UKC

/ Probably not climbing, need insurance for 3 Peaks

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Debbie - on 03 Apr 2018

Hi

Wondering if anyone can advise me, how I can get insurance for 3 Peaks Challenge, either as a team or individual.  Have tried numerous brokers and companies and so far all have come back with a No.    

Thanks

Debbie

ceri - on 03 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

What insurance do you need to walk up a hill in the UK? 

jkarran - on 03 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

Presumably you want some sort of liability insurance as the organiser of a mountain walking event? As an individual or an individual in a group I don't see what insurance you'd want or need.

jk

marsbar - on 03 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

Thats because it’s a terrible idea.  

 

(Back under your bridge)

 

4
rogersavery - on 03 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

If you feel you need it as you are worried about being sued by members of your group, then if you have house insurance it usually covers £2m to £5m in public liability

Baggie - on 03 Apr 2018
In reply to ceri:> What insurance do you need to walk up a hill in the UK? 

If you drop a rock on someone's head, you might find liability insurance quite useful. Debbie, I'd look at the insurance that comes with MCOS/BMC membership and see if that covers your needs - see here for more info. https://www.thebmc.co.uk/members-liability-insurance?s=6  

 

 

Post edited at 13:52
3
teh_mark on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

In the UK rescue is free, helicopters are free and healthcare is free. People take out insurance to climb in the bigger mountains abroad because very often none of those are free, and when they're not free they're very, very expensive*. In the UK it's not necessary.

* - the figures for a recent rescue and short hospital stay in France were €1000 plus €1500/day in hospital (though the EHIC pays 80% of that)

Post edited at 01:54
teh_mark on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to Baggie:

Oh come off it. How many people have ever been sued in the UK for accidentally dropping rocks (or ice, or gear) on parties below? And how many of those managed to do it whilst walking up a footpath?

Baggie - on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to teh_mark:

Probably not many/any yet fortunately, however in the past a solicitor has sued their mountain bike instructor for   £3 million for falling off their bike (https://dirtmountainbike.com/news/paralysed-solicitor-sues-mountain-bike-instructor-4million.html) and climbing walls have been sued for broken ankles... https://www.ukclimbing.com/news/2012/03/court_rules_against_climbing_wall_in_injury_claim-66978

I give you the following scenario. Debbie takes her team up for a walk up the Ben. One of them falls and breaks their ankle. Being a solicitor, he sues, claiming that the risks were not made clear to him and that  Debbie should be liable. Rightly or wrongly, if this goes to court and Debbie has no protection, she is likely to be financially ruined.

I'm really glad that this kind of court case doesn't seem to happen very often, especially since most regular hill walkers understand the risks and accept them, but if I was taking a group of inexperienced people up a hill, especially as part of an organised event, I'd want cover. The £20 or so it costs to join the BMC to get the cover would be well worth it to me for the peace of mind.

I'm just glad that the climbing community in general are understanding enough of the risks that they don't resort to these tactics. Legally they probably could. 

Post edited at 10:29
Deleted bagger - on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

I'll give you a tenner not to do it. Really rubbish idea..............

Hat Dude on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to teh_mark:

> Oh come off it. How many people have ever been sued in the UK for accidentally dropping rocks (or ice, or gear) on parties below?

I was at a BMC area meeting approx 15 years ago when the question was asked whether anybody had ever claimed on the BMC liability insurance; at that time the answer was no. I wonder if that is still the case?

> And how many of those managed to do it whilst walking up a footpath?

Some years back a party from our club were descending the path off St Sunday Crag when one of them accidentally kicked a stone which bounced down the hill and hit another from the group on the head necessitating hospital treatment; so it can happen.

 

ceri - on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to Baggie:

The difference between your examples and Debbie's post is that I assume, as she doesn't know about insurance, Debbie is neither an instructor or a company running an outdoor business. If she is doing a 3 peaks challenge as an individual she is just a woman going for a walk. If she is going as a group, she may take the role of leader and things might change if she is charging or claiming to run an event or taking people she does not know but there is no indication of this. 

However, as Debbie has not been back to clarify the situation I call troll. 

rogersavery - on 04 Apr 2018
In reply to ceri:

Even if it is people she knows, that does not remove her duty of care if she has organised the trip and invited them. She can still be sued if it goes pear shape

Bulls Crack - on 05 Apr 2018
In reply to ceri:

Debbie could possibly  sue the National Park if the landscape paths and associated facilities don't live up to expectations? And perhaps the Met Office if it rains more than expected. 

Howard J - on 05 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

If she is not doing this in any professional capacity, perhaps the simplest solution would be for her to join the BMC which comes with third party liability insurance.

Debbie - on 10 Apr 2018
In reply to ceri:

Sorry for not getting back sooner, you've summed it up perfectly - I have been asked to look into this for some colleagues who are stupid enough to want to do this to raise funds for charity but going through an organised event costs quite a bit meaning the charity wouldn't raise as much money, (they want to donate their application fees as well as getting sponsors).  My main concern is as we seem to becoming a 'SUE State' and even though everyone says 'oh we'd never sue' as soon as they get back and talk to others there will suddenly be a claim. hence my question.  

davefj on 11 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

It would be really ironic if you were raising money for mountain rescue teams in the Lake District  >:o

 

marsbar - on 11 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

Seriously, if you are not a troll, tell them to find a different challenge.  

The 3 peaks is not well thought of, due to litter, stupid amount of driving and waking people up in the Lake District.  

It’s not original, and there are better ways to raise money without causing such problems.  

 

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/the-three-peaks-challenge--what-do-you-think

 

Post edited at 19:54
davefj on 11 Apr 2018
captain paranoia - on 11 Apr 2018
In reply to Debbie:

> I have been asked to look into this for some colleagues who are stupid enough to want to do this to raise funds for charity

"No, thanks; organise it yourselves. BTW, it's a stupid idea."


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