UKC

When are people making the decision to bail on a route due to sprindrift avalanches?

I'd say when there is wind around, sprindrift is likely coming down your route, but does that mean you are on a lee-facing crag when you shouldn't be? Is it indicative of danger at the top-out?

Previously I've made the decision to ab only based on "there is enough snow coming down with enough regularity, that it'll probably knock me off on the lead - so bail"

Thoughts?

In reply to paulpitcher:

I would always abandon a route if there was any spindrift at all coming down. It's never a good sign.

In reply to paulpitcher:

There's no simple answer to that. It depends whether there are potential collecting areas higher up, how icy the surface is and whether spindrift will collect in dangerous amounts. But if there's enough that it might knock you off, then I would go down (I've twice abbed off Point Five Gully like that).

In reply to paulpitcher:

I feel the same with regards to being knocked off lead. Spindrift is a necessary evil of a lot of winter climbing. Bailing at the first sign of spindrift would considerably shorten your winter season. Last Saturday my partner and I abbed off point five after there was a huge dump which physically hurt us. There was pretty bad spindrift before that but we put up with it. When we got back to CIC we heard that someone had been caught in an avalanche on The Curtain (the guy posted on here about it) so we felt we had made the right call as the snow conditions weren't great. If I ever think I'm pushing it then i say to myself "the mountain will be here another day, lets make sure i am too!".

In reply to Rylstone_Cowboy:
Any at all? Personally, I think that's a bit over-cautious and would make it tricky to get much done in our maritime climate. There are so many factors to consider, not least the potential for build-up and what steepness/aspect of slopes lie above the route.

To the OP:
It's a question I've often wondered. I've never had it bad enough to bail, yet, but have not started up routes when they've been obviously getting dumped down. I'd always be worried of getting knocked off as spindrift can often contain bigger lumps.

John Cunningham shows some fortitude in the lovely old Chouinard video of him on the Ben: http://youtu.be/mXzVNFrLzk0?t=5m35s

In reply to Rylstone_Cowboy:

On Great End last weekend I was getting pelted by plenty of spindrift, but the direction of fall was counter to the wind, which by contrast was (and had for days been) scouring the upper levels of the gully which was consequently bare. Had the wind been at 180 degrees then I would have taken the spindrift as a signal to bail out. Not a hard and fast rule but one that held true on that one occasion.

In reply to DannyC:

Hardcore - No gloves on a motorbike in winter!!

Really good climbing as well.

In reply to paulpitcher:

It really depends on what lies above from a threat perspective and the nature and persistence of the stuff coming down. If it's continuous, it's going to be a pretty unpleasant day out. If it's periodic that's sustainable. If it's got lumps in it that's not so good - I've retreated from a route in the Northern Corries when there were golf ball sized lumps of ice in the stuff coming down. It made looking up well-night impossible.

Conversely, a gale blowing stuff up the route makes it hard to see your feet, which makes life tricky, but that's seldom sufficiently sustained to warrant rereat. You may have to think what life will be like on the top though, espcially if you haven't got goggles.

In reply to Richard White:


And no helmet, whilst riding or climbing.

In reply to pec:


But did you notice the number of different tools he used, must have weighed a ton, really hard humping that lot up the Ben.

In reply to paulpitcher:

Some time ago a friend and I were climbing Astral Highway and got caught out during a temperature rise. We were hammered by slough and spin drift. One one belay a particularly big pour came down and forced me tight on my anchor, pulled my hood off, got inside my clothing and soaked me, subsequently resulting in mild hypothermia, it turned into a grim shift.

In reply to Murko Fuzz:

Murko - what was the forecast like that day? Did you feel the conditions were unexpected?

In reply to paulpitcher:

I think it was '99 and the forecast I used then was Metfax. The rise in temperature wasn't mentioned, so for sure it caught us out. Now the forecasts are way better, plus I'm more savvy. We should have bailed while we still could.