UKC

https://news.sky.com/story/elon-musks-brain-chip-company-neuralink-says-it-...

"Mr Musk, who last year claimed the devices were so safe he would happily use his children as guinea pigs, hopes they will one day help conditions including obesity, autism, depression and schizophrenia, as well as enabling web browsing and telepathy."

Every shade of wrong! I for one will not be in the queue, having seen his admittedly remarkable smart rockets explode.

I won't be in the queue either as I wouldn't want to take the risk that comes with being an early adopter, but why is it every shade of wrong?

If the tech leads to benefits to humans this is presumably a good thing.

SpaceX have a fast turnover of prototyping approach to development. Explosions are part of the process. Note the lack of human tragedy related to SpaceX since the risky launches don't involve humans.

Not sure why you think the SpaceX prototyping approach suggest the brain chip would be unnecessarily risky.

Boring medical regulatory information warning.

Regulators will look at the safety-risk benefit profile in detail before approving a human trial.

I don’t think these types of medical devices have been approved for human trials before this would likely mean Musk has to go through what is called a de novo registration process of which the FDA will ask his company to perform almost every safety test they can think of before they will consider investigational device exemption to conduct human trials.

Even then it would need to show potential for considerable benefit to outweigh any residual risk after all the benchtop & animal testing is completed.

Okay, take just a single claim, that the chips can help those with depression or schizophrenia. Seems a bold claim! How might this differ from the chemical cosh employed today, or ECT, or frontal lobotomy's or the myriad of other "cures" actually inflected upon people over the centuries. I don't believe he's thought it through particularly well.

And telepathy? What could possibly go wrong there!

What is particularly amusing is the number of blue tick Twitter antivaxxers who are super excited about getting these. Non existent chips implanted through vaccines? Rage. Actual chips actually implanted via a surgical procedure? Yes, sir!

Expanded access (compassionate use) on quadriplegics who are otherwise intending assisted suicide is one route to human trials more promptly, although even that might need a move to a more conventional and already human tested and licensed implantable battery (likely involving a more permanent external wireless power feed when the device is in usage).

Waiting to see what the federal investigation in to animal welfare at Neuralink says; I'd be immensely uncomfortable to see it going to people if it turns out systematic issues with management and culture have led to the alleged breaches now under investigation.

What disturbs me isn't so much the medical/technological implication but more the corporate one. Musk and other members of the corporate elite have demonstrated countless times that they act solely for themselves and individual profit. Musk might cite the 'good' it could do for numerous conditions but I doubt he acts on any sort of moral guiding principle.

I feel it foolhardy to put such an integral part of life in the hands of malicious forces.

Instagram and tictoc have already worked out how to get into their users cerebral cortex. Why bother implanting anything when the forefinger and eyeball works just fine in disabling critical thinking.

I desperately want to make some facetious rant about musk's chips are real but nano - and they were in the fake vaccine, but worried people would think I was serious.

In Musk's case his chips may need to be introduced via an enema as that's where these ideas seem to originate

A more appropriate title might have been 'Musk's fishy chips'. Alas, it's too late now.

I was going to mention the animal trials and alledgedly cavalier attitude to welfare and compliance issues but.you got there first

I'm far more interested in the current wave of psychedelic research going on and the benefits some of those compounds may often common brain and mental health issues

I'm not sure his action follow what you suggest.

About 10 years ago, Tesla opened up all their patents in order to help other car companies build electric cars faster. Tesla claimed that their purpose was to roll out EV's as quickly as possible for the greater good, and opening patents helped in this endeavour despite it reducing their competitive edge.

Now there may be another angle to this that benefits Musk/Tesla, but I can't think what it might be. 

Not himself then?

Reminds of a Tory who happily let his kids eat BSE riddled burgers.

I don't think this example shows altruism on Musk's part in any sense.

A closer read of the terms of the patent sharing place a huge amount of restrictions and limitations upon companies using the patents. I won't go into complete details but the use of Tesla patents effectively shields Tesla from any suit that the company using their patents could file in regard to intellectual property, regardless of what product it is (or so is my interpretation). This article goes into more detail https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=ca6c332f-2cc5-401b-b80d-3647...

On top of this, Musk himself admitted that the strategy was non-altruistic, with the sharing of patents massively increasing the electric car market and furthering public interest.

Regardless, this singular act does not mean he is not someone who acts morally. In order to become the wealthiest human on the planet that is simply not possible. My point is that I do not trust someone who has the mentality and morality to amass that level of wealth, be it Musk or another billionaire.

If it'll stop me farting after eating broccoli I'll sign up

Makes sense. They just want consent.

Any chance of Musk using one of these to develop some interpersonal skills, like empathy?

It would be easier to hook up some electrodes to his nadgers, triggered by a microphone that detects him speaking. Or maybe simply when he tweets...

Why would the FDA need to be involved, he'll just do the trials in another country with lesser controls. 

Ok but have you considered what might happen if you didn't fart?

youtube.com/watch?v=7y_9m9bzm8Y&

A close family member had their life ruined by parkinsons disease, I'm sure if it were available at the time that an implant would fix them they would have gone for it. 

I'm fairly sure were I paralysed and something could be implanted to bypass the broken bit I would be up for it too. 

At one point in time eyesight was corrected by magnifying glasses, then glasses, then contact lenses and now through lazer surgery and implanting new lenses. I see nothing wrong with a chip that let's you see via a camera. 

We live in exiting times. 

Definitely. Good points. Framed in such a way I'd back it 100%. It's the frankly terrifying applications quoted in the Sky article that gave me the heebie jeebies!

Edit: I think you mean exciting times. Although it feels like exiting times at times!

Really? I haven’t seen any one saying they want one..

What patents ? Bung lithium batteries in a car weighing 2 tons and fit washing machine motors to as many wheels as you fancy. Glue an Ipad to the dashboard. Job done. 

Oh and mow down cyclists. 

That's capitalism. I am pleased that you appreciate the risk, and would encourage you to further analyze its implications.

Putting their 600 patents to one side for a minute that's really all there is to it.

A bit like sending people to the moon was just a matter of sticking a load of kerosene and oxygen in a can, pointing the pointy end at the moon and lighting the fuse.

Aside from the tracking control issues what happens when they need upgrading?

https://www.sapiens.org/culture/planned-obsolescence-cochlear-implants/

Has he not read "The Terminal Man" by Michael Crichton (written in the 70s iirc)?

Did not end well

And “his” cars set on fire

Is it because that’s before Musk got involved in Tesla?

No it isn’t. The patent sharing started in 2014, a good 5 or 6 years after Musk took control of the company.

Its a tactic to grow the market.

Everything I hear about this company makes me think it's another Theranos waiting to happen.

Funnily enough that wort's been getting bandied around over Tesla since this leak - https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/05/massive-trove-of-tesla-files-contains-...

In neither case do I want to go anywhere near a life threatening device (brain implant or motor vehicle) coming out of the kind of work cultures that are being alleged.  

It's all getting painted as our glorious hi tech future - after some useful idiot has showcased it other suckers will follow