UKC

Hi folks,
I've never had a jacket with Neoshell fabric before and I've been looking at the Jottnar Hymir jacket.

The reason I've be looking at the Hymir is that I prefer smock type hard shells and my 10 year old Arcteryx Alpha SL pullover has finally given up the ghost and they sadly don't make them anymore. I had a google around and saw the Berghaus Asgard smock and managed to find a mate with one but I didn't like the cut and fit of it. I've tried on a Jottnar Bergelmir jacket and on face value I really liked it, it felt well made, comfortable and the fit was good (although I realise a smock would be slightly different) but I haven't managed to try the smock on.

All this is fairly irrelevant as I don't really know how Neoshell compares against Goretex. Reading around, I can see that breathable means not as wind proof which doesn't really bother me as my old SL let in the wind as well and layers sorted that out.

So in a convoluted way, I'm looking for pros and cons in Neoshell. I would also say that despite it being factory standard, proshell hasn't always impressed me and no thanks, I don't want a paramo smock

Cheers, Den

PS, Toby, I've seen the review

In reply to Denni:

Hey Den,
Can't speak about the jottnar specifically, but I have an m.e neoshell jacket and I can't see me going back to goretex any time soon. So much more breathable for a sweaty fecker like me and I can honestly say I haven't noticed any reduction in waterproofness. It also feels and sounds so much nicer than goretex.

In reply to crustypunkuk:
Den,

I've had a rab neoshell jacket for the last couple of years and was initially really pleased with it. Waterproof and definitely more breathable than standard goretex.

But... You need to be really careful with Velcro near it when washing and when in use with a rucksack on I've got holes developing through the surface at my hips from the waist belt and patches where the surface is rubbing through from shoulder straps and back.

It's not as breathable as soft shell and normally now even in moderate rain id stay in softshell by choice, we walk fast and get really hot so soon dry off. But you can feel the wind coming through it if it's blowing, much more so than goretex and less than stretch softshell which does help to get the moisture away.

Overall it's a useful addition and if the weather is bad I'd still go to it over softshell but next time I'm going over to goretex pro which seems to be much more robust but not quite as breathable as I don't think I've worn the jacket for 30 days total in the last 2 years.

In reply to philmitch:

Which Rab jacket is it? I've just picked up a brand new Nexus for a silly cheap price, so I'm not too worried about trashing it, but I'd hope for a couple of days of wear...

In reply to 2powern:

Stretch neo qwe38. It still keeps out water apart from at my hips, which isn't a problem. You'll get more than a couple of days of wear.

I think mine will go for a bit longer yet, but it's in worse shape than my old goretex shell I've had for 10 years and has been used for climbing grit and everything else.

In reply to Denni:

Or have you thought about this one with pit zips (+£30), haven't used it and don't know the fabric but worth a punt and a similar price.
http://www.phdesigns.co.uk/alpamayo-waterproof-smock

In reply to crustypunkuk:

Cheers Gordon,
sounds good coming from a gear monster ;0)
Hope the MX is serving you well :0)

In reply to philmitch:

Cheers Phil,
I've noticed the same problem with velcro and my softshell jacket so will bear that in mind.
Think I'm going to pull the trigger and give it a punt, proshell just hasn't been durable enough for me.

My last Arcteryx jacket was sent for repair twice to the point it was replaced after a third party row with goretex and I ended up sending it back and basically demanded my money back. 1 year old, worn 10 times, hinch cord failed twice and delaminated all the way round the hem, even after repair!

I'm getting a refund from them so that will cover the cost of my new gleaming neoshell :0)

In reply to ColdWill:

Thanks mate, I have literally just looked at that but have decided to go down the neoshel route, nice jacket though.

In reply to Denni:

I had a Rab Neo Guide jacket for about 2 months this winter and it didn't really function as a proper waterproof during that time and wore out really quickly (maybe 25 climbing and skiing days). I sent it back along with the trousers and got a full refund which was good customer service on Rab and Equip UK's part.

Had a chat with Tommy from Jottnar at the film festival in Fort William and he said the main reason for the poor performance of the Rab jacket is that it is bonded onto a polyester face fabric as opposed to nylon which is much harder wearing. I've decided to plump for bombproof and gone with the double ME Tupilak set up now with Gore Tex Pro, not too fussed about the breathability difference as I sweat a lot regardless of my layers.

So if the Hymir uses a nylon face fabric then you're onto a winner, Neoshell is a really sweet material but still going through some teething problems with certain companies I think. Got a mate who uses a Hymir and he really rates it but couldn't comment on the fit of it.

In reply to Denni:

Hi Denni

I have the Hymir as my "summer" hardshell. Night and day difference compared to Goretex. Huge improvement in breathability and functionally waterproof, so far at least. I wouldn't subject it to winter thrutching however, the face fabric isn't as tough as the Bergelmir, nor as pricey, to be fair. I'm not a fan of smocks but I find it less of a hassle taking on and off than I expected.

The key for durability isn't the membrane, it's the face fabric, and the Rab Neo stuff doesn't cut the mustard.

In reply to BnB:

+1 for Hymir. Cut is excellent for slim folks. Wear mine all the time. Stood up well to Cornish Granite at Bozigran too.

In reply to Nath93:

Sounds reasonable, it's mostly the face fabric I've had issues with.

In reply to philmitch:

Seems to me that all of this premature wearing out is very little if anything to do with the technology, i.e. the membrane, and everything to do with manufacturers' pursuit of fashionable lightweight products. A light weight jacket, IMHO, is all well and good but unless its a 'just in case' jacket for carrying whilst climbing or lightweight backpacking it is a triumph of marketing over genuine customer requirements. I have no problem wearing a full waterproof jacket that weighs, shock horror, even as much as a kilo. A 400 gram jacket is bound to wear out quickly.

My 90s vintage goretex taslan jacket is still going strong. I did re-tape it once and, OK, it doesn't really breathe, but methinks manufacturers should offer the buyer a choice- lightweight if you want it fine, but tough as old boots ought to be available too...

In reply to Denni:

Hi Denni, I have both the belgamir shell and the Hymir, and use one or the other pretty much every day for the last year and a half. They are both very different shells. The belgamir is a beast, great for bad weather days with a slightly roomier cut. The Hymir smock, as far as im concerned is the most impressive waterproof jacket on the market, it is really really breathable. However it does let the wind in.... So keep this in mind with your layering, I like a light midlayer and a puffy gilet under it in winter. The pocket is also huge, takes a full sized os map in its case with no bother.

I wash both jackets fairly regularly, more than any gtx shell I've owned, and neither are showing any signs of letting me down soon.

I've also been running in the smock regularly, and have yet to experience any sweat build up.

Basically it's good
Buy one.

In reply to connor:

Interesting, that's basically what I found was the right midlayers for me also under the Hymir in winter. Or the Jottnar Alfar which is pretty much the same thing sewn into on jacket!

Denni - have you seen the Jottnar Asmund review from a couple of days ago also? Same fabric as the Hymir and my conclusions are very similar.

On the Rab NeoShell jackets, I know a number of people who were very disappointed with theirs and ended up returning them - but it seems to have been a problem with that particular model. The Marmot neoshell jackets I reviewed 3 and 4 years back are still going strong.