UKC

Cultural Appropriation of Yoga

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 Yanis Nayu 23 Nov 2015
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/23/yoga-classes-cultural-...

Apparently if you're a skinny white woman and you do a bit of yoga, you're a Very Bad Person.

How does the Guardian give voice to this shit?
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In reply to Yanis Nayu:
Is it OK in Guardian land to 'culturally appropriate' some Chinese Takeaway?
Post edited at 22:58
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

The Guardian is the home of the first world problem. Some of their opinion pieces are beyond parody.
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 JayPee630 24 Nov 2015
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

Funnily enough.... http://everydayfeminism.com/2015/11/foodie-without-appropriation/

Both are equally ridiculous IMO.
cb294 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

I saw the piece but didn´t bother reading it, as was said above, first world problems....

However, I can appreciate that someone doing yoga as a spiritual exercise, and who may even have grown up with this, may despair at the westernized, gymnastics version. Some of those derivatives are even more ridiculous. At UCSC and at UBC Vancouver you could book classes in "combat yoga", whatever that may be, perhaps an attempt at a world record in missing the point.

Similar differences can be found in the martial arts, where some people look for zen-related philosophy and perform rather yoga-like meditative exercises, while others (like me) are in it for the olympic sport of pyjama wrestling.

Back to yoga, in summer I can see our institute yoga class (run by some Indian postdocs) putting their mats on the grass in front of my office window, and have to admit they are quite a distraction.

CB
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 Postmanpat 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

I can feel a Simon4 style rant coming on. It does rather worry me that so many loony obsessions that first see the light of the day in the Grauniad end up as conventional wisdom.
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 alasdair19 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:
I spent a bit of time doing yoga in India.

the point of the exercise is to train your body to be able to sit still for long periods and facilitate medication.

we were hanging out at rishikesh and probably 10 were weterners the rest Indian pilgrims there for the religion.

My favourite religious line was.

The gange must be holy otherwise all thus bathing in it and drinking would make us ill!
 Chris the Tall 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:


> Apparently if you're a skinny white woman and you do a bit of yoga, you're a Very Bad Person.

Neither of the two writers say that, although the second does state frustration at the images of yoga being predominately skinny white women

> How does the Guardian give voice to this shit?

Although some people like to argue the Guardian likes to argue is just a left wing Daily Mail, there is a clear distinction if you care to look. These writers are not only giving different opinions, but neither is very supportive of the original decision. The intention is to make you think, rather than tell you what to think. And unlike some many articles in the Mail, it isn't promoting hatred

I've been to a few yoga classes and can't be doing with any of the spiritual nonsense - i just want some stretching and a bit of calm. It may or may not be real yoga, but that doesn't bother me. But you see the same in climbing - some climbers look down on others because all they want is exercise at a wall rather than outdoors at a crag, trad climbers look down on sports climbers because they aren't respecting the traditions of the sport.
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 pebbles 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

to be fair, this is labeled as an 'opinion piece' about a row thats appeared elsewhere, with two columnists putting opposing views. Neither columnist is endorsing the statement as implied. one says " it is by no means culturally insensitive to go to a free yoga class just because it makes you feel better. Or because you like the bending." and the other says this is "a fairly small event on a university campus" and questions why everyones making such a big deal about what a group of students have said in canada. So to use this as an example of the guardian being silly seems a tad unjustified.
 dek 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Postmanpat:

> I can feel a Simon4 style rant coming on. It does rather worry me that so many loony obsessions that first see the light of the day in the Grauniad end up as conventional wisdom.

Come now Pat....you've wondered for years, how the guardianistas can stick their heads up their own arses?...'now breathe'....
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 Fraser 24 Nov 2015
In reply to alasdair19:

> the point of the exercise is to train your body to be able to sit still for long periods and facilitate medication.

Can't you just take a pill instead? ;P
 Flinticus 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:


> Apparently if you're a skinny white woman and you do a bit of yoga, you're a Very Bad Person.

Don't see that in the piece at all, and there are two contributors to the article, one of whom say 'And to practise that, however you see fit, is absolutely fine.'

How does UKC give voice to this shit?

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OP Yanis Nayu 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Flinticus:

And the other one, rather than discussing how yoga has moved away from its Indian spiritual roots, has a whine about how people of a different colour to her do yoga. It's irrelevant and even given this irrelevancy, doesn't say what the bars to black people partaking in yoga are, possibly because there are none.
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 Chris the Tall 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

> And the other one, rather than discussing how yoga has moved away from its Indian spiritual roots, has a whine about how people of a different colour to her do yoga.

No she doesn't

She complains that the perception of yoga is that it is for skinny, flexible white women. A quick look at "yoga" on google images suggests she might have a valid point. But the only real target of any animosity seem to be people who think that doing yoga balances out their drug use !
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OP Yanis Nayu 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Chris the Tall:

> No she doesn't

> She complains that the perception of yoga is that it is for skinny, flexible white women. A quick look at "yoga" on google images suggests she might have a valid point. But the only real target of any animosity seem to be people who think that doing yoga balances out their drug use !

That's incredibly selective reading. Skinny white women attract far more ire. Why is their race relevant? What is stopping fat, black or male people doing yoga? What's wrong with the skinny white women who do yoga? Why does yoga need "wrenching away" from them?
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 mudmonkey 24 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:
> That's incredibly selective reading. Skinny white women attract far more ire. Why is their race relevant? What is stopping fat, black or male people doing yoga? What's wrong with the skinny white women who do yoga? Why does yoga need "wrenching away" from them?

Agreed : Substitute the word "black" for "white" in the second half of this article and I think most on UKC would rightly feel a little uncomfortable reading it and have something to say....
Post edited at 21:35
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 Chris the Tall 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

How on earth can you accuse me of selective reading ????

She doesn't say that it needs to be "wrenched away" from anyone. She says it needs to be "wrenched away from the perception" that its only for a skinny white elite. A huge difference. Whether she is right or wrong is another matter - she has clearly been asked to put one side of a somewhat bizarre argument- but don't deliberately omit key words in a sentence to give it a different meaning.

Why are you trying to misrepresent her argument ? She isn't saying that skinny white women shouldn't do yoga, quite the opposite. She is saying that it should be inclusive of everyone.
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OP Yanis Nayu 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Chris the Tall:

I read the title, which is helpfully in bold type face.
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 Hooo 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

> I read the title, which is helpfully in bold type face.

But did you read the rest of it? I just did, and the title is obviously bait to get you read a completely innocuous article. Both writers answer the question in the title with "No", and comment that it is a non-story. Which it is.
 Chris the Tall 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

> I read the title, which is helpfully in bold type face.

The epitome of selective reading !

That bit will have been written by a bored sub-editor who has paid about as much attention to the actual article as you have.
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 The New NickB 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Chris the Tall:

> The epitome of selective reading !

> That bit will have been written by a bored sub-editor who has paid about as much attention to the actual article as you have.

Yes, the real critisism here should be for the sub-editor, who doesn't do either contributor any favours.
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 winhill 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Chris the Tall:

> But the only real target of any animosity seem to be people who think that doing yoga balances out their drug use !

That bit is all stupid, chillums are a yogi's most personal possession. For some sadhus a walking stick and a chillum are their only material possessions.
 winhill 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

"That’s why I’d rather take my yogic lead from women like Jessamyn Stanley– fat, black, body-positive and the antithesis of the willowy white women Instagram club."

Although a cursory glance at Jessamyn's social media says that she did her 250 hour yogic mastery course under the tutelage of a skinny blond white woman called Kimberley, so I'm not sure if she understands the meaning of antithesis.
OP Yanis Nayu 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Chris the Tall:

A bored sub-editor employed by the Guardian, who read an article purporting to be about cultural appropriation of yoga and failed to notice that it doesn't actually discuss that at all. It doesn't reference Indian culture, which at least would be relevant, but is casually racist toward white women.

She is arguing that skinny, flexible white women have hijacked yoga. Well I as a fat, very inflexible man (albeit white) am the opposite in most regards and I know that there is nothing stopping me doing yoga other than I don't want to do a class. If black people want to do yoga there is nothing stopping them.

How you can continue to defend such a poorly written and inflammatory piece?
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 Andy Morley 25 Nov 2015
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

> How does the Guardian give voice to this shit?

There's lots of stupid people in this world. If you try to avoid them altogether you can unexpectedly find yourself thrown together with one and be flummoxed by the experience, so it's good to keep your hand it just a little bit. Reading the Guardian is one way to remind oneself how one faction of the greater world of stupidity thinks. You don't even have to buy it - just pick up an old copy, still does the job. The advantage is, once you've reminded yourself, you can throw it in the bin and stop taking your time up with it. So actually, the Guardian is providing a useful social service.


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