UKC

Probably not the best time to ask this as we are due to start a family very soon but I was interested in thoughts/suggestions on the best trad multipitch VS(ish) route in the world. VS is a good grade as it’s never too difficult and me and my partner can generally swing leads enjoyably. Here is a rough criteria:

Should be graded VS or a roughly equivalent (not really interested in discussions as to whether this comparison is possible but am probably going to get them anyway)

Must be no technical snow or ice, the climbing should be entirely on rock

Must be a good length, at least 100m

Must be a logical sustained line, no girdles or enchainment’s

Might have some fixed gear but needs a reasonable sized trad rack for your average punter

Some of my suggestions:

In the UK Fionn Buttress is in a league of it’s own for me remote, sustained with stunning climbing. We’ve done other major contenders: south ridge direct, salamander and mousetrap (didn't rate it too highly but featured in a ukc VS’s article a while back) which whilst quality I thought were substantially  inferior

In Norway Bare Blåbær had amazing climbing but the top two pitches are not so good and it ends in the middle of nowhere

In the Dolomites the Southeast Arete of the Tofana de Rozes, brilliant sustained climbing although maybe a bit hard for VS and doesn’t end near the summit  

The north ridge of the Piz Badile felt a bit like a very long VS

In Morocco Central Buttress on Aylim, the climbing is maybe not the very best but a great adventure route

Any other suggestions? I’m guessing there are lots in North America I’m not aware of  

I thought South Crack (5.8) in Tuolomne was a world-class VS - lots of great jamming cracks plus some bold slab work.

Via Lara (n3+) is supposed to be Norway's best 'moderate' climb, probably more like HS than VS mind and it deffo isn't N3+!

Chris

This might have a bit too much fixed gear for your taste, though I think we took a small rack. Superb situation with some excellent climbing: Crimson Chrysalis (5.8) at Red Rocks, Nevada.

Another North American classic, from Yosemite this time, and you'll certainly want your trad rack, as the name implies: Nutcracker (5.8). Great route, but don't expect to have it to yourself!

For me the south face of Charlotte Dome in the high Sierra ticks all of the boxes - much longer than any of the Yosemite routes of that grade, sustained throughout its length and in a wonderful remote location.

My third North America suggestion is also from Yosemite: Snake Dike (5.7). Opinions differ as to whether it's VS or HS and you won't place very much gear, but it's another marvellous big day out.

What would you say Piz Badile North Ridge is? Amazing route maybe HS?

For the uk Spartan Slabs is the best mountain contender I’ve done or One Step in the Clouds on a crag.

What about Northeast Ridge (Bugaboo Spire) (5.8)?

Steve

For alpine rock, what about Papillons Arête (D+ 5c) above Chamonix, which felt around VS/HVS. Easy access, long and with super views. No snow involved if you ab back down the Peigne slabs.

May be a bit too much fixed gear for you but I really enjoyed Palavar les Flots at Ailefroide.

The abseil descent adds to the excitement

UKC Logbook - 'Palavar-les-flots' (ukclimbing.com)

If you didn't do the three crux pitches up the headwall, but instead went along the ledge to join the normal route, I suspect Sydpilaren (n6-) on Stetind would be among the best day routes you could find at about VS? I believe the crux moves of the normal route (Sydøsteggen/Normalveien (n4+)) are meant to be about VS, I've only abbed down that bit descending it - the rest was pretty straightforward scrambling, we descended it in approach shoes.

I'm not sure if it'll stand up to the competition, but Espolón Central (4c) is an amazing 12-pitch HS/VS in a great location and probably the best long route I've done roughly in that grade. Following the rest of the thread recommendations enthusiastically! Three of the OP's routes were already on my wishlist

Its a great easy alpine rock route, but its not a sustained multipitch climb in the true sense. there is only 1 section (the crux tower) where you have two back to back VS pitches (the second is more like E1 if done direct and free), otherwise its a typical ridge route, a few moves of climbing followed by meters of scrambling. nothing wrong with that but not what the OP is after.

In the chamonix area the best trad route (and probably the best rock climb) i have done in that grade range is the Praz Torrent NE face route (cant remember the name of the line itself, but its the only one people really go up there to do). It has a pitch of 6a which would put it into the E1 range, but each hard move can be aided on pegs, which puts the route on the whole as a fairly consistent 8 pitch VS 5a.

The durance route on the devils tower (Wyoming USA) is spectacular and summits a truly unique geological feature and feels about VS (5.7/5.8). It is also the easiest way to the top which makes it even more spactacular (ie. there is no simple walk off the back)!

I've done Papillons Arete, it is 20 years ago but I can hardly remember anything beyond my water bladder somehow split in my pack (do you squish through a narrow bit?) and going up a hard bit I thought I had wet myself without realising it because there was water dribbling down my leg. :-/ Doesn't it finish at the start of another ridge, but you scramble off down a scruffy gully? I guess it didn't leave a huge impression on me.

Fionn Butttess is nice. Snake Dyke and Charlotte Dome are pretty amazing but Only Blueberries is Only Severe.

Eliminate A on Dow is better than any of them.

Eliminate A is fantastic but the world is a big place 

Go to Table Mountain and do Jacobs Ladder, VS climbing in extreme situations.

If you need a warm up do Africa Crag first by the harder variants which take it up to VS. Both are world class.

High Exposure at the Gunks in New York state, US, is an absolute belter. Three pitches, I’m pretty sure it’s at least 100m, and when you do that move onto the top wall above the abyss, it feels like more.  It’s 5.6, which according to grade comparison tables is less than VS. But you can ignore the grade comparison tables…

like many alpine routes there is much thrutching to be had... it tops out at the 'start' of the peigne normal route.

A few suggestions to throw into the mix:

South Ridge on the Salbit - one of the best (if not the best) long rock routes I’ve ever done, on incredible weathered alpine granite. There’s on average probably 2-3 bolts per pitch but you definitely need a trad rack to fill in the gaps. 

Calculus Crack on the Chief, Squamish - amazing granite crack climbing in one of the best crack destinations for mortals anywhere.

…and for a UK suggestion - it’s technically three routes linked up, they’re not all VS (although the crux is), but it’s definitely longer that 100m and an amazing day out, so let’s not let that get in the way! Cioch West into Arrow Route into Integrity on Sron na Ciche, Skye.

Thought the top pitch was outrageously positioned VS 4c but the rest of it is rambling V Diff country...

Oh dear, I guess my fond memories of the route have once again been influenced by the excellent company I was in. We spent a fair bit of time sunbathing and shooting the breeze, as the party in front of us were super slow. They were well prepared for a full-on trad experience -  even to the point of carrying peg hammers! We spurned the easy ab descent, carried on, missed the last 'phrique and had to walk back down - an essential part of the Chamonix experience.

Northeast Ridge (Bugaboo Spire) (5.8)?
Agreed, one of the very best.

Direct Exum  in the Tetons is also pretty amazing.
https://www.mountainproject.com/route/105839153/lower-exum-ridge

Fissure D'Ailefroide  https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/ailefroide_-_south_end_of_the_vall...

Trad but with bolted belays ( if you don't miss them).   Lovely mix of climbing and great views, though a bit of a squeeze sometimes.    But do remember your headtorches if you start after lunch ! 

I've done a fair bit of multipitch VS in Scotland and I'm convinced that South Ridge Direct (VS 5a) is the best in country. A second ascent in the spring convinced me of this even more.

Great combo, but you could make a really solid VS with absolutely no loss in quality by starting instead up Cioch Grooves (HVS 5a), but swopping out the crux 5a pitch for the pitch of Cioch Direct (S 4a) which is right alongside.

The only thing that holds it back is the S crack is the only VS level pitch with truly stunning climbing IMO. Its a fantastic climb though and certainly one of the best mountain VS climbs I've done in the UK with lots of good climbing mostly following a great mountain feature. Its a bit of a shame the Rosa Pinnacle is optional too IMO.

Thanks for all the suggestions. It’s pretty pleasing to see that I’ve done all of the Uk suggestions: eliminate A (not even the best VS in the Lakes imo which for my money is engineers slab), Spartan slabs, south ridge direct (already mentioned and not a classic VS but a classic serve with one brief hard section) and the link up on the cioch but that doesn’t fit the criteria anyway, they’re nice but no Fionn buttress. American suggestions sound good but I’m not sure I’ll ever get over there climbing. As do some of the Alps ones apart from Las Palavar’s which is pretty average and bolted, never going to persuade my partner the Fissure is a good idea! 

May be a debate about the grade conversion, but at 5.7, Corrugation Corner (5.7) at Lover's Leap gets my vote, such amazing and unique climbing, with so many styles of climbing squeezed into the three pitches

Consider Arctic Norway again once travel is easier. It really is a gobsmackingly beautiful part of the world with some truly amazing climbing and relatively speaking, not so far away from us in the UK. I didn't even mention Østkammen (n5-) on the  Kuglhornet - that's about VS, maybe a touch easier but it just kicks any of the English and Welsh supposed VS classic into the long grass as a climbing experience. I've still not done Fionn Buttress, although I really must, but as an 'experience', in Scotland only the Old Man of Stoer comes close to the Norwegian routes I've done. They're just on another scale. My trip report from my last summer visit up there http://lightfromthenorth.blogspot.com/2013/09/rock-climbing-in-arctic-norwa... sadly now 8 years ago. I guess you've visited Lofoten. Would you not go back there and do other routes? My friend Dave, who I was with on that trip to Narvik area with, was recently back in Lofoten sailing. We climbed together there 18 years ago. With me (somewhat ridiculously) sending him photos of the guidebook and so on from Derbyshire, he did a few routes there with one of his ship-mates with the minimal climbing gear he took with him. He messaged me after saying "why did it take me so long to come back here!!!???" a sentiment I fully sympathize with. I really think it's a place that no climber would fail to love but I guess if you've been there you've got a fair impression. What routes did you do beyond Bare Blåbær (n5-)?

Hi Toby, we went to Narvik as well. It rained a lot but we did Klubbruta on the Eidetind and the normal route on Steind. Would love to do the South pillar but only the full route with the harder top pitches. Amazing place, we met a team that did the Kuglhornet and they made it sound hard and scary. On Lofoton it seemed like the best long mountain routes were all E1+, the only other route we did of note was the north ridge on Vagakallen which was a fun adventure. I went with a friend my partner is sadly convinced it’s too rainy, cold and expensive.

On another note good see there are other climber RS teachers! Can’t imagine there are many in the country

I did it for the fourth time this summer and I too am convinced.

I've been trying to think of something better abroad. I'm sure there is but I just don't seem to have climbed all that many routes of that grade abroad!

Not as exotic as some locations (although probably as hard to get to as many!) but how about Original Route (VS 5a) on The Old Man of Stoer? Ticks a lot of the boxes in the OP. 

I'll be a heretic here and say that the climbing is not that great on it - awkward more than anything. Its strength is in the pointiness and the fun of the swim. Better than the Old Man of Hoy though which doesn't even have a swim.

I really enjoyed the variation on the Madier Route on the Aiguille Dibona in the Ecrins. Since the Fissure Madier has been stripped of fixed gear making it about 5b (UK) there is a commonly climbed variation to the left of the Boell Ledges and then traversing back right. The route in that form felt about top-end VS and around 20 pitches, for us a magic day out.

That’s interesting! I thought if I got heckled it would be for length, not quality!

I thought the climbing was really good. Big 3D jug hauling, interesting line, good rock. I even enjoyed the first traverse pitch, which I thought was much nicer than advertised! But we had done the old man of hoy a few days earlier, so maybe it just felt top quality by comparison!

 Ostkammen is undoubtedly brilliant but is more of a component of  a great mountain day with wonderful situations - I'm not sure the actual climbing is all that fantastic. Klubrutta on Eidetind is likewise great as the start of a superb traverse of the mountain; I'm not sure it would stand out if you abbed off above the technical pitches.

In a similar style I think both of them are probably trumped by the incredible Wolf's Head TraverseWolf's Head (5.4) in the Wind Rivers, which felt about VS.

Bloomin' 'eck? Are you really an RS teacher too? I'm actually doing less of it this year; I've always taught A level sociology and the philosophy component of A level RS, but last year I started A level politics as well, and just met my new Y12 class today which is a healthy number, so I'll be doing as many hours of politics this year I think as RS. Haven't managed to totally escape from teaching it to Y8s and 9s, who tend to be less enthusiastic shall we say!

I did look at your routes in your logbook in hopefully un-worrying form of cyber-stalking! It does look like you climb at a very similar level to me, so I suspect you'd be fine on Vestpillaren on Presten, or on Sydpilaren on Stetind. But totally understand that if your partner is your life partner as well as your climbing partner, the dynamic can be a lot more complex than just what you are comfortable on.

Don't why, but I've always had predominantly good to great weather in Northern Norway. I never think of myself as particularly lucky with weather, but must have been up there!

I was going to mention Klubbruta but thought it might be easier than VS? But it sounds like sheelba has done it anyway.

I thought it, with a traverse on to the summit was one of the finest days I've had out ever. At the time we had no guidebook, just rumours from Finnish climbers that it was not too hard. I remember the climbing being great - yes, lots of the same, slabby corner cracks, but I guess there's something in the purity of such strong lines.

I agree in some ways about the Kuglhornet - amazing place, but either I was having an amazing low gravity day or the climbing was really straightforward. More alpine an experience.

I'll add the Wolf's Head to my dream list now!

Is this a tick-list for mini-Sheelba when it comes along? More seriously, its an interesting problem and a remarkably difficult one! For some people here it's obviously got to be about the climbing; that's fine, but for me its all about the situation. I'd want something offering wild exposure and some commitment in a wonderful setting that is not too overshadowed by its neighbours.

Comments on some of the suggestions so far:

• Palavar - "a bit too much fixed gear" - I don't think your average punter would require any gear on it, so I think its probably out of remit. And the climbing's not all that good unless you like quite repetitive padding!
• Fissure - good route, and definitely something that most would want a bit of gear on, but world class? Not sure - its definitely not even in my top 5 Ailefroide routes, though I guess by virtue of a lack of many others it might be my top Ailefroide trad route!
• Papillons - think I'd have to agree with Webster insomuch as I doubt its really what Sheelba's after. Great fun mind, just not in the spirit of the brief, even if it does tick the boxes.
• Salbit S ridge - not done it, but if its of anything like the grade-relative quality (phenomenal) of the W ridge then its got to be a contender. It looked sufficiently more of a "climb" than the Papillons for me to think it fits the bill too.
• Dibona - I love the place and its fantastic fun, especially some of the other routes (Savoyardes and Visite Ob stood out for me). Perhaps where it falls short is my need for it not to be overshadowed by its neighbours. Even within the Soreiller cirque you've got summits >500m higher on both sides. When you've been on e.g. the Plat de la Selle, or even the Soreiller summits, the Dibona looks pretty diminutive ! Then again, if we're not allowed on snow our western alps choices are going to be quite limited.
• N ridge of Badile - ok, its long, brilliant, beautiful and complete as can be without snow and ice. But, is it VS? Either way I think this has got to be a contender if we stretch the VSish to be +/- a grade.
• Lakes routes - Eliminate A was a great route with some good situations, but it's all about the middle pitches, either side of which is good, but not stellar climbing. Not done Engineers', but its <100m. I did think that Mickledore Grooves, though ruined by a boulder problem start, had a fabulous second pitch, but it too is <100m. So, given that, unless anybody is going to suggest a route on Scafell proper, Pillar or Esk Buttress I suspect Eliminate A it is.
• Anti-atlas - if I'm remembering correctly, Aylim central buttress was good (and a trip into Samazar is a great day out), but the fact that I'm struggling to remember the climbing only a few years since suggests it perhaps wasn't a world-class route for me?

Other thoughts & left-field suggestions:

• Is there anything in the Verdon? Not been, but I'd imagine if there was a top-notch VS it might be up there. How good and/or hard is la Demande, for example?
• What about something from the Argentiere?- if getting to the hut doesn't count as "technical snow and ice". You'd then have anything on the Plateau/Genepi/Refuge/Minaret/etc to go at. There's definitely some amazing climbing there, but I think it's mostly >VS and once at HVS/E1 they are probably no longer chart-topping given the extended scope elsewhere.
• Cougourde - this ticks my aesthetics boxes and Sam's boxes too. So then its a question of quality. I thought Direct on 3 and the Demenge were both really good routes at that sort of grade. In fact that whole area is fantastic for this brief - little snow beyond June, good peaks, plenty of stuff which hasn't been overly bolted yet. Other good things like the W ridge of Ponset for example.

Edit: removed a daft suggestion...

I agree, I thought I'd immediately be able to come up with half a dozen suggestions but I'm struggling to meet the criteria.

One might have been Directe (5a) on the Miroir de l'Argentine, but from the comments it looks as if it's been fully equipped now, so no longer really trad.  Must be something at Arapiles (but everything that comes to mind is too hard or too easy), ditto Cedarberg.

I think I'd go with Jeff Ingman's suggestions on Table Mountain.  Jacob's Ladder (16) ticks all the boxes I think (maybe it isn't quite 100m high but the situation adds another 1000m in exposure!)

Fingertrip (5.7) might qualify.  Certainly long and memorable.

Corrugation Corner (5.7)

Gets my vote too.

On this basis, I think you'd enjoy some of the North America suggestions, if you haven't been/don't have ethical concerns about long-haul.

It's a pity enchainments are excluded, as I think a big day out up the Cioch slabs offers some of the best rock architecture and most glorious views I've seen. There aren't many places that offer such a beautiful combination of towering dark rock and glittering sea.

Eidetind is fabulous isn't it? We did it overnight after a long drive with midnight sun on the summit. Magic! We did get lost in the bushes on the way down though!

You really should. It is a truly miraculous traverse with a series of brilliant and improbably straightforward pitches in a wonderful location. I see the logbook describes it as one of the best climbs in the world - it probably truly is!

I agree and they should be allowed if logical. I'm not sure what one would do on the lower buttress at about VS though; the best route is probably Cioch Grooves I think but that is HVS.

Yes.  Although a very familiar suggestion, I do think that the VS-ish Idwal enchainment takes some beating. 

Silkeveien in Uskedalen would see you right although the line is not exceptional - its a line of cracks up a slab with lots of other examples of such.  Fly to Bergen, and and drive about an hour east.

Unsure if it meets you’re length requirement but Lamplighter (14) moved me to write an article for UKC entitled Just the Best VS in the World.

Up thread I suggested you could do Cioch Grooves but swop the crux run-out 5a pitch for the pitch of Cioch Direct which is right alongside. This would leave you with the two fine crack pitches, which I'd say are both solid 4c, whatever the guidebook thinks. Should make for a great day out at VS.

I Agree

Its a great route in a great location, would make a top 20 but not top 5

Disagree with you here, the Dibona is such a pointy mountain, its a classic before you even start climbing. (I agree Savouyards and Visite are brilliant)

You want to be leading E1 if you want a pleasant experience on La Demande

Le grand parcours on Sainte Victoire? Its been on my wishful thinking list for too long - 21 pitches, partially bolted only.Le Grand Parcours (5c) Sainte Victoire

Had a great day on Kulbrutta but that was in no small part because we met some very friendly Norwegians and it took us three attempts before we didn’t get rained off it!

I'm only teaching straight AQA philosophy this year (I teach in a large sixth form college) which is a shame as I like the new RS a-level. I’ve also taught Politics and Sociology! Teaching in a college means no disaffected lower school students which is pretty sweet, teaching the compulsory GCSE used to be hard going. 

Guidebook reckons it is E1. I’m planning on doing it later this month.