/ Bear Grylls and Alex Honnold climbing together

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Ned 10 Jan 2020

Climbing.com link below, plus a few 'unanswered' questions including "Why is the grass growing sideways in the final shot of Bear? Was he laying on the ground for this interview segment?"

https://www.climbing.com/videos/alex-honnold-sets-up-a-toprope-for-bear-grylls/

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Hat Dude 10 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Swiss Alps?

Looks to me like a lot of that was filmed at Pandy Outcrop ;-)

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johncook 10 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

I can cope with a bit of grass growing sideways, but trees, not so much. And oddly the rope has disappeared for the little interview bit. 

Also love the way Honnold pretends that it is hard, I expect he was getting paid for this sequence.

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Rob Exile Ward 10 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Surely that is a conscious experiment to try and discover the limits of National Geographic viewer's credulity? 

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tom_in_edinburgh 10 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

2:22  Just above Bear's knee you can see Alex Honnold in the background standing horizontally out from the cliff just like the grass.   A bit like this:

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x53s2c

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gman2012 11 Jan 2020
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

Also worth noting the loose straps on his shoulder and chin.

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felt 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Close your eyes and at the beginning, "and the words that are ringing round my head are ... Bear ... you're screwed", Bear is Gordon Ramsay. 

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Tom V 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Looks like an advert for an approach shoe. While Grylls' shoes are very clearly the point of focus , Honnold's footwear get a lot less attention, probably because he's wearing a shot pair of Mountain Warehouse walking shoes or some such.

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MischaHY 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Tom V:

Bear is wearing Guide Tennies, Alex Sportiva TX2. I assume Adidas have a hand in Bear if they're focusing on the footwear from him. 

Post edited at 10:14
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DaveHK 11 Jan 2020
In reply to MischaHY:

> I assume Adidas have a hand in Bear

All the way up to the elbow?

Like sooty?

Post edited at 10:41
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jethro kiernan 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

I was given a copy of Bears early autobiography as a well meant present 😏, his Everest fundraising essentially read as, “struggling to raise funds for trip to Everest looking dicy, phoned round chums, went to see chums dad in city, merchant bank now “sponsoring” trip”
A chapter that unwittingly sums up the insidious class and privilege problem this country still has.

Post edited at 12:57
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Doghouse 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Burn the witch! burn the Witch! burn the Witch!

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Dave Garnett 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

> Climbing.com link below, plus a few 'unanswered' questions including "Why is the grass growing sideways in the final shot of Bear? Was he laying on the ground for this interview segment?"

Strangely sycophantic/dim comments on climbing.com, makes you wonder how disinterested they are.  

The fakery is so blatant that they are not expecting to be taken seriously, surely?  Or maybe Bear has been getting away with it for so long he just doesn't care.

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NathanP 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Tom V:

Those aren't Guide Tennies - you can see "...altic" written on the side and in the view from below they are clearly a climbing shoe. Pretty sure they are Saltic Garnets http://www.saltic.cz/en/garnet.html

Whilst Alex Honnold is wandering up in trainers, Bear isn't. 

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Alex Riley 11 Jan 2020
In reply to NathanP:

The clip has continuity errors switching between climbing shoes and approach shoes

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L Amine head 11 Jan 2020
In reply to jethro kiernan:

Your totally  correct.  Thing is ,that's life, the, Etonions run the show and everybody  thinks there the dogs balls. BULLSHIT. As we know, our do we.... .   

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NathanP 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Alex Riley:

I don't think so. I've just watched it through again and I'm sure they are Saltic Garnets all the way through.

I thought they were Guide Tennies too, at first - I've had a couple of pair myself. Have a look on the link I posted: the stitching, colour and shape around the toe are very similar it is only the text on the side and underneath view that gives the game away.

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Alex Riley 11 Jan 2020
In reply to NathanP:

He starts climbing in the tennies, then it changes (probably when he got gripped haha!)

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john arran 11 Jan 2020
In reply to Dave Garnett:

> The fakery is so blatant that they are not expecting to be taken seriously, surely?  Or maybe Bear has been getting away with it for so long he just doesn't care.

Very reminiscent of Trumpian or Johnsonian behaviour. Be blatant and persistent enough in lying, and people will not only ignore the obvious deceit, they will even defend your integrity!

We're living in truly strange times.

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Andy Gamisou 12 Jan 2020
In reply to john arran:

> Very reminiscent of Trumpian or Johnsonian behaviour. Be blatant and persistent enough in lying, and people will not only ignore the obvious deceit, they will even defend your integrity!

> We're living in truly strange times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAxXoMrMzi0

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NathanP 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Alex Riley:

No he really doesn't. In the very first frame where you see Grylls foot, he is wearing Saltic Garnet rock shoes. You can see lacing much closer to the front rand and a different rand shape compared to Five Tennies. The orange of the tongue, main suede colour and stitching are exactly as the photo of the Garnet that I linked to and different to Five Tennies.

And if we ever meet in person, you owe me a pint at least for making me watch a Bear Grylls video three times - OK, a half, as I had the sound off ;-) 

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Martin Southville 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Climbing.com being unnecessarily mean in this cynical click-bait. 

Alex isn't struggling, he just answers "I need to figure out which way I go first". The stick is obviously a bow, like you'd make on a bushcraft-for-beginners workshop. The sideways slab shot is just a selfie taken by a clearly nervous Bear, clinging flat against the rock.

Bear's not a climber, nor is he claiming to be! Alex has taken him for a nice, safe outdoor top-rope on a big sunny slab and Bear is full of child-like enthusiasm. Buzzing with nervous energy, he's making all the noises that newcomers do to release the fear (myself included) and he's got a big smile on his face when Alex tells him he's doing well. That's just heartwarming! 

Don't get me wrong, I think Bear is a bit of a dick and some of the advice in his survival-themed shows is dangerous (like jumping from a cliff into a pool of unknown depth when lost) but here he's a more humble version of his drama queen persona and this just seems like a lovely day out. 

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Stuart (aka brt) 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Martin Southville:

> Don't get me wrong, I think Bear is a bit of a dick and some of the advice in his survival-themed shows is dangerous (like jumping from a cliff into a pool of unknown depth when lost) but here he's a more humble version of his drama queen persona and this just seems like a lovely day out. 

Maybe because he's in the presence of someone who is the real deal. Bullshit gets found out pretty quickly in such situations. 

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Rob Parsons 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Martin Southville:

> Bear's not a climber, nor is he claiming to be!

What's your reaction to videos like these (as posted on the other current thread):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5t0mJ63Y8WM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Hs8_Tu4sgg

He does seem to claim to be a climber in those, doesn't he? - indeed, a solo climber. Of course, those videos are so ludicrous and misleading that they verge on self-parody - but I don't think that they're actually intended as that.

Post edited at 12:00
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deepsoup 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Martin Southville:

> The sideways slab shot is just a selfie taken by a clearly nervous Bear, clinging flat against the rock.

Laughable as it is, this is a professionally produced tv programme with high production values.  The sideways slab shot is taken by sideways member of a professional camera crew.  And you're missing the point slightly which is that the rock he's nervously clinging to is horizontal, like the North face of the Uxbridge Road.

> Bear's not a climber, nor is he claiming to be!

He has frequently and repeatedly claimed to be a climber, eg:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5t0mJ63Y8WM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Hs8_Tu4sgg

(In that second one he demonstrates how a 'Master of Movement' places his cams, impressive stuff.)

What's happening here is that everyone knows Honnold is genuinely an extraordinary climber, so the producers of the programme (perhaps including Grylls himself) have decided to reverse the normal roles for this segment.  It might even have been a refreshing change for Grylls to lie about his abilities in the opposite direction for a change and pretend to be less able than he actually is. 

Can't lose too much face though, so Honnold hams up the difficulty while Grylls pretends to be freaked out by following up even more difficult ground than he's used to.

Interesting that Grylls is wearing a helmet - I've never seen that before.  He usually refuses to wear one whether the activity would normally call for it or not because he doesn't think it looks cool*.  But as you say, here he's being all humble (or at least pretending to be) and allowing Honnold to be the 'mentor' for a segment of the programme - so here he's the one wearing a lid like a gumby, while Honnold is temporarily playing the role of the cool kid who doesn't need to bother.

* eg: see this post in the other thread.. https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/off_belay/bear_and_honnold-714348?v=1#x9111173

> Buzzing with nervous energy, he's making all the noises that newcomers do to release the fear

He's no more feeling 'the fear' than Honnold is struggling to make the moves on that Severe-ish slab.  He's on a top rope on easy ground and has a great deal of experience of confidently dangling on a rope in *much* more intimidating situations than that, whilst pretending to the camera that the toprope isn't there (see above).  It's just pantomime.

Post edited at 12:33
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deepsoup 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

Snap!  Ha ha.

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jon 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Martin Southville:

> Bear's not a climber, nor is he claiming to be! 

Master of movement...?

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Northern Star 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

I'm not sure if we (as climbers) are the intended audience for Bear Grylls TV programmes.  He's big on appealing to kids, and for those who like to see celebrities and the public getting a hard time in the jungle, etc, etc.  There are plenty of proper climbing films out there for us people who like our adventure TV a little more real (or as real as it can be considering everything you see on screen is edited to some extent).

Of course all his climbs are rigged for the cameras and with this in mind they are deliberately made and hammed up to seem more exciting and more dangerous to the general public than they actually are.  But then what TV isn't nowadays?  Hidden top rope for additional safety - what's the problem for those that don't understand the basic mechanics or terminology of climbing in any case? 

I know some people on Bear's film crew and safety is taken unbelievably seriously with the stuff he does.  It's all very carefully scripted and filmed.  He's certainly not putting people's lives in unnecessary danger though with his bravado, unlike a certain Brave individual we were discussing on here a while back.

Yes it's all fake peril and carefully engineered jeopardy, yes he comes from a privileged background and his SAS and other claims are dubious, but you know what, as entertainment (which is all it is) then I'd far rather the kids be watching Bear Grylls than Celebrity Love Island or similar toss!

Post edited at 13:57
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TheGeneralist 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

I've never really understood the Bearloathing before.  Now I completely do. What a vacuous tw*t.

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deepsoup 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Northern Star:

>  as entertainment (which is all it is)

Here's the clip I posted in the other thread by way of an explanation for my impatience with that argument. 

Personally, I think the drip-drip-drip of constant dishonesty, self-promotion and hype is insidious and corrosive.  No better than "Celebrity Love Island" or similar toss.  But that isn't the main reason I have a problem with this clown, it's the complete lack of respect and affection for the natural world.  He shows no appreciation of any of it, the landscape is just there as a backdrop for him to look awesome against, the wildlife is only there to be killed so he can pretend to eat it. 

Speaking of which....  I didn't watch this on the telly, I became aware of it via the protests from various conservation groups at the time.  Many of them worried that impressionable yoofs might seek follow his example. 

If they did they'd be committing a criminal offence in Europe of course, or many other countries throughout the world, but the Discovery Channel defended the clip and refused to stop showing it as conservation groups were asking them to on the grounds that what he's doing here is perfectly legal in China, so it's all fine & dandy.

Heads up to those of a sensitive disposition  - I find this clip quite distasteful and a bit upsetting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84HE0MHGbKw

Here he is, just for pure entertainment, chucking a flaming torch into a cave to 'smoke out' the bats roosting in there.  As they flee, he swats as many out of the air as he can with a sort of improvised tennis racket before gleefully stomping on the injured animals on the ground.  He clearly thinks the whole thing is a hoot throughout. 

Bear Grylls threads on here are generally pretty light-hearted, some folks defend him as you do while others think he's a bit of a joke.  I don't think he's a bit of a joke, I think he's fcking vile. 

Steve Irwin mucked about with animals on telly like a big kid for entertainment, but crucially like a big kid with a good heart.  Conversely, Bear Grylls is a big version of the sort of nasty little shit that burns ants with a magnifying glass or pulls the legs off a spider.

Post edited at 15:02
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jon 12 Jan 2020
In reply to deepsoup:

That's appalling. I must admit I stopped watching as he went into the cave. Did he actually kill any?

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gravy 12 Jan 2020
In reply to jon:

Yes - "40ove" (to Bear) I think is the quote at the end

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deepsoup 12 Jan 2020
In reply to jon:

> Did he actually kill any?

Two if you take the video at face value I think, possibly three. 

He hits one with his 'tennis racquet' but can't see it when he looks down, swats another one and stamps on it before holding it up by one wing tip for the camera, then he drops that one and starts swinging his racquet again as he gets into some tennis humour; "You cannot be serious!", "40-15". 

Finally he swats one more, stamps on that one as well and holds it up for the camera with a triumphant "Game, set, match - Bear!"

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jon 12 Jan 2020
In reply to deepsoup:

FFS why?

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Archy Styrigg 12 Jan 2020
In reply to deepsoup:

What a total, utter arsehole!
How is he Chief Scout?  Do the Scouts know about this?
They need to get rid and have someone like Ray Mears.

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deepsoup 12 Jan 2020
In reply to jon:

> FFS why?

'Entertainment'  :-

In reply to Archy Styrigg

> Do the Scouts know about this?

I don't see how they could not know about it.  There was quite the outcry from several different conservation organisations at the time, petitions and wotnot.

I wouldn't blame the Scouts for wanting a bit more pzazz from their Chief Scout than Ray Mears has to offer really. 

Steve Backshall is already an ambassador for the Scout Association though, just saying..  ;-)
 

Post edited at 18:01
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DerwentDiluted 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

I was kinda hoping that in the spirit of Bears Survival skills courses (marketing strongly infers that the course will be run personally by BG, punters pay small fortune then turn up to be told that due to last minute filming commitments BG is not available and the courses will be run by some randomer in dodgy DPM trousers, but this happens on every course), BG would arrive on set to be told that, due to last minute filming commitments Alex was unavailable, and the climbing would be led by some guide fella called Dave Bravid....

Post edited at 17:45
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Martin Southville 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons and deepsoup:

OK, I'd never seen the "Master of Movement" and the "Mojave Desert" videos of Bear before and yeah my reaction to those is really quite different! Thanks for sharing. In those videos he is the classic melodramatic parody of himself. Did the awesome presence of Alex Honnold's icey obsessive nature tame the Bear? Maybe he's humbling with age? I like the goofy top-roping Bear, he reminds me of when I take my 8 year old nephew to my local indoor climbing centre. More of that please internet

Post edited at 18:20
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andyman666999 12 Jan 2020
In reply to deepsoup:

Good grief. I always thought he was a bit of a joke but he this video really does seem to show that he is a massive tw*t. Don’t care about his parodies of climbing etc because there really is no need to be killing wildlife purely for the sake of entertainment no matter the legalities. 

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deepsoup 12 Jan 2020
In reply to andyman666999:

Yeah it's grim innit, sorry, I feel slightly guilty for injecting that bit of miserable reality into what should really be a light-hearted jokey thread.

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Andy Clarke 12 Jan 2020
In reply to andyman666999:

That bat killing video is disgusting. An organisation that awards a Naturalist Activity Badge but thinks such behaviour from its chief ambassador is acceptable needs to pause and reflect. I spent many years as a headteacher looking for good role models for teenagers and I wouldn't have let Bear anywhere near an assembly. 

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Queenie 12 Jan 2020
In reply to deepsoup:

Definitely needed to be said. It's confirmed my gut feeling about the man.

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Tom V 12 Jan 2020
In reply to deepsoup:

You shouldn't feel at all guilty:  on the other hand, Honnold might want to reassess his relationship with BG if he ever has the opportunity to see the video.

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kaiser 12 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

https://beargryllssurvivalacademy.com/survival-courses/courses/snowdon-challenge

Come on - you know you want to.  Only £600!  Perhaps it will be Bryants Gully after breakfast in Ffestiniog!!

There is cake!   And Medals!!

Post edited at 22:41
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Stuart (aka brt) 12 Jan 2020
In reply to kaiser:

> Come on - you know you want to.  Only £600!  Perhaps it will be Bryants Gully after breakfast in Ffestiniog!!

> There is cake!   And Medals!!

I love the disclaimer: all activities are weather dependent! FFS. 

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Mr Lopez 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

He's getting roasted in a Ropes techniques group on FB for this video. Ha, ha

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZahv3BQJ88

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Phil79 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Archy Styrigg:

> What a total, utter arsehole!

> How is he Chief Scout?  Do the Scouts know about this?

> They need to get rid and have someone like Ray Mears.

Steve Backshaw is the man for the job. Already hugely popular with kids, has done far more genuinely adventurous things and expeditions, and has a huge amount of knowledge about the natural world. 

God know why the have Bear doing it.

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L mondite 13 Jan 2020
In reply to kaiser:

> Come on - you know you want to.  Only £600! 

Excluding VAT.

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LastBoyScout 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

The worst bit is he's wearing a Scout Membership Award badge on his arm.

Apart from the fact he's wearing it at all (which is another topic), that badge should be worn on left chest of a uniform top/shirt, not right arm of a random black top.

And what's going on with Honnold's belaying?

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LastBoyScout 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Phil79:

> Steve Backshaw is the man for the job. Already hugely popular with kids, has done far more genuinely adventurous things and expeditions, and has a huge amount of knowledge about the natural world. 

> God know why the have Bear doing it.

Agreed, on both counts.

Steve already does loads with his local Scout groups - he stepped in as Santa at the Beaver colony last month.

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Mick Ward 13 Jan 2020
In reply to LastBoyScout:

> ...he stepped in as Santa at the Beaver colony last month.

The mind boggles!

Mick

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LastBoyScout 13 Jan 2020
Rob Parsons 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Mr Lopez:

> He's getting roasted in a Ropes techniques group on FB for this video. Ha, ha

Once again, what he says he's doing in that video (a balanced double abseil) isn't what he's actually doing: there is a big knot at the top of the rope, so both people are abseiling independently.

He just can't stop himself from cheating and lying, can he?

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LastBoyScout 13 Jan 2020
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

> 2:22  Just above Bear's knee you can see Alex Honnold in the background standing horizontally out from the cliff just like the grass. A bit like this:

In fairness, the earlier video does show him leaning back in his harness, so it's possible he was leaning backwards to see Bear. Also, whatever angle he was at, if the shot was looking vertically upwards, he'd appear upright anyway. Not sure the trees are conclusive, as you might just be referencing a couple of branches, not the whole thing.

It's still a rubbish video.

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Rob Parsons 13 Jan 2020
In reply to LastBoyScout:

> In fairness, the earlier video does show him leaning back in his harness, so it's possible he was leaning backwards to see Bear. Also, whatever angle he was at, if the shot was looking vertically upwards, he'd appear upright anyway. Not sure the trees are conclusive, as you might just be referencing a couple of branches, not the whole thing.

'fraid not. As has already been pointed out, look at the way the upper tapes on the shoulder straps of Mr Grylls's rucksack are dangling.

He's cheating again - and you've been had.

Post edited at 15:08
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deepsoup 13 Jan 2020
In reply to LastBoyScout:

That's great, what a mensch.

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Archy Styrigg 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

He's a total dick.  Anyone remember this?  Goto 7 mins ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASZHIFcsXEM

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Xharlie 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

The more I read about this, the more I wonder: "Why is Honnold doing this?"

Seriously? Why? Surely he knows how the climbing community feels about Grylls' antics -- which range from "bullshit" to actively, objectionable to downright disgraceful?

Surely it can't be for the cash -- he must have saved up enough to replace that old pair of shorts of his, by now.

I'm disappointed. As someone who holds an immense amount of respect for Honnold (practically a living legend) and a strange fascination with his achievements, story and motivations -- as well as an enduring envy of his mental fortitude and control -- this sort of thing confuses me immensely.

Maybe this is what indie music fans feel when their favourite band sell out and start playing music for SUV advertisements.

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LastBoyScout 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

> 'fraid not. As has already been pointed out, look at the way the upper tapes on the shoulder straps of Mr Grylls's rucksack are dangling.

> He's cheating again - and you've been had.

D'oh - missed that.

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Mr Lopez 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Xharlie:

> The more I read about this, the more I wonder: "Why is Honnold doing this?"

> Seriously? Why?

Can't blame him for it though. He's probably clever enough to know that he can't keep soloing stuff to put food on the table, and that to get an income from his sponsors he needs to be out there in the public eye one way or another. A more public profile even if that means ending up in reality shows or saddled with The Bear allows him to tone down on the dangerous stuff or at the very least removes the pressure that might be felt for doing so, specially thinking ahead for the future when the noteworthy ascents will be nabbed by the up and coming generations.

Good on him i say

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stevevans5 13 Jan 2020
In reply to Xharlie:

Surely it's possible he doesn't really know that much about Bear? I don't know how well known he is in the states...

I could see how this might have sounded like a fun opportunity to do something a bit different

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Mick Ward 13 Jan 2020
In reply to LastBoyScout:

Heartwarming photos! Many thanks indeed.

Mick

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Blanche DuBois 14 Jan 2020
In reply to stevevans5:

> Surely it's possible he doesn't really know that much about Bear? I don't know how well known he is in the states...

He's very well known in the US.

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Rob Parsons 14 Jan 2020
In reply to Blanche DuBois:

> He's very well known in the US.


Indeed, Barrack Obama did a show with him.

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stevevans5 14 Jan 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

That is true. I'd imagine the show with Obama probably had very little shouting, jumping off cliffs and fake climbing though, making it easier to understand why Honnold would be up for being on the show 

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Wyn 14 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

Wouldn't be surprised if Honnold didn't own a TV though...

Doesn't the Bear own an Island off the coast of Wales, can't remember which one?  Sure I read somewhere that he'd put in a planning application to build a massive slide running off into the sea.  It got rejected

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George Ormerod 14 Jan 2020
In reply to Ned:

You lot will like this - Andy K's podcast on Bear and general Bear loathing.  He's come round to respecting Bear as good at being Bear - upper class superficial bluffing social media whore - and almost feels sorry for him.  There's a good sting in the tail anecdote at the end on what the real SAS think of Bear.

https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/episode-7-andy-kirkpatrick-me-and-bear-grylls-a-love-story/id1489432991?i=1000462068393

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Frank R. 14 Jan 2020
In reply to George Ormerod:

Worth listening to the whole thing, but the SAS anecdote starts around the 58 minutes mark

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DaveHK 14 Jan 2020
In reply to Frank R.:

> Worth listening to the whole thing, but the SAS anecdote starts around the 58 minutes mark

We'll I listened to it from 58 mins like you suggested and I'd rather slam my nuts in a car door than listen to the whole thing. It's just incoherent rambling.

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George Ormerod 14 Jan 2020
In reply to DaveHK:

Thanks, I now have a disturbing mental image of you trying to slam your knackers in a car door.

Anyway, I rather enjoy his stream of consciousness rambling, but I guess he's a bit of a Marmite character. 

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DaveHK 14 Jan 2020
In reply to George Ormerod:

> Thanks, I now have a disturbing mental image of you trying to slam your knackers in a car door.

I can send actual images?

> Anyway, I rather enjoy his stream of consciousness rambling, but I guess he's a bit of a Marmite character. 

It's not for me but then I think the list of people I could listen to for over an hour is probably a pretty short one.

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Frank R. 14 Jan 2020
In reply to DaveHK:

Glad to have saved you from listening to the previous 58 minutes of it then :D

(from the 58 min mark is a somewhat funny story about Grylls and the SAS reactions to him claiming to be in SAS, although it loses a lot without the rest of the context in the whole podcast).

I do agree Kirkpatrick is not the easiest podcast to listen to though, jumping around themes and such. I quite prefer his writing - usually more to the point, even if controversial at times.

Post edited at 23:36
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