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I am going to be going to betwys-y-coed for a long weekend next year and hope to climb snowdon.
I was looking at all the routes and all the others look to easy. I dont really have any experience but I just think id be dissappointed doing a different route.
It doesnt look too hard plus im good with heights and would treat it with respect.
What does everyone think is this a bad idea?
I was looking at all the routes and all the others look to easy. I dont really have any experience but I just think id be dissappointed doing a different route.
It doesnt look too hard plus im good with heights and would treat it with respect.
What does everyone think is this a bad idea?
In reply to Ben93:
I used to live in the area and have done the horseshoe many time. Choose a fine day and take your time over the knobbly bits. Did it this year with a pal who ain't been out much lately. He did fine.
Cheers
M
http://www.scottishhills.com/html/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopi...
I used to live in the area and have done the horseshoe many time. Choose a fine day and take your time over the knobbly bits. Did it this year with a pal who ain't been out much lately. He did fine.
Cheers
M
http://www.scottishhills.com/html/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopi...
See everyone says its horrible sheer dropa both sides of thr ridge but the left is much less severe. It doesnt look too bad if you take care. Im thinking of going end of july/august I just hope I get decent weather out of 4/5 days of being there.
In reply to Ben93:
With dry conditions and sensible footwear it's an airy walk.
Verglassed is a different story!
With dry conditions and sensible footwear it's an airy walk.
Verglassed is a different story!
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In reply to Ben93:
Crib Goch is not that hard in non-wet non-windy conditions; you do the ridge slightly to the left, and the ridge top proper makes a thigh-waist-high "handrail" you can hold on to most of the way.
That said, people still kill themselves on it.
Do you genuinely have "no experience" of hillwalking? I think if you've been in the mountains before and are half steady on your feet, it's not a big undertaking. However, if you haven't and haven't got a subconscious "mountain sense" going on, I wouldn't recommend you start on CG.
Crib Goch is not that hard in non-wet non-windy conditions; you do the ridge slightly to the left, and the ridge top proper makes a thigh-waist-high "handrail" you can hold on to most of the way.
That said, people still kill themselves on it.
Do you genuinely have "no experience" of hillwalking? I think if you've been in the mountains before and are half steady on your feet, it's not a big undertaking. However, if you haven't and haven't got a subconscious "mountain sense" going on, I wouldn't recommend you start on CG.
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In reply to JJL:
And wind! It should be avoided in high wind.
> With dry conditions and sensible footwear it's an airy walk.
> Verglassed is a different story!
And wind! It should be avoided in high wind.
Id be dissapointed if I didnt I dont have experiemce at all but physically fit and heights dont bother me. Id take the pyg track and see how im feeling on the day. And not too many prople fall for the amount that go over it.
I just want a scarier slightly challenging route ive seen videos of tge pyg track and some others and dont look as good. And the loose scree on the watkin path seems more dangerous than crib goch.
I just want a scarier slightly challenging route ive seen videos of tge pyg track and some others and dont look as good. And the loose scree on the watkin path seems more dangerous than crib goch.
In reply to Ben93:
I wouldn't do Crib Goch as my first ever mountaineering route. It is definitely not a "walk".
I wouldn't do Crib Goch as my first ever mountaineering route. It is definitely not a "walk".
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In reply to Kirill:
I did CG as one of my first routes, I thought it was a walk at the time, it was fine.
I did CG as one of my first routes, I thought it was a walk at the time, it was fine.
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In reply to Ben93:
It may not be technically difficult, but don't under estimate the seriousness of a potential fall. One death is one too many and there have been a lot more than that, including to experienced hill walkers.
By all means go for it in good conditions if you feel confident, but always treat the mountains with respect rather than on a statistical chance.
> And not too many prople fall for the amount that go over it.
>
It may not be technically difficult, but don't under estimate the seriousness of a potential fall. One death is one too many and there have been a lot more than that, including to experienced hill walkers.
By all means go for it in good conditions if you feel confident, but always treat the mountains with respect rather than on a statistical chance.
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Id treat it with respect and do it im good conditionsand stay safe and keep good holds
In reply to JJL:
Hairy yes
> With dry conditions and sensible footwear it's an airy walk.
> Verglassed is a different story!
Hairy yes
In reply to Ben93:
I did CG on my first mountain visit.
As long as the weather is fair and not too windy i think you'll do fine!
You definatley wont forget it!!
I did CG on my first mountain visit.
As long as the weather is fair and not too windy i think you'll do fine!
You definatley wont forget it!!
In reply to Ben93:
You should be fine given the weather. But, have you ever set foot off a pavement?
You should be fine given the weather. But, have you ever set foot off a pavement?
In reply to Ben93:
What experience with heights do you have and how do you think this will compare with heights in the mountains?
What experience with heights do you have and how do you think this will compare with heights in the mountains?
I work at heights alot anf not scared lf them im quite happy with the idea i just want a realistic answer will someone whos fit and healthy struggle to do it or will it be ok.
I want it ti be rememorable which is why i want to do crib goch
I want it ti be rememorable which is why i want to do crib goch
In reply to Ben93:
If your worried hire a guide and even if your not, you could learn alot if you have never been in the hills before.
As people have said in good weather it's probably fine. However you seem to be confident in your abilites but who are you going with and how will they cope. Not a great idea to go alone.
Get some knowlege of navigation and take adiquite clothing, food ect.
If your worried hire a guide and even if your not, you could learn alot if you have never been in the hills before.
As people have said in good weather it's probably fine. However you seem to be confident in your abilites but who are you going with and how will they cope. Not a great idea to go alone.
Get some knowlege of navigation and take adiquite clothing, food ect.
In reply to Ben93:
I found a website that does a guide 1:1 or 1:2 for 100 pound to do crib goch I may use them as it sounds a better way to learn.
I found a website that does a guide 1:1 or 1:2 for 100 pound to do crib goch I may use them as it sounds a better way to learn.
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In reply to Ben93:
Navigation up to the start of the ridge is vague with many paths wending their way up. You can make the route very hard for yourself. Look for cairns (and crampon scratch marks) to guide you.
> I work at heights alot anf not scared lf them im quite happy with the idea i just want a realistic answer will someone whos fit and healthy struggle to do it or will it be ok.
Navigation up to the start of the ridge is vague with many paths wending their way up. You can make the route very hard for yourself. Look for cairns (and crampon scratch marks) to guide you.
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In reply to Ben93:
2 years ago my first steps in the mountain's were on the pyg heading up to crib goch.
I'd spent a lot of time wild camping and bushcrafting the previous few years and thought my nav was pretty good. I'd been climbing indoors for about a month so knew some basic climbing techniques. I'd watched the YouTube videos and thought it looks easy enough if you've got a head for heights.
Left the pyg track at bwlych moch in perfect sunshine and 20 minutes later I was horribly lost in bad fog and caught in the pissing rain. Had a bit of an epic. Ended up having to back off and try and climb, well, surf down a few hundred meters of steep scree, followed by some super knarly down climbs on some small verticall bits and then more scree. Shit my pants and looking back don't know how I didn't break an ankle. I camped down by the lake that night, gave it another go the next morning, in decent weather, and smashed the route.
I had absolutely no right to be there. I got lucky. anyone attempting this as their first steps in the mountains should be accompanied by someone who knows their stuff. It's technically super easy, but don't underestimate the mountains.. they can bite.
That said, since that day on crib goch, I climb indoors or out a few times a week, started to lead trad, gotten into the mountains nearly every month climbing hard scrambles and went back and ticked crib goch as my first winter route the season gone.
So although I had no right being there that first time, it got me addicted to the mountains and has actually changed my life in many ways.
Judge it on the day, assess the conditions and keep respect for the mountains. It'll be a day you never forget.
2 years ago my first steps in the mountain's were on the pyg heading up to crib goch.
I'd spent a lot of time wild camping and bushcrafting the previous few years and thought my nav was pretty good. I'd been climbing indoors for about a month so knew some basic climbing techniques. I'd watched the YouTube videos and thought it looks easy enough if you've got a head for heights.
Left the pyg track at bwlych moch in perfect sunshine and 20 minutes later I was horribly lost in bad fog and caught in the pissing rain. Had a bit of an epic. Ended up having to back off and try and climb, well, surf down a few hundred meters of steep scree, followed by some super knarly down climbs on some small verticall bits and then more scree. Shit my pants and looking back don't know how I didn't break an ankle. I camped down by the lake that night, gave it another go the next morning, in decent weather, and smashed the route.
I had absolutely no right to be there. I got lucky. anyone attempting this as their first steps in the mountains should be accompanied by someone who knows their stuff. It's technically super easy, but don't underestimate the mountains.. they can bite.
That said, since that day on crib goch, I climb indoors or out a few times a week, started to lead trad, gotten into the mountains nearly every month climbing hard scrambles and went back and ticked crib goch as my first winter route the season gone.
So although I had no right being there that first time, it got me addicted to the mountains and has actually changed my life in many ways.
Judge it on the day, assess the conditions and keep respect for the mountains. It'll be a day you never forget.
Post edited at 16:44
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In reply to Ben93:
Proposed to my wife on Crib Goch in full winter conditions. Dropped my camera getting the ring out of my jumper pocket and had an airy climb down a snowfield to recover it.
Proposed to my wife on Crib Goch in full winter conditions. Dropped my camera getting the ring out of my jumper pocket and had an airy climb down a snowfield to recover it.
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In reply to Ben93:
Don't climb Crib Goch as your first venture in to the mountains if you don't have any experience. Many people have died on Crib Goch (and many more not died because Llamberis MRT have got them down after getting stuck) because they lacked experience. How well can you read the weather? How well can you route-find if it gets claggy? Are you going to wander on to a sheep-track that takes you off route? True the actual death rate is not terribly high, but you're giving yourself the best chance of death by being totally inexperienced...
That said, if someone with a bit of experience of hillwalking and easy scrambling can take you up and take responsibility for the decision making (or a guide if you like) then it is a super day out (although in the height of summer when you are going, it is often very busy on a nice day).
Don't climb Crib Goch as your first venture in to the mountains if you don't have any experience. Many people have died on Crib Goch (and many more not died because Llamberis MRT have got them down after getting stuck) because they lacked experience. How well can you read the weather? How well can you route-find if it gets claggy? Are you going to wander on to a sheep-track that takes you off route? True the actual death rate is not terribly high, but you're giving yourself the best chance of death by being totally inexperienced...
That said, if someone with a bit of experience of hillwalking and easy scrambling can take you up and take responsibility for the decision making (or a guide if you like) then it is a super day out (although in the height of summer when you are going, it is often very busy on a nice day).
In reply to Ben93:
A few years ago, a friend and I took a group of his work colleagues along it. All of them were fit, trained and played sports regularly. None of them had any experience of walking or scrambling. It was a beautiful day and conditions were perfect. Of the eight of them six of them coped with it fine, one of them had a bit of a wobble at one point and one spent half of the ridge on his knees or stomach, white in the face. At several points the poor fellow was vomiting from fear. To his credit he would not retreat and ended up on the summit with the rest of us.
So my answer would be that it is very difficult to predict how a person will react. If I were you I'd get a few days in on easier stuff just to find out whether you enjoy it and how you cope with the exposure.
> I work at heights alot anf not scared lf them im quite happy with the idea i just want a realistic answer will someone whos fit and healthy struggle to do it or will it be ok.
> I want it ti be rememorable which is why i want to do crib goch
A few years ago, a friend and I took a group of his work colleagues along it. All of them were fit, trained and played sports regularly. None of them had any experience of walking or scrambling. It was a beautiful day and conditions were perfect. Of the eight of them six of them coped with it fine, one of them had a bit of a wobble at one point and one spent half of the ridge on his knees or stomach, white in the face. At several points the poor fellow was vomiting from fear. To his credit he would not retreat and ended up on the summit with the rest of us.
So my answer would be that it is very difficult to predict how a person will react. If I were you I'd get a few days in on easier stuff just to find out whether you enjoy it and how you cope with the exposure.
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In reply to Ben93:
In fine conditions it is quite easy (From a climbers point of view) but for a newbie it will be a bit more challenging due to the exposure.
If you did the North Ridge of Tryfan as a training scramble then you could make a decision about Crib Goch. The North Ridge is less exposed and is easy to retreat off if you don't feel up to it. Make sure though you do it on a dry day as it can be a slippery bugger in the rain. If you did the North Ridge first then for Crib Goch just expect it to be longer with more exposure.
If you get perfect conditions and have a head for heights as you say then i'm sure you will be fine. Navigation on Crib Goch is piss (IMO) when it is clear. If you go the wrong way you will know about it as you will either fall off the north side of the ridge and probably die or end up rolling down the south side back to the Pyg Track, hence just stick to the ridge!. There are also several point where you can easily bail back down to the Pyg Track.
P.S. I doubt you will want to fork out £100 for a guide as you can easily escape at numerous points back to the Pyg Track or just backtrack to the start and then head back down toward the stile/fence thing.
In fine conditions it is quite easy (From a climbers point of view) but for a newbie it will be a bit more challenging due to the exposure.
If you did the North Ridge of Tryfan as a training scramble then you could make a decision about Crib Goch. The North Ridge is less exposed and is easy to retreat off if you don't feel up to it. Make sure though you do it on a dry day as it can be a slippery bugger in the rain. If you did the North Ridge first then for Crib Goch just expect it to be longer with more exposure.
If you get perfect conditions and have a head for heights as you say then i'm sure you will be fine. Navigation on Crib Goch is piss (IMO) when it is clear. If you go the wrong way you will know about it as you will either fall off the north side of the ridge and probably die or end up rolling down the south side back to the Pyg Track, hence just stick to the ridge!. There are also several point where you can easily bail back down to the Pyg Track.
P.S. I doubt you will want to fork out £100 for a guide as you can easily escape at numerous points back to the Pyg Track or just backtrack to the start and then head back down toward the stile/fence thing.
In reply to Ben93:
Use your common sense - don't climb up anything you wouldn't be comfortable reversing, go on a day with a solid good weather forecast and you will have a good day. A guide will add a degree of safety and may pass on some useful skills, but shouldn't be required in good conditions, relying on someone else may take away some of the adventure too.
Doing a couple of other scrambles in the area to warm up is a great idea, and the North Ridge of Tryfan mentioned above is arguably a better route than Crib Goch and can easily be made harder or easier to suit. Llech Dhu spur on Carnedd Dafydd is another cracker, albeit with a slightly longer approach that does require competent map-reading. Garry Smith's North Wales Scrambles published last year is a great guide which may open your eyes to a range of hill adventures.
Use your common sense - don't climb up anything you wouldn't be comfortable reversing, go on a day with a solid good weather forecast and you will have a good day. A guide will add a degree of safety and may pass on some useful skills, but shouldn't be required in good conditions, relying on someone else may take away some of the adventure too.
Doing a couple of other scrambles in the area to warm up is a great idea, and the North Ridge of Tryfan mentioned above is arguably a better route than Crib Goch and can easily be made harder or easier to suit. Llech Dhu spur on Carnedd Dafydd is another cracker, albeit with a slightly longer approach that does require competent map-reading. Garry Smith's North Wales Scrambles published last year is a great guide which may open your eyes to a range of hill adventures.
In reply to Ben93:
A grade 1 scramble is basically an exposed walking route. So provided you are fine with exposure you won't have a problem.
A grade 1 scramble is basically an exposed walking route. So provided you are fine with exposure you won't have a problem.
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In reply to Orgsm:
Well there are Grade 1s and Grade 1s - something like Bristly Ridge might come as something of a shock to someone just expecting an exposed walk.
Well there are Grade 1s and Grade 1s - something like Bristly Ridge might come as something of a shock to someone just expecting an exposed walk.
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In reply to Ben93:
I would wander up the Lamberis path on the first day and have a wander around on top for a bit, maybe drop down the Pyg track to Pen-y-pass and have a bit of a play on the bottom of Crib Goch. Get the bus back to Lamberis.
Then, if you enjoyed the day out, head back up Crib Goch for day 2.
I would wander up the Lamberis path on the first day and have a wander around on top for a bit, maybe drop down the Pyg track to Pen-y-pass and have a bit of a play on the bottom of Crib Goch. Get the bus back to Lamberis.
Then, if you enjoyed the day out, head back up Crib Goch for day 2.
In reply to David Staples:
Not the most sensible advice I have ever heard so I think it'd be wise for Ben93 to completely ignore it!
> There are also several point where you can easily bail back down to the Pyg Track.
> P.S. I doubt you will want to fork out £100 for a guide as you can easily escape at numerous points back to the Pyg Track or just backtrack to the start and then head back down toward the stile/fence thing.
Not the most sensible advice I have ever heard so I think it'd be wise for Ben93 to completely ignore it!
Post edited at 18:29
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In reply to David Staples:
I'd disagree with this and even argue that it would be better to do them the other way around. CG is pretty easy compared to Tryfan's NR. The descent is harder on Tryfan, as is route finding at times. If the amount of rescues on there is anything to go by I'd definitely say Tryfan is a harder proposition.
> If you did the North Ridge of Tryfan as a training scramble then you could make a decision about Crib Goch. The North Ridge is less exposed and is easy to retreat off if you don't feel up to it. Make sure though you do it on a dry day as it can be a slippery bugger in the rain. If you did the North Ridge first then for Crib Goch just expect it to be longer with more exposure.
I'd disagree with this and even argue that it would be better to do them the other way around. CG is pretty easy compared to Tryfan's NR. The descent is harder on Tryfan, as is route finding at times. If the amount of rescues on there is anything to go by I'd definitely say Tryfan is a harder proposition.
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In reply to Ben93:
If you have no mountain experience then here's some questions to ask yourself:
Are you fit? Can you walk uphill over rough ground for three hours, then do a knee crunching descent for another two? Lots of people think they can walk or run, but rough ground with sustained up is something extra.
How agile and sure-footed are you? Have you done any scrambling at all? Have you even spent any time hopping over or up the rocks at the seaside, or anywhere else?
Do you have the right equipment? It's Wales and it rains a lot even when the weather men say it will be fine, and can be very changeable, so you need waterproofs etc. and something to carry them in.
Boots? I can tell you that it's a lot easier in the correct footwear. Trainers give little or no support over rough terrain.
Do you have a map and a compass and know how to use them? Don't try and rely on your mobile phone. It's very easy to head off to the Parson's Nose in the mist, especially if you're on the chicken path below the ridge. The mist may not be there when you set out (see above).
Try not to be another mountain rescue statistic. If in doubt then take the PyG track, or one of the others from another start point. They are all hard work but well worth the effort.
If you have no mountain experience then here's some questions to ask yourself:
Are you fit? Can you walk uphill over rough ground for three hours, then do a knee crunching descent for another two? Lots of people think they can walk or run, but rough ground with sustained up is something extra.
How agile and sure-footed are you? Have you done any scrambling at all? Have you even spent any time hopping over or up the rocks at the seaside, or anywhere else?
Do you have the right equipment? It's Wales and it rains a lot even when the weather men say it will be fine, and can be very changeable, so you need waterproofs etc. and something to carry them in.
Boots? I can tell you that it's a lot easier in the correct footwear. Trainers give little or no support over rough terrain.
Do you have a map and a compass and know how to use them? Don't try and rely on your mobile phone. It's very easy to head off to the Parson's Nose in the mist, especially if you're on the chicken path below the ridge. The mist may not be there when you set out (see above).
Try not to be another mountain rescue statistic. If in doubt then take the PyG track, or one of the others from another start point. They are all hard work but well worth the effort.
1
In reply to Ben93:
Wow, that's cheap. Make sure they're qualified and insured!
> I found a website that does a guide 1:1 or 1:2 for 100 pound to do crib goch I may use them as it sounds a better way to learn.
Wow, that's cheap. Make sure they're qualified and insured!
I do long walks regularly and have done boulders at seasides ive done one of the steep hills at cheddar gorge that had loose stones so had to have hands down on the ground to go up at some points that was pretty vertical. It was on the grass stony bits not up the rocks at that is an actual rock climb.
I found that a doddle but the person who suggested it to me was getting scared as the rocks were slipping but you just needed to get a good grip before going.
I know its nothing compared to crib goch but its a start. I also do enjoy a climbing wall and am going to start going regukarly leading up to it.
I found that a doddle but the person who suggested it to me was getting scared as the rocks were slipping but you just needed to get a good grip before going.
I know its nothing compared to crib goch but its a start. I also do enjoy a climbing wall and am going to start going regukarly leading up to it.
In reply to Nicholas Livesey:
I have bailed off the ridge a few times in very bad weather, there are a few drainage gullies that are easy to descend. However if Ben93 does the ridge on a crystal clear day I seriously doubt he would want to fork out any £ for a guide. Especially considering that it is easy to turn back if you are not feeling up to it.
> Not the most sensible advice I have ever heard so I think it'd be wise for Ben93 to completely ignore it!
I have bailed off the ridge a few times in very bad weather, there are a few drainage gullies that are easy to descend. However if Ben93 does the ridge on a crystal clear day I seriously doubt he would want to fork out any £ for a guide. Especially considering that it is easy to turn back if you are not feeling up to it.
In reply to Morty:
Could just be me, I didn't find Tryfan NR as exposed as CG and looking back at when I did it I thought it would be easier to retreat off. As far as most scrambles go in North Wales both CG, Tryfan North Ridge and South Ridge are quite easy and would be good for beginners. Maybe the South Ridge of Tryfan would be a better bet as that is probably slightly easier than the north.
Could just be me, I didn't find Tryfan NR as exposed as CG and looking back at when I did it I thought it would be easier to retreat off. As far as most scrambles go in North Wales both CG, Tryfan North Ridge and South Ridge are quite easy and would be good for beginners. Maybe the South Ridge of Tryfan would be a better bet as that is probably slightly easier than the north.
In reply to Ben93:
I reckon you'll be fine.
If it hasn't already been suggested, get to Crib Goch via the North Ridge, it's well worth it!
I reckon you'll be fine.
If it hasn't already been suggested, get to Crib Goch via the North Ridge, it's well worth it!
I think im going to go to the bottom of crib goch on the day I get there and have a look at it maybe have a mess around climbing near the bottom before it gets onto the harder bit at the top and see how I feel. May even give the pyg track a go beforehanf although I dont want to be too achy incase the weather is suitable the next day .
In july/august if im there for a week what are the chances of getting a decent day to climb it.
In july/august if im there for a week what are the chances of getting a decent day to climb it.
Also whats best website to get a written walking route that seems helpful to read too before leaving
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In reply to Ben93:
I'm slightly biased, but if you're looking for a website with brief route descriptions you could try http://www.walk-snowdonia.co.uk/snowdon.php
> Also whats best website to get a written walking route that seems helpful to read too before leaving
I'm slightly biased, but if you're looking for a website with brief route descriptions you could try http://www.walk-snowdonia.co.uk/snowdon.php
In reply to Ben93:
I have OS Explorer OL17, works for me! I'd also get one for somewhere local to you, and a compass, have a bit of a practice.
The better you are at nav, the more quality days out you get, as you don't waste time getting lost or sitting out cloudy days
> What map is good for walking routes in snowdon.
I have OS Explorer OL17, works for me! I'd also get one for somewhere local to you, and a compass, have a bit of a practice.
The better you are at nav, the more quality days out you get, as you don't waste time getting lost or sitting out cloudy days
I dont fully understand how ypu work out how far youve moved on a map and stuff so I need to practice with a compass. Has anyone got a good tutorial on it.
In reply to Jamie B:
Not that cheap really.
ML's are 10 a penny in Snowdonia, I'd not have charged that little but not much more for a short day scrambling.
> Wow, that's cheap. Make sure they're qualified and insured!
Not that cheap really.
ML's are 10 a penny in Snowdonia, I'd not have charged that little but not much more for a short day scrambling.
In reply to David Staples:
The issue with the N Ridge of Tryfan is route finding. You can actually make it far harder, or far easier, you have much more choice. I think people often follow ledges around the E face and get in shit terrain. Crib Goch is more straight forwards but again people swing low and get in trouble on loser terrain.
> Could just be me, I didn't find Tryfan NR as exposed as CG and looking back at when I did it I thought it would be easier to retreat off.
The issue with the N Ridge of Tryfan is route finding. You can actually make it far harder, or far easier, you have much more choice. I think people often follow ledges around the E face and get in shit terrain. Crib Goch is more straight forwards but again people swing low and get in trouble on loser terrain.
In reply to Roadrunner5:
Yes, but *is* crib goch really ML territory...?
<runs for exit>
> Not that cheap really.
> ML's are 10 a penny in Snowdonia, I'd not have charged that little but not much more for a short day scrambling.
Yes, but *is* crib goch really ML territory...?
<runs for exit>
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In reply to Ben93:
I am aged 73 and have done the Snowdon Horseshoe every year for last ?15 years on solo. It is a great day out BUT I would not recommend you go on your own if you have little experience. Parts are Grade 1 scrambles, yes you can avoid the interesting bits (the Pinnacles) and you can escape from the route in one place safely- but doing the scrambles is the best bit, that and the exposure on the ridge itself. See if you can go with someone who's done it before, pick a good day, get fit for it, and it'll be great. As someone else has pointed out in winter it can be a serious undertaking and loads of people have had accidents on it.
I am aged 73 and have done the Snowdon Horseshoe every year for last ?15 years on solo. It is a great day out BUT I would not recommend you go on your own if you have little experience. Parts are Grade 1 scrambles, yes you can avoid the interesting bits (the Pinnacles) and you can escape from the route in one place safely- but doing the scrambles is the best bit, that and the exposure on the ridge itself. See if you can go with someone who's done it before, pick a good day, get fit for it, and it'll be great. As someone else has pointed out in winter it can be a serious undertaking and loads of people have had accidents on it.
In reply to Ben93:
Worth quoting from the introduction to Garry Smith's North Wales Scrambles:
"Any reasonably fit person can enjoy the easier scrambles of North Wales. The ability to scramble is natural and intuitive. It rarely requires any formal training. So long as you, or somebody with you, has some general mountain-walking nous and can navigate using a map and compass, there is every reason to just go for it. If you lack confidence in your route finding ability, start by picking scrambles that follow a strong natural line, like a ridge."
In good weather obviously.
Worth quoting from the introduction to Garry Smith's North Wales Scrambles:
"Any reasonably fit person can enjoy the easier scrambles of North Wales. The ability to scramble is natural and intuitive. It rarely requires any formal training. So long as you, or somebody with you, has some general mountain-walking nous and can navigate using a map and compass, there is every reason to just go for it. If you lack confidence in your route finding ability, start by picking scrambles that follow a strong natural line, like a ridge."
In good weather obviously.
In reply to Roadrunner5:
That's a shame. Your qualification took time, money and application to obtain and is worth more. And a planned scramble is at the top end of the ML bandwidth, short or otherwise. I'm glad I work in Scotland!
> Not that cheap really. MLs are 10 a penny in Snowdonia, I'd not have charged that little but not much more for a short day scrambling.
That's a shame. Your qualification took time, money and application to obtain and is worth more. And a planned scramble is at the top end of the ML bandwidth, short or otherwise. I'm glad I work in Scotland!
2
In reply to Ben93:
I think the best thing that you can do is get out on the hills a bit before you decide to wander up there. After this, if you don't feel confident but still really fancy it, you should put a request for a partner on here a couple of weeks before. I'm sure you will find a partner to enjoy the day out with. I'll even guarantee this comment by saying I will gladly accompany you should you be unable to find a like-minded adventure seeker.
I think the best thing that you can do is get out on the hills a bit before you decide to wander up there. After this, if you don't feel confident but still really fancy it, you should put a request for a partner on here a couple of weeks before. I'm sure you will find a partner to enjoy the day out with. I'll even guarantee this comment by saying I will gladly accompany you should you be unable to find a like-minded adventure seeker.
2
In reply to Jamie B:
Agree with that, I'd be questioning someone only charging £100 for a 1:1 day.
> Wow, that's cheap. Make sure they're qualified and insured!
Agree with that, I'd be questioning someone only charging £100 for a 1:1 day.
In reply to Morty:
^^^
Wot Morty sed... This is how things used to work when outdoors activities were analogue.
^^^
Wot Morty sed... This is how things used to work when outdoors activities were analogue.
1
In reply to The Ivanator:
Believe me, I've had plenty of clients who disrupt that hypothesis!
> "Any reasonably fit person can enjoy the easier scrambles of North Wales. The ability to scramble is natural and intuitive. It rarely requires any formal training. So long as you, or somebody with you, has some general mountain-walking nous and can navigate using a map and compass, there is every reason to just go for it. If you lack confidence in your route finding ability, start by picking scrambles that follow a strong natural line, like a ridge."
Believe me, I've had plenty of clients who disrupt that hypothesis!
2
In reply to Jamie B:
...I can well believe it, but there are quite a few doom warnings on this thread and getting out there and going for it is after all how most of us got started, hence trying to provide a bit of balance.
There are also plenty of people out there who would have no trouble following a VS as their first outing on rock, the range of points people start at is pretty broad.
I cheekily included it as a quote as I didn't want it to be my own words encouraging someone onto Crib Goch when I have no idea about their readiness for doing that.
...I can well believe it, but there are quite a few doom warnings on this thread and getting out there and going for it is after all how most of us got started, hence trying to provide a bit of balance.
There are also plenty of people out there who would have no trouble following a VS as their first outing on rock, the range of points people start at is pretty broad.
I cheekily included it as a quote as I didn't want it to be my own words encouraging someone onto Crib Goch when I have no idea about their readiness for doing that.
In reply to jezb1:
If you go on a nice weekend in summer next year, you will likely be queuing the whole length of the ridge over crib goch, amongst people in trainers and walking the dog. Pick a day in a period of stable high pressure and clear skies and take your place in the crocodile. Snowdon's the busiest mountain in the world (ref: Trail magazine, so may not be strictly true...), so you won't be up there on your own.
Of course, if the weathers unsettled, its a whole different ball game, stay clear til you can use a map and compass, and have the mountain experience to back this up
Cheers
Gregor
If you go on a nice weekend in summer next year, you will likely be queuing the whole length of the ridge over crib goch, amongst people in trainers and walking the dog. Pick a day in a period of stable high pressure and clear skies and take your place in the crocodile. Snowdon's the busiest mountain in the world (ref: Trail magazine, so may not be strictly true...), so you won't be up there on your own.
Of course, if the weathers unsettled, its a whole different ball game, stay clear til you can use a map and compass, and have the mountain experience to back this up
Cheers
Gregor
2
In reply to Jamie B:
There's just lots of ML's in the area, some with other jobs.. some just see the ML work as pocket money which isn't fair on those who depend on their wage. If you phoned around I'd not be surprised to hear of people paying £80-90. It's what the some of the centers will pay their ML's, so many will accept work at around that price.
> That's a shame. Your qualification took time, money and application to obtain and is worth more. And a planned scramble is at the top end of the ML bandwidth, short or otherwise. I'm glad I work in Scotland!
There's just lots of ML's in the area, some with other jobs.. some just see the ML work as pocket money which isn't fair on those who depend on their wage. If you phoned around I'd not be surprised to hear of people paying £80-90. It's what the some of the centers will pay their ML's, so many will accept work at around that price.
Crib goch looks alot easier to navigate than bristly or tryfan looks airy but not too bad. The climb uo and pinnacles look worse than the ridge. I think I will have about 3 others with me and one of them has climbed kilimanjiro.
In reply to Roadrunner5:
That's a regrettable state of affairs, particularly given that ML is arguably not the appropriate award for guiding scrambles...
> There's just lots of ML's in the area, some with other jobs.. some just see the ML work as pocket money which isn't fair on those who depend on their wage. If you phoned around I'd not be surprised to hear of people paying £80-90. It's what the some of the centers will pay their ML's, so many will accept work at around that price.
That's a regrettable state of affairs, particularly given that ML is arguably not the appropriate award for guiding scrambles...
In reply to Jamie B:
We've done that to death on another thread.
In fact I had assumed that the OP was trolling, particularly with their 'L' forum status.
A lot of these scrambles are all about what is going on in your head, physically they're not challenging unless you're exhausting yourself by clinging on too tight or scaring yourself.
> That's a regrettable state of affairs, particularly given that ML is arguably not the appropriate award for guiding scrambles...
We've done that to death on another thread.
In fact I had assumed that the OP was trolling, particularly with their 'L' forum status.
A lot of these scrambles are all about what is going on in your head, physically they're not challenging unless you're exhausting yourself by clinging on too tight or scaring yourself.
In reply to Jamie B:
Argh not that thread again!
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=625658
(there were definitely "arguments" about it, but I think most people thought it was)
> That's a regrettable state of affairs, particularly given that ML is arguably not the appropriate award for guiding scrambles...
Argh not that thread again!
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=625658
(there were definitely "arguments" about it, but I think most people thought it was)
In reply to Jamie B:
Very arguably. But I think its the same for the whole range of awards. I don;t know but I suspect you'd pay more for a guided climb in the highlands than in Snowdonia just because of the numbers of appropriately qualified guides around. That's just simple market forces and a lack of a union. If prices were standardised more we could all charge similar prices but I don't think many would want that, nor would it work.
I used to charge a lot for a guided run, but my view was I was one of the very few fairly good runners who was also an ML and knew snowdonia well. So could charge those prices and clients paid. But the reverse works, for a simple walk, on easy terrain I'd expect to be able to charge less.
Personally I think such terrain with the appropriate clients is ML terrain but as said that's for other threads.
Very arguably. But I think its the same for the whole range of awards. I don;t know but I suspect you'd pay more for a guided climb in the highlands than in Snowdonia just because of the numbers of appropriately qualified guides around. That's just simple market forces and a lack of a union. If prices were standardised more we could all charge similar prices but I don't think many would want that, nor would it work.
I used to charge a lot for a guided run, but my view was I was one of the very few fairly good runners who was also an ML and knew snowdonia well. So could charge those prices and clients paid. But the reverse works, for a simple walk, on easy terrain I'd expect to be able to charge less.
Personally I think such terrain with the appropriate clients is ML terrain but as said that's for other threads.
I am currently in wales and did the pyg track to the summit yesterday and decended the same way in 4 hours total. Was so so cold at the summit had ice crystals forming on any moisture on me.
Shame the clouds and wind and fog stopped me seeing more than a few meters but I haf some nice views on the walk up.
I had a look at crib goch and I think I will give it a go in the summer. I can not work out how to upload pictures but when I do I will put some up.
Shame the clouds and wind and fog stopped me seeing more than a few meters but I haf some nice views on the walk up.
I had a look at crib goch and I think I will give it a go in the summer. I can not work out how to upload pictures but when I do I will put some up.
In reply to Ben93:
Sounds like you had a great time!
You've probably realised that the trick to being in the mountains in the winter is to have clothing that won't overheat you when you're walking, but you need the insulation for when you stop (or, God forbid, you end up immobile due to injury). Although all the temperatures are several degrees warmer, the same principle applies in summer - there's a big temperature drop from the bottom to the top, not to mention additional windchill.
Sounds like you had a great time!
You've probably realised that the trick to being in the mountains in the winter is to have clothing that won't overheat you when you're walking, but you need the insulation for when you stop (or, God forbid, you end up immobile due to injury). Although all the temperatures are several degrees warmer, the same principle applies in summer - there's a big temperature drop from the bottom to the top, not to mention additional windchill.
Yeah I really really enjoyed it. One of the best things ive done. Waa sweating at bottom but the top was bad was the wind that gets you. Whilst looking at crib goch on the way up all i could think was im going to concur that next year.
I think I fancy doing crib goch and decend pyg next year and maybe rhyd ddu track a few days after crib goch.
I think I fancy doing crib goch and decend pyg next year and maybe rhyd ddu track a few days after crib goch.
Only on places where there was a choice to scramble up some bits. Had a little wondee off track up some steep loose scree at one point as its always good practice. I found the pyg track fairly easy tired today but I reckon in reasonabke weather crib goch will be more than doable. Going to start doing some indoor climbing.
Will be only practicing on indoor stuff now was only an off chance that I was in north wales and wont be again unil summer. Am looking foward to it though.
There was some bits where you had to use hands on pyg track especially when its raining and theres water running down the rocks. It was a great experience I just want to push myself further and you dont get anywhere by not doing.
Post edited at 14:04
1
Afternoon Gents,
Can anyone tell me what the conditions are like up the ridge as planning to do Crib Goch this weekend, is there ice up there?
Can anyone tell me what the conditions are like up the ridge as planning to do Crib Goch this weekend, is there ice up there?
In reply to Ben93:
I wouldn't recommend Crib Goch as a first ever hill walk. It's not desperate or serious or anything and there is nothing technical about it but it is committing and sustained and I would imagine it would feel intimidating for anyone who's never been on a mountain before. The Watkin path followed by a descent of the South Ridge will provide more than enough excitement for a first walk on Snowdon.
I wouldn't recommend Crib Goch as a first ever hill walk. It's not desperate or serious or anything and there is nothing technical about it but it is committing and sustained and I would imagine it would feel intimidating for anyone who's never been on a mountain before. The Watkin path followed by a descent of the South Ridge will provide more than enough excitement for a first walk on Snowdon.
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