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Morning culinary masters.
So one of my NY resolutions is to spend less money on takeaways and eating out and spent more time cooking at home this year, which will include many curries. I get to enjoy home cooked food, know what's in it and the money saved on taxis alone will get me a really nice bottle of wine to go with the fodder.
My first attempt was last Friday when I cooked a chichen madras. I consider myself a decent cook, as in I can and do follow a recipe well and have a good sense for flavours etc, rather than having the talent and creativity to create new dishes. I therefore followed a good online recipe for the curry.
I was quite surprised by the result. It tasted nothing like a curry house curry. The sauce was very tomato'y, thick but not velvety like a curry house plate of food and whilst it was very pleasant, was nothing like the standard thing we expect. So, is this that our high street curries are crap and nothing like truly authentic and I need to recalibrate my taste buds or was there something wrong with the recipe.
What was great was that the ingredients were all healthy. It was doubtless full of goodness, low fat, low carb and high in protein. I made some wholemeal chapatis too. What's not to like?
Post edited at 08:51
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Yes, home made curries are MUCH better than most restaurant ones, especially if you start with the individual spices rather than blends or pastes. However, according to my Indian and Bangladeshi former PhD students, most online recipes simply do not call for enough spices. More is better, in this case (up to a point...).
CB
Yes, home made curries are MUCH better than most restaurant ones, especially if you start with the individual spices rather than blends or pastes. However, according to my Indian and Bangladeshi former PhD students, most online recipes simply do not call for enough spices. More is better, in this case (up to a point...).
CB
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In reply to cb294:
Yep, this is exactly what id. Everything made from individual components. Interesting what you say about the spices, it didnt taste spicy enough. Not in the hot sense but could have been more flaoursome rathen than tomato being the most obvious flavour.
Its a very satifying process.
Yep, this is exactly what id. Everything made from individual components. Interesting what you say about the spices, it didnt taste spicy enough. Not in the hot sense but could have been more flaoursome rathen than tomato being the most obvious flavour.
Its a very satifying process.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Beef Rendang, get on it. Rick Stein's recipe from his far eastern odyssey book is a belter. The cooking times are a bit out (closer to 6 hours than 2) but it's worth it 10 times over.
Beef Rendang, get on it. Rick Stein's recipe from his far eastern odyssey book is a belter. The cooking times are a bit out (closer to 6 hours than 2) but it's worth it 10 times over.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Onion bhajis are really simple to make and always seem to come out great for me.
My homemade curries tend to come out less goopy than takeaway ones - more ghee and more tomato paste reverses this but I like them both ways.
There’s a lot to be said for toasting and gridning your own spices. I’ve no idea if it works better, but you appreciate the food all the more. I’ve now got a bay tree and hope to grow a few more spices. We did grow our own chillies until the potting shed disintegrated, hope to remedy that in the summer.
If you haven’t already, find a good source of mutton.
Onion bhajis are really simple to make and always seem to come out great for me.
My homemade curries tend to come out less goopy than takeaway ones - more ghee and more tomato paste reverses this but I like them both ways.
There’s a lot to be said for toasting and gridning your own spices. I’ve no idea if it works better, but you appreciate the food all the more. I’ve now got a bay tree and hope to grow a few more spices. We did grow our own chillies until the potting shed disintegrated, hope to remedy that in the summer.
If you haven’t already, find a good source of mutton.
Post edited at 09:01
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I think the Madhur Jaffrie books are quite good, I tend to use her Ultimate Curry Bible. I've eaten in South Asian homes and been to lots of different restaurants claiming varying degrees of authenticity, but authentic is a rather nebulous term. I have certainly managed to make very tasty food with the right sorts of flavours without too much trouble. I live in an area with a large South Asian community (Pakistani and Bangladeshi mainly), as a result restaurants and takeaways are usually of a decent standard, with some that are very good, but because of the way restaurant food is generally produced, i.e. the tricks to make food that is generally traditionally cooked slowly "fast food" it is often possible to produce a better, but slightly different product at home.
I think the Madhur Jaffrie books are quite good, I tend to use her Ultimate Curry Bible. I've eaten in South Asian homes and been to lots of different restaurants claiming varying degrees of authenticity, but authentic is a rather nebulous term. I have certainly managed to make very tasty food with the right sorts of flavours without too much trouble. I live in an area with a large South Asian community (Pakistani and Bangladeshi mainly), as a result restaurants and takeaways are usually of a decent standard, with some that are very good, but because of the way restaurant food is generally produced, i.e. the tricks to make food that is generally traditionally cooked slowly "fast food" it is often possible to produce a better, but slightly different product at home.
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Get yourself a copy of Madhur Jaffrey's Indian Cookery (https://tinyurl.com/y7whovcc ). That's been our bible for many years; both Rogan Josh (standard and Kashmiri) recipes are favourites and the standard is both so delicious and so unlike a restaurant Rogan Josh that you'll wonder what they, and not you, are doing wrong.
T.
Get yourself a copy of Madhur Jaffrey's Indian Cookery (https://tinyurl.com/y7whovcc ). That's been our bible for many years; both Rogan Josh (standard and Kashmiri) recipes are favourites and the standard is both so delicious and so unlike a restaurant Rogan Josh that you'll wonder what they, and not you, are doing wrong.
T.
Post edited at 09:10
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
High street curries are different, they are made in big batches, stewed for a while and re heated, with a variety of ingredients, they're often blander than what you'd normally expect.
You may get closer to them by adding cream or yoghurt though, but my experience from 9 months in India is that they're all different anyway either due to the region they're from, the ingredients or the taste of the chef.
I just play with ingredients, fresh ingredients with a short cook for freshness, or long simmering for a good saucy flavour, ginger early/ ginger late, tomato based, spinach, onion, whatever. The foods epic, and there's always other recipes to try and to play with. Salivating now....
High street curries are different, they are made in big batches, stewed for a while and re heated, with a variety of ingredients, they're often blander than what you'd normally expect.
You may get closer to them by adding cream or yoghurt though, but my experience from 9 months in India is that they're all different anyway either due to the region they're from, the ingredients or the taste of the chef.
I just play with ingredients, fresh ingredients with a short cook for freshness, or long simmering for a good saucy flavour, ginger early/ ginger late, tomato based, spinach, onion, whatever. The foods epic, and there's always other recipes to try and to play with. Salivating now....
2
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
50 Great Curries of India by Camellia Panjabi is pretty good as is Indian Vegetarian Cookery by Jack Santa Maria.
Both use a great variety of spices esp the 50 Great Curries which means you might have to plan a bit,
plus they both have a lot of curries you don't see in restaurant.
Sounds like you had better luck than mean with the bread like bits, even the birds wouldn't/couldn't eat my failed nan breads.
50 Great Curries of India by Camellia Panjabi is pretty good as is Indian Vegetarian Cookery by Jack Santa Maria.
Both use a great variety of spices esp the 50 Great Curries which means you might have to plan a bit,
plus they both have a lot of curries you don't see in restaurant.
Sounds like you had better luck than mean with the bread like bits, even the birds wouldn't/couldn't eat my failed nan breads.
1
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
i haven't been to India, but have been to Sri Lanka, and the curry there was unrecognisable compared to what we get in takeaways (though Sri Lanka is over a thousand miles from Pakistan, where the majority of curry restaurants here take their cooking from, so i guess that not surprising)
and... UK curries are sold to meet expectations of what 'UK tastes' are- i'm sure i read that the Chicken Tikka masala was invented in Glasgow because Glaswegians thought that the existing curries offered were too dry:
"yer fids too dry, gaunie pit a sauce oan it, pal...?"
so they did, and we're living with the consequences ever since...
here in W Yorks, curry takeaways often offer the 'Desi' option, which has more spices, and is meant to be more 'authentic'- i have no idea if it is, but guess it might be more 'what 2nd generation British asians consider authentic', rather than what you'd get in Mirpur...
i haven't been to India, but have been to Sri Lanka, and the curry there was unrecognisable compared to what we get in takeaways (though Sri Lanka is over a thousand miles from Pakistan, where the majority of curry restaurants here take their cooking from, so i guess that not surprising)
and... UK curries are sold to meet expectations of what 'UK tastes' are- i'm sure i read that the Chicken Tikka masala was invented in Glasgow because Glaswegians thought that the existing curries offered were too dry:
"yer fids too dry, gaunie pit a sauce oan it, pal...?"
so they did, and we're living with the consequences ever since...
here in W Yorks, curry takeaways often offer the 'Desi' option, which has more spices, and is meant to be more 'authentic'- i have no idea if it is, but guess it might be more 'what 2nd generation British asians consider authentic', rather than what you'd get in Mirpur...
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Try these:
https://toastedspecial.wordpress.com/2010/08/07/the-big-8-the-only-curry-re...
W
Try these:
https://toastedspecial.wordpress.com/2010/08/07/the-big-8-the-only-curry-re...
W
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I cook my own and don't really like most 'indian' take aways/ meals out nowadays and tend to avoid them unless it's an absolute favourite place (Birmingham Sparkbrook and the occasional Bradford one)
Amelia Panjabi's 50 Great curries of India is good as is Mridela Baljekar's very authentic 'Indian Cookery'
I cook my own and don't really like most 'indian' take aways/ meals out nowadays and tend to avoid them unless it's an absolute favourite place (Birmingham Sparkbrook and the occasional Bradford one)
Amelia Panjabi's 50 Great curries of India is good as is Mridela Baljekar's very authentic 'Indian Cookery'
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I ate a couple of times at a very 'authentic' seeming Asian restaurant in Moseley, Birmingham. The food was delicious but rich and nothing I have made at home has come close to reproducing the flavour of what I ate there.
Maybe Anthony Bourdain is right about one reason why this might be so. In 'Kitchen Confidential' he says:
"I don't care what they tell you they're putting or not putting in your food at your favourite restaurant, chances are you're eating a tonne of butter"
I ate a couple of times at a very 'authentic' seeming Asian restaurant in Moseley, Birmingham. The food was delicious but rich and nothing I have made at home has come close to reproducing the flavour of what I ate there.
Maybe Anthony Bourdain is right about one reason why this might be so. In 'Kitchen Confidential' he says:
"I don't care what they tell you they're putting or not putting in your food at your favourite restaurant, chances are you're eating a tonne of butter"
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
As has been mentioned, curry shop food is not the same as that served in a home. In a curry shop, they make a few base sauces, and add bits and bobs to make a dozen or more different curries. If you have a local take away, with an open kitchen, you can see this process in action and even ask them about it.
For a curry shop style curry, you need a hand blender. Make a base sauce. Either blend it all smooth or take some veg out, blend the rest smooth, add the veg back. Then add your featured ingredient(s). You need to use lots of oil. (Ever noticed how much you can pour off from a takeaway?). When you simmer the sauce it 'splits' and the oil rises to the surface. It is the oil that carries the flavor.
Fenugreek (methi) is key flavor and acts to enhance other flavors. You can buy the dried leaves and fresh frozen in the supermarkets.
If you want 'authentic' Indian food, you need to be looking more towards the vegetarian end of the spectrum. (There are hundreds of millions of veggies in India!) Its curious that many of the 'Indian' restaurants in the UK are run by Pakistanis and staffed with Bangladeshi cooks. Which is the right subcontinent, but they have different cooking traditions.
As has been mentioned, curry shop food is not the same as that served in a home. In a curry shop, they make a few base sauces, and add bits and bobs to make a dozen or more different curries. If you have a local take away, with an open kitchen, you can see this process in action and even ask them about it.
For a curry shop style curry, you need a hand blender. Make a base sauce. Either blend it all smooth or take some veg out, blend the rest smooth, add the veg back. Then add your featured ingredient(s). You need to use lots of oil. (Ever noticed how much you can pour off from a takeaway?). When you simmer the sauce it 'splits' and the oil rises to the surface. It is the oil that carries the flavor.
Fenugreek (methi) is key flavor and acts to enhance other flavors. You can buy the dried leaves and fresh frozen in the supermarkets.
If you want 'authentic' Indian food, you need to be looking more towards the vegetarian end of the spectrum. (There are hundreds of millions of veggies in India!) Its curious that many of the 'Indian' restaurants in the UK are run by Pakistanis and staffed with Bangladeshi cooks. Which is the right subcontinent, but they have different cooking traditions.
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I can heartily recommend both these books
http://meerasodha.com/about/books/
I find her recipes easier to follow than Madhur Jaffrey's since she has written them specifically for UK supermarkets. Fresh India is particularly good if you want to move towards a more vegetarian diet.
Alan
PS. moved this to Off Belay
I can heartily recommend both these books
http://meerasodha.com/about/books/
I find her recipes easier to follow than Madhur Jaffrey's since she has written them specifically for UK supermarkets. Fresh India is particularly good if you want to move towards a more vegetarian diet.
Alan
PS. moved this to Off Belay
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
For me, the single biggest factor is making my own garam masala mix. It takes a few minutes and makes such a difference. Just put all the ingredients into a spice mill and grind until not-quite-powder.
My current blend, adapted from Madhur Jaffrey:
1tsp each cardamom seed*, cumin seed, cloves, peppercorns
1 inch cinnamon
1/2 nutmeg
* seed, not pods. I made that mistake first time...
For me, the single biggest factor is making my own garam masala mix. It takes a few minutes and makes such a difference. Just put all the ingredients into a spice mill and grind until not-quite-powder.
My current blend, adapted from Madhur Jaffrey:
1tsp each cardamom seed*, cumin seed, cloves, peppercorns
1 inch cinnamon
1/2 nutmeg
* seed, not pods. I made that mistake first time...
In reply to mbh:
I like this, too, although I'd recommend ignoring the amounts of water that she suggests and doing it by eye yourself. Meera Sodha is good, too.
I also like this website a lot:
http://www.vegrecipesofindia.com
> +1 for Camellia Panjabi's 50 great curries of India.
I like this, too, although I'd recommend ignoring the amounts of water that she suggests and doing it by eye yourself. Meera Sodha is good, too.
I also like this website a lot:
http://www.vegrecipesofindia.com
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I can't recommend Rick Stein's India book enough - It has actually improved my life!
I can't recommend Rick Stein's India book enough - It has actually improved my life!
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Other thing I would recommend is making your own ghee. Take a load of double cream, let it come to room temperature, whip it until it splits then take the butter and carefully clarify it by placing in a saucepan over a low heat and skim it constantly, when you see a residue forming on the bottom of the pan transfer to a clean pan and keep going until you have a perfectly clear golden liquid. This will keep for a couple of years at room temp and will take any curry to new levels of flavour!
Other thing I would recommend is making your own ghee. Take a load of double cream, let it come to room temperature, whip it until it splits then take the butter and carefully clarify it by placing in a saucepan over a low heat and skim it constantly, when you see a residue forming on the bottom of the pan transfer to a clean pan and keep going until you have a perfectly clear golden liquid. This will keep for a couple of years at room temp and will take any curry to new levels of flavour!
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In reply to Baron Weasel:
Is that the one with Tibetan noodle soup? If so is worth it just for that (and some of the recipes are faffy, I'm not a fan of cooking street food at home; bhajis, pakora, etc.)
Is that the one with Tibetan noodle soup? If so is worth it just for that (and some of the recipes are faffy, I'm not a fan of cooking street food at home; bhajis, pakora, etc.)
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
We are just home from 2 weeks in Sri Lanka and I'm officially "curried out".
Breakfast: rice and curry.
Lunch: rice and curry.
Dinner: curry and rice.
Love the stuff but fish curry for breakfast was pushing my limit. My stomach is happy to be home!
We are just home from 2 weeks in Sri Lanka and I'm officially "curried out".
Breakfast: rice and curry.
Lunch: rice and curry.
Dinner: curry and rice.
Love the stuff but fish curry for breakfast was pushing my limit. My stomach is happy to be home!
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In reply to jonnie3430:
This is part of the reason that I'm very cagey about buying "restaurant" cookery books, actually. For instance, I got a copy of the Prashad book, and the recipes generally seem nice but there are far more deep-fried starters and street snacks than most home cooks are ever going to need to make.
> (and some of the recipes are faffy, I'm not a fan of cooking street food at home; bhajis, pakora, etc.)
This is part of the reason that I'm very cagey about buying "restaurant" cookery books, actually. For instance, I got a copy of the Prashad book, and the recipes generally seem nice but there are far more deep-fried starters and street snacks than most home cooks are ever going to need to make.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Recently got the following book: The Spice Tree by Niska Katona (of Mowgli Indian Street Food Liverpool and Manchester) which has been quite helpful in explaining what works with what spices/ingredients/style. That in combination with a hand blender to blitz onions, garlic, ginger, spices etc. has made curries much closer to what I would expect with velvety thick sauces which taste so much better. I find this initial curry paste is the key to flavoursome curries!
Recently got the following book: The Spice Tree by Niska Katona (of Mowgli Indian Street Food Liverpool and Manchester) which has been quite helpful in explaining what works with what spices/ingredients/style. That in combination with a hand blender to blitz onions, garlic, ginger, spices etc. has made curries much closer to what I would expect with velvety thick sauces which taste so much better. I find this initial curry paste is the key to flavoursome curries!
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In reply to dread-i:
.
This is definitely true BUT be aware if you eat a lot of methi you'll stink of it a day or two later - the pungent aroma comes back out of your skin!
> Fenugreek (methi) is key flavor and acts to enhance other flavors. You can buy the dried leaves and fresh frozen in the supermarkets.
.
This is definitely true BUT be aware if you eat a lot of methi you'll stink of it a day or two later - the pungent aroma comes back out of your skin!
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In reply to Ramblin dave:
Aye, my test meal, to see if a restaurant was any good was tandoori chicken to start followed by butter chicken as a main (probably closest to chicken tikka masala here, but not the same...)
Pakora, bhajis, bel puri and pani Puri (wish I could find this at home!) Were all sold by individuals at kiosks in the street.
Aye, my test meal, to see if a restaurant was any good was tandoori chicken to start followed by butter chicken as a main (probably closest to chicken tikka masala here, but not the same...)
Pakora, bhajis, bel puri and pani Puri (wish I could find this at home!) Were all sold by individuals at kiosks in the street.
In reply to Moley:
I still have that, I went to my bosses drivers wedding in his home village, they don't get many visitors, do I did the rounds and were fed in every house I went to, always rice, I did my best to leave a clean plate, but by the third day I was stuffed, totally blocked by all the rice, being sick, in cold sweats and had some uncomfortable moments in the bathroom. Everyone was incredibly polite but my body still can't handle rice after that...
I still have that, I went to my bosses drivers wedding in his home village, they don't get many visitors, do I did the rounds and were fed in every house I went to, always rice, I did my best to leave a clean plate, but by the third day I was stuffed, totally blocked by all the rice, being sick, in cold sweats and had some uncomfortable moments in the bathroom. Everyone was incredibly polite but my body still can't handle rice after that...
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Anjum Anand is worth a look I have a couple of her books, the pork vindaloo is amazing nothing like a takeaway i have tried dozens of her recipes all a success
Anjum Anand is worth a look I have a couple of her books, the pork vindaloo is amazing nothing like a takeaway i have tried dozens of her recipes all a success
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In reply to dale1968:
Yea, proper vindaloo is decent, not just over-spiced like most restaurant versions.
Yea, proper vindaloo is decent, not just over-spiced like most restaurant versions.
In reply to jasonC abroad:
Try kohlapuri chicken if you want a kick, one of the hottest things I've ever eaten.
Try kohlapuri chicken if you want a kick, one of the hottest things I've ever eaten.
In reply to jasonC abroad:
I think the Portuguese imported barrels of pork preserved in vinegar to India that’s how pork vindaloo came about
I think the Portuguese imported barrels of pork preserved in vinegar to India that’s how pork vindaloo came about
In reply to dale1968:
Great flavours and easy and quick to follow. Unfortunatley her portion sizes wouldn't feed my son's pet gerbil.
It can be tricky quadrupling up on ingredients to feed just me and the missus.
W
> Anjum Anand is worth a look I have a couple of her books, the pork vindaloo is amazing nothing like a takeaway i have tried dozens of her recipes all a success
Great flavours and easy and quick to follow. Unfortunatley her portion sizes wouldn't feed my son's pet gerbil.
It can be tricky quadrupling up on ingredients to feed just me and the missus.
W
In reply to jonnie3430:
I'm happy to eat that sort of stuff in restaurants, but I find that restaurant cookbooks have a tendency to include too much "stuff that people will order in a restaurant" at the expense of "stuff that you can be bothered cooking on a random Tuesday night". They also tend to include stuff that's fairly efficient if you're doing a hundred covers a night, but not so much if you're cooking for two, eg deep frying or using stuff that's easy to prepare in bulk. I don't avoid them entirely but I do buy a lot more books that are specifically home-cooking focused.
> Pakora, bhajis, bel puri and pani Puri (wish I could find this at home!) Were all sold by individuals at kiosks in the street.
I'm happy to eat that sort of stuff in restaurants, but I find that restaurant cookbooks have a tendency to include too much "stuff that people will order in a restaurant" at the expense of "stuff that you can be bothered cooking on a random Tuesday night". They also tend to include stuff that's fairly efficient if you're doing a hundred covers a night, but not so much if you're cooking for two, eg deep frying or using stuff that's easy to prepare in bulk. I don't avoid them entirely but I do buy a lot more books that are specifically home-cooking focused.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
If you get sick of chicken tikka, try a tarka. It's like a tikka but a little 'otter.
Seriously though, high street curries are made using big plastic buckets of sauces that come from sauce factories. The cook adds a few extras like chillis and ginger, chucks in the meat, moves it around for a minute or two then pours it into the serving dish. The best meal I ever had was in Accrington when I was entertaining some very devout Syrian business visitors who refused to eat anything that wasn't halal. I got a local restaurant to stay open late after lunch and cook us a proper meal from fresh; it was absolutely stunning and when I thanked the chef he said: "the difference was that I couldn't use the sauces, I had to use fresh ingredients."
Apart from that the most delicious meal I ever ate was Gujarati food at the house of a customer in Tanga, in northern Tanzania. Absolutely superb.
If you get sick of chicken tikka, try a tarka. It's like a tikka but a little 'otter.
Seriously though, high street curries are made using big plastic buckets of sauces that come from sauce factories. The cook adds a few extras like chillis and ginger, chucks in the meat, moves it around for a minute or two then pours it into the serving dish. The best meal I ever had was in Accrington when I was entertaining some very devout Syrian business visitors who refused to eat anything that wasn't halal. I got a local restaurant to stay open late after lunch and cook us a proper meal from fresh; it was absolutely stunning and when I thanked the chef he said: "the difference was that I couldn't use the sauces, I had to use fresh ingredients."
Apart from that the most delicious meal I ever ate was Gujarati food at the house of a customer in Tanga, in northern Tanzania. Absolutely superb.
Post edited at 14:27
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In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Have you heard of this company... https://spicemountain.co.uk/product-category/curries/
They do some great mixes - saves you having to buy in a whole jar of a particular spice every time you want to try something new.
Have you heard of this company... https://spicemountain.co.uk/product-category/curries/
They do some great mixes - saves you having to buy in a whole jar of a particular spice every time you want to try something new.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
As others have said, British curry houses use a few base sauces, which will contain sometimes tens of different spices, to which they'll add a few additions dependent on what curry they happen to be making. Actual Indian recipes tend to use fewer and less spices, making the final dish much more subtle in a lot of cases but 'cleaner' tasting for it.
Lots of good recommendations for books above, but www.vegrecipesofindia.com is an amazing online resource (obviously veggie only).
As others have said, British curry houses use a few base sauces, which will contain sometimes tens of different spices, to which they'll add a few additions dependent on what curry they happen to be making. Actual Indian recipes tend to use fewer and less spices, making the final dish much more subtle in a lot of cases but 'cleaner' tasting for it.
Lots of good recommendations for books above, but www.vegrecipesofindia.com is an amazing online resource (obviously veggie only).
1
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I knew someone who made great curries, especially fish curries. But quite a lot of the time, he used to use a decent curry paste, to save time. Especially in his beef madras curries. I have found doing my own that curry paste makes a better tasting mix than the shop jar curries or many of the recipe mixes.
I also found I liked Lloyd Grossman curry sauces - especially the balti, but I would slow cook mine in the oven. It produced a much nicer curry, less gloomy. I always enjoy the smell of my beef balti cooking away!
I know the above isn't going down the whole recipe from scratch route, but a cost saving solution none the less.
I found a really nice Korma recipe on the Tesco recipe site. But have found as you say, some to be a bit hit and miss.
I knew someone who made great curries, especially fish curries. But quite a lot of the time, he used to use a decent curry paste, to save time. Especially in his beef madras curries. I have found doing my own that curry paste makes a better tasting mix than the shop jar curries or many of the recipe mixes.
I also found I liked Lloyd Grossman curry sauces - especially the balti, but I would slow cook mine in the oven. It produced a much nicer curry, less gloomy. I always enjoy the smell of my beef balti cooking away!
I know the above isn't going down the whole recipe from scratch route, but a cost saving solution none the less.
I found a really nice Korma recipe on the Tesco recipe site. But have found as you say, some to be a bit hit and miss.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Every time I do a pot of curry I tell myself to make a big batch of onion/ginger/garlic base and freeze it. Every time I get sick of peeling onions / ginger / garlic and make 'just enough'
Every time I do a pot of curry I tell myself to make a big batch of onion/ginger/garlic base and freeze it. Every time I get sick of peeling onions / ginger / garlic and make 'just enough'
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
The food I have with my in laws is totally different to that served in a restaurant.
I will see if I can find some example recipes for you.
The food I have with my in laws is totally different to that served in a restaurant.
I will see if I can find some example recipes for you.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
https://m.tarladalal.com/recipes-for-main-rice-delicacies-biryanis-222
This website has some authentic recipes
https://m.tarladalal.com/recipes-for-main-rice-delicacies-biryanis-222
This website has some authentic recipes
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In reply to Bellie:
I don't know for sure but I think that korma is one of those things invented to feed English people.
I've never seen it outside a restaurant.
I don't know for sure but I think that korma is one of those things invented to feed English people.
I've never seen it outside a restaurant.
In reply to GrahamD:
Depends what you mean. In this specific context I personally refer to home cooking something that Indian families would cook and eat.
Pakistani or Bangladeshi families might have different authentic recipes.
An authentic chicken tikka masala recipe would include heniz tomato soup, it's authentic Glasgow fusion cuisine.
Depends what you mean. In this specific context I personally refer to home cooking something that Indian families would cook and eat.
Pakistani or Bangladeshi families might have different authentic recipes.
An authentic chicken tikka masala recipe would include heniz tomato soup, it's authentic Glasgow fusion cuisine.
1
In reply to marsbar:
Korma or kurma is a traditional dish from Lucknow. It isn't laced with shitloads of sugar like the restaurant version though.
Korma or kurma is a traditional dish from Lucknow. It isn't laced with shitloads of sugar like the restaurant version though.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
All the above - the world of curry is far more extensive and appetising than most high street offerings.
That said if you really want to make a curry house style offering yourself get hold of a copy of "The curry secret" by Kris Dhillon.
All the above - the world of curry is far more extensive and appetising than most high street offerings.
That said if you really want to make a curry house style offering yourself get hold of a copy of "The curry secret" by Kris Dhillon.
In reply to MonkeyPuzzle:
Yes I was wrong, I just looked it up. I'm intrigued to try the old version as I don't like sweet food.
Yes I was wrong, I just looked it up. I'm intrigued to try the old version as I don't like sweet food.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
My partner is Asian (Sri Lankan) and I lived with her family for many years, as well as travelling all over the subcontinent, so I've had a fair few home made "authentic" curries - lunch today was rice, a daal, pumpkin curry, shredded kathurumurunga and a masala omelette.
Some thoughts:
Cooking good South Asian food is really hard. I think it takes a lot of practice and experimentation. Everyone who is grinding their own spices, yes this is the way forward and hats off to you.
Don't be afraid of using spice. If we go to a curry house that's clearly for white people (most of Brick Lane, for example) then to us it's pretty bland, we don't necessarily like everything hot - different families seem to have different tastes - but it needs to taste of something! The umami element is really important too, particularly in South Indian or Sri Lankan food, probably due to the use of a lot of fish. You're aiming for that full, round, very satisfying experience in the mouth when you come to the end of the meal.
Don't use chilli powder too much. Chillies are much better, or for a really good heat, use black pepper. Curry leaves are important in southern cooking (don't eat them) as is coconut milk. We very rarely use ghee, in fact I'm not sure we even have any in the house.
English people tend to order rice and a curry. Basically meat and a bit of veg approach, but desi-fied. Aim instead for as many dishes as you can, for example if we cook rice and curry at home then we'll have a minimum of two, say some lentils and a paneer or fish dish, but that's just a time saving thing. A proper dinner should have at least four or five! That way you can have a hot dish, a dry dish, something with a lot of gravy (say from coconut milk), maybe a piece of fried fish or a meat dish (remember that most of our family gatherings span the range from strict vegetarians to meat lovers). Sri Lankans eat smaller, slightly thicker popadums but not as a starter, with the main meal. This is really good for getting some crunch into your dinner. They also do deep fried chillies, which you can buy in Tamil shops (might be hard outside London), I think they process them with yoghurt to take off some of the heat, very nice for a special occasion. Curried omelettes are easy and lovely too, either with dinner or on their own.
Get a rice cooker!
My partner is Asian (Sri Lankan) and I lived with her family for many years, as well as travelling all over the subcontinent, so I've had a fair few home made "authentic" curries - lunch today was rice, a daal, pumpkin curry, shredded kathurumurunga and a masala omelette.
Some thoughts:
Cooking good South Asian food is really hard. I think it takes a lot of practice and experimentation. Everyone who is grinding their own spices, yes this is the way forward and hats off to you.
Don't be afraid of using spice. If we go to a curry house that's clearly for white people (most of Brick Lane, for example) then to us it's pretty bland, we don't necessarily like everything hot - different families seem to have different tastes - but it needs to taste of something! The umami element is really important too, particularly in South Indian or Sri Lankan food, probably due to the use of a lot of fish. You're aiming for that full, round, very satisfying experience in the mouth when you come to the end of the meal.
Don't use chilli powder too much. Chillies are much better, or for a really good heat, use black pepper. Curry leaves are important in southern cooking (don't eat them) as is coconut milk. We very rarely use ghee, in fact I'm not sure we even have any in the house.
English people tend to order rice and a curry. Basically meat and a bit of veg approach, but desi-fied. Aim instead for as many dishes as you can, for example if we cook rice and curry at home then we'll have a minimum of two, say some lentils and a paneer or fish dish, but that's just a time saving thing. A proper dinner should have at least four or five! That way you can have a hot dish, a dry dish, something with a lot of gravy (say from coconut milk), maybe a piece of fried fish or a meat dish (remember that most of our family gatherings span the range from strict vegetarians to meat lovers). Sri Lankans eat smaller, slightly thicker popadums but not as a starter, with the main meal. This is really good for getting some crunch into your dinner. They also do deep fried chillies, which you can buy in Tamil shops (might be hard outside London), I think they process them with yoghurt to take off some of the heat, very nice for a special occasion. Curried omelettes are easy and lovely too, either with dinner or on their own.
Get a rice cooker!
In reply to NorthernGrit:
I had that book once, although I think I lent it to someone but forget who so have it no longer. It did produce a decent home clone of a restaurant curry, which was good in one way but upsetting in another in that the quantity of fat used was then made very evident!
I had that book once, although I think I lent it to someone but forget who so have it no longer. It did produce a decent home clone of a restaurant curry, which was good in one way but upsetting in another in that the quantity of fat used was then made very evident!
1
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Two top tips for cooking South Asian food (with trepidation in the face of all the authentic experts above)
1. Cardamon: I love it and use loads. Whack the pods hard in a robust mortar then grind with the pestle and whack some more. Tip into a colander over a surface then scoop up the ground seeds that fall through. The husks stay in the colander. Next meal, repeat with refinements learned the last time. None of that finicky prising of seeds out of the pods with a knife, pods flying all over the kitchen.
2. Rice: faffy but effective method, useful for types like me who are prone to distracted forgetfulness when something is cooking. The thing is to get rid of the starch, so cook in plenty of water until it froths, tip out over a sieve, rinse and start again with plenty more water. Come back when done. (Don't forget!) Fluffy rice every time and none of the dried-up, burned pan disasters I often get when measuring rice:water ratios just so.
Two top tips for cooking South Asian food (with trepidation in the face of all the authentic experts above)
1. Cardamon: I love it and use loads. Whack the pods hard in a robust mortar then grind with the pestle and whack some more. Tip into a colander over a surface then scoop up the ground seeds that fall through. The husks stay in the colander. Next meal, repeat with refinements learned the last time. None of that finicky prising of seeds out of the pods with a knife, pods flying all over the kitchen.
2. Rice: faffy but effective method, useful for types like me who are prone to distracted forgetfulness when something is cooking. The thing is to get rid of the starch, so cook in plenty of water until it froths, tip out over a sieve, rinse and start again with plenty more water. Come back when done. (Don't forget!) Fluffy rice every time and none of the dried-up, burned pan disasters I often get when measuring rice:water ratios just so.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Really recommend this book for some good recipes.
http://www.prashad.co.uk/gift-shop/prashad-cook-book
(I'm not vegetarian but it's still worth it!)
I used to make a lot of curries but this book taught me the importance of using un-ground spices on a recipe as well as ground, as well as the importance of timing. I'd really like to eat in the restaurant one day if I'm ever passing through.
They all contain a lot of oil but I find cutting it down by a third or so does no harm.
Really recommend this book for some good recipes.
http://www.prashad.co.uk/gift-shop/prashad-cook-book
(I'm not vegetarian but it's still worth it!)
I used to make a lot of curries but this book taught me the importance of using un-ground spices on a recipe as well as ground, as well as the importance of timing. I'd really like to eat in the restaurant one day if I'm ever passing through.
They all contain a lot of oil but I find cutting it down by a third or so does no harm.
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
What an amazing response. Thanks all.
Its going to take some, ahem, digesting but Im inspired for a good one on Saturday. Perhaps something lamb.
What an amazing response. Thanks all.
Its going to take some, ahem, digesting but Im inspired for a good one on Saturday. Perhaps something lamb.
4
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
Its made me look up some of the burmese recipes I used to have. Which incidently might be a route to go down. Instead of trying to make the 'staple' curries you are used to. Try a slightly different cuisine, so at least then you can't be disappointed its not like your usual takeaway.
One dish I used to have was almost like noodle soup... it was a burmese chicken curry called Panthe Kawkswe.
We are lucky to have a lovely bangladesh takeaway nearby, and its been interesting to go through their menu, which is different to the usual - although they do offer the indian classics on the menu.
I once had a meal at an indian restaurant in Ballater, which was also different from the usual takeaway stuff, very posh!
Enjoy your cooking. I think I'll be giving a few a go this weekend too.
Its made me look up some of the burmese recipes I used to have. Which incidently might be a route to go down. Instead of trying to make the 'staple' curries you are used to. Try a slightly different cuisine, so at least then you can't be disappointed its not like your usual takeaway.
One dish I used to have was almost like noodle soup... it was a burmese chicken curry called Panthe Kawkswe.
We are lucky to have a lovely bangladesh takeaway nearby, and its been interesting to go through their menu, which is different to the usual - although they do offer the indian classics on the menu.
I once had a meal at an indian restaurant in Ballater, which was also different from the usual takeaway stuff, very posh!
Enjoy your cooking. I think I'll be giving a few a go this weekend too.
2
In reply to marsbar:
I'm sure some Indian families are happy to exist on burger and chips, or plain rice and leftovers ! I was trying to think of an analogue with something I know better like authentic English or French. What the average English and French person actually chooses to eat on a day to day basis is very different from what you think of as 'authentic' English and French. Furthermore every single authentic dish I can think of has advocates for a dozen different 'authentic' ways to cook it !
I tend to think that 'authentic', these days is mainly marketing speak (a bit like the olde worlde inne for Chinese and American tourists).
> Depends what you mean. In this specific context I personally refer to home cooking something that Indian families would cook and eat.
I'm sure some Indian families are happy to exist on burger and chips, or plain rice and leftovers ! I was trying to think of an analogue with something I know better like authentic English or French. What the average English and French person actually chooses to eat on a day to day basis is very different from what you think of as 'authentic' English and French. Furthermore every single authentic dish I can think of has advocates for a dozen different 'authentic' ways to cook it !
I tend to think that 'authentic', these days is mainly marketing speak (a bit like the olde worlde inne for Chinese and American tourists).
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I use the hairy bikers curry book. Made a batch of their garam masala, and it smells and tastes awesome in any curry.
I particularly like their lamb dopiaza.
Also for rice, I use Gordon Ramseys method. Fluffy aromatic tastey rice and no burnt pan!
I use the hairy bikers curry book. Made a batch of their garam masala, and it smells and tastes awesome in any curry.
I particularly like their lamb dopiaza.
Also for rice, I use Gordon Ramseys method. Fluffy aromatic tastey rice and no burnt pan!
In reply to GrahamD:
I’m not a word person. For me authentic English food would be things like toad in the hole, English breakfast, stew and dumplings, rice pudding, that kind of thing. Roast beef with the trimmings is the only one you’d expect in a restaurant I guess.
I’m not a word person. For me authentic English food would be things like toad in the hole, English breakfast, stew and dumplings, rice pudding, that kind of thing. Roast beef with the trimmings is the only one you’d expect in a restaurant I guess.
In reply to marsbar:
The more this thread makes me think about it, the less 'authentic recipe' makes sense. I mean everyone and their grandma will have a stew recipe - its not a definitive thing. So anything that produces a stew is almost by definition an authentic stew recipe. Similarly, if any recipe produces a curry, it must be an 'authentic' curry recipe.
Sorry boring day at the office !
The more this thread makes me think about it, the less 'authentic recipe' makes sense. I mean everyone and their grandma will have a stew recipe - its not a definitive thing. So anything that produces a stew is almost by definition an authentic stew recipe. Similarly, if any recipe produces a curry, it must be an 'authentic' curry recipe.
Sorry boring day at the office !
2
1
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:
I'd agree with most posters - a good home-made curry is a lovely thing. On that however I don't really have much to add that hasn't been covered by the excellent suggestions above.
Instead I'm recommending a book, and it's a bit leftfield, as the entire point of it is to faithfully recreate the kind of homogenous 'Indian' food which is served in restaurants all over the UK aka British Indian restaurant 'BIR' food. I was given the book for Christmas, and while I've not attempted any recipes yet, it's been interesting skimming through.
http://www.greatcurryrecipes.net/2017/01/14/the-curry-guy-cookbook/
Like Rigid Raider I believed that such sauces are made in big factories somewhere and shipped out, so I was surprised reading the intro to the book that the author had convinced various chefs to show him how it's made.
The merits really come down to how much you like BIR-style food! Personally while I find such food enjoyable, it's undeniably a bit bland and inherently quite predictable. I'm also spoilt because I live in Birmingham where authentic (and cheap) curries are widely available. As a result I tend to only eat BIR-style food as the occasional takeaway, or when I go to visit family and friends out of Brum. Even so I'm looking forward to doing some of the recipes; it should teach me some new methods.
Come to think about it WRT more authentic Indian sub-continent food, I really like the Punjabi approach to making heat with an absolute TON of garlic and ginger, and effectively topping up as required with appropriate amounts of chilli. It makes for a very different and more savoury set of flavours.
I'd agree with most posters - a good home-made curry is a lovely thing. On that however I don't really have much to add that hasn't been covered by the excellent suggestions above.
Instead I'm recommending a book, and it's a bit leftfield, as the entire point of it is to faithfully recreate the kind of homogenous 'Indian' food which is served in restaurants all over the UK aka British Indian restaurant 'BIR' food. I was given the book for Christmas, and while I've not attempted any recipes yet, it's been interesting skimming through.
http://www.greatcurryrecipes.net/2017/01/14/the-curry-guy-cookbook/
Like Rigid Raider I believed that such sauces are made in big factories somewhere and shipped out, so I was surprised reading the intro to the book that the author had convinced various chefs to show him how it's made.
The merits really come down to how much you like BIR-style food! Personally while I find such food enjoyable, it's undeniably a bit bland and inherently quite predictable. I'm also spoilt because I live in Birmingham where authentic (and cheap) curries are widely available. As a result I tend to only eat BIR-style food as the occasional takeaway, or when I go to visit family and friends out of Brum. Even so I'm looking forward to doing some of the recipes; it should teach me some new methods.
Come to think about it WRT more authentic Indian sub-continent food, I really like the Punjabi approach to making heat with an absolute TON of garlic and ginger, and effectively topping up as required with appropriate amounts of chilli. It makes for a very different and more savoury set of flavours.
In reply to GrahamD:
I guess so. But then I’ve seen a recipe for beef stew with lavender and orange zest. It was quite nice but my granny wouldn’t have approved.
https://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/Curry
I guess so. But then I’ve seen a recipe for beef stew with lavender and orange zest. It was quite nice but my granny wouldn’t have approved.
https://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/Curry
Post edited at 14:37
In reply to marsbar:
Pshh!
...Campbells, surely
> An authentic chicken tikka masala recipe would include heniz tomato soup, it's authentic Glasgow fusion cuisine.
Pshh!
...Campbells, surely
In reply to jasonC abroad:
King of minimalism, excellent.
> as is Indian Vegetarian Cookery by Jack Santa Maria.
King of minimalism, excellent.
In reply to MonkeyPuzzle:
This as become a particular hatred of mine; dishes that are supposed to be a bit sweet/sour that get laced with so much sugar they're damn near a curried dessert. So my standard order in a restaurant now is a lamb pathia with no added sugar and if they won't do it, I don't go back. I've also tried to find a recipe for this that works at home and I'm nearly there. The idea is not to have anything at all sweet in the dish (a good hit of tamarind though, which can surprise those not used to it) and to have some good mango chutney on the side, which gives a very pleasing mix of spice, sourness and just sufficient sweetness to balance.
T.
> It isn't laced with shitloads of sugar like the restaurant version though.
This as become a particular hatred of mine; dishes that are supposed to be a bit sweet/sour that get laced with so much sugar they're damn near a curried dessert. So my standard order in a restaurant now is a lamb pathia with no added sugar and if they won't do it, I don't go back. I've also tried to find a recipe for this that works at home and I'm nearly there. The idea is not to have anything at all sweet in the dish (a good hit of tamarind though, which can surprise those not used to it) and to have some good mango chutney on the side, which gives a very pleasing mix of spice, sourness and just sufficient sweetness to balance.
T.
In reply to Pursued by a bear:
>...that get laced with so much sugar they're damn near a curried dessert.
There are golden ratios of sugar, salt and fat. From cake to curry. By tweaking the ratios it appeals to our more primitive instincts, as salt, sugar and fat were prized back in cave person days. Bliss point, is the technical name for it.
Having said that, a pinch of sugar can lift things, for the above reasons. Too much, and its a cloying, over sweet mess.
>...that get laced with so much sugar they're damn near a curried dessert.
There are golden ratios of sugar, salt and fat. From cake to curry. By tweaking the ratios it appeals to our more primitive instincts, as salt, sugar and fat were prized back in cave person days. Bliss point, is the technical name for it.
Having said that, a pinch of sugar can lift things, for the above reasons. Too much, and its a cloying, over sweet mess.
1
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