UKC

MWIS : how cold?

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 Flinticus 07 Mar 2019

I assume that they do not factor in wind chill when stating how cold (at 900m). 

Looking at forecast for Saturday (West Highlands) says -3C whereas Met office predicts -10C to -14C

A significant and meaningful difference

 DaveHK 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

Met office Ben Nevis forecast says -6 on Saturday afternoon and -14 with windchill so the figures you saw are likely wind chill ones.

 DaveHK 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

> I assume that they do not factor in wind chill when stating how cold (at 900m). 

Wind chill is a pretty much useless measure imo. All it serves to do is make people feel tougher.

3
 gravy 07 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

While I agree for the attention span challenged (like me) it's also a subtle reminder that it will be windy

OP Flinticus 07 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

> Wind chill is a pretty much useless measure imo. 

Why? It is a good reminder that it will be colder than the 'passive' temperature.

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 ianstevens 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

Because the numbers are often absolute bollocks* and people wildly mis-interpret (see above).

*If there's no wind, I'll happily walk around in -14C in a thick jacket. In "-14" met office windchill (tm) I'd freeze my balls off doing the same. 

 tehmarks 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

But it won't be colder. It'll still be -3, it just means you'll reach -3 quicker* than if it was less windy.

* - hopefully you won't reach -3 at all, because that would be problematic. And fatal.

 nufkin 07 Mar 2019
In reply to tehmarks:

>  It'll still be -3, it just means you'll reach -3 quicker* than if it was less windy

That's a wind-chill caveat that it'd be good to be more widely used

 DaveHK 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

> Why? It is a good reminder that it will be colder than the 'passive' temperature.

Why would you need a reminder? 

 Simon Caldwell 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

> It is a good reminder that it will be colder than the 'passive' temperature

On uncovered skin - so only a problem if you don't have any clothes on.

 bigbobbyking 07 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

> Why would you need a reminder? 

Why would you need to know the temperature in the first place?

To me its a useful indicator/reminder of the magnitude of the wind on my rate of heat loss. You almost always have some skin exposed at some point. Plus no wind proofs are 100% effective.

But yeah, don't get too hung up on the exact number.

 MG 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Simon Caldwell:

That's not true. Clothes obviously help but you still chill faster in a cold wind. Forced convection. 

 DaveHK 07 Mar 2019
In reply to bigbobbyking:

> Why would you need to know the temperature in the first place?

> To me its a useful indicator/reminder of the magnitude of the wind on my rate of heat loss. You almost always have some skin exposed at some point. Plus no wind proofs are 100% effective.

> But yeah, don't get too hung up on the exact number.

Your last line is my whole point. If there's no point in getting hung up on a number then why give a number? 

1
 DaveHK 07 Mar 2019
In reply to bigbobbyking:

> Why would you need to know the temperature in the first place?

I'm guessing you're not a winter climber?

 Joak 07 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

> Why would you need a reminder? 

Fifty odd years ago my mother sent me and my brother of to school each day throughout numerous Scottish winters dressed appropriately for the conditions after looking out the window. She didnae hae a scooby what the term "windchill" meant.......she is now 84 years old and still hasn't a scooby what it means.   

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 DaveHK 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Joak:

> Fifty odd years ago my mother sent me and my brother of to school each day throughout numerous Scottish winters dressed appropriately for the conditions after looking out the window. 

Dinnae forget yer windcheater son!

 Joak 07 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

I had tae make dae wi a jaikit.  

 wintertree 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

I thought we’d dumbed down from “windchill” to “feels like”.  Do try to keep up at the back...

 skog 07 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

MWIS forecasts the temperature, and sometimes says the wind chill too (but as afar as I'm aware makes that clear).

http://www.mwis.org.uk/pdf/weather-forecasts/WH-MWI-WM11856_2019-03-07_1505...

The current forecast for Saturday just says -3C, maybe they had made a mistake and have updated it now?

OP Flinticus 08 Mar 2019
In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Its handy for knowing if I need to bring a dog coat for my dog and which coat, if any: she's got two: a warmish coat that covers her back and some of her sides and a thicker coat that goes further down each side and back as well as full neck. The last only gets packed for real cold.

Removed User 08 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

You might change your mind once you get to 60+ (that's age, not temp) and your ageing body's ability to regulate it's own temperature is not what it once was. I never used to bother much, but now find a chill wind quite severely. 

> Wind chill is a pretty much useless measure imo. All it serves to do is make people feel tougher.

... helps give me some idea of how much to layer up, though I agree that I don't need the actual number to tell me that I feel bloody cold, the figures in the forecasts are still a helpful indicator.

 DaveHK 08 Mar 2019
In reply to Removed Userrabthecairnterrier:

No one here is saying wind doesn't have an effect on perceived temperature, that would be silly. The point is that everyone understands the effect without the need for a number. All the number does is let punters boast that it was colder than it actually was.

4
 Joak 08 Mar 2019
In reply to Removed Userrabthecairnterrier:

> You might change your mind once you get to 60+ 

I'm 60+ and nothing has changed since I was 16. If it's a bit blawy and chilly I'll put another layer on, windproof garment, hat, gloves etc. If I'm getting too warm I'll take a layer off. Windchill figures doesn't enter into it....anyhoo must dash, heading to the Northwest Highlands for the weekend for some wind chill shenagagins.    

 Simon Caldwell 08 Mar 2019
In reply to Flinticus:

> Its handy for knowing if I need to bring a dog coat for my dog 

Tell her to dog up!

https://www.outsideonline.com/2390456/first-dog-ascent-baruntse-nepal

Removed User 08 Mar 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

> No one here is saying wind doesn't have an effect on perceived temperature, that would be silly. The point is that everyone understands the effect without the need for a number. All the number does is let punters boast that it was colder than it actually was.

... pretty much what I was saying, aside from the "boasting" bit. (Never considered that feeling cold was anything much to boast about, but then I'm well past boasting age.)

Removed User 08 Mar 2019
In reply to Joak:

> I'm 60+ and nothing has changed since I was 16. If it's a bit blawy and chilly I'll put another layer on, windproof garment, hat, gloves etc. If I'm getting too warm I'll take a layer off. Windchill figures doesn't enter into it....anyhoo must dash, heading to the Northwest Highlands for the weekend for some wind chill shenagagins.    

Lucky you! I live in the N Highlands (Easter/Mid Ross rather than West). Was out this afternoon, though not higher than about 500M or thereabouts. OK with b/layer, light shirt, light fleece & windproof until it started to rain when cagoule went on; wind moved round to its usual direction rather than NE/N where it's been for last couple of days. 3 degrees and raining outside just now. Out again Sunday (Fannichs, maybe).

OP Flinticus 09 Mar 2019
In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Thanks for that link. Fascinating story.


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