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In reply to Removed User:
Think you are right. Was wondering why there wasn't a thread, now I've realised I haven't even seen yesterday's stage either.
Think you are right. Was wondering why there wasn't a thread, now I've realised I haven't even seen yesterday's stage either.
In reply to balmybaldwin:
Is it viewable somewhere on the Internet. Edited highlights would be fine. We only have Freeview here and it seems Channel 4 aren't covering it.
Is it viewable somewhere on the Internet. Edited highlights would be fine. We only have Freeview here and it seems Channel 4 aren't covering it.
In reply to Removed User:
Still going to be an interesting race. Contador is the clear favourite, but it's not quite as simple as that. On paper he should beat Aru and Porte, but part of their strategy is to tire him out for the benefit of Nibbles and Froome in the Tour.
Is the Giro-Tour double possible these days ? And lets not forget if he does manage it - he become the first man to hold all 3 crowns simultaneously - some feat
Still going to be an interesting race. Contador is the clear favourite, but it's not quite as simple as that. On paper he should beat Aru and Porte, but part of their strategy is to tire him out for the benefit of Nibbles and Froome in the Tour.
Is the Giro-Tour double possible these days ? And lets not forget if he does manage it - he become the first man to hold all 3 crowns simultaneously - some feat
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Reports that Bertie has a dislocated shoulder following today's crash. Mind you a broken leg didn't bother him too much last year.
Reports that Bertie has a dislocated shoulder following today's crash. Mind you a broken leg didn't bother him too much last year.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Some news on Bertie, Crashed, injured, hospital for x-rays, will have a look in the morning.
http://velonews.competitor.com/2015/05/news/contador-crashes-in-giros-stage...
Some news on Bertie, Crashed, injured, hospital for x-rays, will have a look in the morning.
http://velonews.competitor.com/2015/05/news/contador-crashes-in-giros-stage...
In reply to ablackett:
Confirmed as dislocated shoulder. Team "hopeful" he will start - or fearful of Oleg's temper if he doesn't ?
Confirmed as dislocated shoulder. Team "hopeful" he will start - or fearful of Oleg's temper if he doesn't ?
In reply to Chris the Tall:
I see the Giro medical statement says "slight instability" in shoulder and rider experienced "slight pain" !
Poor Colli though, what a horrible looking injury.
I see the Giro medical statement says "slight instability" in shoulder and rider experienced "slight pain" !
Poor Colli though, what a horrible looking injury.
In reply to GrahamD:
Todays stage is a mere 264km, tomorrow we have a summit finish. He'll need a lot of Tramadol ! Thing is, as we saw with Froome last year at the tour, riders are often more crash prone when they are nursing an injury, mainly because they are more nervous and twitchy. He may start the stage but will he finish it ? I think once he starts doubting he can do the double he'll decide to focus on the tour.
Todays stage is a mere 264km, tomorrow we have a summit finish. He'll need a lot of Tramadol ! Thing is, as we saw with Froome last year at the tour, riders are often more crash prone when they are nursing an injury, mainly because they are more nervous and twitchy. He may start the stage but will he finish it ? I think once he starts doubting he can do the double he'll decide to focus on the tour.
In reply to Removed User:
Looks like Simon Clarke of OGS came to Porte's rescue today. Is that ethical ?
Looks like Simon Clarke of OGS came to Porte's rescue today. Is that ethical ?
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Matthews came over the line with him but why shouldn't he help? It's just a crying shame, that's all.
> Looks like Simon Clarke of OGS came to Porte's rescue today. Is that ethical ?
Matthews came over the line with him but why shouldn't he help? It's just a crying shame, that's all.
Post edited at 18:01
In reply to Removed User:
http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/racing/giro-ditalia/richie-porte-given-two-m...
noooooooooooooooo
http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/racing/giro-ditalia/richie-porte-given-two-m...
noooooooooooooooo
In reply to Chris the Tall:
That's bloody daft. Informal alliances form all the time, people share drinks if they are in a breakaway together, Jens Voight once borrowed a bike from a spectating kid to chase back, if someone punctures then often a truce is called to help that person out. It might be in the rules, but the rules are bonkers.
That's bloody daft. Informal alliances form all the time, people share drinks if they are in a breakaway together, Jens Voight once borrowed a bike from a spectating kid to chase back, if someone punctures then often a truce is called to help that person out. It might be in the rules, but the rules are bonkers.
In reply to ablackett:
I agree. What makes grande tours special is the adventure of it (to paraphrase Voight) these stories of people helping each other or waiting after a crash make cycling such a human sport. We don't want it sanitised like this!
I agree. What makes grande tours special is the adventure of it (to paraphrase Voight) these stories of people helping each other or waiting after a crash make cycling such a human sport. We don't want it sanitised like this!
Post edited at 22:00
In reply to ablackett:
Henri Degrange would have expelled him altogether !
2 mins is very harsh, but the rules are clear (even if no one seems to be aware of it). And it's different to the sort of ad hoc alliance you get on a stage, where one rider gifts another the stage as a thank you for help in gaining time on GC rivals. You have a team of 9 (would be better with 2 or 3 less) , and the strength of the team is a bit factor. If all the Italians started riding for Aru, he'd have half the race behind him. And if other teams started riding for Contador, you'd suspect that Oleg has been handing out brown envelopes.
That said, it is sad that a spur of the moment act of sportsmanship should be punished so severely - a token deduction would have been more fitting given that he already lost 43 secs due to no more than bad luck
Henri Degrange would have expelled him altogether !
2 mins is very harsh, but the rules are clear (even if no one seems to be aware of it). And it's different to the sort of ad hoc alliance you get on a stage, where one rider gifts another the stage as a thank you for help in gaining time on GC rivals. You have a team of 9 (would be better with 2 or 3 less) , and the strength of the team is a bit factor. If all the Italians started riding for Aru, he'd have half the race behind him. And if other teams started riding for Contador, you'd suspect that Oleg has been handing out brown envelopes.
That said, it is sad that a spur of the moment act of sportsmanship should be punished so severely - a token deduction would have been more fitting given that he already lost 43 secs due to no more than bad luck
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In reply to Chris the Tall:
Is it because they are both Aussies or because they are mates?
Anyone remember the English lads riding for Cavendish at the Commonwealth Games in Melbourne?
Is it because they are both Aussies or because they are mates?
Anyone remember the English lads riding for Cavendish at the Commonwealth Games in Melbourne?
In reply to Chris the Tall:
This. In a 'sporting' world dominated by utterly unsporting behaviour, it was a lovely gesture. Now shat on from a great height.
I despair. What message does it send? That's right: trample anyone in your way to the top; help no-one; be a selfish dick.
> That said, it is sad that a spur of the moment act of sportsmanship should be punished so severely
This. In a 'sporting' world dominated by utterly unsporting behaviour, it was a lovely gesture. Now shat on from a great height.
I despair. What message does it send? That's right: trample anyone in your way to the top; help no-one; be a selfish dick.
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In reply to The New NickB:
No, but I have heard about spaniards of various teams riding for Degardo and depriving Millar of a vuelta win in the 80s. And of various Belgians doing the opposite on a number of occasions. But there is a huge difference between drafting/ working together and getting a wheel.
More to the point, where was the rest of Team Sky at this point ?You've got 8 men there to look after Porte, he shouldn't need 2 more from another team. And if Sky were focusing on Viviani, then they have to accept the consequences of such decisions. Likewise if they had riders who were dropped from the peloton, then the rival teams had been successful in their tactics and they deserve the benefits.
> Is it because they are both Aussies or because they are mates?
> Anyone remember the English lads riding for Cavendish at the Commonwealth Games in Melbourne?
No, but I have heard about spaniards of various teams riding for Degardo and depriving Millar of a vuelta win in the 80s. And of various Belgians doing the opposite on a number of occasions. But there is a huge difference between drafting/ working together and getting a wheel.
More to the point, where was the rest of Team Sky at this point ?You've got 8 men there to look after Porte, he shouldn't need 2 more from another team. And if Sky were focusing on Viviani, then they have to accept the consequences of such decisions. Likewise if they had riders who were dropped from the peloton, then the rival teams had been successful in their tactics and they deserve the benefits.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
I didn't see the OGE rider do much work at all in the chase. I've certainly seen far more blatant and beneficial examples of riders working for other teams. Remember the two honourary Brits in Austrian jerseys at the Olympics?
I didn't see the OGE rider do much work at all in the chase. I've certainly seen far more blatant and beneficial examples of riders working for other teams. Remember the two honourary Brits in Austrian jerseys at the Olympics?
In reply to Removed User:
Contador hit the nail on the head. Bit of panic, heartrate high, thinking about nothing but loosing time. There probably isn't a rider in the bunch that would have refused that wheel.
Contador hit the nail on the head. Bit of panic, heartrate high, thinking about nothing but loosing time. There probably isn't a rider in the bunch that would have refused that wheel.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Oddly some of the stuff I've seen on twitter shows a Sky rider close by as the wheel change takes place.
Did that rider help Porte chase?
Oddly some of the stuff I've seen on twitter shows a Sky rider close by as the wheel change takes place.
Did that rider help Porte chase?
Post edited at 07:40
In reply to DaveHK:
Or, for instance, Contador sending former team mates up the road to support his attack later in the stage...
Clarke gave him a wheel which, even if you know nothing about cycling and sport, is self-evidently against the rules. Sometimes one can be clever, Porte (?) getting food for Froome from the car when within the final 25km, but this wasn't because, as Nick says above, a team mate was close by. If one hadn't been then a two minute penalty may well have been worth taking.
Apols but I missed the significance of the event earlier.
> I didn't see the OGE rider do much work at all in the chase. I've certainly seen far more blatant and beneficial examples of riders working for other teams. Remember the two honourary Brits in Austrian jerseys at the Olympics?
Or, for instance, Contador sending former team mates up the road to support his attack later in the stage...
Clarke gave him a wheel which, even if you know nothing about cycling and sport, is self-evidently against the rules. Sometimes one can be clever, Porte (?) getting food for Froome from the car when within the final 25km, but this wasn't because, as Nick says above, a team mate was close by. If one hadn't been then a two minute penalty may well have been worth taking.
Apols but I missed the significance of the event earlier.
In reply to The New NickB:
If he didn't then it'll be par for the bloody course in professional bike riding.
> Oddly some of the stuff I've seen on twitter shows a Sky rider close by as the wheel change takes place.
> Did that rider help Porte chase?
If he didn't then it'll be par for the bloody course in professional bike riding.
In reply to Removed User:
taking your helmet off in a ride is against the rules as is crossing under a rail road crossing. Yes I am sure fines were imposed but the penalties weren't, hardly consistent.
taking your helmet off in a ride is against the rules as is crossing under a rail road crossing. Yes I am sure fines were imposed but the penalties weren't, hardly consistent.
In reply to DaveHK:
The history of cycling is littered with examples of riders breaking the rules and getting away with it, often with the UCI/commissars turning a blind eye, particularly when big names are involved. As for the Olympics, that race was won by a guy with a history of buying races, for which he has not been sanctioned (although the LBL case may still be ongoing the in Belgium courts). It's time to move out of the dark ages.
And no, giving a wheel is far more blatant than sharing the work in a break or at the head of the peloton.
This is a classic team Sky balls-up. All the focus on marginal gains with Porte's motor home, but forgetting the basics such as protecting the leader at a crucial time. Yes there was one team mate close by - who was either too slow to offer a wheel or realised he'd be better pacing Porte back - but split second decision making can win or lose the race.
> I've certainly seen far more blatant and beneficial examples of riders working for other teams. Remember the two honourary Brits in Austrian jerseys at the Olympics?
The history of cycling is littered with examples of riders breaking the rules and getting away with it, often with the UCI/commissars turning a blind eye, particularly when big names are involved. As for the Olympics, that race was won by a guy with a history of buying races, for which he has not been sanctioned (although the LBL case may still be ongoing the in Belgium courts). It's time to move out of the dark ages.
And no, giving a wheel is far more blatant than sharing the work in a break or at the head of the peloton.
This is a classic team Sky balls-up. All the focus on marginal gains with Porte's motor home, but forgetting the basics such as protecting the leader at a crucial time. Yes there was one team mate close by - who was either too slow to offer a wheel or realised he'd be better pacing Porte back - but split second decision making can win or lose the race.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
According to Ritchie he picked up the puncture when he went round a roundabout on one other side whilst the rest of the team went round the other side. By the time they'd realised and gone back, the wheel change was done.
>
> More to the point, where was the rest of Team Sky at this point ?
> More to the point, where was the rest of Team Sky at this point ?
According to Ritchie he picked up the puncture when he went round a roundabout on one other side whilst the rest of the team went round the other side. By the time they'd realised and gone back, the wheel change was done.
Post edited at 10:23
Daft decision - if a podium place is within 2 mins of Porte at the finish it will be a false victory.
Reckon Contador and Aru should swap front wheels a few k into today's stage to square up...
Reckon Contador and Aru should swap front wheels a few k into today's stage to square up...
In reply to vscott:
That suggestion is doing the rounds on twitter, somehow I can't see Contadope going for the idea.
That suggestion is doing the rounds on twitter, somehow I can't see Contadope going for the idea.
In reply to Sir Chasm:
Contador has commented that he thinks it's unfair, but there's no way the Vino, Aru or anyone else at Astana would have any sympathy with him at all. In fact both teams have been applying the pressure throughout the first week, and you could say it's finally paid off - Sky made a huge mistake in a moment of panic.
Incidentally, the ever reliable Inner Ring has dug up the rules and found that 2 mins is the designated penalty for a first offence (5 for a second, 10 for third, then DQ)
And do people really think the commissars handling of the level crossing at PR is a good example to follow ?
Contador has commented that he thinks it's unfair, but there's no way the Vino, Aru or anyone else at Astana would have any sympathy with him at all. In fact both teams have been applying the pressure throughout the first week, and you could say it's finally paid off - Sky made a huge mistake in a moment of panic.
Incidentally, the ever reliable Inner Ring has dug up the rules and found that 2 mins is the designated penalty for a first offence (5 for a second, 10 for third, then DQ)
And do people really think the commissars handling of the level crossing at PR is a good example to follow ?
In reply to Chris the Tall:
I don't think anyone is denying the rule exists. But the rules are applied capriciously. If it had suited the officials they would merely have said that there was clearly no intent to improve his position and ignored it (as they do with many infringements). Hey ho, these things happen.
I don't think anyone is denying the rule exists. But the rules are applied capriciously. If it had suited the officials they would merely have said that there was clearly no intent to improve his position and ignored it (as they do with many infringements). Hey ho, these things happen.
In reply to Sir Chasm:
We couldn't give any credence to the idea that the officials took the chance of improving the prospect of an Italian ( Aru) winning the overall title by effectively taking one of his main rivals ( and much better time triallist) out of the equation -- or am I just being cynical?.
We couldn't give any credence to the idea that the officials took the chance of improving the prospect of an Italian ( Aru) winning the overall title by effectively taking one of his main rivals ( and much better time triallist) out of the equation -- or am I just being cynical?.
In reply to Lord of Starkness:
It depends how Anglo one is feeling, I suppose.
> We couldn't give any credence to the idea that the officials took the chance of improving the prospect of an Italian ( Aru) winning the overall title by effectively taking one of his main rivals ( and much better time triallist) out of the equation -- or am I just being cynical?.
It depends how Anglo one is feeling, I suppose.
In reply to tim000:
If the UCI commisaires are to be taken seriously and apply rule 8.2 to Clarke and Porte, then for consistency they must apply Rule 3.3 to Contador.
Rule 3.3 states that any rider removing his (mandatory) helmet during a race will be subject to a 100 SF fine plus disqualification. Bertie was clearly seen to ride along for some distance yesterday without his helmet, whilst a teammate gave him a cap to put on underneath the helmet.
I've got nothing personal against Contador - but if the UCI say the rules must be obeyed they must apply them without fear or favour.
If the UCI commisaires are to be taken seriously and apply rule 8.2 to Clarke and Porte, then for consistency they must apply Rule 3.3 to Contador.
Rule 3.3 states that any rider removing his (mandatory) helmet during a race will be subject to a 100 SF fine plus disqualification. Bertie was clearly seen to ride along for some distance yesterday without his helmet, whilst a teammate gave him a cap to put on underneath the helmet.
I've got nothing personal against Contador - but if the UCI say the rules must be obeyed they must apply them without fear or favour.
1
In reply to Lord of Starkness:
Sorry, do you really think there is no difference between adjusting your clothing and getting major assistance from another team ?
Rules have to be applied with common sense and Bertie wasn't riding along without his helmet for any length of time.
But the wheel is a differant matter - and my first thought (see higher up the thread) was not that it was illegal (like everyone else I didnt know there was a rule), but that it was unethical. For a start, giving someone a wheel is effectively sacrificing your own race - no one outside your team should do that. Secondly it's a standard tactic to wear down your rival's teams and leave him isolated. Far harder to do if he has a team of 18 rather than 9.
And collusion between teams when they share the same goal - pulling back a break, distancing a mutual rival, working to establish echelons and split up the peleton - are all valid tactics. But non-GC teams lending support to a GC team just cos he's a mate - very dubious.
At the Tour de Yorkshire you had Team Sky, Team WIGGINS (aka Sky B team) and GB cycling (sponsored by Sky) - any collusion between those teams to ensure Sky won the race would have been very unfair on the other teams.
Sorry, do you really think there is no difference between adjusting your clothing and getting major assistance from another team ?
Rules have to be applied with common sense and Bertie wasn't riding along without his helmet for any length of time.
But the wheel is a differant matter - and my first thought (see higher up the thread) was not that it was illegal (like everyone else I didnt know there was a rule), but that it was unethical. For a start, giving someone a wheel is effectively sacrificing your own race - no one outside your team should do that. Secondly it's a standard tactic to wear down your rival's teams and leave him isolated. Far harder to do if he has a team of 18 rather than 9.
And collusion between teams when they share the same goal - pulling back a break, distancing a mutual rival, working to establish echelons and split up the peleton - are all valid tactics. But non-GC teams lending support to a GC team just cos he's a mate - very dubious.
At the Tour de Yorkshire you had Team Sky, Team WIGGINS (aka Sky B team) and GB cycling (sponsored by Sky) - any collusion between those teams to ensure Sky won the race would have been very unfair on the other teams.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
So the rulebook is important when it involves who wins, but not important when it comes to safety - ie helmets, level crossings etc?
So the rulebook is important when it involves who wins, but not important when it comes to safety - ie helmets, level crossings etc?
In reply to Chris the Tall:
We seem to be in agreement that the rules can be ignored (and are routinely ignored) at the whim of the officials, but there's a disagreement about when that should be. You think sporting gestures that don't lead to an improvement in position should be penalised, whereas some think sporting gestures that don't improve position aren't too much of an issue.
We seem to be in agreement that the rules can be ignored (and are routinely ignored) at the whim of the officials, but there's a disagreement about when that should be. You think sporting gestures that don't lead to an improvement in position should be penalised, whereas some think sporting gestures that don't improve position aren't too much of an issue.
In reply to JamButty:
The level crossing fiasco at P-R was a disgrace, but we can't criticize commissars for not applying the rules and then criticize them when they do, just because they penalize a rider we like. Common sense should apply and 3 OGE riders working as domestiques for a rival team is clearly wrong.
Anyone remember the World Cup in 1982 ? Was it good sportmanship and friendship that led to Austria and Germany coming up with a mutually beneficial result in the last group game. Ask an Algerian .....
The level crossing fiasco at P-R was a disgrace, but we can't criticize commissars for not applying the rules and then criticize them when they do, just because they penalize a rider we like. Common sense should apply and 3 OGE riders working as domestiques for a rival team is clearly wrong.
Anyone remember the World Cup in 1982 ? Was it good sportmanship and friendship that led to Austria and Germany coming up with a mutually beneficial result in the last group game. Ask an Algerian .....
In reply to Chris the Tall: I guess that interest in the Giro has taken a dip for the huge majority on the thread but can I just remind people that the TT is still to come?
In reply to Mike Highbury:
Along with a very interesting final week. Aru seems to be suffering but Astana have also got Landa and Cataldo in contention. And lets not forget that part of their plan is simply to make sure he doesn't get an easy ride, soften him up for July.
Along with a very interesting final week. Aru seems to be suffering but Astana have also got Landa and Cataldo in contention. And lets not forget that part of their plan is simply to make sure he doesn't get an easy ride, soften him up for July.
In reply to Lord of Starkness:
totally agree . just pointing out it wasn`t the giro that punished porte , it was the UCI . made a compleat farce of the race now.
totally agree . just pointing out it wasn`t the giro that punished porte , it was the UCI . made a compleat farce of the race now.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Totally agree with everything you've said. Porte should know the rules. I once offered Steve Farrell a wheel in the Ras and and he said no it has to come from a team mate. Brailsford and Sky are having a laugh bleating on. Especially when you considered Brailsford thinks it's ok to research gains using electrodes to counteract the natural 'stop' instinct during high intensity training.
" “When the brain goes ‘right, I better close down and stop’, the cranial stimulation overrides that, and allows you to compete closer to your body’s capability, which is interesting."
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/mar/06/team-sky-dave-brailsford-cycli...
And that sort of development is morally ok is it Dave ?
Totally agree with everything you've said. Porte should know the rules. I once offered Steve Farrell a wheel in the Ras and and he said no it has to come from a team mate. Brailsford and Sky are having a laugh bleating on. Especially when you considered Brailsford thinks it's ok to research gains using electrodes to counteract the natural 'stop' instinct during high intensity training.
" “When the brain goes ‘right, I better close down and stop’, the cranial stimulation overrides that, and allows you to compete closer to your body’s capability, which is interesting."
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/mar/06/team-sky-dave-brailsford-cycli...
And that sort of development is morally ok is it Dave ?
In reply to tim000:
Bananaman's on the fence on this one: youtube.com/watch?v=SAlLe4BCupA&
(NB, bit of swearing)
Bananaman's on the fence on this one: youtube.com/watch?v=SAlLe4BCupA&
(NB, bit of swearing)
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In reply to Henry Iddon:
You've ridden the Ras ? Chapeau, or whatever the Irish equivalent is ! Been reading the reports on it from sticky bottle and Porte has got off lightly compared to reda. Quite a colourful history to the race as well, interesting to see how often the name McQuaid pops up in various contexts! Want to see today's reports as I've ridden some of those roads
You've ridden the Ras ? Chapeau, or whatever the Irish equivalent is ! Been reading the reports on it from sticky bottle and Porte has got off lightly compared to reda. Quite a colourful history to the race as well, interesting to see how often the name McQuaid pops up in various contexts! Want to see today's reports as I've ridden some of those roads
In reply to felt:
Brilliant. Sometimes I agree with this guy, often I don't, but he never fails to entertain by simply being so damn opinionated!
> Bananaman's on the fence on this one: youtube.com/watch?v=SAlLe4BCupA&
> (NB, bit of swearing)
Brilliant. Sometimes I agree with this guy, often I don't, but he never fails to entertain by simply being so damn opinionated!
In reply to Henry Iddon:
Presumably it's done with his riders' consent - it's not like he's got Froome chained to a Wattbike, giving him another tasering every time he weeps' stop, stop, I want to get off'
> And that sort of development is morally ok is it Dave ?
Presumably it's done with his riders' consent - it's not like he's got Froome chained to a Wattbike, giving him another tasering every time he weeps' stop, stop, I want to get off'
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In reply to Removed User:
Good, well balanced article here - http://www.theguardian.com/sport/100-tours-100-tales/2015/may/20/simon-clar...
Good, well balanced article here - http://www.theguardian.com/sport/100-tours-100-tales/2015/may/20/simon-clar...
In reply to Removed User:
Meanwhile has anyone noticed the profile for todays stage
http://inrng.com/medias/giro/tappa_dettagli_tecnici_altimetria_132015.jpg
Around sheffield you couldn't ride for a mile and do so little ascent, let alone 90 !
Meanwhile has anyone noticed the profile for todays stage
http://inrng.com/medias/giro/tappa_dettagli_tecnici_altimetria_132015.jpg
Around sheffield you couldn't ride for a mile and do so little ascent, let alone 90 !
In reply to nufkin:
I'd consider whether the rider consents to it or not to be independent of the morality of it. EPO caused the deaths of a number of riders in the 90s and they 'consented' (i.e. had to otherwise they wouldn't be able to stay in the team) to taking it, but that certainly doesn't mean it was morally acceptable. I'm not saying I'm either for or against such practices as in the article, but the rider's consent is a moot point IMO.
> Presumably it's done with his riders' consent
I'd consider whether the rider consents to it or not to be independent of the morality of it. EPO caused the deaths of a number of riders in the 90s and they 'consented' (i.e. had to otherwise they wouldn't be able to stay in the team) to taking it, but that certainly doesn't mean it was morally acceptable. I'm not saying I'm either for or against such practices as in the article, but the rider's consent is a moot point IMO.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Yes, but without the penalty it would be easier to recover or at least have a chance. There's still a lot of racing to go
Yes, but without the penalty it would be easier to recover or at least have a chance. There's still a lot of racing to go
In reply to Chris the Tall:
So it seems, I'm afraid to say
> Oh, well, looks like the 2 minute penalty is irrelevant now
So it seems, I'm afraid to say
Post edited at 16:42
In reply to balmybaldwin:
Yep, without the puncture, the penalty and the crash, he'd merely be 5 minutes behind now.
There's talk that he might withdraw to concentrate on the Tour. To be fair, I think it may be that he simply isn't strong enough to be a Grand tour contender. Great record in the one week tours, but not three.
Have to say that, barring calamity, the race is done. Aru will be happy to finish on the podium, but I doubt if he'll attack
Yep, without the puncture, the penalty and the crash, he'd merely be 5 minutes behind now.
There's talk that he might withdraw to concentrate on the Tour. To be fair, I think it may be that he simply isn't strong enough to be a Grand tour contender. Great record in the one week tours, but not three.
Have to say that, barring calamity, the race is done. Aru will be happy to finish on the podium, but I doubt if he'll attack
In reply to Chris the Tall:
I think I agree. I don't think he has the minerals. I think he needs to focus on a supporting role and, tbh, Froome is going to need all the support he can get.
> There's talk that he might withdraw to concentrate on the Tour. To be fair, I think it may be that he simply isn't strong enough to be a Grand tour contender. Great record in the one week tours, but not three.
I think I agree. I don't think he has the minerals. I think he needs to focus on a supporting role and, tbh, Froome is going to need all the support he can get.
In reply to Removed User:
Setting aside the doubts for a moment today's stage showed the class of Contador. Could you imagine Froome doing a ride like that? No team mates and just busting it himself. No chance.
Setting aside the doubts for a moment today's stage showed the class of Contador. Could you imagine Froome doing a ride like that? No team mates and just busting it himself. No chance.
In reply to Removed User:
Oh and someone should remind Kruijswijk to take the coat hanger out his jersey before he puts it on.
Oh and someone should remind Kruijswijk to take the coat hanger out his jersey before he puts it on.
In reply to DaveHK:
Stage 9 of the 2013 Tour.
> Could you imagine Froome doing a ride like that? No team mates and just busting it himself. No chance.
Stage 9 of the 2013 Tour.
In reply to DaveHK:
Oh and someone should remind Kruijswijk to take the coat hanger out his jersey before he puts it on
Did someone say AICAR
Oh and someone should remind Kruijswijk to take the coat hanger out his jersey before he puts it on
Did someone say AICAR
Post edited at 14:50
In reply to carnie:
That's just pie in the sky: I train in Tenerife, you're well-prepared and he's a druggie cheat .
> Did someone say AICAR
That's just pie in the sky: I train in Tenerife, you're well-prepared and he's a druggie cheat .
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