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So we spend most of our time on short walls doing many routes so i have my normal indoor climbing shoes that become painful after a couple of hours.
I want to get into more trad routes this year my profile shows ive not done many. I also am keen on some long mutipitch routes but have questions.
What do i wear on my feet? do people have normal (comfy) rockboots on all day, or do you manage in walking boots or simple trail shoes like merrells or these approach shoe things like the guides.
I assume you carry a small pack for food clothing etc, I assume climbing Vdiff in walking boots and rucksack different to a normal VDiff.
Im hoping to find someone who is doing an assessment and after some practice to take us out but im just keen on what I would wear, or need to buy. Looking at photos and videos of people im still unable to see whats going on.
Hope that makes sense.
Steve
I want to get into more trad routes this year my profile shows ive not done many. I also am keen on some long mutipitch routes but have questions.
What do i wear on my feet? do people have normal (comfy) rockboots on all day, or do you manage in walking boots or simple trail shoes like merrells or these approach shoe things like the guides.
I assume you carry a small pack for food clothing etc, I assume climbing Vdiff in walking boots and rucksack different to a normal VDiff.
Im hoping to find someone who is doing an assessment and after some practice to take us out but im just keen on what I would wear, or need to buy. Looking at photos and videos of people im still unable to see whats going on.
Hope that makes sense.
Steve
In reply to sbattams:
I have a pair of climbing shoes I can wear all day. Having them uncomfortably tight doesn't really effect how hard you can climb unless you are doing it at a high level.
For easy mountain routes then stiff walking boots are also OK, but you need quite different footwork to make the best of them.
I have a pair of climbing shoes I can wear all day. Having them uncomfortably tight doesn't really effect how hard you can climb unless you are doing it at a high level.
For easy mountain routes then stiff walking boots are also OK, but you need quite different footwork to make the best of them.
In reply to davidbeynon:
So really I need to get some super comfy rock boots, what happens if it gets wet or you come to a small pitch or choss to get past as rock boots slide all over the place I assume you just get on and be careful rather than changing your tyres for the conditions.
So really I need to get some super comfy rock boots, what happens if it gets wet or you come to a small pitch or choss to get past as rock boots slide all over the place I assume you just get on and be careful rather than changing your tyres for the conditions.
In reply to sbattams:
Usually that's what you do, but it depends on how bad it is. If you expect a lot of green stuff then you may be better off climbing it in big boots in the first place.
I quite often have trainers clipped to my harness for the descent.
Usually that's what you do, but it depends on how bad it is. If you expect a lot of green stuff then you may be better off climbing it in big boots in the first place.
I quite often have trainers clipped to my harness for the descent.
Post edited at 11:34
In reply to sbattams:
My rock boots are comfy to wear all day. They're wearing out; I'm going to get my next pair fitted with a pair of snug socks to keep my feet warm!
You're right; climbing in walking boots makes a big difference. I try to have a few grades in hand before trying it. If you climb in rock shoes, you need to take something else up with you for the walk off (this is obvious if it's a mountain, but still applies if it's a relatively small route like some in the Llanberis Pass - you don't want to be on grassy terrain in rock shoes).
Plus pack with water, food, a warm layer for belays/unexpected delays. And always take a headtorch.
My rock boots are comfy to wear all day. They're wearing out; I'm going to get my next pair fitted with a pair of snug socks to keep my feet warm!
You're right; climbing in walking boots makes a big difference. I try to have a few grades in hand before trying it. If you climb in rock shoes, you need to take something else up with you for the walk off (this is obvious if it's a mountain, but still applies if it's a relatively small route like some in the Llanberis Pass - you don't want to be on grassy terrain in rock shoes).
Plus pack with water, food, a warm layer for belays/unexpected delays. And always take a headtorch.
1
In reply to davidbeynon:
What example have you got of big boots?
My current walking boots are (NOrth Face Verbera Hiker II GTX) http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/the-north-face-mens-verbera-hiker-ii-gtx-boo...
fairly stiff in the sense they dont flop all over the place but not mega stiff like B3's etc.
I will need to get some rock boots i can wear with socks as well else ill end up looking a bit extreme hobbling round on a Vdiff with cold ankles.
What example have you got of big boots?
My current walking boots are (NOrth Face Verbera Hiker II GTX) http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/the-north-face-mens-verbera-hiker-ii-gtx-boo...
fairly stiff in the sense they dont flop all over the place but not mega stiff like B3's etc.
I will need to get some rock boots i can wear with socks as well else ill end up looking a bit extreme hobbling round on a Vdiff with cold ankles.
In reply to sbattams:
I have climbed all day in rock shoes and in boots, depends on the conditions and the grade of the route. My current rock shoes are not as comfy as my last pair, so if the route wasn't too hard I might choose boots.
I notice you have Avalance/Redwall/longlands on your wish list. I did that in boots, partly because there is a longish walk in and out as well as the climb itself and it was easier than carrying boots. As you say on a route like that a small rucksac, perhaps one between the two of you is usual on a full day. Carried by the second on each pitch usually.
For a smaller route of 2 or 3 pitches at crag, with a simple walk off I would tend to bear the pain, where the rock shoes and any pack with lunch etc. would be left at the bottom.
I have seen people take off their rock boots when belaying to give their feet a rest. Just be careful you don't drop one, or subsequent pitches become more 'interesting'.
Where are you based. I am always after partners for lower grade climbs
Ben
I have climbed all day in rock shoes and in boots, depends on the conditions and the grade of the route. My current rock shoes are not as comfy as my last pair, so if the route wasn't too hard I might choose boots.
I notice you have Avalance/Redwall/longlands on your wish list. I did that in boots, partly because there is a longish walk in and out as well as the climb itself and it was easier than carrying boots. As you say on a route like that a small rucksac, perhaps one between the two of you is usual on a full day. Carried by the second on each pitch usually.
For a smaller route of 2 or 3 pitches at crag, with a simple walk off I would tend to bear the pain, where the rock shoes and any pack with lunch etc. would be left at the bottom.
I have seen people take off their rock boots when belaying to give their feet a rest. Just be careful you don't drop one, or subsequent pitches become more 'interesting'.
Where are you based. I am always after partners for lower grade climbs
Ben
In reply to sbattams:
Rather depends what sort of multipitch route.
If on a valley crag with stable weather you'd just use fairly comfy rock shoes. You might stuff some food in a pocket, take an extra layer and clip trainers to harness for descent. Or use a v light sac to carry a few things but you're best off climbing without added burden if possible.
On a mountain route and/or in variable weather you might want or even gave to climb with sacs (particularly if it's too much faff to go back for them) but go as lightweight as possible. Plan your day ahead. Avoid climbing in big boots if possible; I've never had to in the UK.
Rather depends what sort of multipitch route.
If on a valley crag with stable weather you'd just use fairly comfy rock shoes. You might stuff some food in a pocket, take an extra layer and clip trainers to harness for descent. Or use a v light sac to carry a few things but you're best off climbing without added burden if possible.
On a mountain route and/or in variable weather you might want or even gave to climb with sacs (particularly if it's too much faff to go back for them) but go as lightweight as possible. Plan your day ahead. Avoid climbing in big boots if possible; I've never had to in the UK.
In reply to sbattams:
I normally wear a pair of Asolo Peaks, which are a fairly light weight composite B2 as my all round boot.
If your feet are better with the Scarpa type fit then the equivalent equivalent would be maybe a Manta or Charmoz. Not so sure about other manufacturers.
I normally wear a pair of Asolo Peaks, which are a fairly light weight composite B2 as my all round boot.
If your feet are better with the Scarpa type fit then the equivalent equivalent would be maybe a Manta or Charmoz. Not so sure about other manufacturers.
In reply to sbattams:
Assuming your profile is up to date you can lead 6a+ which would be around E1 5b (physically). Given you've put some HVDs on you wishlist, I'd suggest doing the whole day in approach shoes - it's more or less what they're for.
Try them on some single pitch of the same grade and rock type first to get used to it.
Assuming your profile is up to date you can lead 6a+ which would be around E1 5b (physically). Given you've put some HVDs on you wishlist, I'd suggest doing the whole day in approach shoes - it's more or less what they're for.
Try them on some single pitch of the same grade and rock type first to get used to it.
In reply to Adderbury Climber:
Morning Ben,
Im in Northampton but spend a lot of time driving round the country looking for white water with a kayak on the roof so have no problem with the driving to wales etc for a days climbing and driving home again as im doing it with the weather like it is at the moment on the hunt for the wet stuff.
Steve
Morning Ben,
Im in Northampton but spend a lot of time driving round the country looking for white water with a kayak on the roof so have no problem with the driving to wales etc for a days climbing and driving home again as im doing it with the weather like it is at the moment on the hunt for the wet stuff.
Steve
In reply to sbattams:
I usually just take my shoes off at each belay and let them soak up some sun :p
I usually just take my shoes off at each belay and let them soak up some sun :p
In reply to Andy Hardy:
Yea my profile is up to date as I log ALL my climbs as i try to beat the number from the previous year. Looking forward to 2015 and trying to beat the 160 from 2014.
Steve
Yea my profile is up to date as I log ALL my climbs as i try to beat the number from the previous year. Looking forward to 2015 and trying to beat the 160 from 2014.
Steve
It all depends where are you going. Rock climbing shoes are a must for most non-winter non-chalk climbing. But for approach, abseil and camping you need to choose that you prefer. It could be flip flops in sunny Mallorca, or technical boots to cross glacier in Alps.
Keep in mind that after few hours of walking in boots your feet will swallow a bit. So it's better to have rock climbing shoes a bit larger than normally you would want to in a gym or sport crag next to a parking.
Keep in mind that after few hours of walking in boots your feet will swallow a bit. So it's better to have rock climbing shoes a bit larger than normally you would want to in a gym or sport crag next to a parking.
In reply to sbattams:
Back in South Africa, I used to climb with sandals clipped to my harness. Yeah, your feet get dirty on the descent but they're light and small and can generally be moved around if you're stuck in a groove or squeezing through a hole. It was somewhat warm, there, and the most comfortable climbing shoes would cook your feet in the sun.
My second usually carried a minimalist pack with nuts and dried fruit mix, water, the guide book, sunblock, the camera and emergency waterproofs. (Table Mountain's weather is temperamental.) If we were swinging leads, the second would divest themselves of the pack and clip it to the stance before heading off on the pointy end.
Oh... and HEADLAMPS! Don't ever forget your headlamp on a route over four pitches long. Never do it. Just don't. Even if you are on time and on schedule and have many hours of daylight left, you do not know what might happen, half way up.
Back in South Africa, I used to climb with sandals clipped to my harness. Yeah, your feet get dirty on the descent but they're light and small and can generally be moved around if you're stuck in a groove or squeezing through a hole. It was somewhat warm, there, and the most comfortable climbing shoes would cook your feet in the sun.
My second usually carried a minimalist pack with nuts and dried fruit mix, water, the guide book, sunblock, the camera and emergency waterproofs. (Table Mountain's weather is temperamental.) If we were swinging leads, the second would divest themselves of the pack and clip it to the stance before heading off on the pointy end.
Oh... and HEADLAMPS! Don't ever forget your headlamp on a route over four pitches long. Never do it. Just don't. Even if you are on time and on schedule and have many hours of daylight left, you do not know what might happen, half way up.
In reply to sbattams:
I have a new-found love of Guide Tennies. I bought them mainly for working in, but they really come into their own on long easy routes. Almost as good to climb in as rock shoes, almost as comfortable as approach shoes. I bought mine big enough to wear socks under and they're fine on VDiffs.
I have a new-found love of Guide Tennies. I bought them mainly for working in, but they really come into their own on long easy routes. Almost as good to climb in as rock shoes, almost as comfortable as approach shoes. I bought mine big enough to wear socks under and they're fine on VDiffs.
Post edited at 14:21
In reply to sbattams:
Don't do what we did - finish a route on Esk Buttress in the dark, wearing tight slippers with only a vague idea of the descent route. Oo, ah, ee
Don't do what we did - finish a route on Esk Buttress in the dark, wearing tight slippers with only a vague idea of the descent route. Oo, ah, ee
In reply to sbattams:
I've not done that much multipitch but found a one-strap super lightweight climbing pack great in Ailefroide. It's big enough to get a set of approach shoes, a snack, and a waterproof in but as it only has one shoulder strap, doesn't restrict climbing significantly. It has a camelpack built it for water. I'd borrowed one from a mate and then bought something in France so not sure where to get them in the UK. Super comfy rock shoes for climbing, comfy trainers for walk-in/out
I've not done that much multipitch but found a one-strap super lightweight climbing pack great in Ailefroide. It's big enough to get a set of approach shoes, a snack, and a waterproof in but as it only has one shoulder strap, doesn't restrict climbing significantly. It has a camelpack built it for water. I'd borrowed one from a mate and then bought something in France so not sure where to get them in the UK. Super comfy rock shoes for climbing, comfy trainers for walk-in/out
In reply to davidbeynon:
As a multipitch trad beginner myself this is the absolute top footwear related tip. It's so easy not to think about the descent until you're slipping on your arse in some sketchy grassy gully wearing your rock shoes. I often take a pair of light boots or shoes up with me depending one the descent route. Another option is to climb and descend the whole thing in climbing oriented-approach shoes if it's within your grade - I'm planning on giving this method a shot this year.
As far all-day climbing shoes goes, try half a size bigger in your regular shoes (or even a whole size if your existing shoes are painfully tight). I have two pairs of 5:10 newtons half a size apart for this reason, although to be honest I could probably climb in the bigger pair all the time (I bought the smaller pair first, hence the later purchase of the bigger pair).
> I quite often have trainers clipped to my harness for the descent.
As a multipitch trad beginner myself this is the absolute top footwear related tip. It's so easy not to think about the descent until you're slipping on your arse in some sketchy grassy gully wearing your rock shoes. I often take a pair of light boots or shoes up with me depending one the descent route. Another option is to climb and descend the whole thing in climbing oriented-approach shoes if it's within your grade - I'm planning on giving this method a shot this year.
As far all-day climbing shoes goes, try half a size bigger in your regular shoes (or even a whole size if your existing shoes are painfully tight). I have two pairs of 5:10 newtons half a size apart for this reason, although to be honest I could probably climb in the bigger pair all the time (I bought the smaller pair first, hence the later purchase of the bigger pair).
In reply to sbattams:
Are there many easy multipitches in the UK that take longer than a few hours? I mean, yeah on a long route you might have lunch or take a break, but then you can take off your rock shoes and rest your feet. If you can't handle 5 pitches with your rock shoes on then they obviously don't fit you correctly.
That being said, there are so many great and lightweight approach shoes I think carrying both shouldn't be an issue. Some of the modern trail shoes probably weigh less than a standard bowel movement.
Are there many easy multipitches in the UK that take longer than a few hours? I mean, yeah on a long route you might have lunch or take a break, but then you can take off your rock shoes and rest your feet. If you can't handle 5 pitches with your rock shoes on then they obviously don't fit you correctly.
That being said, there are so many great and lightweight approach shoes I think carrying both shouldn't be an issue. Some of the modern trail shoes probably weigh less than a standard bowel movement.
In reply to purplemonkeyelephant:
http://www.inov-8.com/new/global/Product-View-Mudroc-290.html?L=26
Try these, climb VD (not as nice as rockboots ) and descend safely, light
http://www.inov-8.com/new/global/Product-View-Mudroc-290.html?L=26
Try these, climb VD (not as nice as rockboots ) and descend safely, light
In reply to sbattams:
I agree with Xharlie, sandals are my footwear of choice for most of the day. I can cross small level snow patches and scramble moderate stuff in them. When the rock gets more challenging I wear a comfy pair of Mythos with light socks under. Of course if I'm on a mountain with big snow and glaciers then I wear full-on mtn boots. It has surprised me how easy and pleasant it is to travel in sandals. My feet are dirty at day's end but they are not as sweaty and manky as they would've been in shoes.
For spring to autumn I take a headlight, small pack, a snack, and windproof jacket for a normal dry day. I wear swimming trunks for the approach and take along nylon pants to wear over them if it gets windy. I often start out cold but it usually only takes about 20mins of uphill walking to come up to a good temp.
I agree with Xharlie, sandals are my footwear of choice for most of the day. I can cross small level snow patches and scramble moderate stuff in them. When the rock gets more challenging I wear a comfy pair of Mythos with light socks under. Of course if I'm on a mountain with big snow and glaciers then I wear full-on mtn boots. It has surprised me how easy and pleasant it is to travel in sandals. My feet are dirty at day's end but they are not as sweaty and manky as they would've been in shoes.
For spring to autumn I take a headlight, small pack, a snack, and windproof jacket for a normal dry day. I wear swimming trunks for the approach and take along nylon pants to wear over them if it gets windy. I often start out cold but it usually only takes about 20mins of uphill walking to come up to a good temp.
In reply to sbattams:
Where are you climbing? If it is England or Wales, or most of Scotland, there are almost no long routes. There isn't really a need to carry food or water on a 4 pitch v.diff. Leave it all at the bottom and concentrate on seeing if you can do the route in less than 2 hrs. That way you will be back at your sacks in 2.30hrs.
> I assume you carry a small pack for food clothing etc, I assume climbing Vdiff in walking boots and rucksack different to a normal VDiff.
Where are you climbing? If it is England or Wales, or most of Scotland, there are almost no long routes. There isn't really a need to carry food or water on a 4 pitch v.diff. Leave it all at the bottom and concentrate on seeing if you can do the route in less than 2 hrs. That way you will be back at your sacks in 2.30hrs.
In reply to David Coley:
It depends if your aim is to climb a route as fast as possible and get back to your starting point or if it's part of a longer linkup. The latter being far more fun IMHO
> Where are you climbing? If it is England or Wales, or most of Scotland, there are almost no long routes.
It depends if your aim is to climb a route as fast as possible and get back to your starting point or if it's part of a longer linkup. The latter being far more fun IMHO
In reply to sbattams:
You don't say where these multi-pitch routes are going to be.
It may be worth investing in a specific pair of rock shoes - from a shop where the staff know what they're talking about, taking the time to fit them properly. this doesn't solve the problem of slippery walking descents of course but they would be suitable for rappel or scrambling descents.
Most folk would carry a small sac but be aware that on some routes with chimneys a sac may hamper you. Cotswold (I think) sell 0.75l water bottles that can be strapped to your harness; likewise teeny harness bags big enough for some energy bars and a windproof.
You don't say where these multi-pitch routes are going to be.
It may be worth investing in a specific pair of rock shoes - from a shop where the staff know what they're talking about, taking the time to fit them properly. this doesn't solve the problem of slippery walking descents of course but they would be suitable for rappel or scrambling descents.
Most folk would carry a small sac but be aware that on some routes with chimneys a sac may hamper you. Cotswold (I think) sell 0.75l water bottles that can be strapped to your harness; likewise teeny harness bags big enough for some energy bars and a windproof.
1
In reply to silhouette:
Apart from routes where the obvious way down doesn't pass the bottom of the route (e.g. Long Climb on Nevis), I can't think of any UK rock route where I've carried a sac, including routes on the Shelter Stone. At most I've tied a light wind/water proof round my waist & shoved some sweets or a cereal bar into a pocket.
Apart from routes where the obvious way down doesn't pass the bottom of the route (e.g. Long Climb on Nevis), I can't think of any UK rock route where I've carried a sac, including routes on the Shelter Stone. At most I've tied a light wind/water proof round my waist & shoved some sweets or a cereal bar into a pocket.
In reply to sbatt
Just wear rock shoes, even if they are tight.... It's generally safer then walking boots and you can climb your hardest. Would suck to get to a section of technical moves you can't do 4 pitches up!
If they hurt, just take them off at the belay.. I saw a video once of a guy who modded his shoes to have a strap of elastic around his ankel so he wouldn't lose them in this way.
If you want any other essentials, then a small pack is a good idea... Google 'Grivel mago 14', there going really cheap at the moment.
Just wear rock shoes, even if they are tight.... It's generally safer then walking boots and you can climb your hardest. Would suck to get to a section of technical moves you can't do 4 pitches up!
If they hurt, just take them off at the belay.. I saw a video once of a guy who modded his shoes to have a strap of elastic around his ankel so he wouldn't lose them in this way.
If you want any other essentials, then a small pack is a good idea... Google 'Grivel mago 14', there going really cheap at the moment.
In reply to origamib:
I was thinking of Simond Cliff 20 rucksack: http://www.decathlon.co.uk/cliff-20-ii-blue-backpack-id_8302352.html
Anyone has used it? Would fit phone, keys, some water, a sandwich, camera and some clothing without many troubles.
I was thinking of Simond Cliff 20 rucksack: http://www.decathlon.co.uk/cliff-20-ii-blue-backpack-id_8302352.html
Anyone has used it? Would fit phone, keys, some water, a sandwich, camera and some clothing without many troubles.
Post edited at 12:27
In reply to sbattams:
Apologies if this has already been stated, but why buy uncomfortably rock shoes? Unless you are climbing E4+ there simply is no need. Get yourself some comfortable shoes that fit. If you don't like shoes that stink constantly, wear socks. I have climbed up to E2 without too many problems, lack of ability being my main foe rather than comfortable shoes and socks.
Apologies if this has already been stated, but why buy uncomfortably rock shoes? Unless you are climbing E4+ there simply is no need. Get yourself some comfortable shoes that fit. If you don't like shoes that stink constantly, wear socks. I have climbed up to E2 without too many problems, lack of ability being my main foe rather than comfortable shoes and socks.
In reply to sbattams:
One wears tweed of course. As for footwear, it is acceptable to wear boots with hob-nails but no gentleman would be seen about the rockface in plimsolls or the like.
One wears tweed of course. As for footwear, it is acceptable to wear boots with hob-nails but no gentleman would be seen about the rockface in plimsolls or the like.
In reply to origamib:
ive got the https://www.springfield-camping.co.uk/montane-cobra-25/4408/vpc?gclid=cmlim...
which i love and is small enough plus has gear loops in the belt.
Shoes sorted and now just need to get out.
Once the weather improves.
Steve
ive got the https://www.springfield-camping.co.uk/montane-cobra-25/4408/vpc?gclid=cmlim...
which i love and is small enough plus has gear loops in the belt.
Shoes sorted and now just need to get out.
Once the weather improves.
Steve
In reply to sbattams:
I climb in my normal rockshoes, the same ones I use for sport, bouldering and everything else. If my feet are getting cramped or cold I drop my heels out at belays. I don't like climbing in trainers or boots even on easy ground, it's generally less secure so slower, harder on my feet and it reduces my enjoyment of the climbing.
I walk in in trainers unless it's swampy in which case, since I generally didn't bother to pack boots I walk in in wet trainers. Boots for snow.
Clothes wise it's just whatever you need to keep the cold out and stay dry. Personally I go for woolly jumpers and an overcoat for wind and rain protection. Open the coat while climbing to stay cool. Tracksters under my jeans or tracksuit bottoms if it's cold or windy. Don't do out in the rain to stay dry.
Trainers I carry on my harness, extra layers and snacks in a small bag. If I were going somewhere more remote I would consider chucking in some sort of shelter in case I had to spend a bit of time out in the weather.
jk
I climb in my normal rockshoes, the same ones I use for sport, bouldering and everything else. If my feet are getting cramped or cold I drop my heels out at belays. I don't like climbing in trainers or boots even on easy ground, it's generally less secure so slower, harder on my feet and it reduces my enjoyment of the climbing.
I walk in in trainers unless it's swampy in which case, since I generally didn't bother to pack boots I walk in in wet trainers. Boots for snow.
Clothes wise it's just whatever you need to keep the cold out and stay dry. Personally I go for woolly jumpers and an overcoat for wind and rain protection. Open the coat while climbing to stay cool. Tracksters under my jeans or tracksuit bottoms if it's cold or windy. Don't do out in the rain to stay dry.
Trainers I carry on my harness, extra layers and snacks in a small bag. If I were going somewhere more remote I would consider chucking in some sort of shelter in case I had to spend a bit of time out in the weather.
jk
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