UKC

Hi Folks, 

I'm just back from Kalymnos and we used two ropes out there. An old Mammut Infinity which is fully dry treated (core and sheath) but looks like a furry caterpillar and a brand new (used once at Ratho to make sure we'd got the kinks out after uncoiling etc) Beal Virus with no dry treatment. 

The Beal rope is now totally filthy and covered in black stuff. Your hands end up completely black after lowering someone The Mammut rope is fine. Neither rope got dropped in the dirt / dragged through the dirt etc and thus I'm 99.9% sure the blackness has come from the lower offs or contact with some metalwork. 

I've tried running it through a rope brush and also giving it a good scrub with a damp cloth and tea towels. A fair bit of black stuff has come off but it's still pretty grim.

I've also previously washed dirty (as in covered in dust/mud etc) ropes with good results but this black stuff seems to be welded onto the surface of the rope and thus I'm not convinced that washing the rope will actually help. 

So, does anyone know what causes some ropes to end up filthy and black like this? and also if there's any way to get them clean again? 

Many thanks, 

Fiona

In reply to Fiona Reid: I've always thought it to be aluminium oxide; doubtless I'm wrong, though. 

 

In reply to Mike Highbury:

That was my guess too... I've just never seen anything quite so minging. I only used the rope for 7 days of climbing as the old Mammut got used when I didn't need the 80m one. Every time we lowered off a climb you could see it getting noticeably blacker! 

The ends of the rope that didn't come into contact with lower offs or q-draws etc are still bright pink and clean (okay a bit chalky from hands tying in etc). The fact I'm using the same q-draws as always and no other rope has done this makes me wonder if it's something specific to the Beal Virus or that the that the rope doesn't have a dry treatment? 

We've given all our metal work a wipe but no blackness came off on the cloths suggesting our q-draws etc are not causing the problem. 

In reply to Fiona Reid:

search forums under author Heike and see subject Click up.

it could be the famous black rope syndrome.

(sorry,  can't copy the link for some reason!)

In reply to Fiona Reid:

I've had more or less the same thing - two ropes roughly the same age, used for the same amount of time on the same routes and same quickdraws, same grigri etc. The Beal one is very dirty - black as you say. The Decathlon one not dirty at all. Both are fluffy to a certain extent. Clearly there's more to this than just assuming it's alu oxide. The construction of the rope must have something to do with it too. The main difference between the two ropes is that the Beal is nice to handle but the Decathlon is very hard/stiff and not really nice to handle - maybe more 'abrasive'?

In reply to CPH:

Thanks, the link you were hunting for is https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/gear/click_up-693053?v=1

In reply to jon:

Indeed, it's not just a Beal thing either as my trad climbing ropes are Beal Cobra GoldenDry II's and although mostly used for trad they have been used for multipitch sport stuff and the odd sport route too (although I guess mostly abseiling rather than lowering off and abseiling won't have much weight going through the lower off/ring) and they are both free of any black stuff. 

I'd love to know how to avoid it or if particular ropes are more problematic than others. I wondered if it was because it was because it was brand new and shiny and not old and furry. Maybe the surface/construction of the new rope generates more heat or picks up the blackness more easily than the old furry one. I think this is the 5th sport rope I've had and it's the first one to do this.

I know it's just black stuff and doesn't make the rope any less safe etc but it's pretty minging when you end up with totally black hands and black lines on your t-shirt, trousers etc though coming into contact with the rope. At least with this one being an 80m it will only get used for trips where I need that longer length and my shorter (clean rope) can be used otherwise. 

In reply to Fiona Reid:

luke warm water shower, no soap in the bath tub??...

 

In reply to Mike Highbury:

Aluminium oxide would be white, surely?

(Or appear white in microcrystalline form, as it is transparent and colourless).

In reply to captain paranoia:

In a previous thread, Jim titt explained why all.. oxide looks black on rope.

As it happens my black rope is a beal.

In reply to Fiona Reid:

Might be worth adding that on my partner's harness front two gear loops where the q-draws were clipped also went black.  He has a new harness with fabric gear loops (his old harness had plastic loops,  mine are also plastic).

This is very odd as the end of the q-draw the rope runs through is different from the end clipped to the harness! and the rope doesn't go anywhere near the gear loops. The end clipped to the harness is the same end clipped to a bolt, there shouldn't be much movement or dust generated from that end of the q-draw surely?   Very odd. 

I've checked and his belay loop isn't black plus he clips his belay krab and device (BD ATC) to a rear gear loop so that's not causing the issue as the rear loops are not black. 

 

In reply to Fiona Reid:

My Mammut Infinity (sheath treated only) was filthy after 2 weeks in Kalymnos. I thought this was because we were climbing in areas where there'd been fires recently. However I bought a similarly treated, shorter, version for UK use and this also quickly became covered in black crap so I assumed it was something to do with the treatment used.

In reply to Fiona Reid:

It’s the metal from lowering.  Stick it in the washing machine on 30 deg wash and it will come up a treat.  They never come properly clean just flipped around in the bath.  I tie the two ends together and pile in.

Use a mild detergent, tech wash or soap flakes for instance.

I try and not wash dry treated ropes unless older or minging , but non dry go straight in without hesitation.  

Hang up to dry.

Marvel at your new looking rope.

In reply to Wayne S:

I get black shit all over my hands on big multipitch abs. One way to clean the rope I guess ?

In reply to Offwidth:

I can live with black hands a bit, soon shades of gray with some extra chalk ground in, the lower offs at my local wall are excellent at turning ropes black.  As well washing machine, picking dark coloured ropes helps.

In reply to Fiona Reid:

Many thanks for all the ideas and suggestions. Seems like the black stuff is likely caused by a combination of the lower off and type/coating on the rope and maybe the Beal Virus is particularly prone to going black.

Anyways, I chucked the filthy rope in the washing machine this morning with some tech wash. Rope now looks pretty clean, it's not perfect but infinitely better than before washing it so it seems the black stuff does wash out. A bit rubbish to need to wash it after 7 days use but at least it's cleaned up okay  

 

 

 

 

In reply to Fiona Reid:

Dry it as slowly as you can or it'll shrink. A lot. 

In reply to Fiona Reid:

Were the lower offs on steel or aluminium and were they generally a bit worn?

In reply to Removed User:

I don't know whether the were steel / aluminium but am assuming aluminium as they didn't feel heavy like steel ones you get in Ratho etc. A few were worn but not worryingly so.. however some were obviously worn. 

In reply to jon:

Will do. We've not got our heating running, just a dehumidifier to remove the moisture which we use in the colder months to get the washing dry so suspect the rope will probably take up to a week to fully dry out.

 

In reply to Fiona Reid:

Hi Fiona,  would be suprised if it takes a full week to dry,  ropes are nylon so the fibers do not actually absorb water, it’s more the structure gets waterlogged.  Most ropes are heat stabilised at manufacture, so shrinkage isn’t really a thing.  Whilst a tumble dryer or directly on a radiator might not be a great idea, I wouldn’t necessarily shy away from some heat convection.  I guess a lot depends on when you need the rope next, if a few days is fine that as you were, but an airing cupboard is always an option.  

In reply to Wayne S:

The rope won't be needed for a good while so drying slowly over the clothes horse is fine. Id rather leave it till I'm 100% sure it's dry before chucking in the cupboard.