UKC

Rest assured, I won't be doing this as DIY job! Just after a bit of background before speaking to a local electrician.

We need to replace the current cooker, which runs on LPG (we're out in the sticks). Unfortunately LPG ovens are now virtually unobtainable, apart from 2 models of Rangemaster, which Mrs Ridge doesn't like... Therefore electric is the way to go.

Unfortunately we have a shiny Mrs Ridge-spec kitchen with moulded splash backs and stuff, so channeling out the walls to run cables is going to get expensive, (not to mention the earache..). 2 possible options are:

Running the cable, (in conduit/trunking?), behind the fitted units at floor level or;

Down from the ceiling behind the removable stainless steel fascia that covers the extractor duct from the cooker hood. Knock a hole through the inner leaf of the cavity wall at high level, knock a second hole out behind the cooker and run the cable down the cavity, thereby not damaging the oh so precious splash back.. (I'm aware of the fun we'll have feeding 6 or 8mm cable down the cavity). All the knocking out and making good will be hidden behind the cooker and extractor if we did this.

Do the regs allow for either of the above?

Next problem would be where to fit the isolator switch. The regs state:

The horizontal distance between a cooker switch/control unit and the appliance(s) it serves must be sufficiently short for the switch to be under the control of persons relying on it for safety. This requirement is likely to be met if the distance does not exceed 2m.

To me 'control of the persons relying on it for safety' implies the 2m distance is to allow anyone working on the cooker to see some numpty approaching the isolator, rather than allowing someone using the cooker to flick the switch while in the process of being electrocuted.

The consumer unit is in a cupboard at ceiling height, 2.3m horizontally away from the appliance. I'm assuming just using the MCB isn't acceptable, (not double pole isolation), but would an isolator here, (maybe even a lockable one as it slightly exceeds the recommended 2m), be ok?

Any thoughts?

In reply to Ridge:
If the cable is hidden and not buried in the wall it needs to be protected in metal conduit. If it's on the surface it can be in plastic conduit.
Using the MCB is not ok as an isolator because it has to be a dual pole isolator and needs to be as an accessible height, not at ceiling height.

I think the distance regs are more there so that someone using the cooker can turn it off quickly in case of emergency. Electricians I've had in have little devices with padlocks on them that lock the consumer unit switches in the off position. You don't really want a big yellow and red lockable isolator in the kitchen anyway.
Have you considered a gas hob/electric oven set-up? Hobs can usually be modified simply for log and the ovens alone are on a 13a plug which is much easier to play with.
Also, calor have loads of lpg cookers for sale.
http://www.calor.co.uk/shop/in-the-home/lpg-cookers.html

In reply to gethin_allen:

Thanks Gethin. I thought as much re the MCB, plus an oven fault would trip the RCD and take out out sorts of other stuff. Reading various electrician's forums the 2m is simply a recommendation, and there's a lot of debate regarding how accessible is accessible...

There is an existing 13A socket for the cooker timer etc, but that seems a bit feeble for a decent oven, (and the gap is for a 110cm range). Plus the switch would be on the socket behind the oven anyway. You're right about the hob, it's fairly simple job to convert to LPG.

In reply to gethin_allen:
We also thought there were a few LPG ovens available. However once we tried to order one it turns out that Rangemaster, who make the bulk of the 110 LPG ovens, including the ones on the calor website, no longer provide LPG other than in the Rangemaster and Rangemaster Classic. Nice of them to let the suppliers know, poor bloke in our local shop wasn't a happy bunny when he tried to get us one!

In reply to Ridge: I am not a qualified sparky but....

the wiring regs define where you can run cables in walls with and without protection https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=cable+runs+in+walls&client=tablet-and...

I think you will need a local isolator for the cooker.

you may be able to use a shower isolator switch mounted to the ceiling if the load allows?

Imho I would go for the wall option as it's going to look a lot better if you can get round the isolator, can you use a surface mounted box adjacent to the cooker splash back?

In reply to Ridge:
Go down the cavity, but bare in mind horizontal "Noggins" which hold the uprights together could be in the way. Or use plastic mini trunking on the backside of the wall and come through from the rear of the isolator and then back out and down to the cooker.

For the isolator, you could use an surface one. It wont look pretty but you wont have to chop out the wall or the extra special splashback



As long as you can reach the isolator whilst using the cooker you should be ok.

In reply to Ridge:

From what I have experienced... 13a supply is ok for a small single oven/grill combo. Once you get to double you would need a dedicated supply.

I had to upgrade to get dedicated supply in to deal with that when I upgraded an under counter oven to a double. We got 2 45a (I think, possibly a slightly lower number) supplies fitted (one for new oven and one spare in case we decide to ditch the LPG hob and go induction eventually). Ours come in under the floor and it seemed worth while getting the second line fitted just in case while the sparky was crawling around down there.

WRT to isolation, we have the oven on an angle with a corner (i.e. there is a section of worktop making a deep 45 degree corner) and there is a cupboard to one side and a drawer unit on the other (both of which are back on the normal in line with walls cabinet runs). The sparky was able to fit 2 standard 13a socket with 45a cooker isolator type things, inside the carcass of the drawer unit without them fouling the drawers. So you can isolate simply by opening the drawer and reaching in. His interp of rules was that you didn't need to be able to see the isolator permanently and WRT to isolating in an emergency, pulling a drawer open in an emergency to access the switch was fine. The isolation is right beside the cooker so no danger of somebody turning it back on while you are working which I think is the main thing. If the cooker was on fire you wouldn't be reaching over it to turn off in a 'normal' set up, you'd use the consumer unit switch for that scenario in any case, so having them inside a cabinet was irrelevant for turning off if something went urgently wrong with cooker.

So - if you can get under the floor that might help, but otherwise in terms of where to put the isolation, it doesn't necessarily need to be 'on display' so that might give a few more options for getting the mess out of the way somewhere.... route cables in behind other appliances possibly, trunking along walls behind units and isolation inside a cupboard or drawer unit close to the cooker? This was done in 2011 or 12 I think so probably still in line with whatever version of rules we are onto now.