UKC

NEWS: Major New Article Format for UKC for 2015

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 UKC News 30 Mar 2015
Starlight and Storm, 2 kbStarting today with a piece on Alison Hargreaves and her son Tom Ballard, UKC are rolling out a major new article format, using full page photo and text viewing as well as integrated video.

Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=69624
 planetmarshall 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

That final photo of Alison on K2 is spectacular - never seen it before.
 DannyC 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Hi,

Looks interesting, but I can't get past the first page using Google Chrome, and (I think) Windows 8.

Thanks,
D.
In reply to DannyC:

So the first page is loading but you are unable to progress to the next page?
RocUp 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Trying to view on iPad but errors occur after 3rd page and it reloads back to first page
 climbwhenready 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

How are you meant to use it? If I scroll down/right it always jumps 2 pages at a time. On Safari.

Will all articles be like this or will there be things to read as well?
 Jack Geldard 30 Mar 2015
In reply to RocUp:

iPad errors are causing us a bit of trouble, we hope to have them sorted by the end of this week.

Cheers
 Tom F Harding 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Works really well with Firefox and windows 7. It's a really big improvement on the normal UKC article style - nice work. I look forward to more to come.
1
In reply to UKC News:

If anyone is having issues feel free to drop me an email including your browser information, operating system and a small description of what is going wrong. It will greatly help us improve these feature articles going forward.

Cheers,

Martin
 odox 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I enjoyed it. Would be nice to have a bit more control on the videos (progress bar & volume) and I found that flashing, video leak transition a bit jarring after a while. Overall nicely done, certainly easier reading for a larger amount of content.
 seankenny 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

It looks nice, but only being able to read three paragraphs at a time feels a bit wrong - like it's a slide show with some extended captions, rather than an actual article.
 DannyC 30 Mar 2015
In reply to Martin McKenna - Rockfax:

Yes Martin, exactly. It's still doing it now.

Danny.
 Brian Pollock 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Fantastic read. Really enjoyed that and the new format.
1
 Motown 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Good article but felt an awkward read. Flashing transitions are particularly disruptive.
 dmetcalfe 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I like the new format, keeps crashing on iPad mini 3 iOS 8.2 with Google Chrome.
 ChrisBrooke 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Looks great on Chrome on OSX 10.8.5!
Andy Gamisou 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Works poorly on kindle fire (well, on mine anyway). With the ocean browser I get a blank page once the flashing blob has stopped. WIth silk I get bits of the pages appearing, but missing bits off the bottom, and navigating back and forth amongst the pages feels clunky with the text rendering randomely on the page (or not at all). Works a bit better on chrome, but still seems clunky. Even with chrome gave up trying to read it after a while.
 Robin Woodward 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I don't have a tablet, but it seems like you've tried to go for a traditional magazine style aimed at tablets (where page turning seems more natural) and added integrated video to give a modern touch. I imagine this approach would work fairly well on tablets. I have some slight concerns over the lack of creativity/ingenuity which goes into this fairly basic approach, but that is slightly irrelevant.

Constructive (if in some cases a little harsh) comments:

-I think the font choice looks poor, and like a first time blog.

-I think that black text on white background should be avoided outside print. I'm pretty sure there's quite a few studys which show it's harder on the eyes (than other colour combos, white on black for instance), it make it look slightly unfinished in places, and is only the 'norm' due to printing costs, which we have clearly moved away from here.

-The formatting and layout in general also adds to the slightly unfinished and amateur look. some of the full photo pages look great, but as previously commented, pages where neither photo or text fill half the screen is pretty poor. There's lots of more personal preferences which aren't necessarily constructive (such as justified text), but I think you just need to take each page and ask yourself if that page looks like a quality designed page, or whether you've decided you really want this photo, but don't really have anything to say about it, and therefore if it is contributing well, or whether you need o have some kind of multiple photo page or other approach.

-Leading on from the two above points, being viewed on a wide screen monitor, the extra space is simply filled by more white, which looks a bit daft. If you had a coloured background behind the text, and maybe put a fake page frame around it, it might look nicer.

-I'm not sure in what cases you intend to use this format, but I can see it being most effective in your monthly news letters or as a monthly download for tablet users, where similar styles of article can be grouped together with some nice contents page to flick between the articles.

Hope this doesn't seem too negative as I think UKC is great in soo many ways.
1
 Fraser 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

This format almost works really well ... but it actually falls short. I'm not sure if it's just me, but it's confusing not knowing if you're watching a slideshow, reading a static page, or watching a video. When you navigate quickly, it seems to skip things. Good try, but it still feels a bit of a work in progress.
1
 ablackett 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I don't like that format at all.

I like to flick down to see if it's going to take me 30 seconds to read, or a 10 minute sit down. I don't have a clue with this new format. I like to flick through and just look at the photos, I can't do that with this format. I really don't like it. Have never liked it when BBC have done a similar thing.

Sorry, but can't watch it/read it in this format.
1
 Doug 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:
I hope this isn't the format for all future articles, I really don't like it & gave up after a fe pages of photos & very little text. Is there more to read later on ? It looks a bit like a magazine (but why on the web ?) but there's not much to read, at least on the pages I saw.
Post edited at 20:44
1
 Robert Durran 30 Mar 2015
In reply to ablackett:

> I don't like that format at all.

Me too, for same reasons. I don't see what is gained by it. It is just annoying not being able to scroll.
 Ramon Marin 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I think it looked great, and not because some of my pictures are published, but that it had a better scope for stories like the video interview in just one place. I loved it
In reply to dmetcalfe:

> I like the new format, keeps crashing on iPad mini 3 iOS 8.2 with Google Chrome.

There's a fix in the works for mobile devices with limited processing power, particularly for those running iOS Chrome which seems to struggle a bit more than other browsers.

 Wft 30 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I liked it.

It's not that easy to just scroll through and consume like news articles so I waited 'till I could really view it and had a richer experience because of this. Its obvious a lot of work went into the piece and the writing is great. Thanks for framing this inspiring story. All the best to Tom and Jim, you are living what seems a very rich life.
 Robert Durran 30 Mar 2015
In reply to GuyVG:

> It's not that easy to just scroll through and consume like news articles so I waited 'till I could really view it and had a richer experience because of this.

But this is the internet, not a coffee table book.
1
 kyaizawa 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Dislike.

I can see what is trying to be achieved here, and it's visually impressive and has the feel of a series of panels in a museum/pages in a coffee table book as others have said, but ultimately a waste of time for me as the reader. It's too cumbersome, too slow (even with the latest LinuxMint OS, Firefox and superfast broadband) and is really really frustrating to navigate, especially if you want to go backwards/forwards, revisit, reread or skip bits. Technically too, I imagine this would be horrendous for someone on limited internet speed, especially given that the videos auto load and auto play.

Much prefer the old style for articles.
1
 Robert Durran 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Robert Durran:

> But this is the internet, not a coffee table book.

A really fine article though.

 Sharp 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Agree with the others that it looks nice but at the cost of functionality. I like being able to scroll up and down the page, see how long it is, scroll back to a previous section or just scroll down and look at the pictures. One of the good things about being on a computer or tablet is the format, it allows you to see the whole document, search the text, see everything in one go.

Another issue is if I flick through an article and it looks good I usually save it on my phone so I can view it offline, with this you can't do that which is a shame cause I'm going to have to find sine alternative reading material for the John.

I was quite keen to like this new format but I really don't, did anyone actually ask for this or give feedback that the normal format was inadequate. If not why fix something that's not broken? If all the pictures loaded it would look pretty but I thought the way pictures viewed in articles before was pretty good and superior to a lot of other websites, clicking to zoom allowed you to view the pictures in detail but without leaving the article and you could see which ones you wanted to look at more.

Will we be able to choose the old format along side the new One? It might be a useful way for you to monitor how well it's doing who uses the new format and who uses the old one.
 Morgan Woods 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Robin Woodward:

>

> -I think that black text on white background should be avoided outside print.

If the alternative is the retina searing white on black then count me out.

Good job with the article.
Bellie 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I have tried three times, but Safari crashes everytime I try to view the article.

 Jack Geldard 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Bellie:

Hi Bellie,

What machine and operating system are you on?

Thanks,

Jack
Bellie 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Jack Geldard - UKC Chief Editor:

Mac OSX 10.8.5 Safari 6.0.5

1
 digby 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:
Not working on Safari 5.1.10 with Mac Os snow leopard. Though this browser is out of date and doesn't work all that well anymore there must still be a lot of it around.

I think the format is too special. As others have said, it's very coffee table, there's no navigation other than next/previous; if you click any link on the page and then return to it you are put back at the start; the Times Roman (or similar) seriffed font is not very good for screen legibility.
The sliding off left gets pretty wearing after a while. I don't like things sliding about the screen. Like that dratted post replies button that makes the forum lurch up the screen.

You should maybe save it for special occasions! It does make the photos look lush.
Post edited at 10:05
 planetmarshall 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Sharp:

> I was quite keen to like this new format but I really don't, did anyone actually ask for this or give feedback that the normal format was inadequate. If not why fix something that's not broken?

No one ever asks for these things - no one ever asked for a smartphone or ipod. We have them because people anticipated a desire for them. I like the format, it works well, and no one has suggested that it will replace the conventional article format.
 Jack Geldard 31 Mar 2015
In reply to digby:

> Not working on Safari 5.1.10 with Mac Os snow leopard. Though this browser is out of date and doesn't work all that well anymore there must still be a lot of it around.

Thanks - we'll look in to that.

> You should maybe save it for special occasions! It does make the photos look lush.

Yes, that's the idea, possibly 5 or 6 pieces per year.

Cheers,

Jack


 Jack Geldard 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Bellie:

Thanks.
 planetmarshall 31 Mar 2015
In reply to Robin Woodward:

> -I think that black text on white background should be avoided outside print. I'm pretty sure there's quite a few studys which show it's harder on the eyes (than other colour combos, white on black for instance)

Actually the reverse is true - https://www.joedolson.com/2006/08/on-the-readability-of-inverted-color-sche...

However, it wouldn't be hugely difficult to provide an option for users to invert the color scheme if they preferred.
 mr.pozor 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:
Crashes Firefox on Ubuntu 14.04 LTS running Unity 7.2.4

-Ben
Post edited at 15:24
 drolex 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

It doesn't work well with linux generally speaking. Can't turn pages on Fedora 19 (Gnome) + FF, crashes on Ubuntu 14.10 (Unity) + FF.

No technical issue with Windows or Android, but:
- not much text on each page (a lot of blank around a few sentences)
- the autoplay of videos is a big no-no for me
Dr Avinash Aujayeb 31 Mar 2015
In reply to UKC News:

This is awesome thanks. Everything I pretty much read is digital now, and on a tablet of sorts, so great.
 AymanC 01 Apr 2015
In reply to ablackett:

In the bottom right hand corner it tells you 1/29. That gives you some idea of how long it is.
Its clearly an extended article as its in this format in the first place. This format isn't for '30 second' reads.

I like the new format for longer articles like this. The ken burns ish 'moving stills' and multimedia approach add a lot.
 digby 01 Apr 2015
In reply to Robin Woodward:

> -I think that black text on white background should be avoided outside print.

White text on black is an after-image headache inducing abomination that should never be used for body text on a web page

> -Leading on from the two above points, being viewed on a wide screen monitor, the extra space is simply filled by more white, which looks a bit daft. If you had a coloured background behind the text, and maybe put a fake page frame around it, it might look nicer.

Keep it simple. It wouldn't look nicer. Avoid gimmicks at all costs. Including ones by Ken Burns.
 full stottie 01 Apr 2015
In reply to Martin McKenna - Rockfax:

I like the format, its fresh and interesting, and works fine for me on Chrome and Windows 8.
At my age, everything seems to change too fast, much of it not gaining that much, but I like this one - large format visuals and integrated video makes it very engaging. This article length seems about right - I don't know what it would feel like if it was twice the length. I'd love to do something myself in this format.
 Paul B 02 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

On Win 7 + IE 9.08 I get nothing beyond black text on white. This is at work but all of the other UKC features work, inc. video.
 Coel Hellier 02 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Sorry -- and maybe this is just me -- but I don't like it.

First, the whole "feel" is like one of those learn-to-read books for 5-yr-olds, where you have a picture and a small amount of text on each page, and are continually flicking to the next page.

Second, such "overly designed" presentation of material rarely works well, since there are such a wide range of devices one could view it on, and it'll only be as-designed on a subset of them. This looks as though it'd be good on an iPad, where you only have a small amount of space, but isn't good on a large screen.

Thirdly, my standard complaint about such things -- and maybe this one really is just me -- but when something I'm looking at suddenly shoots left, or otherwise starts moving, then it gives me motion-sickness nausea. The effect is worse the bigger the thing that starts moving, so for that reason I stopped reading after 3 pages, and would not read such things, however good the content. Why, oh why oh why can't web designers use one of the motionless forms of transition? OK, it's just me.
 Robin Woodward 02 Apr 2015
In reply to planetmarshall:

Stand corrected. Clearly made that up.

Personally I have issues with black text (or any colour, but black worst) on white/beige background (linked to dyspraxia I'm told - the words move around, causing me to skip lines, lose focus etc.), which is improved by a change in the background colour, but I think that's just me/a minority then.
 James FR 02 Apr 2015
In reply to drolex:

> It doesn't work well with linux generally speaking. Can't turn pages on Fedora 19 (Gnome) + FF, crashes on Ubuntu 14.10 (Unity) + FF.

Working fine on Linux Mint (and Firefox 37.0)

 Yanis Nayu 02 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Nice article.
 digby 02 Apr 2015
In reply to Coel Hellier:

> Thirdly, my standard complaint about such things -- and maybe this one really is just me -- but when something I'm looking at suddenly shoots left, or otherwise starts moving, then it gives me motion-sickness nausea. The effect is worse the bigger the thing that starts moving, so for that reason I stopped reading after 3 pages, and would not read such things, however good the content. Why, oh why oh why can't web designers use one of the motionless forms of transition? OK, it's just me.

Exactly. It's not just you!
 StevenF 02 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

Excellent article, I really enjoyed that!

I viewed it on my Samsung galaxy S2 and the only issue I had was when I tried to get back to the article after watching a video, it closed the article completely and I had to reload it and scroll through to my last position.
 geezer 02 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I think it was the best article I've read on UKC ! Well done authors and techie

I'm sure the technical problems (browser/device compatibility) can be ironed out in but i think that it should be reserved for leader articles . I don't think it suits a flash report for example.

It was the best I've read on UKC because of the depth and thought in the reporting aswell as the presentation.

Neil S
 SachaF 03 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I can't open the page on my iphone which has ios7.1.2. I can't upgrade the ios as that will crash the phone and i don't want to buy a new one. When i click the link to the article it just closes safari down.
I can see it on my ipad browser, and am just playing the inset video now. That runs on ios8.2.
In reply to UKC News:

Tried it on my iPad this morning, keeps throwing an error and returning to the first page.
 Jack Geldard 03 Apr 2015
In reply to Everyone:

Thanks everyone for the feedback and for the faults.

We're working on sorting loading issues etc and hope to have it all working pretty much 100% by the time we launch the next one.

In response to the folks who didn't like the 'style' of the presentation - thanks for that feedback, as with all things it's a case of you can't please everyone, but we'll look in to seeing if we can please more people!

These features will just be for special long-form stories, and we're hoping to do around 5 or 6 per year.

And is response to the page layout, and the white space around the text etc:

This is a responsive design, which means that the pages change if you have different screen sizes and resolutions. Try changing the size of your browser window and all the pages change. So I'm afraid it isn't as simple as laying out a magazine, but the design hopefully looks 'quite good' on most screen sizes! that's the aim.

Thanks again everyone,

Jack


 dereke12000 03 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:
Generally works well on Chrome on touch screen Windows 7 laptop running Windows 8.1.
But:
- I would ALWAYS want the option of the plain simple format
- it needs some sort of navigation slider so you can see visually where you are (I know it says e.g. 16/28), and navigate to any point as you wish (maybe like the thumbnails that popup as you hover on YouTube timeline at the bottom of a video)
- at one point just the one Chrome tab was using over 440 MB of memory (not counting the Browser and the GPU)
- the first video was very shaky with horrible white transitions
- at page 21 when I decided to try Full Screen, it went back to page 1, the page counter at the bottom right started counting up from 1/1 up to page 21/16 (which is nonsense) and then it froze
- in fact every time you swap to and from Full Screen it resets to page 1

Derek
PS is it worth the coding to support dinosaur browsers like IE7 and IE8? Chrome & FF work fairly well on XP
Post edited at 10:19
 nikhoward 05 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:
Hi Jack, amazing article and I love the new format
In reply to dereke12000:

Hi Derek,

Thanks for taking the time for the feedback. The IE dinosaurs (less than version 9) get the old version of the website and the article is displayed in the scroll down format used in other articles. I think we may offer the choice to switch back to this style in the next released for low powered devices or for those who prefer it.

Cheers, Paul.
 dereke12000 06 Apr 2015
In reply to Paul Phillips - UKC and UKH:

> I think we may offer the choice to switch back to this style in the next released for low powered devices or for those who prefer it.

That sounds an ideal solution
Derek
 phil456 08 Apr 2015
In reply to UKC News:

I found the article itself very well written.

The format worked well on my ipad

As previously mentioned the transitions were awfull

Is it possible to shift the pause button out of the middle of the shots as its distracting

Otherwise its good

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