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Brukit

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Morning ,

I received my new Alpkit Brukit last night.
I have to say I'm mighty impressed by this piece of kit.

Any concerns I had about the mesh bag being a tight fit or it being impossible to get the kit back into the bag with the neoprene cosy on have evaporated.
Maybe this is due to some redesigning.
I can get the stove in easily even with the cosy on and the free canister stand tucked into the loop on the side of the cosy.

I also have no problem getting the 230 gram gas canisters into the pot for carrying once I noticed the little locking studs on the side of the stove top.

Superb stuff.

It looks great too.

OM
 DaveHK 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Wait until you get half way down a canister and it is taking 15 minutes to boil half a litre of water. A serious limitation IMO.
 knighty 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

3.45 seconds to boil half a litre of water? Christ. I need me one of these...
In reply to Onion magnet:
I can't comment on that until I've tested it fully. Which I will do this weekend and report back.

I can however state that with a new cartridge just now I've boiled 500 ml of water in 3 minutes 45 seconds. Which to me is pretty damn fast.

Canister weight before trial 377.7 grams
Canister weight after boiling 372.9 grams
Total gas consumed 4.8 grams
Again pretty good so far

OM

Post edited at 10:40
In reply to knighty:

> 3.45 seconds to boil half a litre of water? Christ. I need me one of these...

Ha ha ha,

I wouldn't have noticed the error had you not spotted it first.

Rectified now



OM
 knighty 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Still very impressive though!
In reply to knighty:

> Still very impressive though!

Well we'll see once its been through its paces until the canister is empty.

I'm quite sad like this regarding gear. If it turns out to be crap with half canisters I'll certainly report the truth.

OM

 DaveHK 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

> If it turns out to be crap with half canisters I'll certainly report the truth.

> OM

I sent mine back. Alpkit admitted that performance was poor on low canisters but were good enough to refund me anyway. Full marks for customer service, lower marks for the product.

In reply to DaveHK:

> I sent mine back. Alpkit admitted that performance was poor on low canisters but were good enough to refund me anyway. Full marks for customer service, lower marks for the product.

Thanks for that. I'll still give it a whirl and see over the weekend.

OM
 JoshOvki 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Make sure you don't put the gas in too tight. I managed to bork 2 gas canisters last week by over tightening. It made for a very sad evening with cold food.
1
In reply to JoshOvki:

> Make sure you don't put the gas in too tight. I managed to bork 2 gas canisters last week by over tightening. It made for a very sad evening with cold food.

Bork ?
Never heard that expression before.


I shall try and be careful , thanks

OM
 JoshOvki 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

I think it might be an IT term, when something is borked.
 galpinos 16 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

I'll be interested to see how you get on. I was keen to get one when they first came out but the early reports of poor performance put me off.

Mainstream competitors' stoves seem to do 2 mins to 2 mins 15 secs for a rolling boil (I understand the limitations of comparing boil times in different tests) so it still seems a bit on the slow/inefficient side.
 Andypeak 16 Jun 2015
In reply to galpinos:

Ive been quite impressed with mine. I dare say that jetboil, msr etc are better but they also cost 3-4 times the price. For £35 I thought the brewkit was excellent.
In reply to andy.smythe:

> Ive been quite impressed with mine. I dare say that jetboil, msr etc are better but they also cost 3-4 times the price. For £35 I thought the brewkit was excellent.

I agree totally, but looking at the thing it really seems like a no-brainer so far.
Regardless of boil time (unless it really is bad on half cartridges) I can't think I'd return it for what you pay.
I've never been in a situation where a little more boiling time has been a matter of life and death
I've a pocket rocket copy as well as an old Go systems Sirocco type stove (which really has stood the test of time) and I still think this will beat them hands down.

But we will see after the weekend

OM
In reply to Onion magnet:

Also if you look up the fire maple stoves that these seem to be rebanded. You can't get them at anything like this price all in.

OM
In reply to DaveHK:

> Wait until you get half way down a canister and it is taking 15 minutes to boil half a litre of water.

Out of interest, what fuel mix was that, and what conditions?

Any butane/propane mix will behave like that at low temperatures, and the initial, volatile propane (bp - 42C) boils off preferentially, leaving behind the less volatile butane (bp -1C).

It's why inverted canister, liquid-feed stoves are better in winter, with the propane providing pressure to drive out the mixed, liquid gas to the evaporation/preheat tube, hence little or no fractional evaporation occurs, and the burn is more consistent throughout the canister life.
 DaveHK 16 Jun 2015
In reply to captain paranoia:

> Out of interest, what fuel mix was that, and what conditions?

I can't remember the canister mix or model but it was in my kitchen so the temp was probably 15 c plus.
In reply to DaveHK:

Okay, that's pretty poor. Did you run it continuously so you got frost on the outside of the canister? That would give the same effect as cold weather use.

Canister-top stoves where the burner is pretty close to the canister usually allow some heat from the burner to reach the canister, by radiation and conduction, keeping it warm enough to continue supplying gas.
 DaveHK 16 Jun 2015
In reply to captain paranoia:
> Okay, that's pretty poor. Did you run it continuously so you got frost on the outside of the canister? That would give the same effect as cold weather use

It was several single tests with time in between for me to drink the resulting cuppa. My feeling was that the (very) long boil time was solely due to low gas pressure. AK tested the stove on return with a new canister and said it was normal.

> Canister-top stoves where the burner is pretty close to the canister usually allow some heat from the burner to reach the canister, by radiation and conduction, keeping it warm enough to continue supplying gas.

I've noticed that too with my new Krakau. I was worried it would suffer the same problem but it does not. The isolation of the canister from the burner on the Brukit does not allow for that.

I'm sure the Brukit will still suit some folks. I saw this issue as a pretty major drawback though.
Post edited at 19:02
 galpinos 17 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:
> Regardless of boil time (unless it really is bad on half cartridges) I can't think I'd return it for what you pay.
> I've never been in a situation where a little more boiling time has been a matter of life and death

It's not life or death, and it's not necessarily faster boil times*, its more fuel efficiency that I'm after. The whole point is that these heat exchanger systems will be super-efficient as well as convenient but the weight penalty of the Brukit unit compared to a pocket rocket and Ti mug doesn’t seem worth it (to me).

Will be keen to see what you think after the weekend’s use though.

*Boil times only come to play when you get to your tent/camp and you’re frozen, tired and shattered and NEED that warm drink!
 trouserburp 17 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Mines pretty much broken from the get go- sometimes slows to a sputtering candle flame, sometimes conks out completely. When it did work it was good but that was only twice. Have been meaning to send it back for 2 months but not very good at things like that (note to self-fathers day)
 DaveHK 17 Jun 2015
In reply to galpinos:
> It's not life or death, and it's not necessarily faster boil times*,

I wouldn't have been too fussed if it just got a few minutes slower on a low canister but mine was taking between 10 and 15 mins to boil a half litre.
Post edited at 20:49
In reply to trouserburp:

> Mines pretty much broken from the get go- sometimes slows to a sputtering candle flame, sometimes conks out completely. When it did work it was good but that was only twice. Have been meaning to send it back for 2 months but not very good at things like that (note to self-fathers day)

Sounds like a blockage somewhere .
I heard of that happening.
Send it back man !

OM
In reply to Onion magnet:
Here's my report from a full weekend of using my Brukit out in Edale.

Total uses 16
Original 230 g gas bottle weight = 377.7g
Weight of gas bottle this morning = 304.6g

Number of boils = 16
Gas used = 73.1 g
Average gas expenditure per boil = 4.6 g


The boiling times took between 3 minutes and 4 minutes .
I've not noticed any drop in performance so far.

PS
I also discovered a new Hot peanut butter drink that I brought from Morrison's before heading out. That was novel and quite tasty I might add.



OM
Post edited at 08:43
In reply to Onion magnet:

I'm out again this weekend so expect another update on the Brukit folks.

Does Alpkit need any beta testers ???
I work in education and now I run a lab.
I have worked for 10 years chemical testing fabrics for M&S, Next etc.
I did ICP heavy metal analysis, formaldehyde colourmetric analysis, pilling, colour fastness, Nickel testing, hydrostatic head, lots more besides. ~Before that I tested your water for Severn Trent.

Just a thought.

OM


Alpkit ???
 marsbar 24 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

I keep used cannisters for my lamp and use newish ones on my stove.
 DaveHK 24 Jun 2015
In reply to marsbar:

You can get a doofer to transfer the gas from canister to canister. Called Gas saver R1 on Ebay (UKC doesn't allow ebay links).
ultrabumbly 24 Jun 2015
In reply to mattrm:

Has anyone used one of these "chargers" to good effect? On paper it looks really good as often I end up taking out 250s when I could have maybe got away with a 100 for a trip and would love to be able to partially refill the 250 again for a similar trip. I could see that might work well from a 500 but I am guessing that you couldn't very well "collate" the remnants of a bunch of 20% to 25% full 250s into one 80% full 250? I am guessing also that this gravity process favours the butane transferring and not the propane so much.

The badly translated description on that product page is a little worrying. I am kind of dubious that if this works well that a stove/gas manufacturer is not offering something similar.

Not being a skintflint so much as it is more that I hate wasting the canister bodies unnecessarily. I also end up with a collection of near dead ones as it is. I try to use these up when by the car on a proper campsite which can be a ballache in itself. And often end up piercing ones for disposal when I could have perhaps simmered on them for 10-20 mins.
I often wish there was a truly refillable en417 type cartridge. Even if it meant a small weight penalty
 DaveHK 24 Jun 2015
In reply to ultrabumbly:

> Has anyone used one of these "chargers" to good effect?

I haven't but apparently they do work.

Some say the key is to make one canister warm and the other cold so that the pressure is increased in the warm one. It is my belief however that the over engineered look of the unit is because it imprisons a tiny demon who moves the gas from one into the other. How or even whether the demon makes a record of these transactions is impossible for me to say.
In reply to Onion magnet:

With filling of diving compressed gas cylinders you only can balance them by connecting together.

If you think about it, its just a stream so bear it mind it will only equalise the pressures and won't necessarily fill or transfer from one to the other
In reply to minus273degrees:

Looks interested. I assume it's gonna be a one-way valve.

They recommend the bottom target canister be put in the freezer and hot water added to the bottom dish in the top canister to promote the gas exchange.
In reply to minus273degrees:

> With filling of diving compressed gas cylinders you only can balance them by connecting together.

> If you think about it, its just a stream so bear it mind it will only equalise the pressures and won't necessarily fill or transfer from one to the other

I think this is the reason to freeze the bottom receiving cylinder in order to promote the exchange.
But I agree they could never completely fill one cylinder from another .

OM
 neuromancer 24 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

The only way this is going to work feasibly is to refill small carts from a large one to be a bit more eco friendly.

I assume a big 500+ cart thats warm will have enough pressure to fill a 100/125 thats cold.

Removing the dregs of multiple 100s though is a bit above it.
In reply to Onion magnet:
Afternoon,

Here's another report on my use of the Alpkit Brukit and its continuing mission of supplying me with hot drinks and pasta

Total uses 30
Original 230 g gas bottle weight = 377.7g
Weight of gas bottle this morning = 229.8 g

Number of boils = 30 averaging 500 ml per boil
Gas used = 147.9 g
Average gas expenditure per boil = 4.93 g

I've now used 64.3 % of the gas cartridge.

The boiling times still took between 3 minutes and 4 minutes .
I've still not noticed any drop in performance so far.

I'll continue this until the gas is completely empty.

OM
Post edited at 15:53
 goose299 29 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

You've used it 30 times in 2 weeks?
Are you using it at home?

 PPP 29 Jun 2015
In reply to goose299:

Only if he brings it to the crag and shares some tea with everyone. Otherwise, using it indoors/in the lab/etc. is a waste of research as Brukit is meant to be terrible in windy conditions.
In reply to goose299:

> You've used it 30 times in 2 weeks?

> Are you using it at home?

I've been camping 4 weekends on the trot and been using this for the last 2 weekends , consisting of rocking up to Edale Friday night, 3 or 4 hot chocolates and tea for friends , combined with 3 or 4 drinks Saturday morning for breakfast, then tea and drinks in the evening after walking , then Sunday morning before leaving . Also been cooking pasta in it.

I've a perfectly good cooker at home thanks



OM


In reply to PPP:

> Only if he brings it to the crag and shares some tea with everyone. Otherwise, using it indoors/in the lab/etc. is a waste of research as Brukit is meant to be terrible in windy conditions.

I refer you to the post above

Not everyone is house/lab bound .

OM
 TobyA 30 Jun 2015
In reply to PPP:

> Otherwise, using it indoors/in the lab/etc. is a waste of research as Brukit is meant to be terrible in windy conditions.

Wouldn't you just put it out of the wind like you do with every other stove?

 PPP 30 Jun 2015
In reply to TobyA:

Yes, you would, but you cannot eliminate the wind completely. I have been faffing with solid fuel stoves (Esbit) for over 5 years and they are quite sensitive to the wind, even with Esbit Cookset 585 (which has some sort of wind screen). I tried many different ways (including burning myself), but it's nearly impossible to have the same conditions as indoors.
 PPP 30 Jun 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Oh, I see! To be honest, I can get only 2-3 times of cooking a day even on longer than one week trips as I travel solo and I usually don't have enough patience to cook . A brew in the end of the day is cool, but if it rains all day (and it does, in Scotland), I am not going to stop for a tea.

So 30 times in 2 weeks sounded like impossible for me!
In reply to Onion magnet:

Good morning,

After another great weekend of camping here are the latest figures from my Brukit

Total uses 42
Original 230 g gas bottle weight = 377.7g
Weight of gas bottle this morning = 163.1 g

Number of boils = 42 averaging 500 ml per boil
Gas used = 214.6 g
Average gas expenditure per boil = 5.1 g

I've now used 93.3 % of the gas cartridge.

I've started to notice a slight drop in performance on the last few boils but nothing remotely drastic.

I should have about 15.4 grams of gas left in the cartridge.
I'm interested to see how much I can use this before it's exhausted.
The current rate of gas consumption would predict 3 more times although part of me thinks maybe more than that.

We shall see next weekend



OM
In reply to Onion magnet:

Unfortunately no update on the Brukit and the remaining fuel this weekend.

I'm off lightweight bike packing this weekend. Testing out my new Kraku stove, Myti mug and snapwires.

:-D

OM
In reply to Onion magnet:

Keep up the good work Onion this is first proper study I have ever seen of a stove, real life tests, with real results !!

Amazing !!
In reply to minus273degrees:
> Keep up the good work Onion this is first proper study I have ever seen of a stove, real life tests, with real results !!

> Amazing !!

Why thank you
Nice to know some folk are interested.

I'll probably give a review of how I get on with the new Kraku stove after the weekend including how many meals and drinks I do with it and the efficiency regarding gas consumption. I'm going to be using a 100 gram gas canister so that it all fits together in a nice small bundle.

The Brukit will no doubt get some action again next week being as I'm pushing to get out every weekend before my summer holiday starts ( a glorious 6 weeks off). Then I'll be out even more and in more remote environments !
This weekend will be my 6th weekend on the trot .

OM
Post edited at 10:29
In reply to Onion magnet:

Morning,

After bike camping around the peak district this weekend I gave my Kraku stove and Myti mug a first field test.

First off the Kraku stove weighing in at exactly 45 grams it has to be a contender for lightest stove in the world, its ridiculously small ( and cute).
The stove is very powerful and it's like cooking with a blow torch, it does have some adjustability , however the instructions ask that you don't run the stove on low for too long to avoid damaging it.
After a good boil on high the folding support arms for your cooking vessel are glowing bright orange . kinda cool really.
I was originally concerned that I'd have problems balancing the Myti mug on the stove it's so small however this turned out to be no real problem as long as you find a fairly flat area to place it on to begin with. I didn't knock it over or worry about it at all while cooking. To be fair its a cooking mug and being 650 ml your not cooking the most extravagant meals in it and so your not constantly having to stir it and check up on it.
Although my partner for the weekend did cook meatballs and gravy , smashed potato and mange tout in on of his many many meals.
One thing to mention was I had a couple of instances where I hadn't screwed the stove on tightly enough and the pin obviously hadn't pressed open the canister and so wouldn't let any gas out. This is not a worry once you get a feel for how tight it needs to be, and I was aware that this could be the case after reading about the issue with other makes of stove.
I was being over cautious with it being brand new.


Here's some figures on the gas consumption and efficiency

I was using a Colemans C100 canister

Starting canister weight = 175 g
Gas weight = 100 g
Canister weight = 75 g

Canister weight this morning = 143
Gas used = 32 g
Number of boils averaging 300 ml per boil = 7
Average gas consumption per boil 4.57 g

Unfortunately I didn't record the boil times, I'll do this in the future sometime. However it didn't seem long and I certainly wasn't concerned about it at all.

I'm already in the process of creating my Myti mug recipe list for meals on the go.



OM
In reply to Onion magnet:
> I'm already in the process of creating my Myti mug recipe list for meals on the go.
>

Nice work again OM

Make sure you post these recipes up !!

In reply to Onion magnet:

Morning.

The final update on my use of the Brukit will be appearing come Monday.
I'm off out again straight after work. This is the 7th weekend camping in a row :-D
I will have used the remaining gas up by this evening at a guess.
I'll then have a complete set of results from new gas cartridge to completely empty.

Have a great weekend



OM
 TobyA 17 Jul 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Vaguely inspired by these posts I weighed a new 100c gas canister on my post scales before going out for an overnight bikepack this week. Once out, I brewed a cup of tea before bed, then tea and coffee the next morning while packing up. Of course I wasn't quite organised enough to write down the weight but I think when I got home it had gone down only about 10 grams. I think each drink was about 300-400 mls, so 10 grams of gas to boil about a litre of water is similar to your figures isn't it? This was a pocket rocket and little alu Primus one person pot (no heat exchanger or clever tech involved - just a stove and plain pot).

I had never really put much thought into how much gas you use camping and as result invariably have lots of half filled cans in attic because when going out into the wilds I buy a new one not sure if there is enough gas in the used ones to see me through a weekend. It's a bit geeky but actually weighing them and working out how much gas I use, and how much is left in can could save me money!
In reply to TobyA:

I think each drink was about 300-400 mls, so 10 grams of gas to boil about a litre of water is similar to your figures isn't it?

Around the same mark yes

> I had never really put much thought into how much gas you use camping and as result invariably have lots of half filled cans in attic because when going out into the wilds I buy a new one not sure if there is enough gas in the used ones to see me through a weekend. It's a bit geeky but actually weighing them and working out how much gas I use, and how much is left in can could save me money!

Snap , I've also had loads of half canisters about the place for the same reason.

Working out how much a typical use would consume and evaluating my canisters by weight rather than my old shake and listen routine would have some benefit for saving money on buying new canisters that are not required.

So my sad investigation serves a couple of purposes saving money and passing the time when I'm bored


OM



In reply to Onion magnet:

Just taken delivery of my Kraku.

It really is tiny and only £20!

Not used it yet, but hoping it will be as impressive as the Brukit you folks have.
 mattrm 17 Jul 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

Thanks for the detailed reports. You should write all this up and put it on a blog somewhere. It's very useful.
In reply to Onion magnet:

Morning,

I trust you all had a good weekend.

Well I managed a final 2 boils out of the Brukit this weekend, I started a 3rd however it ran out of gas so I had to resort to my old MSR Kettle and my other stove.

The last complete boil before running out took me 7 minutes that's on a almost completely empty gas cartridge.

So the story so far is

Total uses 44
Original 230 g gas bottle weight = 377.7g
Weight of gas bottle this morning = 148 g

Number of boils = 44 averaging 500 ml per boil
Gas used = 229.7 g
Average gas expenditure per boil = 5.2 g

So all in all I have to say I'm very happy with this kit.
I've had no issues with it at all over the past 4 weeks and am looking forward to using it plenty more over the summer holidays.

Now I need to get myself something else to review and test out.



OM




 NottsRich 20 Jul 2015
In reply to Onion magnet:

> Number of boils = 44 averaging 500 ml per boil
> Gas used = 229.7 g
> Average gas expenditure per boil = 5.2 g

Do you know if this is typical of a stove like the Jetboil/Windboiler, or above/below what you would expect?

Good information, thanks.
In reply to NottsRich:
> Do you know if this is typical of a stove like the Jetboil/Windboiler, or above/below what you would expect?

Unfortunately I don't own either of those systems to test out and compare
Now if anyone works for either of these companies and fancies sending me one then send away I won't complain ha ha .
But seriously I don't think I could ever bring myself to pay that much just for a stove.
Part of me being drawn to the Brukit is the price .
I really wanted to test it all out and report back after the horror stories at the beginning of the thread about 15 minute boil times for 500 ml.

OM
Post edited at 11:05

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