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Hi.
I am in the midst of purchasing an assisted belay device and it has come down GriGri + versus GriGri 2019 - the GriGri2 is not sold anymore.
The difference between the two as many here know is that the Plus has extra safety features and a toprope mode but it is around £20 more and a bit bulky.
Recently during the social sessions I have been attending at White Spider I have been belaying using other people's GriGris.
What do people think? Are the features worth the money?
IMO, I think they are worth tnt extra money.
What assisted belay devices do you have? For those who have a GriGri, what carabiner are you using with it?
My manual ones are BD ATC that I use with a DMM Belay Master 2 and a DMM Pivot that came with a DMM Rhino caribiner.
Bye
MS
Post edited at 19:09
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I have the grigri 2019 and am very happy with it. Not used the +. I just use a random screwgate, don't see any good reason to prefer a particular screwgate over any other.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
It depends what your intended use is?
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Have a look at the Click-Up - light, intuitive and very easy to use,
Chris
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In reply to Chris Craggs:
Hi Chris.
I have used the Click Up during ICA training & assessment and CWI training, as far as I can remember it was easy to use.
In reply to Chris Craggs:
> Have a look at the Click-Up - light, intuitive and very easy to use,
> Chris
… and nearly as good as a GriGri!
Tongue (slightly) in cheek
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In reply to jezb1:
> It depends what your intended use is?
At the moment, I am top-roping at WS but after Easter I hope to start indoir leading.
Outdoor-wise, I plan to toprope and second trad and lead sport.
MS
In reply to Mountain Spirit: I have a GriGri2 , a friend has the plus. I'd get the 2019 - once you have a basic level of competence the extra functonality of the plus becomes a nuisance rather than a help.
Day to day use I've moved from a pivot to a gigajul.
My belay karabiner now is the Edelrid bullet - the steel insert stops the body of the krab getting chewed, esp. by the steel grigri
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Use with groups, the plus could have advantages.
Personsl use, stick with the regular.
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In reply to jezb1:
> Use with groups, the plus could have advantages.
> Personsl use, stick with the regular.
I don't get your reply.
Are you saying use the groups GriGris and for my non group climbing I should just stick to the devices I have got?
Please can you clarify your reply.
MS
Post edited at 00:28
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
He means that, for group use the Grigri Plus might have advantages. But for personal use only the regular Grigri is fine.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I imagine the rationale is that the Plus is more suited to people that aren't familiar with the device (the anti-panic lever). Once you are familiar with it, the extra features are less necessary.
Personally I just have a GigaJul, it does everything, with both single and double ropes.
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
It's worth mentioning the steel plate on the GG+. I retired my GG2 after about 5 years because it ended up with a sharp edged groove where the rope runs across the body. I don't have a GG1 but know people who've been using them for decades without any noticable wear, so hopefully the GG+ will be similar. After about 5 years, the same age I retired my GG2, it looks mint. I would guess the amount of use it's had is roughly similar.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
IMO the grigri + is not as good as the other grigris.
The ‘tab’ on the side of a grigri + is harder to hold and I find it uncomfortable with my index finger trying to hold it in position where as the other models especially the newest are very easy to have sitting on your index finger.
and beeing used to the other models the + can be annoying when it keeps locking out whilst lowering someone
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I looked at them both and decided on the GriGri 2 which I have been using now for 2 years, I think you won't need the extra features on the plus once you are comfortable with it AND the £20 saved will buy you a DMM Ceros which answers yours second question regarding which krab.
The Ceros retails at just under £20 and if you look online you'll see that it prevents cross loading and always keeps your Grigri in the right position.
It is a brilliant bit of kit, but took me a few months to master. I just used my mates and after 2 months got my own. Lots of videos on YouTube to help you with hints and tips.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Another vote for the Grigri 2019, which I have. Also bear in mind that, as far as I know, the Grigri + only protects against one mode of panic failure, with lever fully open. I assume you can still grip the lever down in panic, which is how the belayer next to me dropped a leader 20m to the deck.
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In reply to wbo2:
> My belay karabiner now is the Edelrid bullet - the steel insert stops the body of the krab getting chewed, esp. by the steel grigri
Steel Grigri?
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In reply to jon: Isn't that what the plates of the GriGri 2,+, whatever are? That's always been my assumption. I've never checked tho'
In reply to wbo2:
> Isn't that what the plates of the GriGri 2,+, whatever are? That's always been my assumption. I've never checked tho'
I just have , with the magnet of my helmet buckle. The side plates of the original gri gri are not magnetic and probably alloy.
Still a concentrated enough load to score alloy krabs . Hence the click up being sold with a designated ( tougher) krab.
Post edited at 12:55
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In reply to wbo2:
> I have a GriGri2 , a friend has the plus. I'd get the 2019 - once you have a basic level of competence the extra functonality of the plus becomes a nuisance rather than a help.
I do enjoy using the GriGri and it is easy to use and the set-up for it is simple. During the most
> Day to day use I've moved from a pivot to a gigajul.
I've seen a Epic TV YouTube video in the gigajul and it seems to be all round multi purpose assisted belay device.
> My belay karabiner now is the Edelrid bullet - the steel insert stops the body of the krab getting chewed, esp. by the steel grigri
I bought the whole krab thing up as I saw an Epic TV video where Matt Groom was talking to Ben Btansvy about Belaying specific biners.
MS
In reply to midgen:
> I imagine the rationale is that the Plus is more suited to people that aren't familiar with the device (the anti-panic lever). Once you are familiar with it, the extra features are less necessary.
I have used it a few times but the majority of the time I belay I have been using my BD ATC.
> Personally I just have a GigaJul, it does everything, with both single and double ropes.
Matt Groom from Epic TV agrees with you - he loves it and the BD ATC Pilot.
MS
In reply to ERNIESHACK:
> I looked at them both and decided on the GriGri 2 which I have been using now for 2 years, I think you won't need the extra features on the plus once you are comfortable with it AND the £20 saved will buy you a DMM Ceros which answers yours second question regarding which krab.
> The Ceros retails at just under £20 and if you look online you'll see that it prevents cross loading and always keeps your Grigri in the right position.
Apparently The DMM Ceros is recommended for use with the GriGri, at the session, when I use an instructor's GriGri I always use it with the Ceros. Myself, I have the predecessor to the Ceros - the Rhino.
> It is a brilliant bit of kit, but took me a few months to master. I just used my mates and after 2 months got my own. Lots of videos on YouTube to help you with hints and tips.
Too right.
MS
In reply to Rick Graham: Thanks Rick - I had a closer look at mine this afternoon, and did a basic bit of scratching with a knife. I'm genuinely surprised , but live and learn
Do like my 'toughened' edelrid krab tho'
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In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
> It's worth mentioning the steel plate on the GG+. I retired my GG2 after about 5 years because it ended up with a sharp edged groove where the rope runs across the body. I don't have a GG1 but know people who've been using them for decades without any noticable wear, so hopefully the GG+ will be similar. After about 5 years, the same age I retired my GG2, it looks mint. I would guess the amount of use it's had is roughly similar.
Is GG official abbreviation for GriGri now?
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I doubt it.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
> Is GG official abbreviation for GriGri now?
Also known as the Leslie Caron.
In reply to jezb1:
> Use with groups, the plus could have advantages.
> Personsl use, stick with the regular.
I get it now.
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I have both - I use the 2019 for me and my wife and only use the plus when I have my neices visiting or with friends who haven't belayed much. The plus is too grabby in my opinion and the 2019 is a lot smoother for belaying and lowering
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In reply to JMAB:
> I have the grigri 2019 and am very happy with it. Not used the +. I just use a random screwgate, don't see any good reason to prefer a particular screwgate over any other.
Because there are several purpose-made krabs for use with assisted belay devices. I find regular krabs always get cross-loaded. The DMM Belay Master worked really well for me but I hear the rhino ones are great too (with the little internal retaining clip).
In reply to PaulJepson:
Ensure the grigri is on the narrow end of the carabiner, that eliminates nearly all the cross loading in my experience. I also don't think it is something to worry about, I've never heard of a failure due to cross loading a carabiner with a grigri in a belaying scenario.
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In reply to Rick Graham:
> Still a concentrated enough load to score alloy krabs . Hence the click up being sold with a designated ( tougher) krab.
That’s more about ensuring that the type of carabiner users doesn’t stop the click up from functioning correctly. Unlike the gri gri as the biner is part of the braking mechanism, so it’s important it’s correct. If you use one that isn’t right, the shape of the thing could prevent it from clicking up, or make it click up too easily. They solve this by supplying it with the device.
It’s also not that tough, I wore a deep, deep groove in mine where the rope runs over it after about 5 years. Had to replace it with another identical one.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Does anybody have a Beal Birdie?
I have heard it is very similar to the GrGri.
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Definitely not - they both do the same thing. Just buy one and learn to be proficient with it. And use the pennies you've saved for tea, cake or more climbing.
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In reply to tehmarks:
> And use the pennies you've saved for tea, cake or more climbing.
Been my theory all along, the sugar in cake keeps me alert so I don't ned to replace my bug or sprung Stichtplate with an autolocking device!
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In reply to ExiledScot:
I own a GriGri and haven't used it once since I bought it.
The downside is that my lardy 6'4 mate gets a bit shouty when he takes a rest and is very slowly is lowered off the route...
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In reply to Rick Graham:
> I just have , with the magnet of my helmet buckle. The side plates of the original gri gri are not magnetic and probably alloy.
> Still a concentrated enough load to score alloy krabs . Hence the click up being sold with a designated ( tougher) krab.
Which matters for the click up where the rope still runs across the crab. For the grigri a few nics in the crab are no issue, simply because it’s only ever metal to metal. In the same way you always use the same end of your sport draws on the bolts, and they get a little chewed up.
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In reply to ExiledScot:
> Been my theory all along, the sugar in cake keeps me alert so I don't ned to replace my bug or sprung Stichtplate with an autolocking device!
BUT then you can’t eat cake and belay no hands* like you can with a gri gri.
*don’t do this of course
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I have a Beal Birdie, having used gri gris since they originally arrived on the scene.
The Birdie is a really well made piece of kit, but I have found wearing gloves to lower is preferable and the position of the dead rope hand during this manoeuvre is not the same as during more usual use of other unassisted devices. Self lowering (single rope abseil) is also awkward as the rope rolls out of the main groove unless you hold the rope really close to the front of the Birdie.
It works fine for me but my wife hates it so continues with her gri gri. Try one before you buy one.
Paying out rope to a leader is a little smoother than with a gri gri and it is cheaper.
In reply to Stairclimber:
> I have a Beal Birdie, having used gri gris since they originally arrived on the scene.
> The Birdie is a really well made piece of kit, but I have found wearing gloves to lower is preferable and the position of the dead rope hand during this manoeuvre is not the same as during more usual use of other unassisted devices. Self lowering (single rope abseil) is also awkward as the rope rolls out of the main groove unless you hold the rope really close to the front of the Birdie.
I remember seeing what you are talking about in The Epic TV video on it.
youtube.com/watch?v=rQ0oZh7dVMY&
> It works fine for me but my wife hates it so continues with her gri gri. Try one before you buy one.
Where can I try one out? I don't think many people have The Birdie.
> Paying out rope to a leader is a little smoother than with a gri gri and it is cheaper.
It is cheaper by around £12 compared to the latest GrGri.
MS
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In reply to JMAB:
I have actually found Grigris sit nicer on an oval krab (forget the term for these) rather than a more usual HMS type one. But because it is "metal on metal" which can cause scratching and wear that could damage the rope sheath if used for other purposes I think it is worth dedicating one krab to it.
In reply to Stairclimber:
I would call a device where it was awkward to lower without gloves "not fit for purpose" myself. Lowering with a Grigri is annoying enough.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
> Is it worth buying both?
No I don't think so - we started with the plus thinking it would be the better choice. It wasn't
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
I've been using a Grigri+ for a few years now and I love it. I bought it because it was rated for use with a wider range of ropes than either the Grigri or Grigri2. Now that there's another grigri that handles the full range of single ropes, I probably would get that instead, were I to be in the same position again.
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In reply to john arran:
The latest one is just called GriGri but it was brought in 2019 so it has been given the name GriGri 2019 Model.
According to a Petzl video and an Epic TV it can handle 8.5mm to 11mm.
MS
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Not cheaper if you need to buy some gloves! Having watched the same video as you I bought one, but the main reason for using it is to enable my wife's gri gri 2 to last twice as long. My all time favourite device was a Faders SUM, but they aren't made anymore.
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In reply to Stairclimber:
> Not cheaper if you need to buy some gloves! Having watched the same video as you I bought one, but the main reason for using it is to enable my wife's gri gri 2 to last twice as long. My all time favourite device was a Faders SUM, but they aren't made anymore.
Would you say go with the GriGri 2019?
There was a thread on the Faders SUM a while ago.
https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/gear/sum_by_faders-448617
MS
Post edited at 19:23
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Does anybody own an Edelrid Eddy or an Edelweiss Matic?
https://www.gearexpress.com/edelweiss-kinetic-semi-auto-belay-device.html
I think the Eddy is a quite pricey.
Does anyone know anything about Edelweiss or their assisted breaking device - The Matic?
MS
Post edited at 22:02
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
The Kinetic is the Beal Birdie with a different name. Buy a normal GriGri and don't think about it too much.
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In reply to jimtitt:
> The Kinetic is the Beal Birdie with a different name. Buy a normal GriGri and don't think about it too much.
GriGri 2019 Model it is then.
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Just to let people know, I spoke to an instructor at White Spider abs she said my current biners would work fine with the GriGri 2019.
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In reply to john arran:
Are you the same John Arran of Doctor Dolittle (E10 7a) and The Zone (E9 6c) fame?
MS
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Those are routes that I did the FA of, yes.
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In reply to john arran:
Great to here from you.
> Those are routes that I did the FA of, yes.
I don't think the first one has had a repeat.
I wonder if The Zone can be highballed?
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
> GriGri 2019 Model it is then.
Yes, this is a no-brainer in my opinion.
The GriGri (2019) is a great piece of kit which has distinct advantages over the GriGri 2: it will work with a greater range of rope diameters, has a more even action and a longer "sweet spot" with the handle when lowering (or abseiling). It is also less prone to a problem which could sometimes occur with the GriGri 2, which was the rope jamming into the gap when fully cammed.
Many climbers have found that the extra safety features on the GriGri+ are more of a nuisance than an asset. I know of several outdoor pursuits companies who invested in them, but subsequently discontinued their use and reverted to GriGri 2019s or older models (or went on to Petzl Rigs - but that's another story).
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In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Grigri 2019 is good. Learn the correct technique for holding the cam open for paying out rope to a leader, particular with older 10mm ropes.
DMM Rhino is good too. Most of the advantages of the Ceros without the faff of the belay loop end. I use it for all devices and happy with it.
Steve
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In reply to bpmclimb:
> Yes, this is a no-brainer in my opinion.
> Many climbers have found that the extra safety features on the GriGri+ are more of a nuisance than an asset.
I have been told this a few times including on here.
2019 model 100 percent.
Sav
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In reply to sbc23:
> Grigri 2019 is good. Learn the correct technique for holding the cam open for paying out rope to a leader, particular with older 10mm ropes.
Paying out rope to a leader is the only thing I haven't learn to do with any GriGri model.
> DMM Rhino is good too. Most of the advantages of the Ceros without the faff of the belay loop end. I use it for all devices and happy with it.
Too right. Spoke to some people at The Castle Shop agree with you and so does the Duty Manager who assessed my knots and belay proficiency.
> Steve
Sav
Post edited at 15:37
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In reply to Trythallj:
> Another vote for the Grigri 2019, which I have. Also bear in mind that, as far as I know, the Grigri + only protects against one mode of panic failure, with lever fully open. I assume you can still grip the lever down in panic, which is how the belayer next to me dropped a leader 20m to the deck.
I am an experienced climber and have previously used ATC type belay devices for many years. I now use a 'standard' grigri at the indoor wall as I think it has additional safety features over an ATC when being used at an indoor wall [frequent falls and lowering off] once you have familiarised yourself with how to use it correctly.
As in your story above, there are often allegations that people have been 'dropped' when using a grigri usually caused by incorrect usage?
Does anyone at UKC have any further evidence / reports of people being hurt in a fall due to incorrect use of a grigri [or any other belay device come to that]?
In reply to sbc23:
> DMM Rhino is good too. Most of the advantages of the Ceros without the faff of the belay loop end.
What faff with belay loop end of the Ceros?! They are wonderful belaying krabs!
After years of secretly hating my DMM Belay Master for annoying faff of the placcy bit, and hoping I'd lose it but unlike everyone else seeming to be unable to, the Ceros was best little present I bought for myself in years.
More recently with my old Edelrid Strike HMS FG Slider starting to get a bit snaggy on the slide mechanism (as seems to be a problem across the Slider range, I noticed Rock and Run selling https://rockrun.com/products/edelrid-hms-strike-safelock really cheap with free postage so caved in. Now I see why they are on such a good sale - talk about faff! Presumably anyone who actually tries before buying puts it back on the shelf.
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