UKC

Hi

I've been looking to do Mountain Leader as a challenge and a goal to improve. I sail, so my navigation skills and weather knowledge are pretty good, but I wanted to consolidate some land skills and develop more. I'm comfortable with long walks over several days, wild camping, carrying 20kg+ and I'm currently moving on to practice night navigation, winter walking and winter wild camping. I've had 2 nights out so far this winter in 2*C and -2*C, both of which were great, but I want to get out in the snow next.

When I looked at the Mountain Leader course, it looked to be at the right level for what I wanted to do. I read the course material and I realised that I live several hours from 'mountains' and my normal spots of the Peak District, Pennines and Yorkshire Dales are out. Practically, with other commitments that means I'll struggle to do single days and I'll probably only be able to clock up time if I travelled and took a whole weekend, which will be rather rare.

So my question is: it seems like winter walking and winter wild camping are beyond the scope of Hill and Moorland Leader, but I can't practically travel to do Mountain Leader, are there any other options or is Hill and Moorland more advanced than it appears?

Thanks for your help.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

Winter walking and winter wild camping are out of scope of Mountain Leader award as well. It's the ground of Winter Mountain Leader, but to apply for that you have to hold Mountain Leader award first.

I would suggest to talk to few instructors running the Mountain Leader before booking. On my training years ago we had a man who had zero quality mountain days. In fact he had zero UK hiking days before starting the course and all his experience was from Carpathians. Instructors had no problem with that at all.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

Both awards have their challenges, the standard required for navigation for example. However it would be a shame to allow geography to play too big a role in influencing your choice. You don't know what the future holds in terms of potential days on the hill. A week's holiday in the Lakes and you've got 5-6 QMDs. Besides, if you can access the Dales you can access the Lakes?

I say this as someone who did the Old Skool WGL training and was told at the end of the course that I was on the wrong course in terms of my aspirations and experience and I should have been looking at the ML to start with.

As above on the winter camping/WML, but it is relevent- put it in the logbook- as it shows you can look after yourself.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

It was possible to do the ML training then do WGL assessment, as was. This option may still be available (check with the relevant board) and would allow you to stack the options in your favour.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

If you have multi day expedition experience and can fulfill the 20 QMD requirement I would go for ML as it is a higher level award and means you can operate on both ML and HML terrain.

The standard of navigation required is the same but the terrain operated on is different. ML also expects you to be able to operate comfortably on steep and broken ground. You can count days in HML terrain to your QMDs but you would also need a substantial part of your experience to be in ML terrain. Remember that both ML and HML are only for "summer" conditions, though experience in winter is welcome.

If you have any questions I suggest you ask Mountain Training as they would be happy to help.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

If you've got snowy aspirations then the ML is the one so you can move on to the winter ML in due course.

I know people who have gone right through the scheme to MIC that live in the SW of the UK, if you want it enough you'll make it work. I finished my ML and did my MIA training whilst living in Dorset before moving to North Wales.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

Demographically wise the SE of England has more ML's than any region outside the lakes and as far as I know they don't even have any hill's as we see them. My advice would be get the QMD's for ML training then decide from there. For what its worth many people just do the training to improve their personnel skills, without any aspirations of using it for work.

In reply to all:

Thanks everyone, I realise I got the criteria the wrong way round somehow and you've helped clear that up and answer my questions. I thought it was 60 mountain days, but it's 60 hours contact time. That's how people in the SE can do it

Thanks very much, I'll go for mountain leader

In reply to NobleWanderer:

60 hours contact time is for the training course itself.

By the time you attend an assessment you must have logged an absolute minimum of 40 quality mountain days in at least 3 areas.

In reply to NobleWanderer:If you are not already going to the mountains there is no point being an ML. Go and do a skills course the cost of an full ML course is alot so if your not already experienced it defeats the point.