UKC

Further to http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=75896&v=1#1012996 We have now completed this course and can highly recommend it. Perhaps the best way to sell it to other beginners is that it finished last Friday and on Sunday we were able to co-lead Tennis Shoe on the Idwal Slabs, a Hard Severe. Maybe no great shakes for the experienced, but a big deal for us. The instructors were great, though I guess we lucked out getting the head of rock-climbing at the centre and (I guess) one of the UK's foremost mountaineers for the 2:1 sessions - thanks "Twid", you were great!

The rest of the course went like this: -

Day 1a - Rigging bottom ropes
-----------------------------

Venue: Bus Stop Quarry, Gwynedd (Slate).

Climbs (on bottom rope):

- Equinox [VS 4c]
- Solstice [HVS 5a] - may have those two back-to-front grade-wise
- Gnat Attack [E1 5b]

Day 1b - Rigging abseils
-----------------------------

Venue: Outcrop in the Llanberis valley

Day 2 - Rigging top ropes / more abseiling / sea cliff climbing
---------------------------------------------------------------

Venue: "Crag X", Anglesey (Quartzite)

Climbs (on top rope):

Several, all unnamed / ungraded

Day 3 – Seconding / building belay anchors
------------------------------------------

Venue: Craig Bwlch y Moch, Tremadog (Dolerite)

Climbs (seconding):

- One Step In The Clouds [VS 4c]
- Oberon [S] – in the only rain we had all week


Day 4 – More seconding / assisted leading
-----------------------------------------

Venue: Idwal Slabs, Gwynedd (Rhyolite)

Climbs (seconding):

- Tennis Shoe, The Other Direct Route [HS 4b]

Climbs (assisted leading):

- The Ordinary Route [Diff]

Day 5 – More assisted leading
-----------------------------

Venue: Clogwyn yr Oen (Moelwyns), Gwynedd (Rhyolite)

Climbs (assisted leading):

- Bent [S]

Plus some bouldering to finish

***

As alluded to above, all this enabled us to lead Crack 2, Tryfan Fach [Diff] on the Saturday and to revisit Tennis Shoe, The Other Direct Route [HS 4b] on the Sunday.

In reply to TRNovice:
Sounds good, just don't expect to get weather like that all the time!
No all you've got to do is forget everything you learned in the bottom and top roping sessions

In reply to TRNovice: nice one - i predict that nowherwe will ever be quite like snowdonia :¬)

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

I think leading Tennis Shoe wiped most of that from my memory

In reply to TRNovice:

I think that we get extra credit for leading it without any cams

In reply to TRNovice:

Why the need to fork out money to learn to climb all over again, this time outside??

I used to always climb inside until fairly recently. I have now seen the light and have had no problems transfering my skills onto both grit and limestone where i feel confident at fairly respectable grades!

If you want to learn to climb outside why not head out there, start on easy stuff, get a feel for it and progress as you did inside??

In reply to OopzISlippedAgain:

You don't really multi-pitch inside (well not at any of the walls I have been to) - I think that it's sort of helpful to know how to establish belay anchors, rig abseils etc. before you go and learn by trial and error. That's to say nothing of selecting and placing gear. Are you suggesting that I'd have been better off buying some nuts and hexes and figuring out how to use then as I went along???

Are you suggesting that I'd have been better off buying some nuts and hexes and figuring out how to use then as I went along???

That could have been a very painful lesson

In reply to OopzISlippedAgain: but if you havnt got maytes to learn with courses are a good idea.

In reply to TRNovice:


Well, that's what many people do but normally with someone more experienced to help explain etc. In the absence of that guiding hand, it sounds like you did exactly the right thing. Glad you enjoyed it.

I recently revisited Idwal myself and led Tennis Shoe - which is indeed a top route (if polished). Which pitches did you lead? Good effort regardless.

In reply to JonC:

We are both pretty much at the same level (at least outside) and don't have any friends who climb regularly, so needed some pointers. We also thought we might meet some people in a similar position to ourselves. We rather over-achieved in this area as 5 out of the 6 people on the course were from our climbing wall (The Castle)!


I led the first (The Other Direct Route) and third pitches and my girlfriend led through on the second and fourth. We didn't do the final rock face, but rather scrambled up the next mini-pitches and then down into the gully to return to the foot of the slabs.

In reply to Jenn:

... and for using the "rabbit killer" once each

In reply to TRNovice:

Well, good effort on the 1st pitch is all I can say (if you did the normal HS start - very polished and quite interesting). Whatever you did, sounds like a great effort. If you can do that, you can really start to motor now. Although it wasn't exactly my cup of tea, something rather similar in some respects (slabby with only a couple of hard moves) is the The Cracks HS on Dinas Mot.

In reply to JonC:

and with the option of missing out the hardest bit again

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

erm, yes, well I was trying to be polite....

what was your 12 pitches on last weekend? sounds like a good long mountaineering route, or a busy day on a big crag...

In reply to JonC:
a busy day on a little crag actually - Rob's Rocks. Though a couple were only 8m so that's possibly cheating

In reply to Simon Caldwell:


god no, 8m is a long pitch in the Peak It all counts...

ps: where is/are Rob's Rocks? and does he know he left them there?

In reply to JonC:
The Chew Valley. Opposite Wilderness Rocks, and not too far from Dovestones Edge.

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Just wondering, wich bits do you mean - the rock face a the end? - Yes, that looked a bit scary.

As we said we only had minimal kit: two sets of nuts, a few hexes and some slings. I would assume that for more serious stuff we'll need to get a few Friends.

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Bimbling crag for when you do not feel like walking too far to do routes on Laddow. We used to go on there when the watermans house did cups of tea, cat would disappear for a week or so and come in dragging a rabbit with it.

In reply to sutty:

"Bimbling" sums it up quite nicely. Apart from the Nose perhaps

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Hmm - on further inspection:

"Been Climbing For
11 to 20 years

Best Onsights
Trad - VS"

Can't exactly say that you have been cracking up the grades.

In reply to Jenn:

It seems the same comment could go for you, but then you do live in a socially deprived city

Simon does climb HVS, it is just that he calls them VS as he finds that if he thought he was on a 6a he would get elvis leg. He will probably do a few real HVS routes this year, I have a cunning training routine for him.

In reply to Jenn:

I don't think I said that I had did I?
I could claim several HVSs and probably an E1 though if ignored the fact that I'd missed out the crux ;-0

In reply to Jenn:


Abusing Simon doesn't get around the point that he knows what he's talking about, he wasn't being rude to the OP, and he's spot on about The Cracks. The top move is the crux (much harder than the rest of the route) and is quite hard for HS but can be escaped quite easily. In fact though, the top move is very well protected (by nuts) and not at all scary.

In reply to Simon Caldwell: hey theres nothing wrong with being a solid VS leader! Im right there with you (well was we'll see tonight if i still deserve that title).

In reply to TRNovice:

Multi-pitch courses fair enough, i just dont see the point of single pich couses.

>Are you suggesting that I'd have been better off buying some nuts and hexes and figuring out how to use then as I went along???

Borrow a mates and go climb with them.

In reply to Iain Ridgway:

Point taken

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

I am very sorry. I really got it wrong. It thought [incorrectly] that you were making fun of our [not terribly difficult] route.

As we said before, it was only our second time out doing trad. I think that it would of been unwise for us to attempt something more serious without having the experience to back it up.

Once again, I got it wrong and I apologise.

In reply to OopzISlippedAgain:

You still have to know how to place gear and set anchors - which we didn't. It's much less intimidating to learn this on a single pitch route.

In reply to Jenn:

Good effort then

In reply to JonC:

Thanks

In reply to Jenn:
No worries. I certainly wouldn't make fun out of anyone leading that route, I'd been climbing for about 6 years before I found the courage to do it. Though the last pitch was the scariest

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Was the last pitch the rather steep rock face at the top? I saw a few people doing it. It seemed to involve a dodgy traverse upwards. Do you miss out any bit of the tricky descent scramble if you do it?

In reply to Jenn:


Having only done Tennis Shoe a few weeks ago, I can confirm you move left along a muddy ledge (or it was when we were there) to a steep wall with a bit of a groove in the RHS. You start to climb the groove, move left onto the steeper wall, pull up onto the slab above this and then finish by pulling over a huge boulder thing. It is probably the hardest pitch on the route as the pro is less than inspiring and it's about the same tech as the 1st pitch (assuming you did the HS start). It takes you a bit higher up but the descent is the same.

In reply to Jenn:
The last pitch involved an exposed step left onto a nose.
Perhaps the steep rock face you saw was Lazarus, on the next 'tier' of Idwal. You can then do another route on the final tier (eg the Arete VDiff or Groove Above HS).
As far as I can remember this avoids the exposed traverse into the gully, but not the gully itself.
But these days whenever I do routes there I tend to carry on upwards, either to the Cneifion Arete or one of the routes in the Grey Slab area on Glyder whichever-one-it-is.

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Actually, you are right in that what Jenn saw was probably the leftwards traverse on Lazarus. Jenn, the steep wall is the Holly Tree Wall and has a lot of good, if slightly harder, routes on it.

We saw people missing the last pitch on Tennis Shoe - it's actually not descried that well in the guide and a lot of people seem to blast past it on the RHS to the finishing ledge for the normal routes.

In reply to JonC:
Having only done Tennis Shoe a few weeks ago, I can confirm you move left along a muddy ledge (or it was when we were there) to a steep wall with a bit of a groove in the RHS. You start to climb the groove, move left onto the steeper wall, pull up onto the slab above this and then finish by pulling over a huge boulder thing. It is probably the hardest pitch on the route as the pro is less than inspiring and it's about the same tech as the 1st pitch (assuming you did the HS start). It takes you a bit higher up but the descent is the same.

Oh, I see where the last pitch is now - I lead it! I kept thinking that my dodgy bits of pro were due to my lack of placement knowledge and Friends :-o I don't feel so bad now. I wasn't too scared off by the little protection because the climbing wasn't that bad. We started Tennis Shoe with 'The Other Direct Route' which is only a S.

I just had a look at the guidebook - yes, you are right I was looking at Holly Tree Wall. Someone was doing 'The Original Route' [VS] with a right hand traverse. Now that looked scary!

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

I wanted to continue up to Glyder whoever as well, but I think that it was a bit beyond our capabilities at the moment.

In reply to Jenn:

Fawr I think

The guide book had 5 pitches for Tennis Shoe and we did 4 followed by quite a bit of scrambling before we started descending. Either we ran two pitches together at the end (which I doubt), or we scrambled the last pitch.

In reply to TRNovice:
I don't remember how many pitches we took, but I do know that they weren't the same as the ones in the guidebook. My partner missed the belay at some point and rather than downclimbing the slab, just carried on until he found something else (with about 2m rope left).

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

The first, HS pitch, which I did, is 150 feet and I think the guide has another one at 120 feet (which I seem to remember doing and only had a few metres of [50m] rope left which would be about right allowing for a rather complex belay anchor). I think maybe that Jenn did two pitches in one...

In reply to TRNovice:

We ran two pitches together. I'll show you the picture tonight.

I set up my belay just below the boulder thingy - after having first topped out on it but thinking that it didn't offer the best angle to belay from. You will remember this by the rope going taut, then slack, then taut again.

The rather steep rockface to the right that we were looking at was 'Holly Tree Wall' - which wasn't part of Tennis Shoe.

In reply to Jenn:

OK - I'm glad we are not the only ones who didn't find the guide book that clear - did you link two together at the top (our fourth pitch) or in the middle (our second)?

In reply to TRNovice:

I think everyone should go and climb Cinderella on the wall above the Idwal Slabs as my great grandfather and great grandmother put it up...

In reply to TRNovice:

It was the middle ones.

In reply to James Jackson:

Really - that is cool!

Did they do any other new routes?

In reply to Jenn:

OK - so you climbed past the stance for pitch two and stopped just below and to the right of the stance for pitch three - right? All become clearer .

In reply to TRNovice:

Yep - that was where I got into problmes out on the face.

In reply to James Jackson:

That was my first route on that wall, we did it because there was a queue on Lazarus. And it was much better than the guidebook made out, would be better still with a little more traffic.

Any other outes put up by your forebears that I should look out for?