick
Well I think it was actually my partner who forgot it (but hey, I'll take the blame) and choose the route ("This must be it!") Once bigger than you'd like bits started coming down, I was pretty sure we weren't on a classic - but were in for a classic Swanage experience. And so it proved.
Went back with someone else who abbed in without a climbing rope! ("Err... haven't you forgotten something?") What the hell... it's all good fun.
Mick
In reply to Mick Ward:
think we've all been there, to err is human hope to see you at some stage this year - got a couple of ruckle classics in my sights (gotta bag a proper (Ruckle ) E1 - also want to do more sport as well - so might see you at portland - still got one of your snap gates
think we've all been there, to err is human hope to see you at some stage this year - got a couple of ruckle classics in my sights (gotta bag a proper (Ruckle ) E1 - also want to do more sport as well - so might see you at portland - still got one of your snap gates
In reply to The Ivanator:
Finally got my copy today, really pleased with the result.
Some of your tick list VS's are real esoterica, Punish None will probably be a second ascent. Top marks if you can work out why it is called Punish None.
Finally got my copy today, really pleased with the result.
Some of your tick list VS's are real esoterica, Punish None will probably be a second ascent. Top marks if you can work out why it is called Punish None.
In reply to scott titt:
I presume it's a reference to the lady who was with you on the first ascent. In which case we can only wonder what Sophie did to deserve punishment.
> Some of your tick list VS's are real esoterica, Punish None will probably be a second ascent. Top marks if you can work out why it is called Punish None.
I presume it's a reference to the lady who was with you on the first ascent. In which case we can only wonder what Sophie did to deserve punishment.
In reply to Bob M:
Re. Punish None
I was assuming that it was an anagram as that is the name of the next climb to the right. Haven't worked out what yet though! Heinous uses some of the letters, but leaves a few that can't be strung into another word!
But yes, on reflection None is probably Nunn and refers to Sophie.
Re. Punish None
I was assuming that it was an anagram as that is the name of the next climb to the right. Haven't worked out what yet though! Heinous uses some of the letters, but leaves a few that can't be strung into another word!
But yes, on reflection None is probably Nunn and refers to Sophie.
In reply to Fatclimber:
Just texted you re. Sunday at Swanage, let's put those shiny new books to use!
Or if yours hasn't arrived I will see your Rockfax and raise you an all singing definitive guide!
Just texted you re. Sunday at Swanage, let's put those shiny new books to use!
Or if yours hasn't arrived I will see your Rockfax and raise you an all singing definitive guide!
Post edited at 16:22
In reply to The Ivanator:
I was in the Ruckle yesterday. Has there been a rockfall at about 10m to the right of Midge, or thereabout? There is a thread hanging in mid air, and the rock looks fresh and orange.
Note: we might have been a bit lost, and it was getting dark.
I was in the Ruckle yesterday. Has there been a rockfall at about 10m to the right of Midge, or thereabout? There is a thread hanging in mid air, and the rock looks fresh and orange.
Note: we might have been a bit lost, and it was getting dark.
In reply to The Ivanator:
Pegging in the Ruckle.
The new guide suggests that for the routes Victoria and Apache, pegs should be placed for the mid-height belays. For other routes in the area the mid-height belays use pegs, which I assume are now rusted and unsafe.
So, if I climb these routes, should I remove the pegs I place, or leave them for others to enjoy? Finally, if I'm to leave them, is there a type of peg I should use?
Before people jump in with, don't place pegs on sea cliffs, it is what the guide book suggests.
In addition, has anyone reading this climbed in this area. I know that the rock above the main fault line is poor as I've traversed some of it, but what is the main fault like now the Arch has gone?
Thanks for your help.
Pegging in the Ruckle.
The new guide suggests that for the routes Victoria and Apache, pegs should be placed for the mid-height belays. For other routes in the area the mid-height belays use pegs, which I assume are now rusted and unsafe.
So, if I climb these routes, should I remove the pegs I place, or leave them for others to enjoy? Finally, if I'm to leave them, is there a type of peg I should use?
Before people jump in with, don't place pegs on sea cliffs, it is what the guide book suggests.
In addition, has anyone reading this climbed in this area. I know that the rock above the main fault line is poor as I've traversed some of it, but what is the main fault like now the Arch has gone?
Thanks for your help.
In reply to David Coley:
For Victoria my best advice would be don't climb it! I tried it a few years ago with Sue Hazel. The first pitch is a steep corner (very Swanage in style, probably HVS 4c/5a elsewhere). The second pitch starts some way to the left along a ledge making climbing the route in one pitch difficult. The gear on the belay is dreadful. There is a perfect crack for a thick knifeblade/Kingpin style of peg. The second pitch is not the 4b suggested in the old guide, Sue tried it and backed off the loose boulders protected by poor runners. I had a look thinking my familiarity with loose Swanage rock would win through; it didn't. The loose boulders are above the belayer, and form a bulge that you have to pull over.
After a complex retreat (we wouldn't ab off the belays and had to lasso the free hanging ab rope some 10m away), I top roped Sue up the second pitch, she thought the "easy corner" at the top at least 5a.
If you do place pegs take them out again, by the time the route is climbed again they will be rust.
For the other routes it is likely that belays can be constructed without pegs, as has proved the case for the vast majority of Swanage. Apache has not been repeated since its FA in 1985, back when pegs where more routinely carried, and routes where split at the faultline more often (because we had shorter ropes and carried less gear)
The area is very tidal and hard to reach dry-shod from either side; the direct abseils are overhanging and hard to arrange to land on a boulder; this has always limited the popularity of the area once the classic Giraffe fell down.
For Victoria my best advice would be don't climb it! I tried it a few years ago with Sue Hazel. The first pitch is a steep corner (very Swanage in style, probably HVS 4c/5a elsewhere). The second pitch starts some way to the left along a ledge making climbing the route in one pitch difficult. The gear on the belay is dreadful. There is a perfect crack for a thick knifeblade/Kingpin style of peg. The second pitch is not the 4b suggested in the old guide, Sue tried it and backed off the loose boulders protected by poor runners. I had a look thinking my familiarity with loose Swanage rock would win through; it didn't. The loose boulders are above the belayer, and form a bulge that you have to pull over.
After a complex retreat (we wouldn't ab off the belays and had to lasso the free hanging ab rope some 10m away), I top roped Sue up the second pitch, she thought the "easy corner" at the top at least 5a.
If you do place pegs take them out again, by the time the route is climbed again they will be rust.
For the other routes it is likely that belays can be constructed without pegs, as has proved the case for the vast majority of Swanage. Apache has not been repeated since its FA in 1985, back when pegs where more routinely carried, and routes where split at the faultline more often (because we had shorter ropes and carried less gear)
The area is very tidal and hard to reach dry-shod from either side; the direct abseils are overhanging and hard to arrange to land on a boulder; this has always limited the popularity of the area once the classic Giraffe fell down.
In reply to scott titt:
Scott, thanks for that. Really helpful.
As you might have guessed, the reason I'm exploring the area is to find the best way to traverse it as part of my girdle traverse. So I was hoping to climb a few of the routes to find out.
I've tried high, and I guess hit the rubble you and Sue found and I backed off too. Because of the tide and waves this winter (often southernly) I've been unable to walk the base to see if the wall below the fault is protectable, but I have a feeling it won't be. This leaves the fault line. I was trying to avoid the fault, as it was the line of the previous girdle, it becomes repetitive, the climbing is poor - as is the rock.
Any advice would be most welcome. It would be a shame to have made it all the way from Cattle Troughs to be stopped now!
Scott, thanks for that. Really helpful.
As you might have guessed, the reason I'm exploring the area is to find the best way to traverse it as part of my girdle traverse. So I was hoping to climb a few of the routes to find out.
I've tried high, and I guess hit the rubble you and Sue found and I backed off too. Because of the tide and waves this winter (often southernly) I've been unable to walk the base to see if the wall below the fault is protectable, but I have a feeling it won't be. This leaves the fault line. I was trying to avoid the fault, as it was the line of the previous girdle, it becomes repetitive, the climbing is poor - as is the rock.
Any advice would be most welcome. It would be a shame to have made it all the way from Cattle Troughs to be stopped now!
In reply to Mick Ward:
There is a story (possibly apocryphal...) of some visiting Euro climbers who abbed in without any gear other than quickdraws. Not sure if they pulled their rope before discovering their mistake...
> Went back with someone else who abbed in without a climbing rope!
There is a story (possibly apocryphal...) of some visiting Euro climbers who abbed in without any gear other than quickdraws. Not sure if they pulled their rope before discovering their mistake...
In reply to The Ivanator:
I hate to pour a little amount of cold (salty!) water on this one. I have been a Boulder Ruckle fanatic since I started climbing there in 1969. This was a time when nobody went down there apart from Richard Crewe and his immediate following. I started by repeating most of his routes, did some new ones of my own in the seventies (Dandruff and Diagonal having fallen down several times in the interim) and have climbed there regularly ever since. I say this just to indicate that I am no Boulder Ruckle novice. It was thus a great frustration that the old guides were getting very long in the tooth and I eagerly awaited this long delayed production of a new guide. However, I confess to being mildly disappointed having acquired the new one yesterday.
I would have thought that with the time that this has taken that all of the routes would have been re-climbed and checked and grading and descriptive anomalies would have been corrected. But, from my perspective, certainly on a few routes that I have done recently, this does not seem to be so. Over the last year, recovering from two shoulder operations I have gone back and repeated quite a few of the easier routes, in the VS and HVS grades, on the Ruckle. These are routes that I have done lots over the years. To be specific: Firstly, Heidelberg Creature. Since being introduced to this one by its creator Tony Wilmott many years ago I have climbed it several times, including twice recently. Let’s compare it to two close-by HVS’s Lightning Wall and Finale Groove, both fine climbs, both infinitely easier than Heidelberg Creature. If Heidelberg Creature is VS then LW is hard severe and FG is MVS. (Have these climbs really been re-climbed and checked and compared?)
Two other VS’s that I have recently climbed are also a little anomalous to say the least. Black Sunshine has lost a hold I am told. The start is infinitely harder than anything on the aforementioned climbs and it is hard to rig effective protection at the bottom. HVS for this would certainly not be understated. Seventh Wave on The Far East area is certainly very much harder than FG or LW and I think it deserves at least the HVS grade. Lastly, a descriptive faut pas: I think that I might have done the second or third ascent of Sweet and Sour in 1969 and have done it a fair few times since, always enjoying the experience. I have always thought that the description was nonsense and I remember mentioning this to Richard Crewe soon after climbing it for the first time. But this description still persists word for word. It says: “Pitch 1 is enjoyable and well protected whereas pitch 2 is rather poor and sparsely protected”. In fact they are both very good pitches and you can lace the top one with runners every metre or so if you have a mind. (Have I been doing a different climb?) So has this really been re-climbed and checked? At least the grade is about spot on. Perhaps it should be a yardstick for the aforementioned climbs?
I will carry on climbing on this fantastic cliff as I reach my dotage and I will certainly use my new guide, which has a lot of good points, but I do not want to see repeats of some of the accidents that I have seen on this serious area over the years and wrong information will not help.
I hate to pour a little amount of cold (salty!) water on this one. I have been a Boulder Ruckle fanatic since I started climbing there in 1969. This was a time when nobody went down there apart from Richard Crewe and his immediate following. I started by repeating most of his routes, did some new ones of my own in the seventies (Dandruff and Diagonal having fallen down several times in the interim) and have climbed there regularly ever since. I say this just to indicate that I am no Boulder Ruckle novice. It was thus a great frustration that the old guides were getting very long in the tooth and I eagerly awaited this long delayed production of a new guide. However, I confess to being mildly disappointed having acquired the new one yesterday.
I would have thought that with the time that this has taken that all of the routes would have been re-climbed and checked and grading and descriptive anomalies would have been corrected. But, from my perspective, certainly on a few routes that I have done recently, this does not seem to be so. Over the last year, recovering from two shoulder operations I have gone back and repeated quite a few of the easier routes, in the VS and HVS grades, on the Ruckle. These are routes that I have done lots over the years. To be specific: Firstly, Heidelberg Creature. Since being introduced to this one by its creator Tony Wilmott many years ago I have climbed it several times, including twice recently. Let’s compare it to two close-by HVS’s Lightning Wall and Finale Groove, both fine climbs, both infinitely easier than Heidelberg Creature. If Heidelberg Creature is VS then LW is hard severe and FG is MVS. (Have these climbs really been re-climbed and checked and compared?)
Two other VS’s that I have recently climbed are also a little anomalous to say the least. Black Sunshine has lost a hold I am told. The start is infinitely harder than anything on the aforementioned climbs and it is hard to rig effective protection at the bottom. HVS for this would certainly not be understated. Seventh Wave on The Far East area is certainly very much harder than FG or LW and I think it deserves at least the HVS grade. Lastly, a descriptive faut pas: I think that I might have done the second or third ascent of Sweet and Sour in 1969 and have done it a fair few times since, always enjoying the experience. I have always thought that the description was nonsense and I remember mentioning this to Richard Crewe soon after climbing it for the first time. But this description still persists word for word. It says: “Pitch 1 is enjoyable and well protected whereas pitch 2 is rather poor and sparsely protected”. In fact they are both very good pitches and you can lace the top one with runners every metre or so if you have a mind. (Have I been doing a different climb?) So has this really been re-climbed and checked? At least the grade is about spot on. Perhaps it should be a yardstick for the aforementioned climbs?
I will carry on climbing on this fantastic cliff as I reach my dotage and I will certainly use my new guide, which has a lot of good points, but I do not want to see repeats of some of the accidents that I have seen on this serious area over the years and wrong information will not help.
In reply to Pete: If this is the moment to comment on grading then Acapulco (E4) is far from bold and the top pitch, though given 5c, is scarcely 5a.
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In reply to Mike Highbury:
Mike, I remember thinking that top-pitch was pretty wild, but then again I did link P1+2 (i.e. the whole route) into a single pitch.
I don't remember questioning the tech grade of P2, but I do recall questioning the structural integrity of the rock - that flake line was terrifying! All of your protection was in it, your hands/feet were laybacking it, then you'd tap the top of it and feel it booming all the way down to the bottom...
Maybe I was having a fragile day, such is the Swanage way
Mike, I remember thinking that top-pitch was pretty wild, but then again I did link P1+2 (i.e. the whole route) into a single pitch.
I don't remember questioning the tech grade of P2, but I do recall questioning the structural integrity of the rock - that flake line was terrifying! All of your protection was in it, your hands/feet were laybacking it, then you'd tap the top of it and feel it booming all the way down to the bottom...
Maybe I was having a fragile day, such is the Swanage way
In reply to Pete:
Heidelberg Creature. Since being introduced to this one by its creator Tony Wilmott many years ago I have climbed it several times, including twice recently. Let’s compare it to two close-by HVS’s Lightning Wall and Finale Groove, both fine climbs, both infinitely easier than Heidelberg Creature. If Heidelberg Creature is VS then LW is hard severe and FG is MVS. (Have these climbs really been re-climbed and checked and compared?)
I've not climbed extensively at Swanage, and not yet seen the new book, but I'm looking forward to getting my copy and putting it to use!
It is, of course, possible that one or two trade routes weren't recently reclimbed by the authors specifically to check grades for the new book; it seems likely, however, that those cases would be confined to routes with a well-established grade consensus. Looking at the UKC logbook entries for Heidelberg Creature, there appears to be a clear consensus that the route is the upper end of VS: there are many logged ascents, but only two or three suggestions that the route is HVS. Had lots of climbers thought the route HVS, I would have thought that the authors would make a special point of reclimbing it with that in mind.
Heidelberg Creature. Since being introduced to this one by its creator Tony Wilmott many years ago I have climbed it several times, including twice recently. Let’s compare it to two close-by HVS’s Lightning Wall and Finale Groove, both fine climbs, both infinitely easier than Heidelberg Creature. If Heidelberg Creature is VS then LW is hard severe and FG is MVS. (Have these climbs really been re-climbed and checked and compared?)
I've not climbed extensively at Swanage, and not yet seen the new book, but I'm looking forward to getting my copy and putting it to use!
It is, of course, possible that one or two trade routes weren't recently reclimbed by the authors specifically to check grades for the new book; it seems likely, however, that those cases would be confined to routes with a well-established grade consensus. Looking at the UKC logbook entries for Heidelberg Creature, there appears to be a clear consensus that the route is the upper end of VS: there are many logged ascents, but only two or three suggestions that the route is HVS. Had lots of climbers thought the route HVS, I would have thought that the authors would make a special point of reclimbing it with that in mind.
In reply to Mike Highbury: I would guess that a few more of these might come out of the woodwork. The reason that I honed in on the VS grade specifically is that this is the entry grade for climbing on The Ruckle. The people climbing these, some of them down there for the first time, need accurate information bearing in mind the seriousness of the place. It could be argued that it is less important for someone climbing E4 on this cliff as they have the experience to sort out any particular problems (not that that excuses ambiguity in any description).
In reply to bpmclimb:
Hmm. Point taken, but if it was just me (off form and ageing) I would not have commented on this. I have spoken to quite a few others who have agreed. Maybe they haven't voted on line. I haven't. A lot of people don't bother. Personally,I usually only ever come on here to find climbing partners, but as this one concerned my favourite cliff it ratttled my cage a bit. My point is that if you take on a new guide you just shouldn't slavishly copy down old information, but it should all be checked.
Hmm. Point taken, but if it was just me (off form and ageing) I would not have commented on this. I have spoken to quite a few others who have agreed. Maybe they haven't voted on line. I haven't. A lot of people don't bother. Personally,I usually only ever come on here to find climbing partners, but as this one concerned my favourite cliff it ratttled my cage a bit. My point is that if you take on a new guide you just shouldn't slavishly copy down old information, but it should all be checked.
In reply to Pete:
As a guidebook writer, there is no way I could possibly overrule 60 of 87 votes for VS on UKC logbooks, even if I was convinced that it was HVS myself. You have to go with the consensus.
Attributing that consensus to a 'different type of climber' doesn't add too your point. That argument is normally used by those who like to disregard the UKC logbook votes for perpetuating over-grading, not under-grading.
In this instance, could it possibly be that the CC guidebook team did check the route by climbing it/talking to others/ checking online databases, and came up with the correct grade which you just happen to disagree with?
Alan
> Hmm. Point taken, but if it was just me (off form and ageing) I would not have commented on this. I have spoken to quite a few others who have agreed. Maybe they haven't voted on line. I haven't. A lot of people don't bother. Personally,I usually only ever come on here to find climbing partners, but as this one concerned my favourite cliff it ratttled my cage a bit. My point is that if you take on a new guide you just shouldn't slavishly copy down old information, but it should all be checked.
As a guidebook writer, there is no way I could possibly overrule 60 of 87 votes for VS on UKC logbooks, even if I was convinced that it was HVS myself. You have to go with the consensus.
Attributing that consensus to a 'different type of climber' doesn't add too your point. That argument is normally used by those who like to disregard the UKC logbook votes for perpetuating over-grading, not under-grading.
In this instance, could it possibly be that the CC guidebook team did check the route by climbing it/talking to others/ checking online databases, and came up with the correct grade which you just happen to disagree with?
Alan
In reply to Alan James - Rockfax:
I think there is a bit of a placebo effect with the UKC voting. I've done routes where I thought they were a bit too hard for the grade, then looked at the ukc votes and reconsidered that maybe it was just me and voted it hard for the grade rather than a whole grade up. Sure I'm not the only one. I probably even voted Heidelberg Creature a hard VS on this basis but in retrospect it's probably the hardest VS I've done on limestone and harder than a lot of HVSs I've done in the SW. Then throw into the equation that it is in BR of all places. The exposure and intimidation is very full-on for VS. To throw a random comparison in the air, I'd say it was harder than Organ Grinder at Shorncliff, which gets HVS and similar sort of steep juggy route. I won't go so far as to make any comparisons with Pembroke
I think there is a bit of a placebo effect with the UKC voting. I've done routes where I thought they were a bit too hard for the grade, then looked at the ukc votes and reconsidered that maybe it was just me and voted it hard for the grade rather than a whole grade up. Sure I'm not the only one. I probably even voted Heidelberg Creature a hard VS on this basis but in retrospect it's probably the hardest VS I've done on limestone and harder than a lot of HVSs I've done in the SW. Then throw into the equation that it is in BR of all places. The exposure and intimidation is very full-on for VS. To throw a random comparison in the air, I'd say it was harder than Organ Grinder at Shorncliff, which gets HVS and similar sort of steep juggy route. I won't go so far as to make any comparisons with Pembroke
In reply to Pete:
I’ve climbed Seventh Wave a couple of times, including the first ascent, and to me it felt technically easier than Lightening Wall and less strenuous than Finale Groove. It shares its crux with Second Sight, whose first ascensionist gave it the same grade. Perhaps it was salty & damp when you did it?
As regards whether the top pitch of Acapulco is 5a or 5c, perhaps the difference of opinion is down to whether one lead or seconded it. Now in an ideal world this shouldn’t influence the technical grade, but when seconding a loose pitch most climbers would be pulling on things that they wouldn’t touch with a barge pole while leading.
Finally, I'm glad to hear you've got so much enjoyment from the Ruckle, Pete. (I certainly enjoyed your route Diagonal.) I'm in Swanage this weekend so, weather permitting, may be in the Ruckle after too long away. And I can't wait!
I’ve climbed Seventh Wave a couple of times, including the first ascent, and to me it felt technically easier than Lightening Wall and less strenuous than Finale Groove. It shares its crux with Second Sight, whose first ascensionist gave it the same grade. Perhaps it was salty & damp when you did it?
As regards whether the top pitch of Acapulco is 5a or 5c, perhaps the difference of opinion is down to whether one lead or seconded it. Now in an ideal world this shouldn’t influence the technical grade, but when seconding a loose pitch most climbers would be pulling on things that they wouldn’t touch with a barge pole while leading.
Finally, I'm glad to hear you've got so much enjoyment from the Ruckle, Pete. (I certainly enjoyed your route Diagonal.) I'm in Swanage this weekend so, weather permitting, may be in the Ruckle after too long away. And I can't wait!
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In reply to Nigel Coe:
Excuse me but I led it. That either makes me foolhardy or my assessment , um, foolhardy.
Having landed on my belayer when I pulled a block off the exit of Fish Supper, I won't stand in the way of the little upgrading there. Now what was I saying about foolhardy?
> As regards whether the top pitch of Acapulco is 5a or 5c, perhaps the difference of opinion is down to whether one lead or seconded it. Now in an ideal world this shouldn’t influence the technical grade, but when seconding a loose pitch most climbers would be pulling on things that they wouldn’t touch with a barge pole while leading.
Excuse me but I led it. That either makes me foolhardy or my assessment , um, foolhardy.
Having landed on my belayer when I pulled a block off the exit of Fish Supper, I won't stand in the way of the little upgrading there. Now what was I saying about foolhardy?
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In reply to The Ivanator:
Being only a novice climber and only fairly recently having started to do my Ruckle apprenticeship I think that the whole thing is sheer and utter madness, with a touch of mild peril thrown in for good measure.
Although having only climbed in a limited number of places I always find that the Ruckle is at best intimidating, and you are always accompanied by "the fear" when you climb there. That said, I think that there's nothing finer than topping out on the marbly finishes having just led some chossy horror show, and scared yourself shitless. Then there's always the square and compass to celebrate the fact that you've survived
I can't wait to do my first ruckle E1 (hopefully this year ) and then I feel I'd be able to hold my head high anywhere.
I think that everything there feels harder because of the whole experience - I don't think that's it's the right place for a new VS leader either.
As for HC I led it onsight (last year I think) and it's pretty full on for VS (and not that much easier than FG) although I would say harder by a mile than Aventura. Although if you compare it to say Jo it's easier.
Love it or loath it the ruckle can't be beaten - and I'll drink to that (at the S&C) - mines a pint of ale please with a pint of cider chaser
Being only a novice climber and only fairly recently having started to do my Ruckle apprenticeship I think that the whole thing is sheer and utter madness, with a touch of mild peril thrown in for good measure.
Although having only climbed in a limited number of places I always find that the Ruckle is at best intimidating, and you are always accompanied by "the fear" when you climb there. That said, I think that there's nothing finer than topping out on the marbly finishes having just led some chossy horror show, and scared yourself shitless. Then there's always the square and compass to celebrate the fact that you've survived
I can't wait to do my first ruckle E1 (hopefully this year ) and then I feel I'd be able to hold my head high anywhere.
I think that everything there feels harder because of the whole experience - I don't think that's it's the right place for a new VS leader either.
As for HC I led it onsight (last year I think) and it's pretty full on for VS (and not that much easier than FG) although I would say harder by a mile than Aventura. Although if you compare it to say Jo it's easier.
Love it or loath it the ruckle can't be beaten - and I'll drink to that (at the S&C) - mines a pint of ale please with a pint of cider chaser
In reply to Ciderslider:
Stuff around HVS/VS is a pertinent discussion regarding the Ruckle, as often these routes are the easiest escapes and many are challenging for their given grade, particularly if steep jug-hauling stamina fests are not your speciality. Obviously all grades are massively variable dependent on form, conditions and personal climbing preferences.
I found Heidelberg Creature harder than other Ruckle VS's like Silhouette Arete and Old Faithful also harder than Aventura, about the same as Tatra (pre-rockfall), Black Sunshine and Finale Groove (HC harder to the break then easier above), easier than Lightning Wall and Jo. I reckon in many areas HC would get HVS, it is certainly on the cusp of the grade, but within the general Swanage grading continuum VS does not seem out of place IMO.
Stuff around HVS/VS is a pertinent discussion regarding the Ruckle, as often these routes are the easiest escapes and many are challenging for their given grade, particularly if steep jug-hauling stamina fests are not your speciality. Obviously all grades are massively variable dependent on form, conditions and personal climbing preferences.
I found Heidelberg Creature harder than other Ruckle VS's like Silhouette Arete and Old Faithful also harder than Aventura, about the same as Tatra (pre-rockfall), Black Sunshine and Finale Groove (HC harder to the break then easier above), easier than Lightning Wall and Jo. I reckon in many areas HC would get HVS, it is certainly on the cusp of the grade, but within the general Swanage grading continuum VS does not seem out of place IMO.
In reply to Pete:
>o be specific: Firstly, Heidelberg Creature. Since being introduced to this one by its creator Tony Wilmott many years ago I have climbed it several times, including twice recently. Let’s compare it to two close-by HVS’s Lightning Wall and Finale Groove, both fine climbs, both infinitely easier than Heidelberg Creature. If Heidelberg Creature is VS then LW is hard severe and FG is MVS. (Have these climbs really been re-climbed and checked and compared?
This strikes me as total bollocks. HC seemed to me absolutely standard VS and the other two standard low-end HVS. Personal preference such as yours shouldn't be used as material for slagging a guidebook; it's daft.
jcm
>o be specific: Firstly, Heidelberg Creature. Since being introduced to this one by its creator Tony Wilmott many years ago I have climbed it several times, including twice recently. Let’s compare it to two close-by HVS’s Lightning Wall and Finale Groove, both fine climbs, both infinitely easier than Heidelberg Creature. If Heidelberg Creature is VS then LW is hard severe and FG is MVS. (Have these climbs really been re-climbed and checked and compared?
This strikes me as total bollocks. HC seemed to me absolutely standard VS and the other two standard low-end HVS. Personal preference such as yours shouldn't be used as material for slagging a guidebook; it's daft.
jcm
Post edited at 01:11
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