UKC

They say that getting back into the saddle is the best thing to do following a setback. Considering I spectacularly failed to do that and instead spent a miserable 14 year hiatus instead, what would be a good route to aim towards 6 months from now? I'm not bothered about doing something very technical just something achievable and of more than one pitch. The idea being even if this aim isn't realised, working towards it through a variety of lesser routes would be enriching - it isn't about the destination, it's about the journey (but a journey requires a destination!).

I have good upper body strength, could do with losing a stone and do with being generally fitter but to my advantage I should be getting a bit more free time than I'm used to. I think it would be reasonable to do something of about the grade of Severe six months from now. Any recommendations?

Troutdale Pinnacle. 

No particularly original but Troutdale Pinnacle fits the bill.

Not sure where you are based, but a weekend in Borrowdale could let you do a few routes at Shepherds on saturday first. Brown Slabs, Little Chamonix?

Just need a dry weekend in October? 

Fools seldom differ😊

Just reading the words "very exposed belay" left me cold - but also intrigued!

They probably mean the belay before the very last short, but steepish pitch. Good holds, superb setting. I’ve done it loads, but last time was after a long lay off. In fact, thinking about it, probs the last route I did. Climbed it with a Columbian guy who needed a partner and I said ‘why not’.  
My first multi pitch lead was nearby: I was directed by my mentors onto Orbituary Grooves. Found it quite hard but steady. Afterwards I was informed it was Mortician which is HVS iirc. Apart from a bunch of single pitch routes in Wilton etc, I’d only done half a dozen leads, some mentored by Christheclimber. I peaked early!

Troutdale Pinnacle it is then!

Cheers

Top end I'd say, which probably means it will be E1 in the next (or perhaps one after) edition of the guidebook. 

For a severe it certainly is.

The traverse pitch requires a steady second and is a good test of gear placement (that doesn't pull out and helps the second ) for the leader. 

Aim for mileage, dozens of diffs, nearly as many vdiff, severe will just happen naturally. 

I wouldn't get grade focused, but quality lines that take you up hills, a day out. Corvus, grooved arete, Murrays route, gillercombe butt, Ash tree slab, hope/lazaraus/continuation.., 

Aye, no wonder it felt a bit stiff for a VS !  

More than 2 days dry weather that  I can get off work / domestic duties would be an achievement the way my last year went

I seconded a guy up it last year who only used really short sport style draws. As soon as he took in at the belay all his gear lifted out of the traverse!

Climbing; it's a balancing act <gets coat>

Sorry I can't help with recommendations for specific routes.  Some general thoughts though:

I agree with ExiledScot - mileage is very important. Climb lots of routes at a grade you're very comfortable with, even if they seem "too easy".  One day, you'll look at a harder route and think: "I can do that!". I've been through that cycle many times.

If you can, find partners who climb a little bit harder than you and get them to buy into your project for the days you go out together. You can always return the favour by belaying them on their own projects.   

Best wishes 

Al

Troutdale Pinnacle is a good choice, but 6 months from now it'll be minging. Better make it 4 months from now Or be prepared to be flexible or pick something (a lot) further south.

If you check the logbooks or talk to locals it gets plenty of ascents in November (sometimes a bit wet at the start) and a few in winter. I think its a perfectly reasonable and suitably spectacular target, speaking as a lower grade specialist.

I don't "get" Troutdale Pinnacle" it was a polish-fest (not the country), I was very disapointed when we limbed it.

Arete Chimney and Crack, or Tophet Wall much better options.

There is plenty of unpolished lower grade stuff in Borrowdale if polish bugs anyone that much. Troutdale Pinnacle was polished nearly three and a half decades back when I started climbing and the polish only really impacts aesthetics (the climbing is still middling severe).

Wrinkle. 

Used to be VDiff but it seems to be Severe now. I've led it in January so it must be OK off season. 

Crackstone Rib (S 4a) is IMO a more inspiring objective than The Wrinkle (VD), but they're both worthwhile so whilst there, do both 😁

Did a walk up Hen Cloud today then along the skyline to the trig point and back with canine companion - Jasper (who I borrow). Slightly alarmingly out of puff on the steeper sections and I can feel it now in my thighs but all good and the first step towards improving fitness

Dropping off the radar now, I won't be inflicting every detail of my journey back to being an average punter on you.

Troutdale Pinnacle before October!!

I think most people are aware there, lots of other stuff to do in Borrowdale, they might not be aware of how polished TDP is though, no matter how long ago it was done.

My post was to let the OP know my thoughts, and since someone mentioned TDP, and I've climbed it, thought I might offer my thoughts.

Polished or not, I didn't rate the climb that much, there are much better climbs, in my opinion (obvs.) than TDP.

According to the old UKC logbook I've done this one but I can't remember it! Dives/Better Things (HS 4b) however has scorched itself into my hippocampus.

A couple of thoughts...

Firstly, Severe should be easily achievable within 6 months if you can put the time into climbing, getting fitter, etc. but I suspect it's not really the grade that bothers you, so

I would suggest that you ignore the "target" grade and instead come up with some routes that inspire you, that you want to do, because of the line, their reputation, how it looks, whatever. Doesn't matter if it's a Diff or a HVS, just make a list of maybe a dozen routes that you'd like to have done and think that if you get at least 3 or 4 of those done this year, you'll be back to having enjoyable and satisfying climbing experiences. 

This also means that you'll avoid disappointment if you only have a single objective that for whatever reason, doesn't work out.

Cioch Nose.

I agree with the Welsh routes.

If at Hen Cloud, why not consider Black and Tans at the Roaches?

Aim to have fun doing all of the suggestions.

Black and Tans feels bold at the top. Not one I'd recommend.

I really think the polish is unusually irrelevant on TPD. I understand your opinion on quality but I completely disagree, even though it's independently a delight to climb unpolished starred routes elsewhere in Borrowdale.

Are you mistaking TDP and TPD?

Honestly I thought the severe pitches were harder than the VS pitches. Less polish, more obvious climbing that is less committing. 

Sorry, that's a copied typo I missed ... should avoid shorthand..... of course I'm talking about the classic severe Troutdale Pinnacle (not the Direct). Route finding is helped by the polish and if you read the logbook comments and votes it's not like many people think the polish makes a difference.

People can try a proper tough graded Borrowdale easier multi-pitch classic by climbing Quayfoot Buttress, VD,....I really enjoyed it but my experience on it when dry would lead me to guess it might be harder than quite a few local VS climbs in November!

I started climbing on Clwyd limestone so IMHO there is no polish in the Lakes 😊 If they were a little graesy I could see the wear on the first two pitches causing some issues, but not from the traverse onwards. 

A friend had his first full summer climbing last year amongst others he did all the Classic rock routes in the Lakes. His most memorable route was Arete Chimney and Crack, he said it felt like it was a real adventure. I wonder how much the company/conditions affect our view? I did think of suggesting it, but thought in Oct/Nov Dow would be too cold. For some reason my first ascent of Tophet Wall didn't leave a good first impression, even compared to other routes completed previously that day. Consequently didn't repeat it for over a decade and then wondered how I had come to that dismissive conclusion. IMO the top pitches of TDP have a bit of everything in a fantastic position for the grade, but it does have competition in the Lakes. 

I understand what you are saying and personally would rather bring a nervous second up the direct. But isn't the commitment part of what makes Troutdale Pinnacle a great severe, technically easy climbing in a great (and at times serious for the second) positions

After that they could stoll along to do Woden's Face and Wimpey Way. Ahh.. sorry, forget that, I'm looking in my old guidebook😊

Well I didn't.

And neither did a number of my mates, but there you go, climbing is different things to different people.

It's got a nice view from the top, I'll give it that.

You might be right about the weather in Oct. mind.

I climbed Tophet with a hangover, not usually a great enhancer, and it was a long time ago now, but I remember thinking, "this is great" while I was on it.

Agree about ACC being an adventure though, it was. Getting back down was another one too, when I decided I could take a short cut; I couldn't   It's one of those routes I want all my mates to climb, it was so good.

All subjective of course.

I've done Woden's Face but can't remember much about it.

I dunno, I thought it suffered from the same thing most lakes easy routes do - it's a lot of bush bashing to get to one or two interesting pitches. I guess that's why I prefer the slightly 'harder' deviations (hard very subjective) - they tend to have cleaner rock and better climbing. 

OK... where exactly did the polish really influence the key climbing in such a negative way? Why are you and all your friends saying something so different from all the logbook posts? What grade do you think it is (and would be without the polish)? I think the polish is very much there but hardly affects the difficulty of the key pitches, and the grade wouldn't be lower without it. I felt the top pitches are outstanding and personally only found the traverse a bit underwhelming (but the scene of many a protection disaster).

Even I would be avoiding Dow in November and I've climbed a lot of mountain multi-pitch in that month. Tophet was always good fun but pretty full-on for the HS grade on the bold short wall crux... I wouldn't want cold fingers on this.... a good notch up from TDP late season unless you are cruising those grades.

I thought TDP was one of the best severes I've done in the lakes (that or Gillercombe butress) and didnt even notice any polish. I should probably note that I was having a very good day after climbing a few long term goals and that no doubt influenced my experience. 

Also my wife, who is a very nervous leader led all but the last pitch so quite friendly climbing unlike tophet wall which I thought was a bit spooky.

I would respectfully suggest that you embrace the journey. After 55 years climbing, I've come to the conclusion that, very often, the biggest limiting factor is... the right people, i.e. really supportive partners. 

With the wrong partners/approach, you might well do a Severe this afternoon. But if it's not a good experience, then really, what's the point? 

I would totally go with the ExiledScot/alibrightman approach of loads and loads of mileage at a grade which you feel easy. It's all climbing, which is... well, brilliant! If I could do no more than Diffs for the rest of my days, I would still be happy. 

But if you do loads and loads, as alibrightman pointed out, one day you'll look at something harder and feel OK about it. 

Another tactic is to occasionally second people on harder stuff. I once met a guy who cleanly seconded three E4s in the same afternoon after years of never climbing harder than Severe. Obviously this is highly unusual. But I suspect that one of the factors was that the leader was a super-chilled guy who'd have been just as happy doing V Diffs. 

You've not said what the setback was and I don't want to ask. But I've encountered quite a few people who had climbing accidents and wanted to 'get back on the horse again', i.e. return to their old grade quickly. In every case I suggested that they just went out and enjoyed themselves on easy stuff, developed memories of good times which would overlay the memory of the bad time. When you enjoy yourself, you feel good about things - and progression just seems to naturally follow in its own time. 

Good luck!

Mick 

I don't know how old you are and obviously the headgames will be an issue getting back into climbing but I'd say that Severe is a relatively low target to set if you used to do lots of climbing back in the day.

I was doing some sunny sport climbing this winter to try and get some strength back and as I started just after new year, I set myself some new-years resolutions for the following year. If you can set a series of several targets (the top ones might be a tad unrealistic ofc), it might help to be continually trying to ramp up as it were, if you set a single goal then a) when you get there you kind of relax and stop making progress and b) you might take longer to achieve it than you would otherwise if you set it slightly too low and you know in your head that you have masses of time to get there.

When working up to severe, I'd recommend:

Sou'wester slabs Vdif

Tower Ridge dif

Then for the finale I'd go for a combination:

Cioch West or Cioch Direct then Arrow Route then Wallwork's Route or Archer Thompson's route.

(I've done all of the above except the last two of which I definitely did one of them but I don't remember if it was Wallwork's or Thompson's).

It would make an absolutely cracking day out and you have the option to cut the day short at a couple of different points on the way up.

ha ha in the overall experience, I'm not sure what "the key climbing" means.

Because we're all allowed our own opinions.

No one said it would alter the grade.

The traverse was probably the best bit. Again personal choice.

Well if EVEN you would then maybe no one should, I did say earlier that it might be a bit late in the year for that.

Do have a nice day.

Where are you based. I'm in a not dissimilar position and maybe we could motivate each other. I'm just below the Peak.

PM'd you Philip!

It's just a S4a but it felt bold to me; The "trio of awkward, and poorly-protected semi-mantelshelves" turned out to be OK but were intimidating to encounter. This was pre-logbook and pre-common sense days (I don't think I was even shaving then!), it was safer to commit to the only option left available than to freeze up.

What about new west on pillar rock. New West Climb (VD)It’s a lovely walk. You get to a real summit. Might have the place to yourself. Once you have done that if you are feeling confident then rib and slab is HS Rib and Slab Climb (HS 4b)but awesome if you like an exposed slab. 
Push the grade to HS and you get everyone’s favourite route at any grade main wall Main Wall (HS 4b)at cyrn las (or Doorpost Doorpost (HS 4b)on Bosigran if the weather is better down south.)

If when I die, there is a heaven and even less likely, I end up there, I expect to see doorpost and main wall with a tea shop, pub and the kalymnos ice cream shop at the top. 
have fun. 

"quod ali cibus est aliis fuat acre venenum!"

No thank you.

New West Climb (VD) looks interesting, thanks for this one

Indeed! We got so sick of the sandbagging, and lack of sensitivity (and occasional gaslighting) for genuine struggles we experienced and witnessed, on Peak grit lower grades that we published our notes on a website and ended up helping produce guidebooks.  Things are much better these days: the guidebooks are great and most bad forum advice is just well intentioned ignorance of the realities of lower grade leaders (although suggestions of high mountain routes in the shade in November does really make one wonder).

Do you want to go and do TP again with me, I'll lead

My lardy arse would pull that pinnacle off!  I have a plan to get slim again, and then I say ‘yes please’.