/ Rockfall at Stoney (The Flakes/ Armageddon)

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CharlieMack - on 14 Sep 2016
Just went to try The Flakes Direct (E2 5c) yesterday to find there was a block missing at the start (3m). Looks pretty recent, anyone know much about it? Is there going to be anything done? It's the start of a handful of classic lines which all break out different directions after this initial section.
There is a stuck wire at 2m where i'm assuming someone has fallen and dislodged the block. Me and my friend both had a go tackling the new scarred section, but it felt pretty nails.

Just going to be left and waited to be reclimbed at a higher grade for 3m then pretty steady ground for the rest of the routes, glue some of the block back on to make it climbable at the previous grade, or something else...
deacondeacon - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:

I haven't looked recently but there was always a section where it looks like a rock had come out.theres also been a nut stuck there too ( for the last few years anyway).
tebs on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to deacondeacon:

As deacondeacon says, there's a block's been gone for a while and the stuck wire's been there for years too. How fresh did the scar look? If it's the last month (and so really dusty/obvious/blocks scattered around underneath) it might be new, otherwise it's the old one and I think the routes are graded for it (ie Windhover, which used to be HVS, is now a soft E2). The starting moves are definitely the crux for both Windhover and Armaggedon, (and the Flakes? not done it), but the crux on Flakes Direct is still moving through the overlap (if only cos it's harder to climb up and down to rest than it is at the start).

Last year a peg which you clipped just after the starting crux (a couple of feet above the stuck wire) came out. This makes the start marginally bolder but I don't think has changed the grade.

All this is not to say those starting moves aren't really hard!
CharlieMack - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to tebs:

The blocks on the floor looked a few weeks old. Pretty dusty still. Me and a friend both tried it for about 10 mins each and couldn't get anywhere (both E3-4 onsighters). Then just walked up Scoop wall round the corner (defo E2 for what it's worth :p ).

Seemed like quite a bit of chalk around but non higher up so looks like others have had similar difficulties.
ChrisBrooke - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:
The stuck nut I'm pretty sure is from my mate who took a decent lob off the start, summer 2014 (didn't pull any rock off). There's a perfect backup nut above it though for when its safety is in doubt.
I've climbed all the routes which start there (most recently Armageddon, June of this year), and can confirm the start is a proper bastard every time. It would be a shame if it's become even harder. I'll have a look next time I'm up.

Like Tebs, I reckon the crux of Flakes Direct is on the second pitch.
Post edited at 11:25
snoop6060 - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to ChrisBrooke:

said friend was me. I have done all these routes quite a few times, the start has defo got harder, i last did them in 2013. Not the move that used to be considered tough but wasn't too bad (left to the peg low down i seem to recall, the pegs gone now), but before that getting to the big blocky undercuts. But we are real shorties so it might be just something has fallen off that isn't noticeable to normal sized people .
CharlieMack - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to snoop6060:

Me and my mates are both shorties too, but he has done all the routes there before and couldnt get more than 1m off the floor. Would be interesting to find out if we're both just being total punters, or if something has actually changed.
deacondeacon - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:

I'm actually climbing at Stoney tonight so I'll have a butchers.
The start is a real pig but there is a sequence that makes it fine, which involves a hidden crimp, and a cross through to a good pocket. The chances of using that sequence when Onsighting would be very slim

Scoop Wall= definitive E2.3
ChrisBrooke - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to snoop6060:

Lol. Well, I'm quite tall.... For me the move is committing to a weird side-pully-undercling on the chalky block, on poor feet, to get the weight over to the left, then a stiff pull up past where there was a peg to mantle onto the ledge and a nice rest.
In reply to deacondeacon:

> I'm actually climbing at Stoney tonight so I'll have a butchers.

No logged ascents on UKC Logbook since mid-July for the routes which use the start. One failed attempt on August 13.

Could be worth a look.

Alan
ChrisBrooke - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to deacondeacon:

> I'm actually climbing at Stoney tonight so I'll have a butchers.

Will be good to know. Those routes off Windy Ledge are some of my favourites, especially Armageddon.
CharlieMack - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

I'd like to think we were both just having a bad day, as I'd like to do all those routes.
First time i've ever wanted to be a punter...
deacondeacon - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:

Sorry, I'd ididnt get a chance to look this evening. Climbing in electric quarry and didn't leave until it was pitch black.
ashtond6 - on 14 Sep 2016
In reply to deacondeacon:

I tried it a few weeks ago and couldnt touch it, I was onsighting 7a and E3/4 at the time

So I handed over to my friend who was onsighting 7b and E4/5

Couldn't touch it either...

Both did Kelly's Eye (E4 6a) on the same day which is much easier
snoop6060 - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:

> Me and my mates are both shorties too....

Yes, I know. I'm your friend you Muppet. It's Simon of recent cannot repeat flakes direct fame.

Which has defo got harder since 2013, clawed my way up a few 7bs onsight recently so surely I can repeat a move on a e2 I've done about 5 times without fail.

deacondeacon - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to snoop6060:
Maybe you've shrunk?
snoop6060 - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to deacondeacon:

I seriously hope not, i've not got a lot to work with!
Stoney Boy on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to snoop6060:

If it's really become so hard it's time to clean the rest of the loose rock off and perhaps place a solid bolt in the start for use as either a runner or an aid point so people can get on the fantastic climbing beyond.

Otherwise will be another relic gathering cobwebs.

Cheers
Simon Cundy.
Shani - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to Stoney Boy:

> If it's really become so hard it's time to clean the rest of the loose rock off and perhaps place a solid bolt in the start for use as either a runner or an aid point so people can get on the fantastic climbing beyond.

> Otherwise will be another relic gathering cobwebs.

> Cheers

> Simon Cundy.

F*ck it. Let's just chip a jug.
deacondeacon - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to Stoney Boy:
It's about 7' off the ground. You could just get a bunk up off your belayer.

Timmd on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to Stoney Boy:

Unless cleaning the loose rock off unearths more usable holds?
Misha - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:

That start has always been hard, that's what the old timers will tell you. In practice, I suspect it's been getting harder as more bits have dropped off. Did it a couple of years back and thought it was 6a. May be it's even harder now.
Shani - on 15 Sep 2016
There is a ready made solution in UK climbing to the issue of climbs which have become more serious and technically harder.....
Jimbo C - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack:
Loose rock is de-rigeur at Stoney isn't it? (or have I been climbing on the wrong bits)
Post edited at 19:55
CharlieMack - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to snoop6060:

Haha, thought I recognised the user name :p

As per original post, think once there's been some consensus something should be done.

If it turned out the three classic E2s are now 6a/b start followed by 5b for the rest, they might fall into obscurity. Which would be a great shame.
Michael Hood - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to CharlieMack: Do the start of Choss and then traverse round the arÍte - only 5b

How to make a 3 star route into a 2 or 1 star experience

Bulls Crack - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to Misha:
Question is: is it now as hard as Gnat Attack?
Post edited at 22:03
ChrisBrooke - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to Michael Hood:

or approach via Alcasan....... might be quicker to just bring a little set of steps to get past the first move though.
CharlieMack - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to ChrisBrooke:

Step ladders will become de rigueur :p
Misha - on 15 Sep 2016
In reply to Bulls Crack:
Ha, doubt it ;-)
Michael Hood - on 16 Sep 2016
In reply to ChrisBrooke: Maybe it should end up similar to Carnage at Malham - consistent grade if done with a point of aid but freeable if you're good enough (certainly not me) and want to do that.

ChrisBrooke - on 16 Sep 2016
In reply to Michael Hood:

From memory of the move I don't think the nut is that useful to aid through the move on - too low down - and there's nothing until past the crux. Maybe there's a new gear possibility with the missing bit though....? Step ladder/mate's shoulders might be the best bet Dying to go have a look now!
Martin Haworth on 16 Sep 2016
In reply to ChrisBrooke:

Clip the in situ wire with a sling. Foot in the sling and off you go. That's what I've done a couple of times.
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ChrisBrooke - on 16 Sep 2016
In reply to Martin Haworth:

OK, cool. Never had to ;)

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