UKC

If I were to go out of my way to help you today, would you expect me to ignore you or abuse you tomorrow?

I’ll stress before I explain that I am not generalising and assuming this is the norm, but for a small sample of 3 people I’ve met recently, this is what I’ve found.

I’ve met 3 men who have been or are in the army and have all served in Afghanistan. These 3 men are also among the most outspoken in their hatred of asylum seekers I have come across.

They tell stories of how grim it is over in Afghanistan and some of the things they’ve witnessed, yet seem to have zero appreciation that they hate a group of people for wanting to escape those same things they were fighting against.

I suppose in some ways it’s just some nimbyism as asylum seekers are certainly portrayed as a burden and problem but surely there's hypocrisy with wanting to help them over there and then hating them over here.

I’m told the armed forces are made up of heroes fighting for good causes but I’m losing faith in these guys at least and thinking they just joined as teens looking for adventure and a fight.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

I'm thinking the armed forces are a mixture of people who joined for a mixture of reasons.

In reply to Timmd:

yes, you're right, I'm certainly not looking to tar the entire forces, but trying to work out these particular chaps.

Looking at a similar situation on a different scale though, I guess if I bought a coffee for a homeless man and then he appeared on my doorstep later on hoping to join me and my family for dinner, I'd feel equally hypocritically uneasy.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:
Perhaps there's an association in their minds with the horrors they've seen, and they're averse to it 'coming home' having thought they'd left it behind when they left where they were fighting?

In relation to something quite different, my Dad has always been very out spoken in being averse to the idea of staying in a caravan and the whole concept, and then I learnt that on a (staying in caravans) club winter climbing trip in Scotland before I was born, he fell off Devil's Ridge and badly injured his knee and they lost one of their group to injuries he sustained falling down a gully, it set me pondering if that had anything to do with it. Or he might just hate caravans.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

I went through army officer selection over ten years ago - never joined for a number of reasons, but my reasons for considering joining were adventure, the opportunity to do many outdoor activities at someone else's expense, and what many might view as an old fashioned view of serving one's country. Helping to reduce someone else's poverty or improve their circumstances was not really part of that.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:
I can assure you now that its not just a "bunch of teens looking for a fight" and anyone with such sociopathic tendencies gets quickly weeded out. And you would be surprised how many people drop out after the "Realities of War" lecture. The Military far from glorifies war, despite what the media tells you. Or this Xbox generation that think signing up is like Call Of Duty.

Many different people, from lots of different walks of life, join the Military for lots of different reasons. Some are looking for adventure, some are trying to escape, some just dont know what to do with themselves. This brings a lot of different opinions and thoughts.

To address your issue of the Refugee and Immigration problem, maybe its frustration at the fact that perople think just opening the floodgates will instantly solve the problem, rather than dilute it and spread it around. Yes you are quite right we probably should be helping such people, however just inviting them in, and not getting to the root of the problem and solving it, is not the answer. And some people just dont want to be helped.

Lets not think of the Military as some violent organisation permitting murder and death. Yes some situations may require aggression and violence of action. And on the other foot, why do you think a lot of soldiers have a lack of faith in Civilians, when they arent even going to take on board the immense good they do, the humanitarian aid. Helping with the Floods, the Tsunami, Earthquakes. The list goes on.

And please dont think or say that people in the forces are "Heroes" some would find it incerdibly patronising and a bit undeserved. If anyone are the "Heroes" its the lads and lasses that never made it back, and made the ultimate sacrifice.

In reply to Bootrock:
>Lets not think of the Military as some violent organisation permitting murder and death.


No they're a violent organisation whose business is murder and death.

And please dont think or say that people in the forces are "Heroes"

That annoys me too.

I await the dislikes.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:
If I were to go out of my way to help you today, would you expect me to ignore you or abuse you tomorrow?

I'll stress before I explain that I am not generalising and assuming this is the norm, but for a small sample of 3 people I've met recently, this is what I've found.

I've met 3 men who are asylum seekers from Afghanistan/Syria. These 3 men are also among the most outspoken in their hatred of women, jews, gays and kuffars I have come across.

They tell stories of how grim it is over in Afghanistan and some of the things they've witnessed, yet seem to have zero appreciation that they hate a group of people for wanting to give them asylum, and are keen to recreate the same misogynistic, mediaeval shithole over here.

I suppose in some ways it's just some nimbyism as asylum seekers are certainly portrayed as entirely consisting of families of doctors and engineers with sweet children who cure cancer, but surely there's hypocrisy somewhere as they go on mass sexual assaults across Europe and Scandinavia.

I'm told the asylum seekers are made up of highly educated liberals who will benefit Europe, but I'm losing faith in these guys at least and thinking they came here as teens looking for adventure, a fight and a bit of Tarrahush Gamea...

(Just tweaked the above a bit from the OP)


Now, does the above sound a teeny bit like extrapolating the behaviours of some onto an entire population?

Never been to Afghanistan or Iraq, but I have dug up the odd mass grave and found a mutilated body here or there, not too far from where Torvil and Dean were skating about a few years previously. Lets just say I can see the current levels of migration, and media denial of unpalatable facts about a subset of those migrants, ending up in a similar situation. I'm certainly no hero, but I'm getting too old to go through all that ethnic cleansing shit again.