UKC

Hi all,
Sorry nothing new but have done as much research as I can and just want to get some opinions...

I'm looking at finally getting my own ropes and lead gear. I think i'm after a pair of 60m dry treated half ropes as I will be using them in winter.

I know ideally I would be buying a pair of 50m halves for summer and a single for top roping, but my budget will only allow me one set just now, and winter is what I really love.

Is this the right choice? I will probably use them a bit over the summer for single and multi-pitch rock, and perhaps one rope doubled for the occasional top rope (after doing some reading, it appears this is safe, even if not ideal?). In winter they will be used for scottish winter (probably no harder than IV) and some ice in the pyrenees if my plans for next season work out. Also maybe occasionally one rope halved again for snowboard mountaineering. I'm after 60s instead of 50s as I've already had experiences of 50s not quite making it to ideal belays on winter routes.

I've just seen the Edelrid Perfect Alpine 8.3 for £80 at Go. Can't find any info on it other than a thread on here suggesting it is a rebranded Esculap. Can anyone confirm this? If so it sounds pretty ideal for my needs and at a great price!

Have also found the Mammut Meteor 8.3 for £85 at needlesports. This also looks pretty good!

Would either of these be good choices? Any opinions on which would be better?

Thank you for your help!
Kahti

In reply to Kahti:

the perfect alpine at go would be a great half rope to start with on rock as its basically just a re-branding on edelrids current line. It only has a dry treated sheath which is the same technology they use in nikwax to give jackets a DWR treatment, so it eventually wears off. You can retreat this with nikwax rope proof and this is basically all i dry treated sheath is. This would be ideal for summer trad as your not wasting money getting a fully featured rope mainly for winter that will get battered on grit/dolerite and even standard rhyolite.

If you want to spend a bit more cash for something that can do summer and winter if you are really careful not to run it over rough edges etc then have a look online for deals on the mammut genesis 8.5, this is because the new version has just been released so go outdoors will price match and nock 10% off if you can find them online cheaper as im sure other retailers will have them in the sale. The genesis has a sheath and core treatment so is a all round winter and summer work horse. Sheath treatment will inevitably rub off (which as i said can be retreated) but the treatment on the rope core will take a fair old while to wear off.

hope this all helps

In reply to Kahti:
I got a pair of meteors back in december, they're pretty nice ropes for belaying, seem to knot pretty nicely. It's useful to have 60m halves for rock climb as well as winter as abseil descents can be a little easier, from what I remember the descent from Dinas Mot is a full length abseil on 60m ropes for example. If you're climbing on grit/ small single pitch crags a lot you can always just fold the rope in half and have your second tie into the middle, there were a couple of occasions where I regretted doing this on a 50 as there wasn't quite enough rope for the belay. I've top roped on a single strand of a half rope before, there is no reason for it to snap, you just need to beware that the rope will stretch a lot if you do fall off! Top roping will also likely put considerably more wear on a half rope than leading on it.
Edit: The genesis ropes mentioned above will take a proper hammering and are also generally quite nice.

In reply to spenser:

Thank you for the replies!

So the Edelrid is more of a summer rope which can take getting a bit damp, but not suitable for full on winter?

How about the meteor? Will it stand up to winter or would I be better waiting to see if I can get a good deal on some Genesis'?

Any other recommendations for my criteria?

Also if using one rope doubled for top roping or as a confidence rope what is the best way to tie into the middle? Clip in to an Alpine butterfly?

In reply to Kahti:

There are loads of ways, I tend to go for a rethreaded figure of eight on a bight but that's mostly just familiarity with the knot. No idea about the meteor ropes for winter use as I don't do winter stuff at the moment.

A simpler way is to tie a bowline with the bight and secure the free end-loop to the harness belay loop with a krab. Note that this is a bowline WITH a bight (actually a triple bowline), not a bowline ON a bight - that's something completely different. If you don't know what I'm talking about.......well, don't do it. But if I'm teaching my granny etc, sorry!

In reply to Kahti:

The Meteor is also rated as a twin rope, which means that two strands together (i.e. treated as one) can be used in place of a single rope, and the impact forces etc will all be okay on a leader fall with both ropes clipped into one piece of gear.

Of course it can also be used as a standard half rope (one strand per piece of gear) - but the flexibility is handy.

There is nothing unsafe about doubling up a half rope for top-roping: there's no difference between that and a climber coming up seconding a leader. As spenser says, toproping (or seconding) on just one strand will be a bit bouncy if you fall off, but doubling up the rope will sort that out.

For tying in to the middle, a less bulky option is a re-threaded overhand knot with the end loop clipped back to the belay loop with a screwgate carabiner. (Personally I'd never just clip in with a screwgate krab, but then I'm paranoid about it coming undone.).

In reply to Becky E:

Haha oh yeah. Brainfart! For some reason I was imagining rethreading with a doubled up rope to be a PITA but just tried it with a piece of accessory cord and its not really much different. All 3 methods seem easy enough to tie. The bowline is definitely the least faff, but I assume it would struggle with jamming after taking a load like a standard bowline can do. Guess i'll stick with the ol' figure 8. One day I will find a use for all these other fancy knots I know!

In reply to Kahti:

Hi Kahti, I have an Edelrid Perfect Alpine which I have been using for the past year both summer and winter. I would say it's exactly what you need. I'm pretty sure the core has a dry treatment too. It's marked on the packaging. Anyway, used it this winter in v wet conditions and it was fine. I actually went for a 50m rope as before I had a 60m genesis which is a really good rope but found I very rarely needed that length. Was just excess weight I was carrying around and more rope to pull up at belays. Might be useful if you are climbing pure ice routes and can run out the full 60m which is what I have kept the Genesis for. The Ederid has a more supple feeling compared to the Genesis but maybe not as hard wearing. If you can, go into the shop and compare the ropes side by side. Also, you only need to buy one rope as your partner should have one, hopefully a different colour !

In reply to Kahti:
Another vote for 60m.Genisis.Have just purchased my second pair-first pair lasted a good 5/6 years.
I would also endorse using 60 m for Scotish Winter.

In reply to bobpilgrem:

Thank you for the reccomendations!

I think i'm going to go for the Meteor as its slightly lighter than the edelrid while also being rated slightly stronger. So a win win.
Also it's basically a genesis without the core treatment, and that seems to be the most recommended half rope out there! Unfortunately an actual genesis is much more expensive but I'm guessing taken good care of the meteor should still last me a long time.

nemo9: I'm going to be buying a pair so I can go out climbing with mates that don't have ropes (and aren't into it enough to invest in one). Will also mean I know I've got 2 matching 60s as have experienced the "joy" of climbing on one 60 and one 50 of different diameters before!