UKC

Just wondered if anyone here is experienced in cycle touring?
I've got the chance of a week or so in July touring and camping around the Normandy coast. I'm a regular cyclist and was actually considering a new commuter bike that I could use as a general knock around bike, however, a tourer appeals and I'll need something for the trip.
I've looked at the Ridgeback Tour, the Dawes Galaxly AL and the Raleigh Royal....all around the £500 mark. Any views or experience of these or any alternatives?
Thanks

In reply to abr1966:

I'll start by saying that I'm not a very experienced cycle tourer. I spent three weeks in the Outer Hebrides last year though and enjoyed (nearly) every minute (the weather was good and the midges could have been worse).

Having had a quick look at the three bikes you've mentioned my recommendation would be go and try test riding them and buy the one that feels right.

I hope you enjoy your trip, assuming you do it. I can't wait to go cycle touring again.

In reply to abr1966:
Last time I bought a bike was 2013 and I did have a cursory look at all the bikes you mention above but assumed I'd get a Dawes.

Have to say I was utterly appalled at the stratospheric price Dawes were charging for bikes with a mish mash of near entry level components. It's interesting to see that Dawes no longer offer a Super Galaxy, Super Galaxy Plus or Ultra Galaxy but seems they still like charging like a wounded rhino for so so components.

The rims on a £1800 2015 Dawes 'Gran Tour' can be bought for £23. The disc brakes £35 to name but a few.

Sad really to the point I'd avoid Dawes at any price point.

In reply to August West:

Thanks....seems it's quite hard to get to see them as the shops don't seem to stock tourers! I'm pretty aware of the geometry issues as I'm a fairly experienced road cyclist...

In reply to Indy:
I agree....there didn't seem a great difference in the spec on a 500 quid Dawes compared to a £1200 version! Certainly not £700-1000 worth!!

In reply to Indy:


Used Dawes bikes can be had for much less if you're happy to accept things like bar-end shifters and scruffy paint (my Super Galaxy cost £125 from ebay). A Super Galaxy is a great solo road bike too but it's bomber enough to tour pretty much anywhere.

vimeo.com/125846747

In reply to abr1966:

I've only toured on a racer or mtb, but have a look at Spa Cycles website, they're all about touring

In reply to moffatross:

Use anything! I've been around that area several times. On a road bike with tiny panniers, mountain bike, hybrid. Just don't go too far each day. I think an old, good quality mountain bike (eg non suspension cannondale = £150) with smooth tyres is about as good as it gets for easy touring. No worries leaving it locked up in places. etc etc
Have a great time - I love cycle touring!

In reply to Pesda potato:

Thanks....that's a very good site!

In reply to djellworth:

Having ridden road bikes since I was about 15 it's never really occurred to me before, but, it seems such an obvious thing to do now!

In reply to djellworth:

>" Use anything! "<

Yep, but even a 25 year old steel framed Super Galaxy is designed to be stable and balanced at speed while loaded with the kitchen sink and everything but I know it's also less fatiguing over long rides than a carbon racer or a mountain bike. Anyway, just saying it's an option to keep an eye out for one because the cost of a new 105 chainset and a perfectly decent pair of wheels and hubs means you can have a £1,500-£2000 spec bike for < £400.

In reply to abr1966:

Read this; http://ultralightcycling.blogspot.co.uk/?m=1 then buy what you want. My other half spent the weeks touring in western China last year on my decathlon triban 3, I'd steer away (!) From a tourer and get a bike you'll use at home. I like the idea of a rigid MTB with slicks, but anything works.

I drove a support car on the London, Edinburgh, London a few years ago and there was an old dude doing it on an ancient French bike that he had to pedal backwards on to go up hills, dressed as an onion seller...

In reply to abr1966:

What bike (bikes) do you have now? I've sort of toured (bikepacking) on my old MTB and on my cyclocross bike. Could you just use what you've already got? Of course if its a super light roadbike with no eyelets for panniers, then maybe not, but lots of cyclocross, hybrids etc. seem quit good for touring.

In reply to TobyA:

Yep.... got my carbon road bike and an Ali winter bike but no lugs or any way of attaching panniers! I was planning on a new commuter bike as I've recently moved bases and within a commutable distance (18 miles) to do a couple of days a week so a tourer with drop bars seems a good option anyway...

In reply to abr1966:

How about a new fangled "adventure road"/gravel bike? Loads of them can take panniers, and probably a bit nippier/fun on the bumpy paths when commuting or day riding without kit. Glorified CX bikes really I guess, but look rather good.

In reply to abr1966:

I have a dawes vantage and has done me well. 600 new but through bike to work scheme got it for 400.
Just be careful about the shop you get it from. I suspect when they build it they swap the advertised parts for cheaper ones like bottom bracket etc which is not obvious until it needs changed. Better to order and build your self or trusted shop

In reply to abr1966:

Have a google at St John Street cycles, The Light Blue's Darwin and Ghyllside cycles. All of them will do a brilliant tourer which won't break the bank. It is true that you can tour on pretty much anything but a made-for-purpose tourer will distract much less from why you went on holiday in the first place.

In reply to abr1966:



That is what I found too. Although Evans said they would order in anything that I wanted to try.( not taken them up on that yet)
A friend let me try his ridgeback ( unloaded) and I have been on a few borrowed bikes ( loaded) whilst on touring holidays.

So far I have not committed to buying myself a new bike, but I have been right up the Outer Hebrides, and Skye, Orkneys, Shetland and lots more, all on a £125 quid bike I bought (just to see if I would like it. )

Everyone I met had a better bike ( and attachments) than me, but were happy to let me try out theirs.
There are lots of great bikes out there( and I'm no closer to knowing what one to chose. )

For the moment, I'm waiting for my cheepo bike to break, and then that will perhaps force the issue.

In reply to abr1966:
I've done a bit on a variety of bikes from mountain to my current Thorn Nomad from SJS cycles.

The thorn is bombproof and would handle everything but the new ones cost.

The mtb was fine but the 100 quid Dawes galaxy off eBay was sublime. It rode nicely as a road bike but when you put weight on it especially on the front forks it felt amazing and handled beautifully.

Good luck

Toby

In reply to abr1966:

I have only ever owned (and still own) the one touring bike, which is a Surly Long Haul Trucker. I had this built up for me by Drover Cycles in Hay-on-Wye.

I did a fair amount of research and settled on the following:

Steel Frame Surly LHT, 26" wheels (will accept up to 2" MTB tires)
36 spoke regida grizzly rims with shimano LX hubs (steel axle, cup & cone)
Schwalbe marathon tyres
Rim brakes, AVID 5 vee brakes
Bar end shifters, Dura ace 9 speed
Shimano 9 speed groupset
Steel front & rear racks (tubus)
Carradice panniers front, rear & handlebar bag

The price of this bespoke build suited to many years of touring in a wide variety of terrains, while being a doddle to fix on the road (hence the simplicity of rim brakes, bar end shifters and bomber wheels, was only £150 more than the off the peg surly bike. (excluding panniers which I had to purchase separately).

My bike may not suit everyone, it is heavy and slow, however I found I could sit in the saddle for 6-8 hours a day in comfort. It is very solid laden up on both steep ascents & descents. It is also the most versatile bike I have ever owned, and have enjoyed day trips out with the racks & mudguards removed. It was considerably cheaper that the Thorn equivalent (mainly due to 'normal' drive-train instead of hub gear).

It is likely OTT as would be a Thorn for cycling the Normandy coast, however it will give you the option of extended tours in far flung places in the future should you get the bug

Ollie.

In reply to abr1966:
Some of the new gravel bikes look just the thing, or there is the genesis coix d fer (which was a gravel bike before the term was used)

In reply to jethro kiernan:


That is what I used for my Hebridean trip. It's a great bike which I bought for rough tracks etc (I kept cycling past tracks/bridleways on my road bike and thought they would be too rough for my road bike but not worth the effort of bringing the mountain bike). Mine however is only a compact so is not best suited for touring. I am currently looking into my next +1 which will be a touring specific bike and the Iron Cross will return to light duties (muddy fields and Lakeland passes).

I found a good blog page on converting the Croix de Fer to touring purposes:

http://blog.robertbeal.com/2011/05/converting-genesis-croix-de-fer-into.htm...

In reply to abr1966:

Thanks everyone for the helpful replies....
Had a look at some cyclo cross and 'adventure' style bikes today....still prefer the idea of a tourer (maybe it's because I'm now 52)!
Had a look at a Dawes tourer in an Evans shop which was really nice but overpriced for what the spec was. I had a good chat with the staff in Brian Rourkes and am more convinced it's a tourer I'm interested in, especially as a commuter bike also. Will keep looking and may take a trip up to Spa cycles in Harrogate as I'm up in York next weekend.

In reply to abr1966:

I just finished 3 months cycling through patagonia on a specialized rockhopper from 1997, I found the mb frame and 26" wheels made for a stately and comfortable ride, even with 4 panniers and probably a bit too much kit. The bike, so long as it's solid can be anything that you find comfortable to sit on all day, I'd recommend splashing out on a nice saddle and some fancy adjustable handle bars, I didn't and had a really sore arse/back

In reply to abr1966:
Also my bike and pannier racks are for sale, so if you're interested pm me and I'll send you some pictures.

In reply to abr1966:

I knew someone who did LEJOG on a carbon Road bike with panniers held on with P-clips round the seat stays.

I did an overnighter last year on my carbon Road bike with this pannier: https://www.merlincycles.com/blackburn-expedition-1-disc-rear-bike-rack-736...
Used some old innertube and zip ties to attach behind the seatpost clamp, but have since discovered these: https://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/Acor-Pannier-Rack-Seat-Clamp-Mount

These might save you buying a new bike if you can travel light enough.

In reply to abr1966:

when i was looking at cheapish steel tourers, this was top of my list..
https://www.evanscycles.com/fuji-touring-2016-touring-bike-EV241592

In reply to malk:

Did you stop looking?

In reply to abr1966:

I still have my Raleigh Randonneur, which I bought in about 1994. I still use it, although it needs some fettling at the moment. This was one of Raleigh's touring bikes and if you can pick up a decent one second hand would be a good buy. I have also done some short tours on my Giant Defy 2, which has lugs, etc. If you are sticking mainly to roads, it would be a decent choice although maybe outside your budget.

In reply to felt:

for a tourer, yes.
i only needed a new frame really, so got a secondhand Galaxy 531ST.
still looking at carbon tho

In reply to malk:



Yep noticed the Fuji but it doesn't have mudguards or mounts for them!

Had a look at a Raleigh royal today that a guy uses for work in the next building to where I work....it was a good looking bike and had a kind of retro look, there's something nostalgic and appealing about a Raleigh!

In reply to abr1966: I have a giant defy in M/L that I might look at selling, it's good bike and very comfortable for aluminium except I should have a medium and it is a shade to big for me

In reply to abr1966:

Yes, the British Orbea.

In reply to abr1966:

If you're in York, Cycle Heaven is probably worth a visit too.

OM

In reply to abr1966:


it surely will have mounts for them..

In reply to malk:
You'd expect so for a tourer wouldn't you! I may be wrong but if you read the 'questions' part at the bottom the answer from Evans is 'no you can't fit mudguards'!

In reply to abr1966:
Do you really want drop handle bars ?

I just got the Marin San Rafael DS3. Its super comfortable but still pretty nippy and very stable. I like the more upright body position you get with the suspension ( I replaced mine with the rockshox paragon).

Anyway there is tonnes of great touring bikes at that £600 sort of mark. Specialized would be well worth considering IMO.

In reply to CurlyStevo:


I do really....been a roadie for a long time so I'm pretty happy with drops! I've got to a point though where I'm pi**ing myself off looking at bikes on the internet so I need to go and look at some in the flesh and try them out.
Sizing looks interesting as many don't do a 56 which I ride... with a 120 stem. I need to sit on some and measure up I'm not sure how upright I will be comfy with as I'm pretty happy stretched out normally...

In reply to abr1966:
Steel all the way. The idea of getting a super galaxy frame ( these used to be the gold standard) off eBay and then rebuilding as necessary seems like a good one. about 25 years ago I decided to head off for several months on a bike and decided to buy myself a fancy bike for the trip , i was going to get a Klein but having been thoroughly patronised by the owner of the nearest dealer , I went to steels on the advice of a climbing mate , in Newcastle and got a custom dave Yates steel frame which steels built to a really nice spec for less than I could get the bits . The bike has done loads over the years and despite looking a bit battered is still going strong with a few new chains , brake blocks, two bottom brackets , . The cost was slightly less than the Klein , which I'm pretty sure would have given up long ago. The trip never happened , I went climbing instead.
Dave still makes some nice looking tourers and frames . A bit pricyer than 25 years ago though. Funny that.
http://www.daveyatescycles.co.uk/custom_bike_frames-Touring_Frames-27.php

In reply to abr1966:

Takes less. Single change of clothes and a set for the pub/bar. Credit card, sleeping bag. BnB, Bunkhouse. You can get hold of tent around 1-1.5kg for a couple of hundred quid or less. Less work on the bike, shorter days, more fun. Shake my head at these four pannier guys and girls crawling around the scottish hills. Horses for courses though. Depends what kind of touring you are doing. There's all these bike packing bags available these days which don't require any braze ons for metal work. I've toured on 23mm tyres on a race bike and it was a bit unstable but fast and quick uphills.
I haven't got a spare dog of a bike sitting in the garage all year waiting for next years holiday, so bonus.

D

In reply to Dauphin:

Depends how much independence you want to have en route, and the variety of stuff you want to be able to do on your road/track trip I suppose.

In reply to moffatross:

I know. But the thing is unless you have a specific objective you end up taking all this gear just in case you decide to do this or that and after 5 or 6 hours on the bike you can't be f*cked to do anything but shower, eat something and bask in the glory of it all or avoid the bad weather. A pair of old mudclaws or mudrocks sit at the bottom of a single pannier if I decide that I'm going to walk up a hill. I'm talking about myself here obviously.

D

In reply to Dauphin:

Yep, 4 panniers not required. A 3 kg tent with enough space to get out of the rain and feel relaxed about it, plenty clothes, fly fishing rod, towel, walking shoes, inflatable insulating mat, sleeping bag, trangia, oil to fry the trout, extra fuel, cup, whisky, dried milk, honey, porridge, tea/coffee, water purifier, headtorch, camera, mobile, batteries, dehydrated meals, radio, tent/camp shoes, lots of bungees yada, yada, yada, all spreads nicely and is well balanced across a big bar bag, two panniers and a rack. Can do a quite relaxed 60-70 miles in a day on a 25 yr old steel frame and though I'm quite happy to stay in them, I don't feel the need to aim for a bothy/hostel by the end of the day. Instead I can catch my supper from a hill lochan, then go swimming with the dolphins on my own beach. The dolphins and trout aren't always obliging but you get the idea

In reply to moffatross:

I applaud your style. I've got a nice stream fly rod but there is zip chance I'm going to lug all that with me while on a bike.

D

In reply to abr1966:

Long time since I swapped cycling for climbing, but I do remember we used to buy just a frame and build up a bike to a personal spec. Also remember touring the Pyrenees and northern Spain with just a saddlebag, minimal gear, would hate to have humped a heavy bike load of panniers over the passes. Only five speeds. And just to induce some more groans, in my very first job I used to write ads for Dawes, back when it was an independent company. The slogan used to be, transports of delight.

In reply to abr1966:

Just had a quick look at websites and thought that Merlin bikes seem to offer good value at your price range, but they would need some sort of pannier for luggage.

In reply to abr1966:

http://www.specializedconceptstore.co.uk/awol-comp/34119/my15-final-sale

Been looking at various versions of this on and off. Theres one for £900.

Have a look at Shand cycles if you really want to depress yourself / max out the slave card. Pure touring bike Penthouse.

D

In reply to Dauphin:

Will do....typical when looking at new bikes I'm already wondering how much over my self imposed budget I can justify to my conscience!

In reply to jethro kiernan:


I love my croix de fer. Planning to weigh it down later in the year with some panniers for touring but currently soaks up abuse when I cant be arsed to put my whyte through the mud.

In reply to KevinD:

Thanks everyone for the replies and advice. I've just picked up and got in from my first ride on my new tourer! Got a Dawes Galaxy cromo for a decent price as the local Evans got one in for me to try and price matched it for a 20% discount so I was happy with that! Riding 32mm tyres on a steel frame after riding my winter aluminium frame on 23mm tyres is like an armchair!!
Looking at panniers now and may just splash out on some Ortileb....any pannier opinions greatly received....
Thanks

In reply to abr1966:
Rack mounted panniers are heavy and the rack can fail. Am alternative would be frame bags and a large saddle pack.
Apidura and alpkit make good bags

In reply to abr1966:
If you want panniers which will last a lifetime then Carradice Super C are brilliant. They are made from cotton duck in the UK in Nelson. I have a front and rear set, and use the smaller ones on my town bike. I have also heard good things about Ortlieb, however for me the Carradice won me over and feel harder wearing.

A work colleague of mine has had a set for about 30 years still going strong.

Regarding racks, if you want longevity then steel racks from Tubus should outlive aluminium racks (welds seem to fracture frequently on alloy racks if there is a decent load in the panniers). I have the 'Cargo Evo' on the rear, and the 'Tara' for the front. I leave the rear rack on permanently, and only fit the front rack if required.

I also use high tensile cap head bolts for securing the racks to bike (Gr 10.9).

For my needs this is the perfect setup. All good quality long lasting kit. As your bike is steel and heavy anyway, I would not worry too much about the weight of the racks and panniers if you are going to be laden down with gear anyhows.

If you were going down the light and fast route, then as Pesda potato mentioned, frame bags may be the better option. However if you were going down the fast and light route then you would maybe have chosen a light bike not a tank like a galaxy

In reply to abr1966:

Watch out for those canti brakes, if you are fully loaded they won't stop you very quickly (especially if you're going downhill..................)

In reply to abr1966:

Next half term, I'm planning to ride Venice to Budapest with my wife and my son. It's only 200 miles and pretty flat, so I've bought some late 90s Raleigh Pioneers which are superb bikes for this sort of thing. They're essentially a hybrid that Raleigh produced at the end of the 90s - one of their last models to be produced in Nottingham in fact. Our plan is to ditch the bikes in Budapest (I found a charity that'll take them) and fly directly home from there.

In reply to abr1966:

Yay for new bikes

I've got a couple of Ortleib Back Roller panniers which seem pretty indestructible and very waterproof but they are expensive. Make sure you get a good rack. I used Nyloc nuts and spring washers to secure mine against road vibration. 1700 miles later and no adjustment needed.

In reply to thedatastream:

Was just about to recommend Ortlieb pannier bags. I bought mine in the first year they came onto the market (some time in the 1980s, too far back to remember...), and they are in almost daily use ever since. Only thing I did to them was to upgrade the rack mounting system (from straps to clip on).

CB

In reply to abr1966:

i use ortlieb panniers which are fully waterproof. Whatever type you go for though, if you have to open them in the rain then everything inside can still get wet. Dry bags are a good option for everything inside you do not want to get wet.