UKC

Any advice for longest VDiff in Europe... or the world?

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 Kramma 30 May 2016
I have a buddy who will only climb VDiffish (possibly up to Severe with really solid quality rock) stuff but is keen to develop on a multi-pitch scale. Any advice for a final goal of a lengthy climb to consolidate knowledge? I know of Little Chamonix but not been there yet, is there anything longer in the UK, Europe or the wider world? Ultimately I would love to be able to suggest to him a 10 pitch climb although I know this may not exist.

Thanks for any help in advance,
K
1
 Pbob 30 May 2016
There are some long 10+ pitch Vdiff & Severe routes on Lliwedd. I've never climbed them but I believe they are quite commiting.
 Andes 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:
Cuillin Ridge, Tower Ridge on Ben Nevis are probably the two longest in Britain... but neither is really a continuous rock climb. There will definitely be longer ones in Europe.
Post edited at 08:20
 HeMa 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:
Via del Veterano in Tessin might be there (possibly Severe or so, if you're not against a few moves of french free).

http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/56248/it/placche-di-freggio-via-del-vetera...

Via del veterano (5a)
Post edited at 08:32
 ben b 30 May 2016
In reply to Pbob:
The only one at this grade on Y Lliwedd is Slanting Buttress Ridge Route. An excellent day out unless you lose the line (when it becomes rapidly more committed, all devoid of pro and direction) or it snows. Or both.

Nonetheless, a great route and the à cheval arête is great fun.

I guess you could call the true traverse of the Black Cuillin a V Diff with some easier sections

b
Post edited at 08:35
 Dogwatch 30 May 2016
In reply to HeMa:

Hmmm. Not sure the request for a long VDiff translates to Alpine D+.
 HeMa 30 May 2016
In reply to Dogwatch:

Fully bolted french 5a-c and about french 4c with few moves of aid (pulling on quick draws). Exit at around 2/3rds way up, and even possible to rap down (albeit as a slab, not really advised).

Easy, mellow walk off descent.

So not really an "alpine" route per se...
 tjhare1 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

An alpine-esque offering: the east ridge of Monte Viso.

If left late enough there'll be no requirement for crampons/axe. It's easy, pleasant climbing in a wonderful situation. Avoid the Tour Saint Robert and the climbing doesn't exceed french 3c. The views are stupendous: on a good, clear day, because of its isolation, you can see the arc of the alps from the Mercantour through the Ecrins, Vanoise, Mont Blanc and right around to the Monte Rosa group. A small caveat: it's a long route (approximately 1000m from gearing up to the summit) with no/few opportunities to escape before the normal route is joined just before the summit.

http://www.camptocamp.org/routes/54677/fr/mont-viso-arete-e
 GridNorth 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

The Dolomites and Ailefroide in the Ecrin should meet your requirements for longer routes. The former is limestone of varying quality but sound on the easier popular routes, the latter is solid granite but mostly slabs.

Al
OP Kramma 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

Thanks for all the suggestions. We were hoping to use trad gear and although the ridges do look spectacular I was hoping for more of a continuous ascent. Lliwedd looks great though.
 GridNorth 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

There's at least one 26 pitch Severe that I know of in the Dolomites, near the Sella Towers but I can't remember it's name.

Al
 skog 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

In terms of mostly-continuous climbing at V Diff, I don't think you can do much better in the UK than a link-up on Sron na Ciche on Skye. There are longer climbs, but they tend to have a lot of scrambling on them.

If you can stretch to Severe, start with Cioch Direct (beware loose rock) or, probably better, Cioch West; if not, there's the highly entertaining Little Gully. For the middle tier, Arrow Route or Cioch Nose are great - the former being the better climb, the latter landing you directly on the Cioch. For the upper tier you have the phenomenal Wallworks Route, a very out-there V Diff. All in all, that's somewhere from about 7-12 pitches, depending on how long you run them.

There are obviously many far longer routes elsewhere in the world; the suggestion of heading to the Dolomites is a good one.
 Offwidth 30 May 2016
In reply to GridNorth:
More like VS in modern UK grade terms.

In California, Mt Connes N ridge is good as is Mathes Crest (skipping the hard bit up to the final top). The Cuillin Ridge is still the best.
Post edited at 09:48
 GridNorth 30 May 2016
In reply to Offwidth:

You could be right. By definition a route that long should allow for the seriousness of the length in the grade even though it's technically easy.

Al
 Coel Hellier 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:
Not "the longest in Europe", but good, fairly long expeditions in the UK:

Cioch Nose (VD)
Amphitheatre Buttress (VD)
Bosigran Ridge a.k.a Commando Ridge (VD)
Avalanche/Red Wall/Longlands (S 4b) though maybe Avalanche and then Terminal Arete is easier at the grade.
Grooved Arête (HVD 4a)
Post edited at 10:28
 ashtond6 30 May 2016
In reply to HeMa:

> Fully bolted french 5a-c and about french 4c with few moves of aid (pulling on quick draws). Exit at around 2/3rds way up, and even possible to rap down (albeit as a slab, not really advised).

> Easy, mellow walk off descent.

> So not really an "alpine" route per se...

So not VDiff then
 Martin Bennett 30 May 2016
In reply to GridNorth:

> There's at least one 26 pitch Severe that I know of in the Dolomites, near the Sella Towers but I can't remember it's name.



I'd guess you have the Fidele on Sass Pordoi in mind there Al. So have I - and have had for 30 years or more, so still on the list, but even though it's UIAA 4+ at most I think it might be a bit "uphill" for our purposes here. And after it's 20 pitches you have to factor in the 8 pitches of The Dibona route above the finishing ledge, to get to the cable car station and a quick zoom down (or not!).
 Mark Haward 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

Not a single climb but Ogwen has lots of opportunities to link routes of that grade. Eg:

Choice of 2 / 3 pitch routes on Gribin Facet
Trot across to Sub Cneifion Rib for another 4 pitches
Drop down to Idwal Slabs for another 5 pitches
Head across to Cneifion arête for another couple of pitches followed by scramble / moving together or pitched if you like.
On descent head to Bochlwyd Buttress for a final 3 pitches

About 17 pitches, includes some starred routes.
 HeMa 30 May 2016
In reply to ashtond6:

> So not VDiff then

Nope, more like Severe... in terms of skill required.

And 23 long pitches...
 full stottie 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:
As Grid North suggests, the Dolomites have some excellent long routes at this grade. Hexenstein South Arete at the Falzarego Pass goes in 8 pitches at IV+ and has a short approach and a summit.
Nearby at the Falzarego Pass there are a range of routes at IV on Lagazuoi and the Falzarego Towers all about 8/9 pitches.

The Normal Route on the South Face of Cima Grande is easier at III+ but with more route-finding challenges, about 14 pitches but you get to the top of a great mountain. Near Cortina on the Punta Fiames is Via Dimai at 4+ in 15 pitches, and if you are going well in good weather you can break right after 4 pitches of Via Demai to do the classic and exposed Fiames Arete at V+, although its easier than it sounds and hard to get lost.

Then there's the fine Espolon Central Directe on the Puig de Campagna in the Costa Blanca - about 13 pitches, no more than Severe.

And then again, there's the Royal Arches Route in Yosemite - lovely.

Hope this helps

Dave
Post edited at 11:56
In reply to Kramma:

Based on my own UK experience.

Bosigran Ridge a.k.a Commando Ridge (VD)

Is an excellent target (of course already suggested)

But I don't think any one has suggested this

The Great Ridge Direct (S)

Ticked in my guide with a note that we did it in 12 pitches VD ***. Now seems to be * Severe. Nut I thought it was great and it mainly went up





 Trangia 30 May 2016
In reply to Pbob:

I've done a number of the Lily Wed VDiffs and Severes.

They do tend to be committing and hard for their grades. Route finding can be difficult

I'd say that Amphitheatre Buttress is the best long V Diff in Wales.

Another worthwhile and long mountain V Diff is Bowfell Buttress

Someone mentioned Bosigran Ridge (Commando Ridge). It's a bit long but rambling, the only worthwhile pitch is the first which climbs out of a booming zawn.

The Devils Slide on Lundy is fun. Although graded Severe it's easy for the grade.

Faith, Hope and Charity are all nice longish v Diffs. Milestone Buttress and Grooved Arete are good longish V Diffs (you can make a day out combing the two), as is Flying Buttress
 tjhare1 30 May 2016
In reply to Trangia:

A second vote for Amphitheatre buttress being possibly the best long VD in Wales!
 Xharlie 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

If you're including the World, I'd recommend Cape Town and Surrounds, South Africa. There, you'll find long routes at all grades - lots or routes (and lots of absolute classics, too) around V. Diff..

If you run out in the town, there's the South of the Cape Peninsula and the nearby mountain passes or, about three to four hours drive will take you to many many more grand places. Expect multi-pich trad. between four and twelve pitches, at about 20 - 30 metres a pitch.

If you stay for a few weeks, your friend will be climbing harder just because the quality of the hard Sandstone rock, population of bomber placements and the friction (like bone-dry, 50 grit sandpaper) simply inspires confidence.

We don't do slimy and polished - a massive problem with easier grades on Limestone. What we do do is exposure. Bring your trad. undies. (South African for "pants")
 Trangia 30 May 2016
In reply to Xharlie:

Agree about the exposure and superb rock quality.

I've had some great days on Table Mountain and Lions Head. Also Du Toits Kloof (Fledermaus)
 BnB 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

If your buddy doesn't climb harder than Severe then a ten pitch route will be a much longer undertaking than it would be even with a plodding VS punter like me. The suggestions in Idwal and on Sron na Ciche are fantastic days out and should probably be regarded as sufficient but, if you must, here's one with 15 pitches in the most beautiful spot in the land:

North Buttress of An Caisteal (Diff) Route 63 in Skye Scrambles.

Actually I really want to do this route!! Anyone around on Skye this weekend?

 DaveHK 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:
It wont be the longest but the Upper Exum Ridge on Grand Teton is pretty long and absolutely brilliant.

Edit: I notice that in the UKC logbooks the Exum is given 1 star and the Owen-Spalding 3 stars this is surely the wrong way round.
Post edited at 15:36
 Tricadam 30 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

The Chasm.
 GrahamD 31 May 2016
In reply to Kramma:

I would say that if your friend is climbing Vdiff or Severe then really long routes are a bad idea because you will run out of time on them. So routes like Piz Badile N Ridge which are really only VDiff/Severe at most you want to be climbing VS or so so that easy sections you are happy to solo. You don't want to be there in a thunder storm !

In the UK Tower Ridge would be a good adventure
 Offwidth 31 May 2016
In reply to full stottie:

I've done most of those and they all felt to me to contain crux climbing of at least HS. Using Grid North's sensible maxim of allowing for the seriousness of long big mountain routes some should be VS. Royal Arches gave me an insight into some key differences in UK and US grades. In UK trad terms it is almost perfectly balanced leader challenge for its size, with numerous HS pitches from safe cruxy HS 4c to plenty of UK sustained HS 4a sections to runout HS 3c near the top, whereas the YDS pitch grades make it sound like a crux in a romp (which it is if the climbing is easy for you and you are moving fast).
 Offwidth 31 May 2016
In reply to Trangia:

For information Bowfell Butress is given HS 4b in the latest definitive: more like HVD with a short 4a wall above a good ledge in reality and I'd agree its a good choice.
1
 Offwidth 31 May 2016
In reply to Tricadam:

Ha.. the VS leaders ultimate adventure challenge!
 Offwidth 31 May 2016
In reply to GrahamD:

Tower Ridge is a scramble with a few short mod and diff pitches... a grand day out on a great line but hardly long VD. Observatory Ridge is the real thing on the Ben.
 full stottie 31 May 2016
In reply to Offwidth:

Fair enough points. I thought the Dolomite examples were mostly VDiff with some pitches of Severe, and Gridnorth's point about long routes is worth taking, although I feel that once you get into a rhythm on a long route you climb better and are more likely to take a slightly harder section in your stride. The Fiames Arete is probably solid VS in the middle section. Royal Arches - apart from the pendulum I won't argue with your assessment of UK grade comparisons. I always lose grading wars!

Dave

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