UKC

With the possibility of travel restrictions(including foreign) being eased I've been thinking about a trip to the French Alps later this year, perhaps August or September. The only reservation I have is that I've been seeing reports that the EU are in a bit of a tizz following the debacle over the Oxford Astra Zeneca vaccine and the resultant reluctance of people in Europe to have it. I've seen suggestions that a side effect could be a further surge in Covid cases in France.

On a positive note I've had my first inoculation and I'm expecting my second before very much longer.

Does anyone care to hazard a guess as to how travel to France might be affected?

Bump

Speaking to my friends in France (Strasbourg and Brittany), they are really despondent with both the take up and availability of the vaccine in France. They have cautioned about getting excited about visits to France this summer as they fear that France and the UK might be in very different positions from each other by the summer. They certainly don't share our optimism that we're beginning to see a way through and out of this.

I live in France, I only know one person who's been vacinated (a nurse) although according to the news all nursing home residents have been offered one of the vacines. My 88 year mother in law has been offered a vaccination but so far has refused to have it, although she usually has the annual flu jag.

As I type the French PM is making annoucements & who knows what will happen & when over the next few months. I'm not planning to travel to the UK this summer  for fear of having problems getting back

I'm not holding out much hope of European trips based on articles like this:

https://p.dw.com/p/3pcG

It's looking like we'll be in a unique position, for better or worse.

I am based in the Écrins and I know a few people who have had the jab, I have a sneaky feeling that travel to France will be ok in the summer based on the following.

1) We had high numbers in France before Chirstmas and yet they still allowed travel and holiday for the Christmas break, and the numbers jumped after.

2) We are currently in Half term and they allowed holidays and travel continue and guess what the numbers have jumped.

3) Last summer this area saw record numbers of visitors, it was very busy and that was from people all over Europe.

4) Apart from the small issue when the UK variant kicked off, the French have always said they would just follow the UK lead and only quarantine if the UK did.

So with the above it seams that the french think having tourists and the money it brings, out ways the risk. I am guessing they will see it that way this summer, especially if most of the UK have had a vaccine.

Now the question is will the UK insist on a quarantine, if you come to France, a big part of me think they wont as they will want to show the world how good they have been with the vaccine and show that it all works, but a smaller side of me wonders if they will have one to encourage lots of people to stay and spend money in the uk over summer? 

did you really have a lot of non-French visitors ? We had almost none & the winter has been similar so far

If there is a quarantine requirement it will be because they are rightly worried about another variant coming along that knackers our progress.

I suspect this (a quarantine requirement) is very likely to be the case all through 2020.

I think the "review" on international travel that Boris has commissioned to report by May is just a sop to his backbenchers on the CRG and to the travel industry. It gets some them off his back for a few months while we get out of lockdown.

In the summer there were lots from all over, a lot and lots of Germans and Dutch, as a region we were 20% on visitors, winter is down because of the ski resorts not opening, but it is still busy, probably more french as it seams to be weekenders or long weekender more that full week bookings.

Maybe your right,

I don't see them that worried about a variant, as they have only just got around to sorting some kind of a policy for overseas travelers arriving. It would be quite funny if the UK was insisting on tighter measure to stop a variant, when a lot of the UK population got upset when other countries put measures in place with the UK variant.

All I was saying is the so far the French have said they will only have a quarantine if the UK does one, maybe that will change now the UK is not in the EU?

We drove from the UK to the Alps a few weeks ago with no trouble, quite a lot of English down here (mostly for the season). We'll stay a few more weeks at least, it's much more climbing weather than skiing! Loads of people out on the slopes and the cliffs, though.

If you want to come then you'll be able to, it wasn't that hard for us to get here. Life is a lot more relaxed here than the UK, except for the 6 'til 6 curfew, which isn't as strict as you might think.

We came "now" rather than waiting because I think that if anything restrictions will get tighter as the year goes on and they develop more advanced ways to monitor and restrict our movements. For now, you can get here easily. Good weather, did I mention?

Perhaps from abroad it isn't obvious, but the risk of a variant arriving from abroad that could undo the progress made with the vaccine is the entire point of the current UK travel policy.  The variant that happened here completely changed the picture - it has meant that the only way to control the virus without vaccination is now a full lockdown - partial restrictions aren't enough. Last November it even grew during lockdown. So our eggs are all in the vaccination basket and having managed to get the vaccination programme moving so well the Govt (and to be fair, country) are desperate not to risk squandering it.

​​I would be amazed if they allow travel without quarantine anywhere before that place has either suppressed the virus through vaccination or else has both very low case rates and an active genomic sequencing capability.

Maybe funny wasn't the right word. I just remember when the UK announced its variant, and lots of other countries put restrictions on travel from the UK, I read lots of comment from people in the UK who thought it was wrong and out of line, but now it might be the other way round they think restrictions are a good thing.

Of course it's the right thing to do for safety, if a variant comes from anywhere that turns out to be resistant to the current vaccines, then everyone is back to stage one. It just strange that they didn't think that when they were the ones posing a risk. 

As for the quarantine as it stands, again I agree its a good idea, it would be the safest option to keep it for a long time yet and I don't have an issue with it, In many ways I support it. all I was saying is that I have a feeling they may relent and let people travel, its not like they have followed the science at every turn so far. 

Yes sorry I wasn't really arguing your point about how people reacted in December. I think a lot of people were a bit shocked at the change as they all thought we were on the road out of the last lockdown towards a better Christmas, then wham. There was also a bit of disgruntlement around because we do far more genome sequencing than anywhere else so there was a feeling we were being punished for being the ones who actually looked for stuff. But I think most people who you saw complaining were probably just acting viscerally. In retrospect it was certainly the right thing for the EU to try to keep this variant out if they could. Unfortunately it seems they failed - I read the other day it is now up to 30% of cases in Germany.

In terms of holidays, selfishly I hope France catch up with the vaccine programme so I can go to Font next spring. Maybe by then things could be normal, who knows.

I thought I heard yesterday that Macron was suggesting that more restrictions might be introduced in some parts of France so any plans to visit may be premature. 

He has been saying this since Christmas, but kept pulling out of doing it. My understanding is that some local lockdown may start on the 6 of may, just after the holidays, and I am guessing that is to get the number down to open in summer. 

6 march ? there are already local lockdowns announced for Nice & Dunkerque

summary of the current situation - https://www.lemonde.fr/politique/article/2021/02/25/le-virus-gagne-de-nouve...  (in French)

Vaccine availability most likely won’t be a problem in France from April onwards.

This doesn’t mean you will be able to travel there in September, it will depend on whether they work and whether the take up is high enough.

My two grandmothers were offered the vaccines. One had it, the other has dementia and said no, probably not knowing what she was saying no to... result : she is not vaccinated .

That seems wrong to me.  If she has dementia can she consent meaningfully?  

https://www.dementiauk.org/giving-covid-19-vaccine-to-someone-with-dementia...

It will be interesting to see how things pan out in the next few months here in The Vaucluse. We're right on the border with The Drome which is apparently under surveillance.

We were a Covid hot spot for many months yet I still haven't spoken to anyone who has been hospitalised by it or know anyone else who knows anyone who has been ill with it.

I do know a dozen or so people who did test positive, their symptoms ranged from a bad cold to losing taste and smell for a week. None of them were bedridden at all.

I'm in the tourist industry and all my friends are in hospitality and tourism. I just can't see them accepting another summer of being closed down. If their friends and family were dropping like flies it would be different. But they're not. Nothing we see on the news reflects what is ahappening on the ground.
To put it into context, our region has a population of 5 million and there are 1500 people in hospital with Covid.

E

I don't think that's right, there are just under 3400 people in hospital with Covid in your region: https://www.gouvernement.fr/info-coronavirus/carte-et-donnees which is very nearly the highest it has been at any point since the beginning of the pandemic.

And, maybe even more importantly, only about 220 000 people have had the first dose of the vaccine...

I clicked on that link. The nearest figure I saw to 3400 was 3430 which is the number of patients in intensive care for the whole of France.

E

From the main page, you need to click on the map, on the grey circle over your region - that takes you to the region-specific stats. For PACA at the moment it's 3389 in hospital, 472 in intensive care. Hope that helps.

Probably not, but they aren’t going to give a vaccine to someone who says no to it.

That is despite having warned the care hole staff repeatedly that they should contact us beforehand. Obviously they didn’t.

Someone asked a similar question on another thread. Copying my response here:

It’s a good question. My view is that this summer will be all about climbing in the UK. Perhaps doing all those routes I’ve been wanting to do for ages, especially if the weather is kind. Overseas travel remains uncertain. I’m sure the travel industry will be chewing off the government’s ear but if we get to a low Covid and high vaccination situation here while most other countries are behind us, how sensible would it be to travel, even if it’s allowed?

They are looking at vaccine passports, otherwise it’s down to testing which is a right faff, especially if you want to be a bit flexible with dates. Even if I get the first jab more than three weeks before travelling, I won’t be comfortable staying in a hut for example. I have a campervan and happy to bivvy so it’s not a showstopper but it’s a consideration.

Other considerations are that I need to get rock fit again and alpine isn’t conducive to that. Also late season summer conditions tend to be poor so unless I can go early season (late June / early July) it might not be worthwhile for any glacial stuff anyway.

See how it goes - too early to tell. However I’m thinking being able / willing to go this season would be a bonus but isn’t very likely at the moment. 

Also the French government is making noises about additional measures, as discussed above. They may well get a third wave. I’m actually surprised they’ve not had a far worse situation given that they’ve not had a lockdown over the winter (although no doubt places like ski resorts would have been in a far worse situation with the lifts open and the usual crowds). It might be possible to travel but you might not want to as there might not be much you’re allowed to do... Having had both jabs before you travel does put in you a relatively good position but even then it depends how much of a faff it will be and what you can do when you get there, plus whether you can get insurance. We shall see...

France has, in effect, locked down most of the winter. No pubs or restaurants open since November and a 6:00pm curfew (with weekend curfews threatened in some areas). There are also limits on how many can "gather" in public, though the limits on private gatherings are difficult to enforce. It's disappointing that this hasn't reduced the infection rate more, possibly leaving France with closed doors for a while longer until they get their vaccination programme sorted.

It's been a semi lockdown. Shops are still open outside the curfew and there are no travel restrictions. My Instagram has been full of underemployed guides in Cham ice climbing and ski touring with their mates...

No-one seems to have pointed out that officially it is very difficult to get into France from the UK at the minute. Unless you have 'motifs imperious' such as shared childcare, unavoidable medical appointments, you live here and your travel started before 31 Jan or your work will save the world (or France at least). These restrictions should be eased as the infection situation in the UK improves, but your freedom to do things in France may depend on the situation here. That said I returned here mid-Jan and they only checked my PCR test info, not any residence papers.

And indeed at the moment it is illegal (!) to go on holiday abroad or indeed the UK. The earliest this might change is 17 May, although of course that is some weeks before the classic summer alpine season begins.

Is the childcare only parents?  I would like to travel to France in the summer to help my sister by looking after my niece.  

I would have had one jab by then or possibly both. 

Parents or legal guardians as far as I understand it. Could all change by the summer!

Wait and see I suppose.  Thanks.

As you say, it's quite hard to get into France currently. I've just been emailed by the French Embassy here in Saudi to say I can't visit France, despite my wife being a French resident. 

Here's hoping that the lockdown/vaccination programme (in KSA and France) has the desired impact and I can get back soon.

I have just returned from France, 10 days in Bleau (perfect conditions by the way). Travel from within the EU is easy: get a pcr-test before leaving, show at the airport., be equal to french citizens. Meaning curfew.

Returning to Austria is a pain or nonsense: from the airport you are quarantined for days, or five with an antigen test. To get to your place of quarantine, you are allowed to travel on public transport😜.

Thus the main difference seems to be membership to a certain club named EU.