UKC

Grand Couloir Mont Blanc

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 IainMunro 03 Dec 2004
How long is the section on the normal route which crosses the Grand Couloir? Can you avoid the risk of rockfall by crossing this section before dawn? Any advice much appreciated
 LakesWinter 03 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro: I would not attempt this route, go via the trois mont blancs route from the col du midi.
Big David 03 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:
The Grand Couloir is a f*cking death trap. I crossed it the summer before last (twice) when climbing the Gouter Ridge Mt Blanc. I saw two climbers hit by very large rocks (the size of a T.V) which seemed to be moving at warp speed. Both were evacuated by helicopter - i'm not sure what kind of damage was caused to the climbers, but i'd imagine quite alot.
If you must cross it, i'd advise doing so very early in the morning before it all starts melting. Run.
Ice Rat 04 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

I crossed the Grand Couloir on the way up to the Gouter last June. The crossing is roughly 150m across, but is at a slight angle. Yes rocks do fall down, but timing is the critical thing: 1) Time of year - June and July are best, 2) Time of day - early morning. The first train to the Eagles Nest leaves Fayet at 7am, so when you get to the Couloir the conditions are good, and it is still in shadow. I think most of the problems are unfit parties taking too long to reach the couloir, carrying too much stuff so they are slow (and a big target), and taking too long on the ascent of Mont Blanc. This obviously means that you arrive at the Couloir too late in the day. I know getting into the Gouter is an issue, but you know when you are climbing if you are taking too long, and pushing it to reach a summit late, means that you are playing a stone lottery on the descent. You could be unlucky, but if you are fit and prepared, then you should be OK.
 Bruce Hooker 04 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

It's not as bad as all that! You just wait for the rocks to come down, then nip across smartly straight after. Wait till the previous person has got across, I didn't and the silly b**** stopped right in the most dangerous place to ask his mates which way to go... I jumped past him and nothing came down so no problems.

Going up it was night, we slept in the TĂȘte Rousse hut, so there was no problem - we didn't even notice we had crossed it till we got to the other side.
pete allen 04 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro: crossed end of july and didnt see a single piece of debris either on the ascent or descent.i dont know what all the fuss is about,or maybe i was lucky
 earlsdonwhu 04 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro: Even tho it's seen as snow plod, i would take a helmet just for this section but then I'm old and don't run as fast as in the past!
 Bruce Hooker 04 Dec 2004
In reply to earlsdonhammer:

I reckon a helmet is a good idea for the whole scramble up to the hut, even after the couloir; so many people and it's a real slag heap.
ruarigh 06 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro: I went up mid-July 2004 no probs, stayed at Tete Rousse hut near bottom of Gouter Ridge and crossed couloir around 6am, back down midday next day.
I can see why it is a problem and wouldn't like to cross while rocks are rolling down at high speed. You are not exposed for long as it only takes a couple of minutes to cross it but it would only take one rock to kill you. Helmet advised.
Tom Watts 06 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro: Went to try crossing @ around 8, constant rockfall, no real gaps at all, got hit on the leg so decided to call it a day. Not deterred though, back next year to try again, we went too late (september)
 Paul L 06 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:
Crossed it this summer in August, was a lot less scary then expected. Crossed it in the afternoon both times and found it fine. Best tactic is to run, took us about a minute to get across though we did have light sacks..

Found certain areas under the Chamonix Aiguilles a lot scarier, though i guess it's the amount of people crossing the couloir that means someone will eventually be hit.
Andrew M 06 Dec 2004
In reply to Bruce Hooker:
Very good point indeed. There are lots of people around on the ascent/descent to the Gouter and many of them are roped up bumblies who don't take care to see that they aren't knocking rocks off. I reckon that there was more danger from this than from the general stone fall in the Grand Couloir when we descended at about 8.30 am (having done the traverse). At least when you are crossing the couloir you can take time to take stock of the situation, listen out for rock fall etc. and you don't have people directly above you, which you do most of the time on the route between the couloir and the hut. So I'd say helmets are essential at all times.
Draxx 06 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

My advice would be to stay at the Tete Rousse hut and make a very early start, say around 2 or 3am - that way you will minimise the risk of rockfall. The Tete Rousse is also a lot more pleasant place to stay than the Gouter.

However, the early start means making the tricky ascent up to the Gouter by headtorch, which might not be everyone's cup of tea. Route finding could also be a problem but we had a guide so it wasn't an issue.

Of course you will still have to run the gauntlet of the Grand Couloir on the way down but you just need to stay calm and be sensible. Listen carefully and wait for the person in front to get across before committing yourself. When you do decide to go for it try not peg it across too fast or hang on to the cable as doing one or the other or both will inevitably lead you to falling over - and believe me you don't really want to be doing that!

It's not that bad though, and I found a descent of the Geant Icefall on the Mer de Glace a far more harrowing experience!!

Jeanot Boulet 07 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

I crossed it several times in different months of the year. My best experience was early september in the early morning. We slept in the Tete Rousse and when we crossed the couloir we found it covered in snow. Now rocks came down at all. The rest of the spur was Ok and not so many climbers in september to kick loose rocks!!!
Tim 07 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

It's not as long as 150m I think... more like 100m or less. I crossed it back in early September on the way down and it was fine, just walk quickly across after looking (and listening) for any debris coming.

However:

Why on earth do you want to go this route? The three summits is a FAR more enjoyable way to do M Blanc. In September I went up the 3 summits, and we decided to go down via Gouter for some variety. OK so the ridge down from the summit is quite nice, but as soon as you get near the Gouter hut (which truly deserves to be demolished - you can smell it about 500m away) the fun ends. Going up this route with all the tourists after staying in this stinking hell-hole is NOT my idea of a fun day out.

Climbing down the Gouter ridge isn't much fun either, it's just a great heap of rock and crap, and there are plenty of slow people bumbling about on it knocking stuff off.

Once you come down the ridge you've got the Couloir to deal with, which was a bit of an anti-climax after hearing everyone say how dangerous it was.

After that you've got a long boring walk to get home, especially if the train isn't running like the day I went. Fortunately my climbing partner generously broke his ankle in a bizarre accident and we took a helicopter down to Chamonix!

Tim
zigzagwonderer 07 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

I completely agree with the above. I climbed it by the 3 summits in July 2003, we had the route almost to ourselves, it was a truly wonderful experience. We then got to the summit to find queues of people being dragged up the Gouter ridge. I can barely imagine that the gouter route is any fun at all, when we were descending it there were masses of people coming up and the exposed part is actually made quite dangerous by the number of novices unused to their crampons!

As for the coulouir, the advice above is sound. We crossed about midday, waited for the stones to stop and made a dash for it. I don't think you need to get massively worked up about it, though wearing a helmet is pretty sensible
Nigels 17 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:
Excuse my ingnorance, but to which route are you referring when you say 3 summits?
Regs, Nigels.
Mick's Daughter @ Work 17 Dec 2004
In reply to IainMunro:

I crossed it sometime between 2 and 3am on 5th July this year and there were no rockfalls. We went back across it at about 1pm the same day and there was a very small amount but it was raining.
Dave Ashcroft 18 Dec 2004
In reply to Nigels:

By three summits he means les trois mont blancs route, which is not strictly true, as the normal route would take you over the shoulder of the first two mountains rather than summiting all three.

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