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In reply to Gone for good:
John Arran of this forum is leading the climbing team as well I believe. Just started watching it. Looks amazing so far
John Arran of this forum is leading the climbing team as well I believe. Just started watching it. Looks amazing so far
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In reply to Gone for good:
Just started watching. Looks the dogs bollocks so far.
Just started watching. Looks the dogs bollocks so far.
Post edited at 20:35
In reply to Greasy Prusiks:
I can't say Mr Backshall is the most positive belayer I have come across.
I can't say Mr Backshall is the most positive belayer I have come across.
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In reply to pebbles:
Never mind the spider what about the wasp!
I hate wasps and if I had seen that one I would have ran away with the speed of Usain Bolt.
Never mind the spider what about the wasp!
I hate wasps and if I had seen that one I would have ran away with the speed of Usain Bolt.
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Loved every minute of it, a proper adventure!
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In reply to Gone for good:
Considering the position they were in he could have been worse!
Full respect to John for leading those pitches.
Considering the position they were in he could have been worse!
Full respect to John for leading those pitches.
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In reply to neuromancer:
Yeah, I wondered about that, not having done anything expeditiony...was it there for camera crew, or for Steve B's celebrity insurance bill without it? Or is it considered ok abroad if nothing natural for portaledges etc? They certainly didn't SHOW anyone drilling.
Still, great prog, my mum texted to tell me it wad on. Very glad she didn't watch it though.
Yeah, I wondered about that, not having done anything expeditiony...was it there for camera crew, or for Steve B's celebrity insurance bill without it? Or is it considered ok abroad if nothing natural for portaledges etc? They certainly didn't SHOW anyone drilling.
Still, great prog, my mum texted to tell me it wad on. Very glad she didn't watch it though.
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In reply to neuromancer:
Well, if you fancy popping back and chopping them, feel free - I'm sure you'll have errr "fun"
JW
Well, if you fancy popping back and chopping them, feel free - I'm sure you'll have errr "fun"
JW
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In reply to Gone for good:
For more tepui adventures check out "The Vulture's Garden" from our own Strappo on page 53.
https://issuu.com/rock-and-ice/docs/189/1?e=1647928/3970908
Persistence - or what?
For more tepui adventures check out "The Vulture's Garden" from our own Strappo on page 53.
https://issuu.com/rock-and-ice/docs/189/1?e=1647928/3970908
Persistence - or what?
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In reply to Gone for good:
There's a video on Youtube of him climbing Mt Asgard on Baffin. He certainly gets after it in some wild places
There's a video on Youtube of him climbing Mt Asgard on Baffin. He certainly gets after it in some wild places
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In reply to Greasy Prusiks:
Peak limestone would make essential training for this I would have thought.
Peak limestone would make essential training for this I would have thought.
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In reply to Gone for good:
I think there will always be flaws in making TV, when you have to get a camera and crew into location, but at least he is more genuine and realistic than some TV adventurers. He did some interviews with some other adventurers on R4 last year, which were quite good too.
I think there will always be flaws in making TV, when you have to get a camera and crew into location, but at least he is more genuine and realistic than some TV adventurers. He did some interviews with some other adventurers on R4 last year, which were quite good too.
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In reply to Gone for good:
I started watching this wondering whether it was going to be one of those programmes full of false jeopardy and annoying 'coming up next' pieces. But glad it wasn't. Those guys looked proper sh!t scared at the end, even the excitable Steve was a bit more 'real', which brought home the seriousness of the climb well - not that I enjoy seeing folks fearing they might die or anything!
I started watching this wondering whether it was going to be one of those programmes full of false jeopardy and annoying 'coming up next' pieces. But glad it wasn't. Those guys looked proper sh!t scared at the end, even the excitable Steve was a bit more 'real', which brought home the seriousness of the climb well - not that I enjoy seeing folks fearing they might die or anything!
Post edited at 08:41
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In reply to summo:
This is what endears him to people i think. He has a go and gets stuck in but doesn't take credit for what other people do nor does he pretend it things are extreme, he describes them "accurately" to his feelings, i.e this this amazing or "I'm proper scared".
> but at least he is more genuine and realistic than some TV adventurers.
This is what endears him to people i think. He has a go and gets stuck in but doesn't take credit for what other people do nor does he pretend it things are extreme, he describes them "accurately" to his feelings, i.e this this amazing or "I'm proper scared".
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In reply to neuromancer:
I'd be interested to know what the ethics/decisions were on bolting. It's a real taboo in the UK but is more acceptable in other countries, especially for belays. John and Ivan have done FAs on other tepui so I'd imagine they were in tune to the local ethic.
I'd be interested to know what the ethics/decisions were on bolting. It's a real taboo in the UK but is more acceptable in other countries, especially for belays. John and Ivan have done FAs on other tepui so I'd imagine they were in tune to the local ethic.
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In reply to Gone for good:
My bolt question was only in jest
On a similar line -
I can't help also but ask; when they were musing about the "only way to the top", of these "never before explored isolated wildernesses", why they couldn't just like, land a helicopter on top? (and then fix cables for the film crews? maybe they did that?)
I mean it would have probably been less of an extreme mountain adventure then though.
My bolt question was only in jest
On a similar line -
I can't help also but ask; when they were musing about the "only way to the top", of these "never before explored isolated wildernesses", why they couldn't just like, land a helicopter on top? (and then fix cables for the film crews? maybe they did that?)
I mean it would have probably been less of an extreme mountain adventure then though.
Post edited at 08:57
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In reply to Gone for good:
Id been wracking my brain through the whole thing trying to remember what I had seen John in before.
Turns out it was the video ''Esoterica'' so id imagine he is quite at home on minging wet pitches, crappy rock and generally horrible climbs.
And yes, what a negative nancy Backshaw is.
Good show to watch though, a little more honest than the usual TV adventurer drivel
Id been wracking my brain through the whole thing trying to remember what I had seen John in before.
Turns out it was the video ''Esoterica'' so id imagine he is quite at home on minging wet pitches, crappy rock and generally horrible climbs.
And yes, what a negative nancy Backshaw is.
Good show to watch though, a little more honest than the usual TV adventurer drivel
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In reply to neuromancer:
Regarding the bolting situation, I have made it known many times that I am opposed in principle to bolts on tepuis to make climbs easier. That is not to say that I haven't placed bolts on tepuis, but I have done so only where no reasonable belay, bivi or hauling point can be made with other gear, and never ever as protection mid-pitch. I am aware that this is a compromise situation and I find it more rewarding when a tepui route does not end up needing any bolts at all (there was one 600m E6 where we placed not a single bolt or peg, and even managed to descend by abseil without leaving so much as a piece of tat - that really is the ideal outcome but unfortunately rarely achievable in practice.) I was impressed that the BBC was sympathetic to my concerns and we had a good understanding that bolts would only be placed if necessary in those situations.
As it turned out, this particular tepui had very much fewer options for removable gear than most of the others I've climbed, and on several occasions there simply was no alternative to bolting at a belay stance (without reversing much of the scary pitch anyway - a particularly uninviting prospect!) Imagine arriving at the top of a very scary E6 or E7 pitch to find a ledge with not a single option for non-drilled protection. Amazingly this happened twice on the same climb and in the circumstances I thought bolting a belay at those stances was justified.
Regarding the bolting situation, I have made it known many times that I am opposed in principle to bolts on tepuis to make climbs easier. That is not to say that I haven't placed bolts on tepuis, but I have done so only where no reasonable belay, bivi or hauling point can be made with other gear, and never ever as protection mid-pitch. I am aware that this is a compromise situation and I find it more rewarding when a tepui route does not end up needing any bolts at all (there was one 600m E6 where we placed not a single bolt or peg, and even managed to descend by abseil without leaving so much as a piece of tat - that really is the ideal outcome but unfortunately rarely achievable in practice.) I was impressed that the BBC was sympathetic to my concerns and we had a good understanding that bolts would only be placed if necessary in those situations.
As it turned out, this particular tepui had very much fewer options for removable gear than most of the others I've climbed, and on several occasions there simply was no alternative to bolting at a belay stance (without reversing much of the scary pitch anyway - a particularly uninviting prospect!) Imagine arriving at the top of a very scary E6 or E7 pitch to find a ledge with not a single option for non-drilled protection. Amazingly this happened twice on the same climb and in the circumstances I thought bolting a belay at those stances was justified.
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In reply to Gone for good:
Really enjoyed the program last night, was very impressed with John's ability to turn on the very brittish 'stiff upper lip' in the face of some atrocious conditions, however, the finest example of stoisism had to come from Steve Backshall when stung not once but twice by this !
http://www.wired.com/2015/07/absurd-creature-of-the-week-tarantula-hawk/
Ouch !!
Really enjoyed the program last night, was very impressed with John's ability to turn on the very brittish 'stiff upper lip' in the face of some atrocious conditions, however, the finest example of stoisism had to come from Steve Backshall when stung not once but twice by this !
http://www.wired.com/2015/07/absurd-creature-of-the-week-tarantula-hawk/
Ouch !!
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In reply to Gone for good:
Enjoyed this far more than I thought I would after the slightly OTT BBC trailers ("we're all going to die... !"
The first pitch looked absolutely desperate on that wet slimy stuff - followed by steep dry loose stuff. Great adventure.
I was hooked on the close ups of the climbing but less enthusiastic about the pieces to camera. Lets hope Steve wasn't belaying at those points, jabbering away without paying much attention.
Enjoyed this far more than I thought I would after the slightly OTT BBC trailers ("we're all going to die... !"
The first pitch looked absolutely desperate on that wet slimy stuff - followed by steep dry loose stuff. Great adventure.
I was hooked on the close ups of the climbing but less enthusiastic about the pieces to camera. Lets hope Steve wasn't belaying at those points, jabbering away without paying much attention.
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Just to add that I'm glad it's clear that none of the crew were hamming up any emotion. We all got a lot more adventure than we were expecting and the reactions of the others to finding themselves in such a 'real deal' situation were plainly genuine. For me that sets this film apart from virtually all others; the shame is that if we'd been able to reliably predict the situations we'd find ourselves in on the wall the filming never would have gone ahead!
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In reply to galpinos:
Agreed. After seeing John Arran fall off before reaching the first ledge I was confidently telling myself I wouldnt have been able to make the first move on the green slimy rock never mind any of the moves that led to the fall. And the weather conditions were truly awful. Hats off to the whole team for getting up there. (I had a sneaky look at Johns profile halfway through the programme and see he has attempted E10. Thats what summed up the level of difficulty for me)
Agreed. After seeing John Arran fall off before reaching the first ledge I was confidently telling myself I wouldnt have been able to make the first move on the green slimy rock never mind any of the moves that led to the fall. And the weather conditions were truly awful. Hats off to the whole team for getting up there. (I had a sneaky look at Johns profile halfway through the programme and see he has attempted E10. Thats what summed up the level of difficulty for me)
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In reply to john arran:
Fantastic to watch John an amazing adventure by the looks of it. Can't wait for the next episode, don't spoil it!!
Fantastic to watch John an amazing adventure by the looks of it. Can't wait for the next episode, don't spoil it!!
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In reply to Removed User:
I thought it was Wintours Leap at first
> Peak limestone would make essential training for this I would have thought.
I thought it was Wintours Leap at first
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In reply to galpinos:
I'd second that - it worked on so many levels and had the entire family (both climbers and not/young and old) enthralled for the entire hour.
> You should be proud John, it's a really good documentary.
I'd second that - it worked on so many levels and had the entire family (both climbers and not/young and old) enthralled for the entire hour.
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In reply to john arran:
Agree with the comments above. an amazing bit of real life, as it happens adventure! that 30 ft fall made me shit myself. Climbing on crumbly rock is never ideal, but having to trust that your gear is going to hold is another matter altogether.
Looking forward to the next installment!!!!
Agree with the comments above. an amazing bit of real life, as it happens adventure! that 30 ft fall made me shit myself. Climbing on crumbly rock is never ideal, but having to trust that your gear is going to hold is another matter altogether.
Looking forward to the next installment!!!!
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In reply to More-On:
Third that. Much better than many so called adventure progs you see these days. It genuinely looked like the brown adrenaline would kick in at any moment. No fake jeopardy enhanced by a fast tempo drum beat sound track.
Well done John and all those involved.
Third that. Much better than many so called adventure progs you see these days. It genuinely looked like the brown adrenaline would kick in at any moment. No fake jeopardy enhanced by a fast tempo drum beat sound track.
Well done John and all those involved.
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In reply to john arran:
I'd just like to say well done on a brilliant piece of television.just the thought of doing a first accent in such a remote,scary place is terrifying enough, never mind actually doing it and having it documented too. I've always liked that Steve bloke, he comes across as a genuine nice guy. Well done again.
I'd just like to say well done on a brilliant piece of television.just the thought of doing a first accent in such a remote,scary place is terrifying enough, never mind actually doing it and having it documented too. I've always liked that Steve bloke, he comes across as a genuine nice guy. Well done again.
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In reply to Gone for good:
Enjoyed this. FWIW anyone who doubts Mr Backshaw's commitment to adventure need only look at him undertaking the bullet ant ritual. Gruesome.
Enjoyed this. FWIW anyone who doubts Mr Backshaw's commitment to adventure need only look at him undertaking the bullet ant ritual. Gruesome.
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In reply to Wsdconst:
Voice-over technology is quite advanced nowadays......
> I'd just like to say well done on a brilliant piece of television.just the thought of doing a first accent in such a remote,scary place is terrifying enough,
Voice-over technology is quite advanced nowadays......
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In reply to Bulls Crack:
Haha, well spotted, I did notice it after but couldn't be arsed to change it.
Haha, well spotted, I did notice it after but couldn't be arsed to change it.
In reply to john arran:
I was really impressed with your climbing John. When you were bridging up that steep wall the climbing looked nails but was also a pitch I wouldn't have minded to tackle (but without all the bugs). However you need to go on a course in root and sapling pulling. A neccessary skill I suspect in that region. It would be interesting to know what you would have graded the individual pitches once established on the route. I noticed that the initial pitches were done in trainers?
All in all, very good television. A niece bought me Steve's autobiography for Xmas so I might now get around to reading it. I had no idea who he was as he is not mainstream climbing. Looking forward to part 2 and I am assuming that you all did make the top, or would that be telling!
I was really impressed with your climbing John. When you were bridging up that steep wall the climbing looked nails but was also a pitch I wouldn't have minded to tackle (but without all the bugs). However you need to go on a course in root and sapling pulling. A neccessary skill I suspect in that region. It would be interesting to know what you would have graded the individual pitches once established on the route. I noticed that the initial pitches were done in trainers?
All in all, very good television. A niece bought me Steve's autobiography for Xmas so I might now get around to reading it. I had no idea who he was as he is not mainstream climbing. Looking forward to part 2 and I am assuming that you all did make the top, or would that be telling!
Post edited at 19:35
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In reply to john arran:
I loved it! Most of all I loved the honesty. Steve Backshaw always comes across as the kind of person you could have a natter with - where most celebs I'd go out my way to avoid.
I have to admit though, of all the scary things, the one that had me muttering at the screen was the spider - I had a proper 'Well don't go poking it and picking it up then!' moment!
I loved it! Most of all I loved the honesty. Steve Backshaw always comes across as the kind of person you could have a natter with - where most celebs I'd go out my way to avoid.
I have to admit though, of all the scary things, the one that had me muttering at the screen was the spider - I had a proper 'Well don't go poking it and picking it up then!' moment!
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Thanks everyone for the positive words.
Sean, none of the climbing itself was in trainers. I was wearing Boreal Marduk shoes, which I can heartily recommend for anyone who wants a shoe they can wear pretty much all day and yet still performs really well. If you have Steve's autobiography then you might spot in it a few bits and pieces that look quite familiar, since Steve and I did a climb together on a different tepui some years ago now for a programme called Lost Land of the Jaguar. On that one I was looking for ways to spice it up, whereas on this one I was desperate for any way to tone it down!
Thanks everyone for the positive words.
Sean, none of the climbing itself was in trainers. I was wearing Boreal Marduk shoes, which I can heartily recommend for anyone who wants a shoe they can wear pretty much all day and yet still performs really well. If you have Steve's autobiography then you might spot in it a few bits and pieces that look quite familiar, since Steve and I did a climb together on a different tepui some years ago now for a programme called Lost Land of the Jaguar. On that one I was looking for ways to spice it up, whereas on this one I was desperate for any way to tone it down!
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In reply to john arran:
I really enjoyed watching the first episode. I can't wait to see the next one... As a spoiler, can you let us know whether you managed to return from Venezuela?
I really enjoyed watching the first episode. I can't wait to see the next one... As a spoiler, can you let us know whether you managed to return from Venezuela?
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In reply to john arran:
Another thumbs up from me John, really enjoyed it! The irony of "Vertical Limit" being shown on another channel at the same time wasn't lost on ne
JW
Another thumbs up from me John, really enjoyed it! The irony of "Vertical Limit" being shown on another channel at the same time wasn't lost on ne
JW
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In reply to digby:
"some people like five star hotels, here we have a billion star hotel"
made me chuckle
> 'Bear' Grylls should be made to eat the video.
"some people like five star hotels, here we have a billion star hotel"
made me chuckle
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In reply to galpinos:
He's done some pretty scary stuff. I'm thinking of him partnering Ola Jordan on Strictly Come Dancing. Terrifying woman.
He's done some pretty scary stuff. I'm thinking of him partnering Ola Jordan on Strictly Come Dancing. Terrifying woman.
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In reply to Dr.S at work:
I didn't notice that at the time. Very dry!
Even my missus said as we were watching the programme "this is miles better than the rubbish that Bear Grylls does".
I liked the way John was talking to the rock as he was climbing. I do that too. On VDiffs... ("Are you a hold? Let's assume that, for the purposes of this exercise, you are." Overheard on King Bee, Creag Dubh - by my leader as I was climbing up to join him at the second belay stance.)
> > 'Bear' Grylls should be made to eat the video.
> "some people like five star hotels, here we have a billion star hotel"
> made me chuckle
I didn't notice that at the time. Very dry!
Even my missus said as we were watching the programme "this is miles better than the rubbish that Bear Grylls does".
I liked the way John was talking to the rock as he was climbing. I do that too. On VDiffs... ("Are you a hold? Let's assume that, for the purposes of this exercise, you are." Overheard on King Bee, Creag Dubh - by my leader as I was climbing up to join him at the second belay stance.)
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In reply to Gone for good:
Saw this on iplayer yesterday. It ended up being much more emotional than I thought it was going to be at the beginning! Really good effort, to all involved.
Saw this on iplayer yesterday. It ended up being much more emotional than I thought it was going to be at the beginning! Really good effort, to all involved.
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In reply to Gone for good:
I watched an it was some thing I'd love to do. I would wan to be a lot more experienced, together and committed than steve back shaw was before I tried it though! Cool tv.
I watched an it was some thing I'd love to do. I would wan to be a lot more experienced, together and committed than steve back shaw was before I tried it though! Cool tv.
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In reply to purplemonkeyelephant:
Ah! This one, presumably:
youtube.com/watch?v=yCSzwnUczcw&
It's slightly less interesting purely from a climber's point of view - the actual climbing itself doesn't start until about halfway through, and very little detail is shown - but it's stuffed with fantastic scenery which I'm sure will give it greater appeal to a mainstream target audience. Of interest to climbers however, and not entirely for the best reason, is the one bit that is shown in some detail - "Lizzy" leading the lower part of the penultimate (crux) pitch, presumably up to the point when fading light would have called a halt to filming. With due apologies for a slightly pedantic thread hijack, it's somewhat disappointing to note that what looks very much like a line of bolts has appeared up the wall immediately right of the crack; at the highest point shown she has the first two bolts clipped as her last two runners, and two or three more are visible above her. I should stress that there are absolutely no grounds for suggesting that Steve B and his team had anything to do with their installation; I would imagine that the route has become quite popular in recent years, and many people will have been up there.
A quick search turned up this old UKC thread from 2003,
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=54242&v=1#x720161
wherein "Dru" reports that the crux can now be by-passed by aiding "up scary bolts on the outer edge". That sounds more like a description of the rock immediately left of the crack rather than right; and the bolts in the video look substantial not "scary". One therefore assumes that the earlier bolts, far from being chopped as a very inappropriate bit of retro-fitting, have sadly been replaced with something more robust in what was seen as a more convenient position. I'm sure it will of interest to many people if anyone is able to shed more light on this.
> There's a video on Youtube of him climbing Mt Asgard on Baffin. He certainly gets after it in some wild places
Ah! This one, presumably:
youtube.com/watch?v=yCSzwnUczcw&
It's slightly less interesting purely from a climber's point of view - the actual climbing itself doesn't start until about halfway through, and very little detail is shown - but it's stuffed with fantastic scenery which I'm sure will give it greater appeal to a mainstream target audience. Of interest to climbers however, and not entirely for the best reason, is the one bit that is shown in some detail - "Lizzy" leading the lower part of the penultimate (crux) pitch, presumably up to the point when fading light would have called a halt to filming. With due apologies for a slightly pedantic thread hijack, it's somewhat disappointing to note that what looks very much like a line of bolts has appeared up the wall immediately right of the crack; at the highest point shown she has the first two bolts clipped as her last two runners, and two or three more are visible above her. I should stress that there are absolutely no grounds for suggesting that Steve B and his team had anything to do with their installation; I would imagine that the route has become quite popular in recent years, and many people will have been up there.
A quick search turned up this old UKC thread from 2003,
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=54242&v=1#x720161
wherein "Dru" reports that the crux can now be by-passed by aiding "up scary bolts on the outer edge". That sounds more like a description of the rock immediately left of the crack rather than right; and the bolts in the video look substantial not "scary". One therefore assumes that the earlier bolts, far from being chopped as a very inappropriate bit of retro-fitting, have sadly been replaced with something more robust in what was seen as a more convenient position. I'm sure it will of interest to many people if anyone is able to shed more light on this.
Thoroughly enjoyed this tonight on iplayer, more of the same please BBC.
In reply to john arran:
Watched this last night, the woman and I thoroughly enjoyed it.
Excellent work John, your balls must weigh as much as your rack, and with a significantly higher steel content!
Watched this last night, the woman and I thoroughly enjoyed it.
Excellent work John, your balls must weigh as much as your rack, and with a significantly higher steel content!
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In reply to john arran:
Stonking stuff John... edge of the seat for me and Moff as it looked genuinely terrifying, can't wait for episode 2. Steve seems like great fun to be with even if his animal exploits often seem more bonkers than climbing (juggling seriously poisonous spiders on his hat ffs).
Stonking stuff John... edge of the seat for me and Moff as it looked genuinely terrifying, can't wait for episode 2. Steve seems like great fun to be with even if his animal exploits often seem more bonkers than climbing (juggling seriously poisonous spiders on his hat ffs).
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In reply to Offwidth:
I was convinced I'd already seen this, but I think it was confusion with Land Of The Jaguars and the Monty Halls / Leo Houlding expedition show recently.
Convinced I've heard Scorpion Belay before, though.
I was convinced I'd already seen this, but I think it was confusion with Land Of The Jaguars and the Monty Halls / Leo Houlding expedition show recently.
Convinced I've heard Scorpion Belay before, though.
In reply to Gone for good:
Brilliant viewing. Must remenber the "some people like five star hotels, here we have a billion star hotel" quote for the next time some snotty git brags about staying in a 5* hotel after asking me how my camping trip went!
Brilliant viewing. Must remenber the "some people like five star hotels, here we have a billion star hotel" quote for the next time some snotty git brags about staying in a 5* hotel after asking me how my camping trip went!
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In reply to GravitySucks:
Yes, he just said 'ouch' and carried on.
> Really enjoyed the program last night, was very impressed with John's ability to turn on the very brittish 'stiff upper lip' in the face of some atrocious conditions, however, the finest example of stoisism had to come from Steve Backshall when stung not once but twice by this !
> Ouch !!
Yes, he just said 'ouch' and carried on.
Post edited at 23:28
In reply to Gone for good:
Superb programme, and really did give me the heebies when he took that fall!
Superb programme, and really did give me the heebies when he took that fall!
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In reply to john arran:
How do you place your bolts? Do you have a powerdrill, or are you using a RocPec type hand drill?
How do you place your bolts? Do you have a powerdrill, or are you using a RocPec type hand drill?
In reply to Baron Weasel:
The only issue for me is what gets placed and what gets left. On most Tepui climbs the likelihood of drilling hasn't merited the hassle and expense of taking a power drill, so bolts typically have been hand drilled. This trip was an exception in that it could be relatively well supported in terms of kit and personnel, so the time and effort of hand drilling could be avoided. The decisions as to what and where to drill were not affected.
> How do you place your bolts? Do you have a powerdrill, or are you using a RocPec type hand drill?
The only issue for me is what gets placed and what gets left. On most Tepui climbs the likelihood of drilling hasn't merited the hassle and expense of taking a power drill, so bolts typically have been hand drilled. This trip was an exception in that it could be relatively well supported in terms of kit and personnel, so the time and effort of hand drilling could be avoided. The decisions as to what and where to drill were not affected.
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In reply to Gone for good:
Sod that cave, going down there would be my worst nightmare. Nothing on earth would have me crawling through those cracks.
Wouldn't have minded the abseil, that looked great.
> Indeed. The cave beckons!
Sod that cave, going down there would be my worst nightmare. Nothing on earth would have me crawling through those cracks.
Wouldn't have minded the abseil, that looked great.
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In reply to Moley:
Interesting username youve chosen then
> Sod that cave, going down there would be my worst nightmare.
Interesting username youve chosen then
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In reply to Moley:
The seedy looking cricket would readily crawl through the cracks-amazing creature.
The seedy looking cricket would readily crawl through the cracks-amazing creature.
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In reply to Gone for good:
Thought the caving part was by far more exciting than the climbing!!! very unusual.
Thought the caving part was by far more exciting than the climbing!!! very unusual.
In reply to nigel baker:
They all looked a damn sight more relaxed down the cave then up on the wall - a roofed in ramble
Chris
> Thought the caving part was by far more exciting than the climbing!!! very unusual.
They all looked a damn sight more relaxed down the cave then up on the wall - a roofed in ramble
Chris
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In reply to Chris Craggs:
Some years ago I went down a coal mine and went to the coal face. I remember stooping there among a forest of hydraulic props with the "ceiling" mere inches above. It felt quite claustrophobic and I had this horrifying thought of all that rock and coal collapsing on top of us. The scenes in that cave brought it back quite vividly.
Some years ago I went down a coal mine and went to the coal face. I remember stooping there among a forest of hydraulic props with the "ceiling" mere inches above. It felt quite claustrophobic and I had this horrifying thought of all that rock and coal collapsing on top of us. The scenes in that cave brought it back quite vividly.
In reply to Gone for good:
The caving bit was very impressive, both the filming and the cave itself.
On the abseil at the end I did wonder about them throwing the ropes down, on multi-pitch, pull-down abseils like this, I've always fed the rope out of a bag as I abseiled down in order to avoid tangles and hang-ups...............
The caving bit was very impressive, both the filming and the cave itself.
On the abseil at the end I did wonder about them throwing the ropes down, on multi-pitch, pull-down abseils like this, I've always fed the rope out of a bag as I abseiled down in order to avoid tangles and hang-ups...............
In reply to Tricky Dicky:
Really? So you pull it down and rebag it after each abseil? Do you have a specific rope bag or just use a rucksack?
Chris
> On the abseil at the end I did wonder about them throwing the ropes down, on multi-pitch, pull-down abseils like this, I've always fed the rope out of a bag as I abseiled down in order to avoid tangles and hang-ups...............
Really? So you pull it down and rebag it after each abseil? Do you have a specific rope bag or just use a rucksack?
Chris
1
In reply to Gone for good:
Gutted I missed this last night. Does anyone know of somewhere you can watch it from outside the UK?
Gutted I missed this last night. Does anyone know of somewhere you can watch it from outside the UK?
In reply to sensibleken:
Install Hola and tell it you want to connect as though in the UK. I use the Hola Chrome extension and it works really well for me from most countries. It's free as well, and as far as I can tell it has no additional security risk (possibly the reverse).
edit: spelling
> Gutted I missed this last night. Does anyone know of somewhere you can watch it from outside the UK?
Install Hola and tell it you want to connect as though in the UK. I use the Hola Chrome extension and it works really well for me from most countries. It's free as well, and as far as I can tell it has no additional security risk (possibly the reverse).
edit: spelling
Post edited at 16:30
2
In reply to john arran:
It was one of the best exploration films I've seen on mainstream TV. Whilst a shame that the new route couldn't be finished within the available time (or maybe at all), the overall result was very good watching and informative.
It was one of the best exploration films I've seen on mainstream TV. Whilst a shame that the new route couldn't be finished within the available time (or maybe at all), the overall result was very good watching and informative.
In reply to Chris Craggs:
Yes, stuff it into a rope bag. (This is caving SRT - Single Rope Technique, so maybe things are different above ground)
> Really? So you pull it down and rebag it after each abseil? Do you have a specific rope bag or just use a rucksack?
> Chris
Yes, stuff it into a rope bag. (This is caving SRT - Single Rope Technique, so maybe things are different above ground)
In reply to Tricky Dicky:
When you pull a rope down a multi-pitch it invariably ends up plenty of the way down the next pitch anyway. You then have the option of either pulling it all up again to sort it out or sorting it out on the way down. If it's caught on trees or flakes part-way down you won't be able to pull it up anyway so the choice will be made for you. Either way if you get 15 or 20m down before the problem you'll have 15 or 20m less rope to pull up while sorting it out. Maybe caving is different because more often the rope lands nearby rather than continuing down after you pull it? Or maybe it's different because in climbing you almost always will want to be abseiling right past where the rope will have fallen, so it will be easier to sort it out as you go past, but either way it doesn't usually feel worth it to pull the whole rope up again each time. There are exceptions of course, like when it's really windy and the rope doesn't fall downwards, or when there are bergschrunds or other chasms ready to digest your ropes, but thankfully these aren't the norm.
When you pull a rope down a multi-pitch it invariably ends up plenty of the way down the next pitch anyway. You then have the option of either pulling it all up again to sort it out or sorting it out on the way down. If it's caught on trees or flakes part-way down you won't be able to pull it up anyway so the choice will be made for you. Either way if you get 15 or 20m down before the problem you'll have 15 or 20m less rope to pull up while sorting it out. Maybe caving is different because more often the rope lands nearby rather than continuing down after you pull it? Or maybe it's different because in climbing you almost always will want to be abseiling right past where the rope will have fallen, so it will be easier to sort it out as you go past, but either way it doesn't usually feel worth it to pull the whole rope up again each time. There are exceptions of course, like when it's really windy and the rope doesn't fall downwards, or when there are bergschrunds or other chasms ready to digest your ropes, but thankfully these aren't the norm.
6
In reply to john arran:
Great programme John and I trust your chin has recovered .
How many abseils did it take to get down from the top of the Tepui and just out of interest how much gear, if any, was left on the descent?
Great programme John and I trust your chin has recovered .
How many abseils did it take to get down from the top of the Tepui and just out of interest how much gear, if any, was left on the descent?
Post edited at 21:47
In reply to Gone for good:
As much as needed to get down safely, of course.
> how much gear, if any, was left on the descent?
As much as needed to get down safely, of course.
7
In reply to john arran:
Was the final abseil something that you setup or was that an established line?
As other have said good tv. Shame about the band of soft rock.
Was the final abseil something that you setup or was that an established line?
As other have said good tv. Shame about the band of soft rock.
In reply to john arran:
An American pal of mine used to have some removable bolts that were like a cylindrical ball nut. Would be good for going up as all you would leave would be a tiny hole, but doesn't help when rapping down.
> The only issue for me is what gets placed and what gets left.
An American pal of mine used to have some removable bolts that were like a cylindrical ball nut. Would be good for going up as all you would leave would be a tiny hole, but doesn't help when rapping down.
In reply to john arran:
Cheers for that, it worked.
Loved it John, fantastic program. I especially liked the way that sacking off the climb wasn't seen as a failure. I was actually relieved for yous. Nice one
Cheers for that, it worked.
Loved it John, fantastic program. I especially liked the way that sacking off the climb wasn't seen as a failure. I was actually relieved for yous. Nice one
1
In reply to Gone for good:
Watched part 1 last night on catch-up, part 2 tonight. One of the best things on TV for years, pity it had to be cut down to 2 hours!!
Watched part 1 last night on catch-up, part 2 tonight. One of the best things on TV for years, pity it had to be cut down to 2 hours!!
In reply to Moley:
The crack/layer which had slabs of rock hanging from the roof waiting to drop if they were brushed against looked awful.
> Sod that cave, going down there would be my worst nightmare. Nothing on earth would have me crawling through those cracks.
> Wouldn't have minded the abseil, that looked great.
The crack/layer which had slabs of rock hanging from the roof waiting to drop if they were brushed against looked awful.
In reply to john arran:
Superb program. Even all of the non-climbers at work were gripped and commenting on your guts tackling such slimy (and later crumbly) rock with that level of exposure.
Superb program. Even all of the non-climbers at work were gripped and commenting on your guts tackling such slimy (and later crumbly) rock with that level of exposure.
In reply to john arran:
Yes, I guess the ledges tend to be bigger, I can't recall having a rope go down the next pitch when it was pulled down.
> . Maybe caving is different because more often the rope lands nearby rather than continuing down after you pull it?
Yes, I guess the ledges tend to be bigger, I can't recall having a rope go down the next pitch when it was pulled down.
In reply to Gone for good:
Avoided this thread until I caught up on iPlayer, so sorry I'm a bit behind the times. I recall watching a programme a few years ago called something like 'Ben Fogle's Extreme Lifechanging Epic Death-Defying Adventures' in which the most terrifying thing he did was fall over in some mud then claim to have nearly perished. I've been waiting for the antidote to that programme ever since and I'm so glad it's finally been made! Loved every minute of this - the adventure, the climbing, the wildlife and the landscapes - really inspirational stuff with nothing hammed up or over-dramatised.
Avoided this thread until I caught up on iPlayer, so sorry I'm a bit behind the times. I recall watching a programme a few years ago called something like 'Ben Fogle's Extreme Lifechanging Epic Death-Defying Adventures' in which the most terrifying thing he did was fall over in some mud then claim to have nearly perished. I've been waiting for the antidote to that programme ever since and I'm so glad it's finally been made! Loved every minute of this - the adventure, the climbing, the wildlife and the landscapes - really inspirational stuff with nothing hammed up or over-dramatised.
5
2
In reply to Alyson:
Couldn't agree more. I'm an elitist tosser who usually looks down on this sort of thing, but I found all very genuine and really enjoyed it. I just wish they'd made a few more episodes!
Couldn't agree more. I'm an elitist tosser who usually looks down on this sort of thing, but I found all very genuine and really enjoyed it. I just wish they'd made a few more episodes!
In reply to Alyson:
The climbing itself looked like a good effort, but the overall goals of this show seem confused: if part of the idea was to look at the wildlife and plants at the top of the tepui, why not just take a chopper ride up there, as they later did for the other peak? Equally, the final abseil just looked like a gimmick to me - quite good fun though, I imagine. I also recoil from the use of the word 'extreme' in the title: more than a little cliched.
But perhaps I'm just a grumpy bastard.
As an aside: I already knew the ending, since the story of the attempted climb is told in an epilogue of Backshall's book, which I happened to flip through in a bookshop a couple of months ago. So he'd arranged his own spoiler! As I recall from the description in the book, they'd managed - en route to the cliff - to drag the climbing ropes through a pile of their own shit - which made things even spicier ...
> ... nothing hammed up or over-dramatised.
The climbing itself looked like a good effort, but the overall goals of this show seem confused: if part of the idea was to look at the wildlife and plants at the top of the tepui, why not just take a chopper ride up there, as they later did for the other peak? Equally, the final abseil just looked like a gimmick to me - quite good fun though, I imagine. I also recoil from the use of the word 'extreme' in the title: more than a little cliched.
But perhaps I'm just a grumpy bastard.
As an aside: I already knew the ending, since the story of the attempted climb is told in an epilogue of Backshall's book, which I happened to flip through in a bookshop a couple of months ago. So he'd arranged his own spoiler! As I recall from the description in the book, they'd managed - en route to the cliff - to drag the climbing ropes through a pile of their own shit - which made things even spicier ...
Post edited at 15:49
1
In reply to Ampthill:
The ab down the side of Angel Falls is a long established line. We used it to get down when we did the free direct route behind the falls in 2005 andit gets used every year by very adventurous trekking groups with a good head for heights! But we did go more directly at the top for the high exposure footage, using gear left in place from myriad other film shoots.
Wasn't really the crappy band that was the problem so much as the whole Tepui face. Very different to anything we've been on before, and we've been on lots of them. Added to the adventure though
> Was the final abseil something that you setup or was that an established line?
> As other have said good tv. Shame about the band of soft rock.
The ab down the side of Angel Falls is a long established line. We used it to get down when we did the free direct route behind the falls in 2005 andit gets used every year by very adventurous trekking groups with a good head for heights! But we did go more directly at the top for the high exposure footage, using gear left in place from myriad other film shoots.
Wasn't really the crappy band that was the problem so much as the whole Tepui face. Very different to anything we've been on before, and we've been on lots of them. Added to the adventure though
8
In reply to Rob Parsons:
I agree. I blame the TV blight of hyping stuff up unnecessarily. In it's own right as an adventure it was brilliant. There was no need to introduce spurious goals. Extreme mountain challenge should have been the be all and end all.
I agree. I blame the TV blight of hyping stuff up unnecessarily. In it's own right as an adventure it was brilliant. There was no need to introduce spurious goals. Extreme mountain challenge should have been the be all and end all.
In reply to digby:
As a non-climber (and the program had to appeal to us as well, some just interested in the wildlife aspect) I found the abseil quite a good ending. It was fairly obvious even to me that it was a bit set up, as in a used route down, but it did give those of us who know nothing of Tepuis or climbing, a last chance to appreciate the scale of the adventure and last views of that Tepui and countryside.
At least it didn't involve a "celebrity challenge" then I would have thrown something at the TV.
As a non-climber (and the program had to appeal to us as well, some just interested in the wildlife aspect) I found the abseil quite a good ending. It was fairly obvious even to me that it was a bit set up, as in a used route down, but it did give those of us who know nothing of Tepuis or climbing, a last chance to appreciate the scale of the adventure and last views of that Tepui and countryside.
At least it didn't involve a "celebrity challenge" then I would have thrown something at the TV.
2
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