UKC

I'm thinking about a new car, looking to spend up to 9k, want something vaguely rapid, economic and stylish. Size wise I'm happy with a large hatch/small estate.

Has anyone got or had a 159?

Thoughts?

Cheers!

In reply to maybe_si:

The naesayers will all suck through their teeth and talk about depreciation, high running costs, fragility and the simple fact they don't handle as well or go as fast as one might think or expect.

The Alfa lovers will say pretty much the same but have a dreamy expression on their faces and finish off with '.... but you'll love it....'

Not much direct experience of the 159, however I had 33s in the 90s and ran a 156 (its precursor) in the noughties... in addition (seeing as I love them so much) my Dad was brought into the fold with a 146 and then a run out model (2004ish I think) 156 as his retirement cars. I've used an Alfa independent for servicing for 20 odd years now keeping my Alfas and other cars running so have also seen a lot of the cars they look after/driven assorted old crates of theirs as loan cars and had a 159 for a fortninght in Italy a few years ago.

I enjoyed the 159 - it was a 1.9 diesel which itself is an engine that is shared with GM so is the same as what's in most of the Astras, Vectras and Signums on the road. Its a decent engine etc. The 159 was stylish, comfy and generally went well and handled OK - Alfas are cars that make it feel like you are driving, they are good at making it feel like you are really going faster and harder than you are which is quite handy as you have a 'rewarding' drive but are not actually going too stupidly fast - alternatively you might feel its awful noisy and rattily at a speed you would generally expect to be cruising along at, and that may start to grate after a while........ I do personally think that they are not as robust as other makes, they are prone to glitches and even low mileage, well looked after older ones tend to develop all sorts off odd issues, and they may well end up rattling and clattering, with heating system and warning lamps (or whatever) not doing what you expect and requiring repair at vast expense, which itself causes problems as messing around too much just makes more thinsg go wrong, or leads to dashboard rattling and flapping etc.

The acid test is that by the time I got older and more sensible, the most recent Alfa was for me always a second car, I used it for a short commute and for occasional longer runs/high days and holidays. It wasn't however my first choice as the main workhorse and the longer trips/camping/climbing/DIY shop and builders yard etc has generally been done out of other more practical or mainstream cars. I still lust after a 3.2 Brera as a fun car, but if I was in the market for something 159 like as my main car I probably wouldn't buy one..

Love them to bits and if you buy it, it will be a heart decision that you will hopefully not regret... head says no for me these days.

In reply to maybe_si:
I would love one, but it's just not big enough for what I need right now. (3 young kids in proper car seats)

Some crackers kicking about - mostly down in SE England. Veloces had quite a few nice ones when I was looking

In reply to Ferret:

I currently have the same 1.9 150 engine in my Signum and am pretty happy with it, although I do like the idea of the 2.4 or newer 2.0 diesel with a bit more power?

It really is a great looking car and the second hand prices certainly seem reasonable....

In reply to maybe_si:

I could be wrong as its not a car I know in detail but is the 2.4 not an older engine that's barely any better than the 1.9? As far as Diesels go, get the newest tech you can is probably the best....

I currently run a 3.0 cdti Signum as my workhorse - great car, bombproof but bland, and the 3 litre is about as powerful as a modern 2......

Go into the Alfa with open eyes - and don't fool yourself, if it seems cheap that's great (you do get a lot of very good looking premium car for not much money at a few years old), but there will not be terribly much value left in it in another few years time so be prepared to go (quite quickly possibly) from newish, tickling the edge of 'premium/exec mkt lots of car for money', to unloved, slightly dodgy, oldish, quirky car with little residual value, that you can only sell to another 'enthusiast'....

You'll feel like a king for a few years, and then join the honourable band of Alfa fanatics pottering around waving too each other from their cherished collections of minor flaws that they are happily living with......

Enjoy the journey though! And I may be being overly pessimistic as quality did improve over time....

In reply to maybe_si:

I've got one (said with happy grin)

1.9 JTDM Turismo.

I have to say Ferret is pretty spot on; if you're after resale value and cheap maintenance you're barking up the wrong tree, but if you want to feel like you're driving something a bit more special than an astra or a mondeo it's very hard to beat.

So far, it's been very reliable - in a year's ownership I've seen no faults whatsoever (touch wood) and find it a very good motorway cruiser - whether you choose to do *insert speed of questionable legality here* or 55 it returns around 40mpg. Ideal for getting four people and four people's things a long way away.
It does fall down a little when you get to the small lanes though - it's very low and has an undertray protector that ironically makes it bottom out very easily - even tramlines left by tractors on country lanes can cause the car to touch on 'flat' sections of road, and pot-holed / wavy sections (between Stanage popular and plantation, anyone?) require some creative snaking just to stay off the deck.
That said...on the majority of [well tarmaced] A and B roads it's a joy to drive, considering it's the size of a small barge. As Ferret says it feels a bit more alive and involving than others, even if you're not actually moving all that fast. The A55 is particularly good fun.

I could go on and on...but that could get boring (and I'm supposed to be working instead of reviewing cars) so I'll just throw some stuff I like about it into the mix:
- The way it looks. Every time you walk up to it you'll be happy you didn't buy the sensible alternative.
- The dash and interior. The dash is assymetric so everything faces the driver, and the fit and finish make it a much more enjoyable (and premium-feeling) place to sit than it's rivals. It's difficult not to reuse the word 'special' for every aspect of the car, but it really does feel it from the driving seat - even with the engine off.
- The rear seats fold impressively flat, if you're sub 6-feet it's great for sleeping in the back
- Very easy motorway cruiser, good economy for what it is
- Have I mentioned the way it looks?

Things to say against it;
- Fairly harsh ride, a mate's Peugeot floats over things you really notice in the Alfa - speed bumps certainly become a bigger obstacle
- The ground clearance
- Alfa garages. Find an indie and distance yourself from Fiat.
- The beep when un/locking, though this can be turned off some obscure sub-menu

I'm going to stop this essay now - hope it's helpful, message me if you've any questions etc..

In reply to George Killaspy: Stop wasting time and just get yerself down to the Skoda garage - you know it makes sense. Could go for a vrs

In reply to obi-wan nick b:

Had a 159.Swapped to a bmw

Loved the 159, but I was always at the dealer getting some fault sorted out.Fortunatleytthey were only a couple of miles from me.

The german car is reliable and solid. But the alfa was just well Italian and great fun.

In reply to maybe_si:

any Alfa is always style over substance, but it does look very stylish which is important when you are sitting in the breakdown lane of the motorway as all those reliable boring cars pass you on the way to work.
:>)

In reply to maybe_si:

Never not owned one and over the years have had 33, 145, 147, 75, 164, 155, 156, 159 and currently Mito as daily transport the ALFA's particularly the 156/9 are good in Snow.

1.9 jtd diesel always returned great mileage to the gallon versus performance and was reliable at 20K plus miles per annum.

Keep it maintained change the oil and filters regularly.
Leave it in gear with the handbrake off in cold weather
Be prepared for electrical niggles and random lights on the dash.

Have a look at the ALFA owners forum.

As others have said heart not head rules an ALFA purchase.

In reply to maybe_si:

I'm a mega Alfa fan, I'm super sad at the moment though as I've recently sold my 156 GTA

The 159 are more solid than the 159 but still require an owner to stay on top of maintenance. The 2.4 is the one to go for. It's a shame they never did a GTA version though.

So much more interesting than the standard Skoda (yawn) etc. Do it!

In reply to maybe_si:

I had a 156 sport wagon 10 years ago, and I can't honestly say what the fuss was about. Maybe I'm not a sufficiently committed petrolhead, but it drove exactly like every other car I've had. The cabin was fairly spartan, he dash was straight off the Cortina Mk2 GLX, but the leather seats were great for transporting a child prone to car sickness.

In reply to maybe_si:

They're so pretty that if you want one you'll probably get one despite possible negatives and regardless of what anyone says! ;p

In reply to maybe_si:

I drove my brother in law's Alfa 147 GTA for a couple of months. The 3.2l one. My god it was fast and looked beautiful, but it was a constant battle with Alfa's "strong entropy" - it fell apart faster than it could be put together again.

Over a couple of years I don't think we ever got the radio to work; the windows would wind down when locking it (nice safety feature!), various alarm lights would randomly come on and the disappear for no obvious reason, and it was a close run thing between whether it consumed more oil or petrol (mpg for both being about 15). More worryingly it would intermittently develop a cyclical revs issue where it would go from 500-1500 and down again every 3 seconds. Made reversing into parking spaces *really* challenging.

Buying an Alfa, Si, is very much like making love to a beautiful woman - one who makes Mariah Carey look low maintenance and will drain you faster than you can say "can I book the car in again next week?".

In reply to maybe_si:

I'm on my second Alfa...not the 159 though, and love them!

In reply to maybe_si:

Sold my 159 2.4 (210 version) last week after 5 years.
Loved it although I did spend quite a bit on it over the years.
I'd probably buy another.

The best bit of advice I could give is to get it remapped, DPF removed and EDR turned off.
It cost me around £400 and the MPG went from 35 to 45 and the BHP from 210 to about 250.
So nice to drive. Made me smile until the very end. Only sold it as I needed a 4x4

In reply to drgrange:


Illegal?

In reply to Willi Crater:

Not sure. These guys did mine and I would recommend them.
Blurb on their site about how to do it legally

http://www.angeltuning.co.uk/

In reply to maybe_si:
Hi, I was banned but I thought I should add my knowledge of this on here. I've just read this thread and there is the usual remapping story. I have one of these in the workshop right now the one with the 2.0 diesel motor in it, 6 month ago it came into the workshop because the turbo had blown, it would have been a simple fix as it's just a step 3 garrett unit, but the Alfa compressor wheel trim was 1mm bigger on both inducer and exducer size with a different tip height too. The aftermarket hasn't as of now reverse engineered one, I have a couple of units just waiting for comp wheels which I'm trying to get pushed through development asap. So I had to fit a genuine Garrett unit which cost £700 trade, 6 month later the remap destroyed the bottom end, I pulled the crank out of it and it had gone too far for a crank regrind it would need 1mm taking off it which would be into the radius. And the new turbo comp wheel was already showing signs of overspeeding, so engine is dead.

I managed to find a secondhand motor for £1400 out of a 2012 car with 35000k on the clock from a write off and am fitting it today.

I see them all the time, egr mapped out, dpf delete, it's a waste of time. It just shortens the life of the engine and isn't good for the air we breath.

If you're going to remap a car, treat it like a race engine and drop the oil and change the filters every 5000 mile and you should be alright. Failing that stop messing about with crap engines with cast iron bottom ends and buy a decent car in the first place.

HTH