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How far do you think would be the swimming equivalent of a marathon? 10km ish? Less? More? It came up in the pub the other day and we went off on (another) tangent before a consensus was reached!
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
A good amateur runner can do a marathon on what?, 4 hours?
A good amateur swimmer could probably do 6-8 miles in that.
A good amateur runner can do a marathon on what?, 4 hours?
A good amateur swimmer could probably do 6-8 miles in that.
In reply to Philip:
I can ride my bike for the same amount of time as it takes me to run a marathon and be way less tired afterwards. Maybe calories burnt would be a better measure than time?
I can ride my bike for the same amount of time as it takes me to run a marathon and be way less tired afterwards. Maybe calories burnt would be a better measure than time?
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
Ironman triathlon distances are 2.4 mile swim, 112 mile cycle and 26 mile run, which makes me think they are probably close to being equivalent efforts.
Almost did an Ironman in Menorca last week, but apparently it doesn't count if you do the required distances over the course of 9 days (and I was still a bit short on each total).
Ironman triathlon distances are 2.4 mile swim, 112 mile cycle and 26 mile run, which makes me think they are probably close to being equivalent efforts.
Almost did an Ironman in Menorca last week, but apparently it doesn't count if you do the required distances over the course of 9 days (and I was still a bit short on each total).
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In reply to Chris the Tall:
I wondered this too. 112 miles seems fair as a bike equivalent but 2.4 miles swim seems very short. Maybe they make the swim shorter because you can't eat during it?
I wondered this too. 112 miles seems fair as a bike equivalent but 2.4 miles swim seems very short. Maybe they make the swim shorter because you can't eat during it?
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
There are a series of 10km swim events out there and to my knowledge that's the longest distance that's on offer in mass participation events. As a swimmer myself I consider the 10km events to be more than the equivalent to a marathon.
There are a series of 10km swim events out there and to my knowledge that's the longest distance that's on offer in mass participation events. As a swimmer myself I consider the 10km events to be more than the equivalent to a marathon.
In reply to theonlyjones:
So, as a swimmer (which I'm not), do you think 2.4miles is about right or somewhere between that and 10Km?
Also - on a slightly different topic - are these 10km swims open water?
So, as a swimmer (which I'm not), do you think 2.4miles is about right or somewhere between that and 10Km?
Also - on a slightly different topic - are these 10km swims open water?
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In reply to Somerset swede basher:
Admittedly I swim in much the same way as a brick doesn't, but they seem about right to me in terms of effort, although not time. I would say the time ratio is approx 1:2:4, and that an hour's swimming is as tiring as 4 hours on the bike (especially for me, as most of my energy goes to keeping breathing and somewhere near the surface - any forward momentum is a bonus)
Admittedly I swim in much the same way as a brick doesn't, but they seem about right to me in terms of effort, although not time. I would say the time ratio is approx 1:2:4, and that an hour's swimming is as tiring as 4 hours on the bike (especially for me, as most of my energy goes to keeping breathing and somewhere near the surface - any forward momentum is a bonus)
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In reply to Somerset swede basher:
I would say a 5 to 10 mile swim would be the same as a marathon, I'm a good swimmer for a tri type (average for a swimmer) and I can do an ironman swim in under an hour. The pros swimming those 10km races look absolutely bolloxed when they finish and as someone above said they eat and drink during the swim.
Cheers
Toby
I would say a 5 to 10 mile swim would be the same as a marathon, I'm a good swimmer for a tri type (average for a swimmer) and I can do an ironman swim in under an hour. The pros swimming those 10km races look absolutely bolloxed when they finish and as someone above said they eat and drink during the swim.
Cheers
Toby
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
I'm mostly a runner but did a 10k swim once and found it roughly equivalent to doing a marathon. Long enough that you have to eat more than once during the event, and pretty similar in terms of time if you compare a beginner swimmer to a beginner runner.
I'm mostly a runner but did a 10k swim once and found it roughly equivalent to doing a marathon. Long enough that you have to eat more than once during the event, and pretty similar in terms of time if you compare a beginner swimmer to a beginner runner.
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In reply to Somerset swede basher:
Cheers guys. Still a range of distances here. I think I burn about 100 calories per mile running (maybe a bit more). Used some calorie calculator for swimming I found on the internet and the 3.5km swim I did today came up as about 850 calories burnt (I'm really slow - it took me nearly an hr and a half - I've only been swimming for 6 months). Based on this I think I'd need to do about 10km to get up to about the same kind of calorie burnage as in a marathon. Having said that I feel far more bolloxed than if I had run 9 miles so maybe my calculations don't work at all!
Cheers guys. Still a range of distances here. I think I burn about 100 calories per mile running (maybe a bit more). Used some calorie calculator for swimming I found on the internet and the 3.5km swim I did today came up as about 850 calories burnt (I'm really slow - it took me nearly an hr and a half - I've only been swimming for 6 months). Based on this I think I'd need to do about 10km to get up to about the same kind of calorie burnage as in a marathon. Having said that I feel far more bolloxed than if I had run 9 miles so maybe my calculations don't work at all!
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
Back in the day when I used to be a keen amateur swimmer I did a 2.5k charity swim with a friend (also a fairly keen swimmer). I took 45 minutes, he took an hour. Keen runner does a marathon in 3.5-4 hours? So around 4-4.5 times our swimming time? I think 10k.
This was in a swimming pool so probably refers better to a track-run marathon.
Back in the day when I used to be a keen amateur swimmer I did a 2.5k charity swim with a friend (also a fairly keen swimmer). I took 45 minutes, he took an hour. Keen runner does a marathon in 3.5-4 hours? So around 4-4.5 times our swimming time? I think 10k.
This was in a swimming pool so probably refers better to a track-run marathon.
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
With a body as mine...not far... And I have huge shoulders!
I can run a half marathon easy but swim.... :-O
I'm not chubby either at 41 inch 23 inch 33 inch and 5 ft 7 1/2! (I look like a guy from behind)
I'm very fit (5min mile to a max of 6) but SWIM?! Gosh. I'd have to get undressed...
I swam well prior to cancer and being rebuilt but now I lack confidence.
Good swimmers do over 6 miles in 4x run time. On average I think; my ex swam but I have no reason to enquire
Work on 20min miles I'd say
With a body as mine...not far... And I have huge shoulders!
I can run a half marathon easy but swim.... :-O
I'm not chubby either at 41 inch 23 inch 33 inch and 5 ft 7 1/2! (I look like a guy from behind)
I'm very fit (5min mile to a max of 6) but SWIM?! Gosh. I'd have to get undressed...
I swam well prior to cancer and being rebuilt but now I lack confidence.
Good swimmers do over 6 miles in 4x run time. On average I think; my ex swam but I have no reason to enquire
Work on 20min miles I'd say
Post edited at 00:26
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In reply to Somerset swede basher:
10k is the longest Olympic swimming event and tends to be considered equivelant. World bests are about 15 minutes quicker for the 10k swim. I would suggest that for an elite athlete specialising in either event, the marathon is probably harder on the body. The same probably applies to longer events such as channel swimming in comparison to ultra running.
10k is the longest Olympic swimming event and tends to be considered equivelant. World bests are about 15 minutes quicker for the 10k swim. I would suggest that for an elite athlete specialising in either event, the marathon is probably harder on the body. The same probably applies to longer events such as channel swimming in comparison to ultra running.
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In reply to Chris the Tall:
The swim in an IM is generally considered to be short compared to the run and bike. Isoman events are an attempt to make the three elements more equal in duration. They feature a 7 mile swim, full marathon and 61.3 mile bike.
> Ironman triathlon distances are 2.4 mile swim, 112 mile cycle and 26 mile run, which makes me think they are probably close to being equivalent effort
The swim in an IM is generally considered to be short compared to the run and bike. Isoman events are an attempt to make the three elements more equal in duration. They feature a 7 mile swim, full marathon and 61.3 mile bike.
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In reply to Somerset swede basher:
The test is whether you can swim it while dressed as the rear end of a pantomime horse surely
The test is whether you can swim it while dressed as the rear end of a pantomime horse surely
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In reply to Chris the Tall:
The original Ironman was a combination of local Hawaiian endurance events which were combined into one race after a night in the pub.
The original Ironman was a combination of local Hawaiian endurance events which were combined into one race after a night in the pub.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
In triathlon teh swim is very short for historic reasons, a fact that those of us better at swimming than cycling dislike.
A 10k swim in good conditions is the equivilant effort to a marathon, I would say. Rough sea can change this quite a bit though. I have never been seasick in a marathon ...
In triathlon teh swim is very short for historic reasons, a fact that those of us better at swimming than cycling dislike.
A 10k swim in good conditions is the equivilant effort to a marathon, I would say. Rough sea can change this quite a bit though. I have never been seasick in a marathon ...
In reply to theonlyjones:
Not quite - more of a "challenge" than a "race", but for 14km see http://henleyswim.com/events/bridge-to-bridge/
> There are a series of 10km swim events out there and to my knowledge that's the longest distance that's on offer in mass participation events. As a swimmer myself I consider the 10km events to be more than the equivalent to a marathon.
Not quite - more of a "challenge" than a "race", but for 14km see http://henleyswim.com/events/bridge-to-bridge/
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In reply to LastBoyScout:
There a quite a few long swimming races here in Spain. There is a 22k event from Tabarca to Alicante and also a 25k swim on Menorca. I suppose these are bit like the 100k equivilant in running.
There a quite a few long swimming races here in Spain. There is a 22k event from Tabarca to Alicante and also a 25k swim on Menorca. I suppose these are bit like the 100k equivilant in running.
Post edited at 15:48
In reply to Naamah:
Have I got this right, you are 41 and run 5 minute miles for up to 6 miles, so effectively a sub 32 10k!
On the basis that I know neither Jo Pavey or Helen Clitheroe have any interest in climbing. Have I understood you correctly?
Have I got this right, you are 41 and run 5 minute miles for up to 6 miles, so effectively a sub 32 10k!
On the basis that I know neither Jo Pavey or Helen Clitheroe have any interest in climbing. Have I understood you correctly?
In reply to The New NickB:
No you have read it wrong. I'm 33. My chest is 41 inches. I'm very broad shouldered.
I run at a pace of 5 minute per mile but I can't do that for more than 6 miles at best. I would slow A LOT to do 10 miles; probably to 8 minutes or possibly 9 minutes per mile to ensure I stuck at it.
I do not swim; used to. My guess would be that a good pace for swimming would be around 20 minutes per mile.
No you have read it wrong. I'm 33. My chest is 41 inches. I'm very broad shouldered.
I run at a pace of 5 minute per mile but I can't do that for more than 6 miles at best. I would slow A LOT to do 10 miles; probably to 8 minutes or possibly 9 minutes per mile to ensure I stuck at it.
I do not swim; used to. My guess would be that a good pace for swimming would be around 20 minutes per mile.
Post edited at 06:46
In reply to Naamah:
That would indeed be good pace, especially in open water. The swimming pool worl record for 1500m is 14:31. In open water many things change. I have swum all my life, but have to admit that I have never have become really good. I tend to finish in the top 30 % of open water races with a pace of about 15 min / km without wetsuit if conditions are just right.
> I do not swim; used to. My guess would be that a good pace for swimming would be around 20 minutes per mile.
That would indeed be good pace, especially in open water. The swimming pool worl record for 1500m is 14:31. In open water many things change. I have swum all my life, but have to admit that I have never have become really good. I tend to finish in the top 30 % of open water races with a pace of about 15 min / km without wetsuit if conditions are just right.
Post edited at 08:46
In reply to Naamah:
So 6 miles would take you 30 minutes, but 10 miles would take you 80 or even 90 minutes. How very strange!
So 6 miles would take you 30 minutes, but 10 miles would take you 80 or even 90 minutes. How very strange!
In reply to The New NickB:
Because I am conditioned to run that distance at that pace. I have no real desire to run a greater distance. A half hour run is respectable at my pace for me - it is comfortable. More would take me out that personal comfort zone.
Should I choose to train at a greater distance; of course I could get my approximate time estimate down to possibly 6 minutes or less.
My point is it is down to training. One doesn't start leading 6b do they? They progress and carry on. Some of us are happy not pushing for a 7 and having a nice plateau of what ever grade they choose; for example. Whilst learning and training the body to do more than it is used to; things take longer.
Because I am conditioned to run that distance at that pace. I have no real desire to run a greater distance. A half hour run is respectable at my pace for me - it is comfortable. More would take me out that personal comfort zone.
Should I choose to train at a greater distance; of course I could get my approximate time estimate down to possibly 6 minutes or less.
My point is it is down to training. One doesn't start leading 6b do they? They progress and carry on. Some of us are happy not pushing for a 7 and having a nice plateau of what ever grade they choose; for example. Whilst learning and training the body to do more than it is used to; things take longer.
Post edited at 16:06
In reply to StefanB:
It was just a guesstimate of what people say is good for running and adding the factor of water resistance. Of course open water is a totally different ball game...there are sharks too as well as temperature and weather to contend with.
I congratulate you on your achievements - it's not about the win or the speed but the success of a finish and above all: the enjoyment.
I take my hat off to you
It was just a guesstimate of what people say is good for running and adding the factor of water resistance. Of course open water is a totally different ball game...there are sharks too as well as temperature and weather to contend with.
I congratulate you on your achievements - it's not about the win or the speed but the success of a finish and above all: the enjoyment.
I take my hat off to you
In reply to The New NickB:
from the power of 10...
10,000m
1 31:41.44 31:41.44 PB Kate Avery 10.10.91 Tony Simmons Shildon Palo Alto CA, USA 2 May 15
10K Road
1 31:54 31:55 31:26 Gemma Steel 12.11.85 John Nuttall Charnwood Manchester 10 May 15
from the power of 10...
10,000m
1 31:41.44 31:41.44 PB Kate Avery 10.10.91 Tony Simmons Shildon Palo Alto CA, USA 2 May 15
10K Road
1 31:54 31:55 31:26 Gemma Steel 12.11.85 John Nuttall Charnwood Manchester 10 May 15
In reply to Somerset swede basher:
The more I think about it the less sure I am to be honest. I was initially thinking that someone who hasn't really done much running can "get round" a marathon with a bit of training but I don't know if the same can be said for a 10k swim. I guess it depends on the person as the effort/training/ability required to complete both is entirely subjective!
The more I think about it the less sure I am to be honest. I was initially thinking that someone who hasn't really done much running can "get round" a marathon with a bit of training but I don't know if the same can be said for a 10k swim. I guess it depends on the person as the effort/training/ability required to complete both is entirely subjective!
In reply to alicia:
No I mean miles. You know nothing of my fitness - I have been running for a long time but that pace KILLS me which is exactly WHY I COULD NOT keep it up for a greater distance. I've done that distance many times a week for many years. It's a preprogrammed routine.
As for swimming - as I said I have no clue.
I tried to extrapolate from a totally different sport to a loose comparison.
This thread has kind of become a flaming session about me and the fact can run a short distance in a reasonable quick time. Plenty do it every day.
And on that - back to the topic of swimming.
Anyone done the channel? That's the length of a marathon. Didn't David Walliams do it for charity?
No I mean miles. You know nothing of my fitness - I have been running for a long time but that pace KILLS me which is exactly WHY I COULD NOT keep it up for a greater distance. I've done that distance many times a week for many years. It's a preprogrammed routine.
As for swimming - as I said I have no clue.
I tried to extrapolate from a totally different sport to a loose comparison.
This thread has kind of become a flaming session about me and the fact can run a short distance in a reasonable quick time. Plenty do it every day.
And on that - back to the topic of swimming.
Anyone done the channel? That's the length of a marathon. Didn't David Walliams do it for charity?
Post edited at 19:19
In reply to Naamah:
It's not a flaming session. It just your claim is very odd.
6 miles at 5 minutes mile paced isn't just decent for a women, it is world class!
It's in the same league as Jo Pavey (European 10,000m Champion) and Gemma Steel ( European XC Champion).
It's not a flaming session. It just your claim is very odd.
6 miles at 5 minutes mile paced isn't just decent for a women, it is world class!
It's in the same league as Jo Pavey (European 10,000m Champion) and Gemma Steel ( European XC Champion).
In reply to The New NickB:
To me it's just a run, a habit, a need. I know what a treadmill measures and I know how old I am and how long I have done it for. It remains an AVERAGE. I did not say I simultaneously, definitely stick to 5 mins each time but NEVER more than 5.5 minutes.
I politely asked to end the discussion on me; my friends don't think what I run is that special. Chap I know runs a lot more distance than me just as quick - very fit...not all of us choose fitness as a career. We have other reasons for exercise addiction. That's what it is. An addiction and obsession.
I take my leave - clearly I'm fitter than I thought. Good.
To me it's just a run, a habit, a need. I know what a treadmill measures and I know how old I am and how long I have done it for. It remains an AVERAGE. I did not say I simultaneously, definitely stick to 5 mins each time but NEVER more than 5.5 minutes.
I politely asked to end the discussion on me; my friends don't think what I run is that special. Chap I know runs a lot more distance than me just as quick - very fit...not all of us choose fitness as a career. We have other reasons for exercise addiction. That's what it is. An addiction and obsession.
I take my leave - clearly I'm fitter than I thought. Good.
In reply to Naamah:
I was just trying to help--there is definitely something off with your maths, and the miles/km thing is the most likely thing I could think of. The pace you are talking about would put you at the very top of the sport, i.e. Olympic level. You mentioned you felt comfortable at that pace--there are very few women in the world who can run that fast for 6 miles and I doubt there are any who could feel comfortable while doing it!
I was just trying to help--there is definitely something off with your maths, and the miles/km thing is the most likely thing I could think of. The pace you are talking about would put you at the very top of the sport, i.e. Olympic level. You mentioned you felt comfortable at that pace--there are very few women in the world who can run that fast for 6 miles and I doubt there are any who could feel comfortable while doing it!
In reply to theonlyjones:
I'd never done running but managed to run the 9 edges after some pretty half hearted training fitted round a young family.
Swimming any sort of distance would be exponentially harder as there is such technique. I wasn't bad at swimming as a kid but I'm dreadful now.
the channel seems an incredible challenge. I watched the Walliams documentary he certainly put in more effort than the average marathon runner.
I'd never done running but managed to run the 9 edges after some pretty half hearted training fitted round a young family.
Swimming any sort of distance would be exponentially harder as there is such technique. I wasn't bad at swimming as a kid but I'm dreadful now.
the channel seems an incredible challenge. I watched the Walliams documentary he certainly put in more effort than the average marathon runner.
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