UKC

Raven Tor Millers Dale Parking issues

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 UKB Shark 10 May 2023

Disappointing to read about recent poor parking on the bend past Raven Tor beyond the clearway sign particularly given the social media posting on the matter and the BMC RAD guidance. 

To clear up any confusion about what a clearway means, as it says on the new police signs that means no stopping except in an emergency. No stopping also includes no parking on the verge even if your wheels are off the road. So whilst you might be able to park off the road in places by the bend it is still illegal and the police notices that have appeared indicate that ticketing might start. The notices have I guess been added following local complaints to the police. 

Still want to risk parking on the bend? Just think about what that leads to. Other climbers thinking that it is ok so they park less well. Next climber sees two cars and they park even more shoddily. Before you know it on a bank holiday weekend there isn’t enough room to get a fire engine or a tractor past. 

Imagine If Raven Tor was banned. Hubble, Revelations, Body Machine, Powerband, Keen Roof, Nachos into something else all gone. Even those who don’t like it see it as a decent wet weather option.

It’s not as if the alternative is that onerous. If you drive up and all the spots are taken then dump your kit and mates at the crag and carry on driving down to the legit free parking at the start of Tideswell Dale and walk 15 mins back up the road. 

If you see anyone behaving badly point them to the BMC RAD advice which is here: https://www.thebmc.co.uk/modules/rad/view.aspx?id=4398 

Thanks

Post edited at 09:57
 Team BMC 10 May 2023
In reply to UKB Shark:

Thanks Simon.

Double parking on the bend is particularly obstructive and likely to piss people off, or worse.

Usually there's parking available in the layby at the bottom of Tideswell dale, but I expect this would have more than filled up this weekend if all the bad parkers had moved there. If this is the case and there is also no parking in Millers Dale then the ultimate fall back would be the big pay and display at Millers Dale station. This would be a 1.2km walk in, which isn't the end of the world. Obviously car sharing and turning up early will help avoid having to endure this fate.

 loose overhang 12 May 2023
In reply to Team BMC:

Isn't it an easy walk from the road crossing?

OP UKB Shark 12 May 2023
In reply to loose overhang:

Yes it’s an easy walk from the turn off from the B6049 by the Anglers Rest where the bus stop is (65 bus route Sheffield to Buxton).

Only very limited car parking around this junction though the side of the road immediately before the pub and the pub car park has signs up that their car park is for patrons only. The clearway starts only a few yards beyond the pub. 

As mentioned above the other options are the foot of Tideswell Dale past Raven Tor (probably less than the 15 mins walk I quoted) which is free but scarcely surfaced car parking probably with room for about 6 cars. 

There is also another proper larger Peak Park car park at the top of Tideswell Dale on the B6049 which is pay and display but free with the annual pass. Lovely walk down Tideswell Dale is free

Similarly with the Millers Station Car Park which is even more extensive but very popular and to access Raven Tor it is nicest and safest to walk back down the Monsal Trail (rather than following the roads) and you turn off to the trail down a steep path/steps to access the foot bridge over the Wye just past Raven Tor.

Note the (free) roadside parking bridge on the B6049 at the Wormhill turn off up to the station car park with the extra wide tarmac pavement has recently been double yellow lined so even if you leave plenty of room for the rare passing pedestrian it is still ticketable.

A bit further up the hill on the B6049 is the pull in for Beginners Wall and Griffs which is best to park back end in to allow space for more cars and a safer exit (room for 5? cars). Not a nice or safe walk down the road though.

Re Peak Parking permit this is good value for regulars at £40pa and you get to use other useful car parks such as the Surprise View Millstone car park and Stanage Plantation one. 

https://www.peakdistrict.gov.uk/visiting/planning-your-visit/parking

If you want to park at the crag at weekends best to get there mega early and as a bonus you generally get to benefit from the best conditions before the sun comes round at lunchtime.

All this said I remain sceptical and think this will fall on deaf ears to the minority who mess things up for the majority. Concerted peer pressure at the crag (I’m sick to death of being a lone voice) and active ticketing of cars on the bend are the things most likely to change everyone’s behaviour sadly. 

 spidermonkey09 12 May 2023
In reply to UKB Shark

Politely challenging people worked far better than signs at Kilnsey in the end. Several years after it was raised the problem parking has all but disappeared. People have to be brave enough to call it out and make it socially unacceptable. 

 llanberis36 12 May 2023
In reply to spidermonkey09:

Tend to agree, being round the peak lime for decades, parking has got worse. Double parking at the Dale, obviously the Tor, however interesting that not so much at Rubicon

asking others to park more sensibly is key, however as climbers we are not very good at that, too nice maybe

many people can’t get to the crag early (or midweek) for ‘Bon Connies’ due to other commitments or travel, but as we do, and if committed to a lime session, we often do the ‘lime triangle’, the Tor, Stony and Rubicon and climb where we can park 

Having  projects at all these helps……..

Let’s not lose another venue like Griffs, we only have ourselves to blame of course 

 Offwidth 12 May 2023
In reply to spidermonkey09:

That has always been the best solution in my opinion.

I just don't get the reluctance to use RAD which always highlights chronic access issues that might lead to tighter restrictions. We lost access to Wildcat again recently because climbers too often ignored simple access information.

Risking prosecution and points by parking on a clearway is also a bit beyond a parking fine, so it suggests worrying ignorance of the highway code (or that some climbers have become so wealthy they don't need to care about such things!?).

 spidermonkey09 12 May 2023
In reply to Offwidth:

I don't think its anything to do with a 'reluctance to use RAD.' Probably most people parking badly are well aware of the potential for access issues and aware, even if only dimly, of the RAD, but iffy parking at the Tor has become so normalised they assume its broadly fine, or they are simply dicks. The RAD advice is good but basically advocates common sense. Much more effective to point out issues in person.

 Offwidth 12 May 2023
In reply to spidermonkey09:

We debated this before and many here admitted they never use RAD and said they rely on signs (which have a habit of being pulled down) and physical guidebooks (which can never deal with changes).  UKC logbooks being linked to RAD helps but my guess is a majority of climbers still don't use UKC.

It's a blight of minority dickish behaviour everywhere.... I regularly drive past my local school at kicking out time and it's more common than not to see a parent parking on zigzags next to the pedestrian crossing outside the school. Similar to parking on clearway or where the road has double white centre lines (where prosecution is possible). 

Post edited at 11:17
OP UKB Shark 12 May 2023
In reply to spidermonkey09:

Yes ‘normalised’ hits the nail on the head. There’s a history of parking there - it’s convenient and to date no one has been ticketed and rarely does anyone pull you up at the crag. In part that’s because you can’t see the cars and vans parked there from the crag because it’s round the corner unlike at Kinsey where cars parked on the roadside are very visible from the crag and perps more easily identified.


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