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Help, found a complete new bouldering area!

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Dynamodux 18 Jan 2017
Hi all ,
ok so this is a weird 1, on my travels recently I have found a potentially large bouldering area, once the weather picks back up I would like to spend some time up there.

what I need help with is how I would go about cleaning whole routes / walls up (best way and to preserve the rock)

I've been a climber for quite a few years but this would be my first on creating some new routes and cleaning up so any advice is really appreciated.


Thanks, Lee
 EddInaBox 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux:

Who owns the land, does it have legal protection, e.g. a SSSI, can you identify any plant species that have legal protection under Schedule 8 of the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981, what rock type is it?
 Offwidth 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux:

What type of rock is it? Some rocks (like soft sandstones) need a lot more care when cleaning than others (like granite). Who owns the land and is it under CRoW. Also it might be worth checking with a BMC access officer if there are any known access issues in the area.
 Trangia 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux and Edinabox:


Good advice. If it's in the UK, the chances are that it's been "discovered" before and there is very probably a good reason why it hasn't been exploited.

I think that it's highly unlikely that that there is anywhere left in Britain not yet "discovered" except perhaps some remote off the beaten track high mountain crags, or sea cliffs, which are physically a faff to get to, and where there is plenty of existing good stuff more easily accessible.
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 James Malloch 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Trangia:

> Good advice. If it's in the UK, the chances are that it's been "discovered" before and there is very probably a good reason why it hasn't been exploited.

> I think that it's highly unlikely that that there is anywhere left in Britain not yet "discovered" except perhaps some remote off the beaten track high mountain crags, or sea cliffs, which are physically a faff to get to, and where there is plenty of existing good stuff more easily accessible.

Really? I've seen new areas being documented fairly regularly. The new area of Caley is just one example - a short walk from one of the most popular areas around Yorkshire!
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 althesin 18 Jan 2017
Somewhere in the Midlands? do tell.
 DaveHK 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Trangia:

>
> I think that it's highly unlikely that that there is anywhere left in Britain not yet "discovered" except perhaps some remote off the beaten track high mountain crags, or sea cliffs, which are physically a faff to get to, and where there is plenty of existing good stuff more easily accessible.

There are lots of new bouldering areas being discovered because for years people walked past them looking for proper climbing.

3
 Bulls Crack 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux:

We can only really help if you post some maps and a photos......
 Will Hunt 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Trangia:

Obviously the OP would do well to ignore this nonsense.


OP - is it on CRoW land? If not you may need to be careful about taking access. Definitely be careful about removing vegetation that is protected, and check whether the land is designated as a SSSI.

Cleaning method will depend on the rock type and quality. For good quality gritstone or anything harder, careful application of a wire brush is useful for removing the more stubborn varieties of lichen. Be sure not to damage the rock.
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 Offwidth 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Will Hunt:

The BMC explicitly recommend not to use wire brushes on grit of whatever quality. The YKC state use only a soft brush on grit.
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 Trangia 18 Jan 2017
In reply to James Malloch:

OK fair comment, I stand corrected.
 Will Hunt 18 Jan 2017
In reply to Offwidth:

In reply to Offwidth:

I think we've discussed this on here before, Steve. At the risk of going over old ground I'd reiterate that it is perfectly possible, and sometimes necessary, to use a wire brush to clean previously unclimbed rock and bring it into a climbable state. I know this because I've seen it first hand. I honestly don't know how else you would remove the dreaded Flat Brown Lichen. Furthermore the old guard of crag developers around Yorkshire used them extensively in developing new crags that we now consider to be popular crags - "we should have taken out shares the companies that made them".
If the BMCs advice is otherwise then that is quite proper, to stop foolish people new to climbing bringing such tools to already developed crags where a careless hand could cause serious and irreversible damage. In this case the geez is asking specifically about vegetated unclimbed rock so ought to be pointed towards the right tools for the job, with the appropriate caveats.
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 James Malloch 19 Jan 2017
In reply to Will Hunt:
Will (or anyone), just wondering what your views are on the best conditions to clean rock in?

I.e. is it easier to get some types of vegetation off whilst it's wet/damp/dry? Asking as my only time really trying to clean something up was when it was a little wet and whilst it seemed okay to climb, but it could definitely have been improved with a extra scrub once dry.

I'd like to go back and try the problem once it's dry again but it'll probably need extra cleaning now. Just wondering if it's worth using a wet weekend to go back and clean it or just do it on the day it's actually dry.

It's Particle Collision on the Chevin if it makes any difference. Seemed pretty decent rock so I don't think the damp would cause any issues.
Post edited at 09:20
 Offwidth 19 Jan 2017
In reply to Will Hunt:

I know we have done it before. Take it to your area meet or the BMC or YMC and get them to change their message with the usual, caveats if you can. If anything someone like you posting on UKC is about as bad as it gets. Any climbing idiot gets to justify their action based on past bad practice and a bit of veg in a crack (hardly uncommon and even on some classics). Popular classics were also formed from past chipping of holds or from hammered aid.

When I've tried to persuade people to not use a wire brush at Burb South boulders, famous climbers do it and they thought it was OK was the most common excuse (most understood the issues and stopped); these days the message seems to be getting through.

If you insist on pointing people in spite of the message and the strong views of others why not at least make very sure they know what they are doing and do it offline.
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 Will Hunt 19 Jan 2017
In reply to James Malloch:

Difficult to say, James. I know that Bonjoy and Warbs rave about how easy it is to get moss and lichen off when it's wet or damp. If cleaning in these conditions you obviously need to be very careful about how you go about it.
If the veg is holding water, and some mosses do more so than others, then the rock is going to be wet underneath once you've finished anyway and probably require a return visit.
Whatever you do with Particle Collision just exercise caution - and let us all know when you've resurrected it!
 steveriley 19 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux:

Yesterday's news story suggests bouldering in the UK isn't quite all done yet... https://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item/70907/pete_robins_in_north_wales_bould...
 Tobes 19 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux:

Well done Lee, stick with it, it becomes quite addictive though!

I've currently got two venues on the go (one quite large, perhaps 30+ problems the other a little smaller) and neither are that remote to 'civilisation'! Both schist so able to responsibly apply a little wire brushing, followed by softer nylon type brushes. Take a pair of clear glasses to protect your eyes.

The following applies specifically to Scotland, for the larger venue I contacted SNH (Scottish Natural Heritage) for confirmation on the areas status and my proposed activities, all good from them. Followed that with an enquiry to MCOS to check if the area has/had any notes of interest etc. Then checked the SMC database of new routes (last 8 years or so) but as these are essentially boulders not routes no reference was found.

Following the above just gives you an outline of best practise I guess, some developers may go further than this, others less so.

A final point on 'new venues' which has already been said but for those motivated enough there is still loads of potential for new routes/boulders etc in the UK. Get an OS map, I.D unknown crags, outcrops, scree fields and go take a look!
 Alex Riley 19 Jan 2017
In reply to Tobes:

Opened a new boulder on the side of loch Tay yesterday. Bit of a scrub and it was good to go after a bit of a breeze to dry it out.
 Tobes 19 Jan 2017
In reply to Alex Riley:

Good work and just what I'm talking about!

Hopefully will have an online guide done for the larger venue soon(ish)....will post here when done and I think MCOS will promote it too if they're happy with the end result.
pasbury 23 Jan 2017
In reply to Dynamodux:

You'll have to be a bit more specific; a grid reference is absolutely necessary before I can make any sensible comment on this matter
In reply to James Malloch:

Brush it when its dry - never when wet.

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