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Winter sun reachable by Train

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 mutt 13 Feb 2020

Winter Sun destinations appear to be somewhat too distant for CO2 free travel. I've found Russan to be a good prospect that can be reached by train. Can anyone else suggest good winter destinations for the environmentally aware?

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 smbnji 13 Feb 2020
In reply to mutt:

Well that depends on how long you're willing to travel.. Regardless there's some great options for journey planning here: https://www.seat61.com/

 AJM 13 Feb 2020
In reply to mutt:

Having had similar thoughts, although with an assumption of a hire car at the far end - not sure if you are also assuming this - I had assumed that the stuff around Orgon, Seynes/Russan/Claret, Buoux, maybe some of the stuff round Monaco, perhaps St Leger, should all be reasonably near Avignon or the spurs of the train line that go to Nines/Montpelier in one direction or to Marseilles/Aix/Nice in the other. I looked at seat61 in the past and I thought they all looked within a (long, sometimes!) day travel from London

 Derek Furze 13 Feb 2020
In reply to smbnji:

Great link thanks.  Clearly easier if you are based near London, but impressive journey times really.  Probably a good deal more interesting than airports, cramped planes and transfers

 smbnji 14 Feb 2020
In reply to Derek Furze:

For sure, I went down to Marrakech and the Atlas mountains over the summer without flying. It's a lovely way to travel.

 Dave Garnett 14 Feb 2020
In reply to mutt:

There’s a station in Barnstaple I think!

 john arran 14 Feb 2020
In reply to mutt:

Overnight trains run from Paris directly to Tarascon-sur-Ariège - the little town in the centre of Ariège climbing. Depending on where you choose to stay nearby, there may be plenty of climbing accessible on foot. Around Chez Arran there are half a dozen or so crags within easy walking distance and a whole lot more crags easily accessible by bikes available for cheap hire.

OP mutt 14 Feb 2020
In reply to mutt:

great suggestions. Thanks. The Man in seat 61 is awesome.

 seankenny 14 Feb 2020
In reply to AJM:

> Having had similar thoughts, although with an assumption of a hire car at the far end - not sure if you are also assuming this - I had assumed that the stuff around Orgon, Seynes/Russan/Claret, Buoux, maybe some of the stuff round Monaco, perhaps St Leger, should all be reasonably near Avignon or the spurs of the train line that go to Nines/Montpelier in one direction or to Marseilles/Aix/Nice in the other. I looked at seat61 in the past and I thought they all looked within a (long, sometimes!) day travel from London


I've done a train trip to Buis les Baronnie and Buoux, getting off at Avignon and picking up a hire car. It is a very easy day trip from London, I think we had picked up the car by about 4pm and we didn't start particularly early. The biggest faff is crossing Paris but it might be possible to avoid that if you change somewhere else - Lille maybe? I'm not sure.

Is Russan any good? Looked a bit short last iirc from a brief look at the guide.

 AJM 14 Feb 2020
In reply to seankenny:

I went there years ago, but I recall a load of reasonably long stuff on the upper tier on the left (facing in). Regrettably I don’t seem to have logged anything in terms of routes to identify the sectors I was at, but I thought it was fairly decent in terms of 6a/b sort of wall climb stuff at that bit. Less sure about harder stuff.

If I were planning a trip now, Seynes is probably higher on my list (and Buoux, of course), but you could probably do both from a single base, the roads aren’t fast but they aren’t that far apart.

edit: I was there on Adrian’s research trip for the Rockfax guide, so if there are pictures in the guide there’d be moderate chance it was in the vague area of the crag that I was climbing.

Post edited at 19:51
 Fakey Rocks 29 Feb 2020
In reply to mutt:

Isn't there absolutely loads to go at in France and north Spain?

I've been researching ways to do this too. Didn't make it anywhere this time last year by train, but a trip to Catalunya is imminent. I was watching train tickets, + got lucky as en.oiu.sncf put loads of promo tickets up in Feb...Paris to Barcelona TGV in 6.5 hrs for €25 2nd class,  €40 1st class. I'd been planning a way carefully,  as I wanted to do the Paris to Barcelona leg all in daylight, so to make it work this time I am taking a  an overnight coach for London to Barcelona via Chunnel, around 9hrs, costs as little as £17 Flix Bus. But next time and ideally,  re being more environmentally friendly, the Eurostar is as cheap as £29 each way, London to Paris, but more commonly around £37, depends how in advance you plan. You can take the 0541 Eurostar from St Pancras, to Paris GdN, then give yourself an hour to get to GDL for the 10.09 TGV, and you can be in Barcelona for 5pmish! From Bristol this would mean getting up stupid early, or planning the journey for a different Eurostar departure with a night in Paris, or, choosing an arrival in Barcelona at 10 PM if you can find an air bnb that will let you in that late, and there are some at around £15!

The return journey costs about the same if planned ahead,  so from London you can get to Barcelona in a day for £60, and £60 back.

Even if hopeless at planning the return can be done by train to Montpellier if you fancy a stop over, with French practice, then on to Paris next day with only 3 weeks notice for £35.

I'm actually travelling by myself this time and hoping for the best on arrival re finding partners,  but if no joy I don't climb steep stuff so will manage ok with my shunt. I'll get a train from Barcelona to Lesborges del Camp and then try hitch the final hrs car leg up to Siurana, as I can't get credit cards to do car hire, shame as it's so cheap and allows visits to other crags eg Arboli, Monsant etc. I need to go by myself first time to get the hang of being organised and making it work without missing connections and ruining the trip for someone else!

I'd be up for repeating this at the end of the year or next March if anyone is keen, and you are happy to hire a car, I'll share the costs.

I've hardly ever flown, but I think I might prefer all this to flying, it's more adventurous I think. Anyway if you gave me free plane tickets, I'd rip them up, the planet just can't cope with all these flights.

I have solo trips to France planned too, as my French is improving and I'm happy to find french partners.

I did make it to Buoux in November last year by coach (possibly only 1/3 as environmentally friendly than planes, whereas trains are apparently around one tenth the emissions? not exactly sure though), but things didn't go quite to plan and the trip ended too soon with hardly any climbing done.

Car hire isn't so cheap in France but happy to share the costs. If anyone fancies planning a trip with me, without flying, please do get in touch.

It's a shame there aren't more people out there who are up for this though, slightly higher costs, need to plan carefully, time taken vs 2 to 4hrs flying, needing the convenience of a quick weekend or weeks trip to some "sun rock", the planet isn't going to die, we'll be ok, space travel will save us, etc, all those kind of lame excuses, + loads of ukc climbers + people in general who obviously must have those thoughts floating around wherever their brains are located whenever they plan a holiday abroad, and so many who it seems just aren't ever going to care anyway.

Post edited at 00:02
 Derek Furze 01 Mar 2020
In reply to Fakey Rocks:

Good to see the results of the research and the continental travel is impressively cheap.  Slightly frustrating that just getting down from Manchester is likely to be a significant addition to cost, but definitely worth a look.

 Ciro 01 Mar 2020
In reply to Fakey Rocks:

Suirana was definitely one of the easier areas to get to - is there not still a local bus service from reus to cornudella?

Definitely a great place for picking up partners too - plenty solo vanlifers hanging around, and a good chance of getting someone keen on the drive over to montsant -which is well worth it!

 Fakey Rocks 01 Mar 2020
In reply to Ciro:

Awesome, Just googled the bus and yes there is!

It's not one that comes up in Google maps though.

Thanks for , I've checked the timetable + it looks like I might as well try hitch this time,  but next time will try arrive so as to not have to wait so long for that bus!

Also, knowing the first bus back down to Barcelona is around 0640 is great, as I can now hopefully make the vague plans for the connections I had for my return work out now .

 Fakey Rocks 01 Mar 2020
In reply to Derek Furze:

Trains are so expensive in the uk! Isn't there a mega bus you can use from Manchester to London?

 climbercool 02 Mar 2020
In reply to mutt:

Does anyone have any decent info on the carbon footprint of traveling with a car by ferry, i had a quick search but couldn't find much of use.   for instance if i was to head to Catalunya would i be better to fly straight to Barcelona and rent a car or take the ferry from plymouth to Santander and then drive the rest.  How about compared to driving the whole thing? obviously it all depends on how many people in the car.

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