UKC

How could your regular climbing wall improve? Or any climbing wall for that matter?

What existing problems could be fixed? What new things could they introduce?

Mick
(not a climbing wall owner, just interested as they get more popular and pop up all over the place)

In reply to Michael Ryan:

And perhaps, what improvements have already been made?

Mine was a bit nippy last time I went. Just made the shower less crucial though, I suppose.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

More 'features' (bulges, aretes, cracks, overlaps...). 23 meters of plumb vertical wall is a good finger stamina workout, but it can get pretty boring unless the route setter is very good.

Oh, and don't make getting to the first/second clip the crux (rare, but frustrating).

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I've seen walls have books to comment on grading of individual route, but it might also be valuable to allow user to comment on the quality of the route setting (just 'good'/'bad' is enough) to provide feedback to the route setters. Good route setting should be acknowledged and encouraged.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Toilets that work consistently would be a start

In reply to Michael Ryan:

A rather niche request but I would enjoy some wooden wide boyz crack machines to train on. A lot of walls have room for multiple campus boards, system boards , woodies etc but never room to squeeze in a couple of 4x2's in a corner

I think the redpoint franchise would be an good model to follow. My local wa has just about every feature and facility I could hope for.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

be outdoors, made of rock , sunny all the time and good toilet facilities

Having recently moved from an area with a big wall to an area with a small wall I would like it to be bigger and all on one floor I'm worn out by the time I've climbed the stairs to the bouldering area!

In reply to Marek:

There's one of them at our local wall (Kelsey Kerridge, Cambridge), but it mostly seems to attract non-specific, non-constructive moaning ("boring, unimaginative, lazy..."), which the cynic in me suspects is from people who got spanked, couldn't deal with it, and decided to blame the setters.

What they could really do with improving is:
* better music (we're stuck with Kiss FM because the whole leisure centre only has one radio receiver and the gym bunnies apparently can't pump iron properly without a bit of David Guetta)
* to be about twice as big - they frequently get full to capacity on weeknights and have to stop letting people in
* to have some roped climbing - it's currently bouldering only
* to have somewhere to warm up - props for maximizing the amount of climbing in the space available, but it's annoying that you can't swing your arms around without hitting someone.
although given the space constraints, we're probably better off hoping for a new wall entirely than for the current one to improve on most of those fronts.

In reply to Timarzi:


Unexpectedly - a couple of (preferably long) lines with auto-belays and a sensible progression of grades (say 4-6a on one and 5+-6b+ on another) can make an excellent pre-bouldering warm-up. Perhaps an unintended 'improvement' but effective.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Videos of the setters climbing their own routes on youtube so people like me can figure out what the hell we were supposed to be doing after spending an hour getting pumped trying to see a viable move. As a low-grade climber, I find that I normally fail on routes due to inability to see the move rather than failing to execute it.

Lots of low grade bouldering (props to Reading Climbing Centre for supplying this). Bouldering is widely acknowledged as a good way to build strength and technique, but if the easiest routes are a couple of F5s then beginners don't have much to go at. Reading has 10-15 routes at VB plus another 10-15 at V0-V2 (and so on V1-V3 etc) which is great for getting in a good session.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Not just my local one, but I think this applies across the board, regular route changes. It is not uncommon to get routes of 5-6 months old (AW Stockport for example). I appreciate it may be a pain in the proverbial to reset them, but commitment to change routes after 3 months would be great. As the paying customer we wante routes to change regularly.

In reply to kipper12:


At Inverness Leisure centre they would be classed as new routes, some lines here are older than Agags's Groove! Last year I spent most of the year using The Boardroom at Queensferry for indoor training and it is a fantastic facility I could not think of anything to improve their wall.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Ventilate the roof space.
It can be a nice temperature at the bottom, but as you get higher it gets warmer until it feels like your in sauna when you clip the lower off.

In reply to Marek:

For bouldering, don't make a bunched sit-start the crux of most routes, as some walls have a habit of doing. It makes things disproportionately hard for those who are long-legged and heavy.

Neil

In reply to MikeSP:

They do an excellent job of this at Ratho.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

No music.

In reply to Neil Williams:

or provides an opportunity to improve your flexibility and get stronger

In reply to Rob Grant:
Yeah, but not when all problems are like that. Then it's just depressing. Not a good idea, for instance, to warm up on a problem that is physically hard.

Neil

In reply to Neil Williams:

Hey, us midgets have to be inventive to work around the reachy moves, surely it's only fair that tall people have to deal with compressed moves!
As a 5 foot tall route setter, I do sometimes end up setting routes that are compressed without realising it. I try to be mindful of it, but it sometimes amazes me how much limb some people end up with! (I also get moaned at for setting routes that are too reachy, so you can't win!)

In reply to Michael Ryan:
- Clean toilets

- bidets supplied for post session foot washing

- a few routes with chains and no draws for new climbers to learn how to climb, clip, and clean a route. (I'm guessing it's for safety reasons that this is not commonly found at indoor walls).

- a bar (not such a crazy idea - there's one at Der Kegel in Berlin)

In reply to Michael Ryan:
My local non-string wall is the Works, which frankly is pretty damn good in almost all aspects. However, it does get unbelievably cold, which means it can take up to half an hour to get fingers warmed up to avoid injury. Please guys, just a little warmer...

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I can't think of much I'd change about my local bouldering wall especially since they now seem to have a drinks licence.

If there was one thing it'd probably be to add a big cave like that at the back of the Depot in place of the walls by reception but then I know they use that space with their groups keeping the main room a bit more orderly.

jk

In reply to Marek:


For a while (they stopped and I don't know why) Alien Rock used to run 'route of the month'. each setter would nominate their favourite route and the punters would vote. It led, or at least coincided, with a period of some of the most imaginative route setting the place had seen in a while. It also felt like we were getting more new routes. the only downside was that the winner was invariably where the most votes were: eg in the lower grade range (6a+ or less) and not in the leading areas (perhaps exacerbated by the request that you had completed the route before you voted). Maybe this is why it stopped. It did seem after while that the setters began to set routes to win, meaning there were lots of new routes but precious few 6b+ or above. Either that or they didn't get enough votes. Democracy, eh?

In reply to gribble:

Get warmed up in the Mini Works.

And we did spend a few grand getting heaters in last year, we are trying but it's a big space to heat!

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Move nearer my house! Ok, maybe that's not reasonable.

For happy accidents I love that the auto belays are under the heater - cracking warm up spot!

Oh and I'd dump paninis for bacon butties but then I'm common...

In reply to mav:


That's why a simple 'good/bad' comment systems would be better than a 'which is the best route' system.

In reply to Graeme Alderson:


Just don't put the radiant heaters near the top of the routes! Ideally you want it warm at the bottom and cooler going up, not cold at the bottom and roasting at the lower off. Tricky I know! Floor level warm air vents might be better than ceiling mounted radiant heaters (for example).

In reply to girlymonkey:

I think a mix is good - including bouldering problems that have standing starts but gain the extra length by traversing a bit rather than going straight up.

Neil

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Few things i'd like to see, mainly at the bouldering walls, is:

1) Consistent grading across problem circuits.
Now, we all know grading is a bit of a dark art and 1 walls Font6B is another walls V5 (I know that's off, kind of my point) but its an often occurrence to find that the 32 problem circuit is often actually F5+ to F6C rather than F5+ to 6A+ as claimed, or they are mostly graded right but theres a random F7A+ in with the 5s.. Or sometimes one circuits all at the bottom of the grade range and the next circuit all at the top.. leaving out 2-3 grades inbetween making your session either soft or way to hard!

2) Paying some attention to whats already on the wall!
At one wall there some great routes and problems, BUT.. They can't be done, due to either a whacking great big volume blocking the body position that vital for a sequence or a big jug slapped on in front of a foot or hand hold making it impossible to use. Not a problem if its the odd route blocked but one wall currently out of a 9 problem circuit 6 climbs are blocked due to the setters not paying attention, leaving barely any climbs between F6A+ and F6C+.

In reply to Neil Williams:



One thing I've done for a mate at his home wall was set a couple of problems that have a standing start, and also a sit start with an extra move or two a couple of grades harder that link into the standing.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

A proper 'Moon' style board that never changes.

In reply to Marek:

If it's a big space to heat, but the top's already hot, why not look at a destratification fan - http://www.megafans.co.uk/33.html [If any wall owners click on this link and contact Megafans tell Stuart I want some commission ]

In reply to Michael Ryan:

A higher turnover of routes (combined with higher quality setting) would massively improve my local wall. As it stands, routes get left for months without being changed, and most of the staff who are 'proper climbers' have left - leaving 19 year-olds with virtually no climbing experience - and the routes end up being lines of randomly placed holds.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

First and foremost the quality of routesetting (and allied to that the selection of holds used). The wall I use most frequently tends to make all the hard moves long lock offs between big holds.

In reply to MikeSP:



Amersham is the worst place I've been for this - it funnels upwards anyway and is made worse because it's always humid due to the swimming pool next door.

RE my local wall - make it easier to get to (it's a pain from my house and annoyingly far to cycle) and improve the parking facilities.

Attitude of a couple of their staff needs a bit of work, too, although I haven't been there for a while!

In reply to Michael Ryan:
I'd like my local wall to stop selling those really cheap but enormous bacon butties that must be the only reason my climbing is so rubbish (actually I hope they don't).
Paul

What about prices? Are people happy with admission prices>

Or perhaps the floor walkers who police belaying methods?

I frequently visit two gyms.

Castle could do with more big lockers. Sometimes I have to go roaming over different levels of the gym to find one to fit my helmet and stuff. Besides that it awesome place.

Mile End is very crappy. But I come here frequently because my partner lives just next to it. They could stop being so paranoid about safety. It's common for a stuff member to stand next to you and watch how you belay. Feels a bit creepy. And they have a bad habit of using all of the routes for lessons. Giving back locker deposits would be nice as well. More routes could be great as well. For last few years they are only expanding bouldering and ignore climbing.

A good thing Castle added is 'Session'. If you don't have anyone to climb with there is a time when stuff gathers people without partners and pairs together. Really nice and useful if you want to climb, but all regular partners are busy.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I must be a happy climber cause I'm not bothered by the admission price I use a monthly direct debit which makes sense for climbing twice a week for most of the year.

I like having floorwalkers so that they can help make the wall safe for everyone. Also gives me someone to point out if I have a concern too...

Have I been told off by them yes sometimes, It hurts my pride but I think I will get over it.........

In reply to Michael Ryan:

As someone who often finds themselves judging other people's belaying, I find the 'belay police' have to let a surprising amount of dubious belaying slide...

Not that long ago I was going to ask one of the wall staff if a slippery hitch was enough to tie off my MegaJul (in the same way you might tie off a grigri), but then I noticed that they were just climbing, not working. Then I noticed the guy he was chatting to was taking his hands off the brake rope of his (locked-off) grigri while his friend was hanging on it, and decided I was probably OK...

More routes is always good - my wall sometimes has a burst of setting then just mostly gives up for 3 months (which I don't think is the fault of the wall staff on the ground).

In reply to MikeSP:


In fact, just ventilation generally! Badly needed at every wall I've visited bar one where it's only sometimes needed.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Campus board/ beastmaker, a small cafe and make the place Warmer

In reply to Michael Ryan: A cafe that actually stays open to a sensible time in the evenings!

In reply to Michael Ryan:

One last question. Out of all the walls you may have been to, which one is your favourite and why?

Converted bunker into a climbing wall in Schanzenpark (Hamburg, DE) is very nice. Outdoor, tall, and has a natural lightning! Heating as well

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Favourite Wall? TCA in Bristol. Essentially because of the consistency and frequency of the setting in there. It helps that the staff are nice too.

Generally I'd like to see more use of big volumes or more featured walls. Having a set of perfectly flat walls at slightly different angles is hardly a good representation of climbing outdoors. I also find it a bit weird when bouldering centres don't have a slab. This is pretty much the only criticism I'd level at TCA.

Taller bouldering walls generally would be nice, especially in places that tend towards standing starts. Regardless of how hard they are, three move bouldering problems are not that fun (this might just be me). This is also a setting thing.

One thing I find people appreciate is where the easier boulder circuits aren't just jug ladders. The downside is that creative setting in the easier grade bands does tend towards the creation of sandbags and excluding those who mainly climb those circuits isn't good. But overall, it should help prepare them for harder stuff / be more fun.

Some walls could do with focusing on the social aspect a bit (most big walls are pretty good at this). Well advertised social evenings / partner schemes, a way to get people talking about the routes (books, online etc), videos of the setters doing the hard problems can be used to start the last one, give people a reason to go to one place to look at the problems then they can discuss it after - all good for building / expanding a community round the centre.

Finally, a standard set of training equipment would be nice. I don't think everywhere needs to be as exhaustive as, say, the Works for example, bu it would be nice if everywhere had both beastmakers / rock rings / circuit wall / Moon Wall / campus rungs, for example. a Separate pull up bar can help stop things becoming too congested, assuming there's space.

Back in the day, the WICC centre used to loads of cheap, homemade food. When the Arch in London opened it had some cheap stuff as well. Most climbing cafes now gear their pricing / menus around high street cafes. Plus there's been a general increase in the price of food in the last few years. This is fine, but it'd be nice if there were a few cheap options that were geared towards the frugal amongst us

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Eden rock in Carlisle is my local when home and is probably my favorite, good rotation of routes, good variation in routes, good atmosphere and the coffee is cheap and better than any large brand coffee shop.

In reply to whenry:

Tell us how you really feel Henry!

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Glasgow Climbing Centre
1) Improve consistency of route grading.
2) Pay attention to grade spread on lead walls so as to provide a couple of routes at each grade between F5 & F8a (15 panels x 3 routes each would provide 2 of everything, there is no excuse for having holes in the spread).
3) Set fewer very cruxy routes (there is bouldering to be had elsewhere).
4) Turn the heating off BEFORE you can fry an egg from the ambient heat radiating from the holds on the second half of routes.

Ratho (EICA)
1) Rebuild to whole shebang in a more suitable building i.e. one less susceptible to the vagaries of the weather.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I'd like my walls to open later in the evening at the weekends. Some weeks this will be the only time that I can get to them (child care) and most are shut by 6.

In reply to Snot:
Not including you mate!

Edit: I'm hoping in vain that Jeremy might read this...

In reply to Michael Ryan:
obvs. ClimbingWorks. Route setting is second to none, wide range of circuits, regular re-setting, great competition board, regular events, high campus boards, beast makers, moon board, gymnast rings, pull up bars. Big place, close to Peak. If you can't work out a move, Ron will be past soon to deliver beta. Great vibe. How's that Graeme???

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:
You spelled his name wrong, apart from that bang on.
The music sometimes sucks, and while the new heaters are lovely they don't do much when they're not switched on (but I do realise they prolly cost a fortune to run). As bouldering walls go though, CW is pretty near perfect.

In reply to deepsoup:



My son comes along with me sometimes, and is very complimentary about some of the mixes being played, esp. deep house!?!. Me, I'm listening to Slayer and Pantera on earphones, so what do I know? Some of the drum and bass that gets played is ok, and the playlists Matt put together before he left for France were, kind of eclectic.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

fav bouldering wall is the Red Goat in York as it's close to where i live and is great atmosphere, routes change often , great people, good vibe, cafe is good apparantly (not a big user of that). I'd improve it by adding a 2nd set of slightly larger footholds (like the moon holds) to the traversing/circuit wall, so when i am shagged i can eek a little bit more out. ROKT has this in their room and it's v.good.

climbing probably H/Gate light, bright , warm enough, good routes changing regularly -( bit slow at the moment though) friendly, lots of nice people, good staff, good auto belays and cafe. Improve - dunno a bit bigger few more route changes maybe. Leeds has come on in the last few years though ....

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:

Deep shite.

Eclectic is ok. At least that way if you hate it you know it'll be different soon enough..

In reply to whenry:

We have comments cards on the desk. He reads those fo sho.

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:


They could provide some spare clothing to those hard-up male students who clearly can't afford shirts though. I'd be willing to donate a few items.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I only go to local walls now so my knowledge of other walls will be out of date:
Local Walls (Manchester):
• Awesome Walls – By far the best imo. Nice vibe, bouldering is a nice open area with good problems with decent variety of angles, only a couple of duff walls and could also do with a better roof. Setting is consistently ok, often good to excellent. Routes are good, not cramped but I only really use the concave, convex and steep to vertical walls.
• Rock Over – Could have been the Climbing Works of Manchester but is a continual disappointment. Apparently has undergone a makeover since I last went. Hopefully setting has improved and the general “half-arsed” and “unfinished” vibes have gone.
• MCC – Bouldering feels either cramped (downstairs) or too low (upstairs). Routes are great, I’d go here for routes if the whole package was better.
Best Ever
• Climbing Works – All you could ever want in a wall.
Best Use of What they were given:
• Alex Fry at Bear Rock (Warwick) – Used to be a fantastic centre, leading was a bit old school and the bouldering was all on top of itself (squash court) but the setting and general atmosphere was excellent.

In reply to Snot:
You learn something every day! I'd half suspected there was a chute leading from the box straight to the bin...

In reply to Michael Ryan:
Theres a lot of valid suggestions - hope you guys have spoken to the wall about your suggestions? Not just moaning here. I'm sure some of you will but some not, get onto them!

My main suggestion is that bouldering circuits are reset slightly more frequently. I usually find they are consistent in terms of grade with only an occasional problem that sticks out. I also agree that different walls certainly have different ideas on how hard a grade is. Consistency across different walls is a bit of a pipe dream.

My local wall do put up youtubes of some of the problems which is good, especially when youre trying to improve.

In reply to deepsoup:


No he didn't


Music depends who is on the desk. If I had my way then we would just have 50,000 Fall Fans Can't Be Wrong on continuous loop with Rez by Underworld thrown in.


But you can't please all of the people. Yesterday we had people complaining that is was cold whilst there was at least 10 people climbing in shorts. Warm up in the Mini Works as it is warmer over there.


Why thank you.

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:

You forgot to mention that we also source obscure bouldering videos on request

In reply to Graeme Alderson:


That's weird, my girlfriend didn't say anything about being in Sheffield...

In reply to Graeme Alderson:


Not after the edit, no.


Jesus. Well, there's an upside to the awful house music I hadn't thought of.


It really was a wee bit too cold yesterday afternoon imo, but there will always be a few freaks.
There were a couple of lads doing the SOBO thing for a bit too which made me smile, haven't seen anyone actually do that in ages.


Sometimes do, but find it a bit of a faff tbh. When it's really cold I'm more likely to go Mini for the whole session (hordes of kids permitting). When it's *really* really cold, it's time for the annual trip to the Matrix.


You're welcome - simple truth not flattery matey. These are all v minor niggles compared to the things that are bugging folk further up the thread. We are rather spoilt in Sheffield.

In reply to Graeme Alderson:


maybe Pat Ament should have got Mark E Smith to provide the soundtrack

In reply to paul_in_cumbria:


Clearly a lot. My only gripe about my local wall (The Climbing Hangar) is the music. How you are supposed to get psyched, bear down and train hard to yet more meaningless repetitive house/drum and bass/rap is beyond me. More metal, more power. Fact.

Andy F

More metal, more power. Fact.


Amen brother!

In reply to paul_in_cumbria: We should start a movement to improve music (I.e. have more metal played) in our local walls. It could be called something like 'Stop House In Training Environments'. Or S.H.I.T.E. for short...

Andy F

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Good wall =

Well set routes (interesting moves)
Regularly changed (on a rotating basis so always something fresh)
Without making the hardest move always to get to second clip (gripper clipper)
Consistent grading (hard/easy doesn't matter, but reasonable consistency good)
spread of grades - not all hero routes; not all beginner
Sensibly priced, with multi-session options (that don't time expire)
Good temperature control (erring on cool if anything)
Wide opening hours (to 9pm Sundays and both Sat and Sun mornings)
Not too loud/shit music

In reply to andy farnell:

Sorry boys. As my Scottish friends might say "get tee". Death metal ain't ever going to have a place at the Works. Good heavy/hard rock eg Cream, Zepp, Free etc will get a look in if I am on the desk (not that I ever am) but death metal, no chance.

Ask for Graeme's special playlist, it currently features lots of stuff with 'Fire' in the title. Who could possibly question that my co-owners are sensitive caring people. But it is actually a good playlist (and don't worry about me, I am over my near death experience).

In reply to Graeme Alderson:

Death? I never mentioned Death metal. A healthy dose of thrash will do very nicely. The occasional bit of classic rock or grunge wouldn't go amiss either...

Andy F

In reply to andy farnell:


Could have been that I was listening to Slayer the other day while I was at the Works, however yesterday afternoon I was listening to Dr Dre and Snoop Dogg on my earphones. Not suggesting we go all West Coast G style at the Works though. As Big Ron wryly observed a while back that the "effing and jeffing" in Gangster Rap "might not be suitable for the kids in the Mini-Works"

In reply to andy farnell:

The sound of impact drivers is currently drowning out Mr Page on his 12 string

Even if it were possible to economically and satisfactorily heat a building like the commercial unit that most climbing walls are in, it would still only keep a percentage of the clientele happy. So for me, that's not an issue.
The Works is just about perfect, the music is to my taste, so that's not a problem! Some kind of hot food would be nice, but realistically that would mean some kind of preparation area, which might mean less bouldering space, so I can live without it.
I like it so much there I'm hoping to buy a flat next door!

In reply to Removed Usergilesf:


In any environment the best that you could possibly do would be to have 50% of the customers too cold & 50% too hot ie 100% moaning.

Walls are very different though. Any, remotely affordable, attempt at heating requires the blocking of all ventilation and a lot of sweaty bodies in a small space inevitably means high humidity and lousy conditions.

The heating moaners are therefore demanding that the rest of us pay extra in order to climb in poxy conditions to save them the trouble of putting a sweat shirt on.

In reply to Graeme Alderson:

Did you mean 'shorts' or shirts?

In reply to johncook:

Shorts

In reply to johncook:

Perfect! A simple rule that would improve every wall I've ever visited.

Ventilation will remain open & heating off until 100% of the customers are wearing both long trousers and shirts!

In reply to Michael Ryan:

1) Good setting
2) Reliable grading, with V-grades or FB grades for bouldering, none of that colour nonsense

That's all I ask for. But apparently I'm asking for too much

In reply to jwi:

Longer routes.

20metres please

In reply to jwi:

>, none of that colour nonsense

Does that mean you don't like circuits, ironic then that you want Font grades

In reply to Graeme Alderson:

No, I'm complaining about the fact that lots of gyms all over the world don't grade their boulder problems on any of the well established standard grading schemes, and instead grade them on some bull shit colour/level scheme. Usually with too wide bands to make the grades useful for feedback on training.

Where I train now the “advanced” level is marked with red tape and correspond to about Fb5c to Fb6c and the “expert” level is marked with white tape and corresponds to Fb6b - Fb8a-ish. Difficulty spans that wide is useless information. I can guess that much myself from just looking at the holds. Without my glasses. While drunk.

In reply to jwi:

Nice ending to your mini rant

In reply to Michael Ryan:

how about pool for DWS, cracks both continuous and short sections at roofs and finally use of natural coloured holds in sections without many alternatives

In reply to Graeme Alderson:

Please don't make things too hot. Walls should be coldish to get the best out of hold friction and climbers should do some aerobic exercise or wear more clothes to get warmed up or swallow their pride and go to the mini works. Am I the only one who would come to a special GA playlist day ? (even the minimalist Fall one).... when I focus on moves I find music goes I to the background of my mind anyhow. So many great walls these days.

In reply to jwi:

That argument doesnt make sense. It seems to be against poorly set circuits not colours; in the same way as some people argue about bad grading. I think circuits are brilliant as they cut grade obsession and encourage an exploratory approach... what bouldering should be about. My main gripe with walls is those that that use V grades too often mean VB when they write V0 and you need to get to mid grades before the grades match what they should be (when folk climbing these go outdoors they might hurt themselves on real V0)

In reply to Michael Ryan:

A 'natural' section with small features where you can make your own problems. Now almost absent fro the current cloned climbing walls

A decent circuit wall - not too steep or too sideways - again hard to find

In reply to Graeme Alderson:

On the subject of bouldering walls. My colour vision isn’t perfect and I find coloured circuits a real pain because sods law says that the grade I want to be doing is in a colour I can’t see. I prefer individually graded problems with the colours spread around so there is almost always stuff I want to do in a colour I can find. The problem is worse when the holds are dirty, the lighting is poor and under overhangs where it is often very gloomy. My vote is:
- Reset regularly with interesting problems (no more than 6 weeks between bouldering re-sets)
- Lighting – bright and even and try to find a way to light underneath overhangs (without creating shadows)
- Vary the colours used at each grade (i.e. avoid single colour circuits) and clean the holds well between sets
- Temperature – cool is better than warm
- Lots of variety in the music

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I would like our wall to open beyond 7pm on weekends. Evenings are the only times I get to climb, and being restricted to weekdays, after a hard day at work is a bit of a ball ache. By the Same token, I'd actually like them to open early, eve if only a couple of times a week. A climb and coffee before work would be great!

Training areas could do with improving, with a greater variety of equipment available - rings, trx etc...

I would also love to see a permanent problem board in place, ala moonboard, for long term projecting and self assessment of development. With constantly changing problems, and the vagaries of grading, having a constant would really help assess improvements through training etc...

Btw, my local wall is big rock in mk, who I think on the whole do a very good job whilst trying to cater for a large user base (including kids parties and crazy climb facilities) but because of this, it does have to make compromises at the expense of things that serious climbers would like IMO

Get rid of all circuits that are unimaginative 'up-along-down-back' rectangular loops. Following coloured holds (rather than numbered tags) is the culprit.

In reply to Boulderdaz:
Though serious climbers at Big Rock probably need to remember the extent to which their costs (particularly the membership, which is very good value IMO, breaking even at slightly more than one visit a week) are subsidised by other users.

I would like them to open later on Sat/Sun - but as they're very commercially driven I think they would if they felt it would be profitable to do so.

I find they are very open to suggestions, though, so why not tell them?

As for the system board, it was removed (now has regular problems set on it) because hardly anyone ever used it, AIUI!

Neil

In reply to Boulderdaz:
I agree. Later opening at weekends would really help me out as well. I'm based in Bristol and have a choice of four walls, none of which open beyond 7pm on a Saturday or Sunday. 3/4 close at 6pm.

In reply to Michael Ryan:
Brookes Rock Solid (Oxford) opening hours:

Mon - Fri: 7.00am -11.00pm
Sat - Sun: 9.00am -10.00pm

can anywhere beat that?

& they will soon start opening at 06:30 on weekdays

In reply to bonelessivar:

just got back to York from a family visit to london and hoped to grab an hour at the red goat - but it closes at 8 on sunday

In reply to Neil Williams:

I did, as part of their recent survey asking for feedback. The results haven't been published, which I would like to see. The direct debit did go up again though.

They do a good job, granted, which I did say, but the thread did ask for how your wall could be better, so I did.

Late opening at weekends would be the best thing, over any new equipment, or system boards etc. that I think most climbing walls could do. It would mean I'd be there right now, rather than writing about it

In reply to Boulderdaz:

I wonder how many would pay extra for late opening at weekend evenings? Its not so hard to keep the wall open but like you, wall workers would normally rather be doing something else at that time.

In reply to Offwidth:


I certainly would. Even over & above a regular membership.

In reply to Offwidth:

My friend and I were at a BMC meeting the other day which ran past the wall's normal weekend closing item of 8pm. As we left he asked why the wall was so empty and I pointed out that it was shut, which he said was outrageous and he thought they shut at the normal 10pm time. I pointed out that despite not knowing the earlier closing time he had never noticed because he had never been climbing at that time, and that perhaps there was a reason for this and thus why the wall shut? (which he accepted) :P

In reply to Graeme Alderson:


Can we have some new problems in there then please? :p We love to warm up in there on a weeknight as you suggest, as it's warmer and quieter... but the reds, pinkles, blacks and yellows seem to have been there for ages. We appreciate that the mini works will be on a slower setting cycle than the main building, but feel it could still be kept a bit fresher.

Could we also have some decent hand driers in the bogs both buildings please?!

On the other side, second to none problem setting, grading normally spot on, problems are always interesting, circuits are a great work out, music is (normally) spot on, staff are great and it's generally an excellent venue! Thanks!

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I think I've got a pretty good selection of centres around here, all with problems set every week (or every other week) and most with winter competition series running (ideal for a novice like me to try and gauge my progression). One centre has a canny training area, another (the main place I go to) has a traversing area and a circuit board and most places have £5 days, decent coffee and decent gear stores (which you need around here with only one real climbing shop apart from Go Outdoors).

While I'd like to see a training area at the main centre I frequent, earlier opening times maybe a couple of days a week would benefit me. Everywhere local opens at 10-12 which is ideal for the majority of people but is a bit of a pain for those working lates or nights. I know the guys working the centres need time to do the setting, cleaning etc but it would be handy to have an 8am opening occasionally and centres might even catch some of the "drop the bairns at school then doss" type.

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Better bouldering.
Earlier kids clubs, to free the wall up for grown ups later on

In reply to Michael Ryan:

Hi Mick

I was reading the answers up here the other day and I figured that quite a lot were focussed on the cold-weather experience of going to a cold indoor wall. But there are other times of the year that we go to them, and while it'd be great to be outside throughout spring, summer and autumn, sometimes we have to go indoors, and then there are particular seasonal issues.

So, for example, when it's warm, lots of lads show up and take their tops off. It's problematic: it creates a particularly gendered (macho) atmosphere, and it definitely makes me and my friends enjoy our time there less. The wall could be improved if it had a policy: men and women should wear tops at all times. (There are plenty of well designed and affordable pieces of clothing which allow people to climb, to keep cool, and not to be topless. Walls can install cooling fans as well).

Here's another change: one wall I've been going to in the last 3 months has started putting notices around encouraging people to use less chalk – partly, I think, there's an issue about how much the centre needs to vacuum it all up all the time. But yeah, you feel like you're breathing it in all the time there, and the holds were getting caked up with it. As I imagine it, since the market for indoor climbing has grown slightly, and retailers are selling beginners kits (shoes, chalkbag, brush), lots of new climbers are arriving with a zeal to chalk up as often as possible. It's a shame to have to put signs everywhere, but yeah, I know several walls that could be improved if there was less chalk around.

Many climbing walls are in slightly less salubrious districts, where property is both cheaper and taller. I hate leaving my bike locked up to a drainpipe outside. It'd be good if these centres made a commitment to proper, safe, well-lit (or indoor) cycle parking.

Boringly practical thoughts. Be neat if someone thinking about setting up a climbing centre took them on board though.

In reply to joeruckus:

I bit like no shoes, no shirt, no service?

I thought most walls were chalk ball only these days: some chalk is worse than others too.

BTW, I'm sure many wall owners will be watching this thread as it is their customers who are expresing their opinions.

M

In reply to Michael Ryan:
some ideas... (big rock, milton keynes)

- switch the boulder problems to being graded individually with a tag at the start showing the grade (as they do for the lead routes, and as is done for boulder problems at the beacon, big rock's sister centre) rather than having a sign that says "all the green problems are v3 to v5" (which in practise means v2 to v6). i imagine the setters would prefer this as they could set whatever with whatever holds and everyone else'd prefer it because it'd mean more accurate grading and a wider variety of holds for each grade at any one time. it's being done a bit with the pink and white problems at the moment. that's the way to go for all of the problems i reckon

- set some more hard lead routes. the hardest right now might be 7b and there is not a lot in the few grades below that

- get rid of those stalactites in the bouldering room

- more slabs and aretes (wishful thinking) / make better use of the slabs and aretes that are there already. there are only really three aretes that don't overhang in the centre, and one of them is vertical. i noticed the other day that both of the routes that go up one of the two not-vertical aretes are marked "no arete" - what a waste of space... these features should be milked for all they are worth! they should also have harder stuff set on them. there are hardly any non-overhanging difficult routes in the centre - and quite a few of the ones that have been set have been great/memorable

it's a good place to climb anyway and i have no alternative so *shrug* it'd be nice though

edit: oh yeah and turn down the music please. i like being able to talk to my belayer

In reply to teltrabm:

Which ,in turn, can mean anything between 3A and 7A+! A good idea that would hold at any wall!

In reply to joeruckus:


How about a requirement to clean the chalk off after you've finished a boulder problem? At least it might start people thinking.

In reply to Removed UserArdverikie2:



The Arch in London is self-chalking. You don't need to take chalk, it gets deposited on your hands as you go

In reply to Michael Ryan:

I am not watching this thread Mick

In reply to Michael Ryan:

MCC is the wall i probably get to most, i really rate the place highly, the routes are excellent and even though the bouldering area isn't as big as others there are usually plenty of problems to get on. I find it a really cool building to go and climb in. The new cafe is decent. They have made plenty of changes to the angles in the bouldering rooms in the last couple of years. The things i'd like to see improve are the training facilities, maybe a pull up bar and some rock rings. The competitions can be a big disappointment!

Awesome walls stockport, is somewhere else i go, mainly to boulder. Haven't got many criticisms, Again as someone who is looking to train, maybe a bar and some rock rings! Other than that the big one here would have to be how dirty the matting is, i guess carpeting it out is the fix, but i'd imagine substantial cost is involved.