If you had to choose for road riding would you rather have carbon wheels and metal frame or the other way around, please share thoughts if you feel like it.
By metal i mean alu alloy, Ti alloy or steel alloy, doesn't really matter although I know each have their own merits.
Isn't that a bit like asking "Do you prefer pesto on your apple pie or custard on your pasta?"
The main advantage of carbon wheels is sensible weight with deep aero rims or super light weight. Both of those only make sense with carbon frames.
IMHO of course. Others may differ.
I'd say that depends - the part of the question the OP is missing is what brakes do you have. If it's rim brake, then alloy wheels make a lot of sense, if it's disc, then that avoids a lot of the braking issues with carbon rims.
If I had to choose between the OPs options, I'd def go with carbon frame and alloy wheels.
For most people, it will come down to cost and carbon wheels are expensive to replace if you prang them on a pothole.
> For most people, it will come down to cost ...
... and aesthetics. Some people may well just want carbon wheel for the 'look'. But deep rims look a bit weird (IMHO again) on a skinny tubed steel frame. Let's face it, most bike purchases are based more on 'want you want/like' rather than what is objectively best.
I wouldn't have carbon anything as I'm not a professional cyclist and it would be a waste of money.
good call, yes disc
Neither, I own a proper (carbon) bike with proper (carbon) wheels for the road.
I didn't add that as an option as I was interested in knowing people's thoughts given a specific budget for one or the other and which they would prioritize
> ... which they would prioritize
Meaningless without some intended usage definition. Commuter? Hill-climb racer? Flat racer? Audax? Do-it-all bike? Going to the pub bike? The trouble is that I don't see that either of your choices is particularly well optimised for any usage.
I would imagine you are getting more cost-relative benefits from upgrading to a carbon frame rather than carbon wheels. There is no real point in having carbon wheels unless you are racing, and if you are racing at that level then you are going to have a full carbon bike anyway so it is a bit of a moot point. whereas a carbon frame definitely has some benefits to the casual cyclist (less power lost through flex when you are out of the saddle for example).
>... whereas a carbon frame definitely has some benefits to the casual cyclist (less power lost through flex when you are out of the saddle for example).
Really? So how many Watts do you lose (measured, not guessed) and what proportion of time do you spend powering out of the saddle on your 'casual' rides?
As Marek says, it very much depends on usage. If it was a triathlon bike I might go deep carbon rims on an alloy frame (along with an alloy set of rims for windy days), but for general riding I'd take the carbon frame.
Tbh if you are after aero gains you'll get more out of deep wheels on an alloy frame than by swapping frames. However, carbon frames have their own, different benefits - things like stiffness/comfort/weight/ride feel.
Of course if you really want aero gains the best bang-for-buck is to sort your position, get some velotoez, a pointy helmet and a skin suit. Downside being that you look like a true Fred chopping around like that on an alloy roadie.
> Tbh if you are after aero gains you'll get more out of deep wheels on an alloy frame than by swapping frames. However, carbon frames have their own, different benefits - things like stiffness/comfort/weight/ride feel.
Yeah, exactly - I prefer the ride of a carbon frame so that would be my first choice of upgrade unless I really wanted the aero gains for racing.
> Of course if you really want aero gains the best bang-for-buck is to sort your position, get some velotoez, a pointy helmet and a skin suit. Downside being that you look like a true Fred chopping around like that on an alloy roadie.
I'll see your skin suit and pointy helmet, and raise you a fairing - both for the gains and the look 😁
I have a selection -
Commuter and filthy weather bike - aluminium frame, aluminium wheels, disc brakes. Solid and reliable.
Fancy road bike - carbon frame, carbon wheels. Rim brakes. Stops fine in the rain, but I hate to grind the rims, so it doesn't really got out in the rain.
Other fancy road bike - lightweight stainless frame, alloy wheels, rim brakes. The rims wear, but a new rim is about £180 fitted.
Old road bike - carbon frame, alloy rims, rim brakes. Winter bike really now.
For choice in the UK - a frame you like and carbon wheels and disc brakes. If you're a fair weather cyclist, then a round tube frame, cable gears, rim brakes and a pair of shallow carbon wheels. I like round tubes. These square/squashed section tubes make it look like you're riding an over-sized coathanger
My good bike is getting on a bit now, carbon with mechanical Dura Ace 9000 with rim brakes. When it came to deciding on wheels, I opted for fairly high end alloy over a more mid range carbon. Largely because of braking and rim wear concerns.
The bike is set up for climbing rather than aero, so deep rims are not a major consideration, although the rims are slightly deeper than standard and the wheels are very light. Whole bike is 6.5kg.
The bike I use most days is all alloy with disks.
If I had to take one, then it would have to be carbon frame over carbon wheels.
> I have a selection -
> Commuter and filthy weather bike - aluminium frame, aluminium wheels, disc brakes. Solid and reliable.
> Fancy road bike - carbon frame, carbon wheels. Rim brakes. Stops fine in the rain, but I hate to grind the rims, so it doesn't really got out in the rain.
> Other fancy road bike - lightweight stainless frame, alloy wheels, rim brakes. The rims wear, but a new rim is about £180 fitted.
> Old road bike - carbon frame, alloy rims, rim brakes. Winter bike really now.
> For choice in the UK - a frame you like and carbon wheels and disc brakes. If you're a fair weather cyclist, then a round tube frame, cable gears, rim brakes and a pair of shallow carbon wheels. I like round tubes. These square/squashed section tubes make it look like you're riding an over-sized coathanger
Converse opinion: round tubes make it look like you're riding scaffolding.
I have a pair of these on my road bike
https://blackinc.cc/product/aero-climber-black-inc-five/
and these get funny looks from people who like carbon wheels (they are incredible BTW I can't see them when i'm riding )
Note 1 - the above is mostly based on hardtail MTB's.
Note 2 - I've always bought 'big branded' rather than Chinese open mould carbon
Thanks for the replies, I'm riding a decent carbon bike with decent alloy wheels so am happy with that and the comments seem to support that. I was hoping the poll would stimulate some good arguments both ways, with the carbon wheels being lighter or more aero, both having advantages, but at a financial cost.
I think it probably depends on specifically which bikes you've had. In my case I had a carbon SuperSix for a few years and more recently an alloy CAAD12. I would say there little difference in comfort although the SuperSix was on 25mm GP4ks @ 80-90psi and the CAAD was on 28mm GP5ks @ 70psi. The CAAD however has be more 'fun' in some weird way I can't specify. Either way if I want all-day comfort I'd use my alloy Kinesis Tripster with 38mm GKs @ 40psi. Bottom line is that I think the frame and its material is quite a small contributor to the overall comfort equation. Geometry and tyres (particularly pressure) are the biggies.
> Thanks for the replies, I'm riding a decent carbon bike with decent alloy wheels so am happy with that and the comments seem to support that. I was hoping the poll would stimulate some good arguments both ways, with the carbon wheels being lighter or more aero, both having advantages, but at a financial cost.
You're probably not alone in that debate - having a carbon frame does make carbon wheels tempting. Full disclosure: Having just lost my lovely CAAD12 under a car, I'm mulling over all sort of options and yes, carbon wheels are singing their siren songs again. I will resist.
I’ve had my bike since 2017, do 8-10,000 miles a year mainly on that bike on the same carbon wheels and the brake track is barely marked.
I have a carbon disc brake bike.
Hunt 4 season aluminium wheels for winter and lovely ZIPP 404's (carbon) for nice weather.
Both have their merits. The Hunts did get damaged during an audax but they have a good replacement policy and I got 50% off a replacement rim.
I would go for a carbon bike first for weight saving ( I live in a hilly area) then upgrade the wheels
Carbon wheels are not the the answer to everything. I have a lovely pair of shallow section carbon wheels - stupid expensive, way more than I would want to pay, but they came with the bike, which was in a sale (rim brake, cable gears, 11 speed Campag, round carbon tubes - not in vogue, but lovely). I have a 73kg rock climber's build.
So far I have broken three spokes on the back and one on the front. Each breakage involves the walk/telephone call of shame because the wheel turns into a Pringle. Apparently, I need to check the tension, but seeing as the nipples are internal that is a) four fifths of f all use to me and b) they shouldn't slacken off in the first place if they're locktited. Fingers crossed, they've settled down and one hasn't broken for a while.
The other good pair has Chris King hubs and a few more spokes. They keep rolling along. Every now and then the hubs get a service and a new alloy rim. That makes a Chris King based wheelset cost effective. You effectively get a top-flight new wheel for £180 when the old rim wears out.
Discs - got a bike with those and prefer the rims brakes frankly, but I don't like the grim grey mess you get with alloy rim brakes in the wet, (especially in London), so the all-weather commuter has discs. I can easily see how much brake pad I have left on a rim brake, which isn't the case with discs
That might all be prejudice tho', but my back says carbon feels better
> I suspect my height (170cms) is a largish factor...
I'm bit taller than you, but the CAAD is a very traditional frame (no dropped/slopping anything) so I still had little exposed seatpost.
> That might all be prejudice tho', but my back says carbon feels better
At the end of the day, if you're not racing, how you feel when riding the bike is all that counts!
Each frame material has its pros and cons, depending on your priorities as a rider, including weight, budget, longevity and the performance characteristics you want from the frame. But it has to be noted, you'll probably ride at a slightly slower average speed when riding a steel frame. For some people, riding faster on a carbon bike is one of its advantages. By the way, here is an interesting article about the speed https://www.bikertricks.com/average-cycling-speed/
From the point of view of the budget, I'd go with a carbon frame and metal wheels. Wheels tend to take more of a beating than frames, so with that in mind I'd rather occasionally have to replace a cheaper metal wheel than an expensive carbon one.
But if we are talking about the ride quality, I vote for carbon wheels. I tried them and they are wow! Not just for killing out trail buzz. They are direct in that when you pedal, it goes straight to the ground better and more efficiently.
That website looks like a 'rab mountain equipment vango black diamond very good price genuine rock climbing equipment carabiner' knock off site.
For your amusement I offer you front, middle and rear gears - who knew!
"Front gears are best used on flat terrain or when riding slowly. They allow you to ride in a straight line without having to shift your whole body each time you change gear.
Rear Gears are best used on hills or when you want to go faster. They allow your bike to go up hills easily and keep you moving along at a more speed, even when you’re going uphill.
Mid-Gear is perfect for all sorts of cycling situations. They let you cover a lot of ground quickly while still being able to handle some hills, making them great for fast-paced cyclists or mountain bikers."
By way of translation (and it still makes no sense) they mean shifters, rear mech/cassette and chainring/front mech.
Entertaining in a car crash sort of way, but it is ten minutes of your life you'll never get back. Personally, I kept scrolling out of disbelief...
As others have said, the poll's an overly simplified choice. For instance, I've got a lovely, Italian (in name at least), carbon aero frame, disc brakes and Di2, that came with, frankly, crap alloy wheels. Once they were swapped out for 50 section carbon wheels, it's on another level in terms of speed and feel.
My other main frame is a carbon gravel frame, analogue shifting, takes mudguards and a rack if necessary. With appropriate tyres, it's great for everything from mellow singletrack through commuting to long-distance endurance e.g. did London-Edinburgh-London on it last year.
However, I once put the 50 section carbon wheels on the gravel bike for what I hoped would be a quick endurance combo and it was indescribably grim. So stiff, every little bump and road imperfection transmitted into body contact points despite playing around with tyre pressures etc
So really you need a wheel/tyre combo that complements the frame construction/layup, regardless of the materials involved
Cannondale CAAD13 Ultegra. All the bike you will ever want. Aluminum frame but light as carbon with upgraded alloy wheels.
Pointless... I'll have carbon for both. Screw compromise!
Fine but not everyone has enough funds for both, so in this hypothetical situation which would you choose.
It's a thought exercise as much as anything rather than just throwing money at things to make them better
> Fine but not everyone has enough funds for both, so in this hypothetical situation which would you choose.
> It's a thought exercise as much as anything rather than just throwing money at things to make them better
I didnt want to spend silly money so I bought the carbon bike originally and built the carbon wheels with good Chinese rims.
Carbon rims only make decent sense if one goes aero. So I went 65mm for the road wheels on my gravel bike 🤣