/ Suspend the logbooks

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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020

Might it be an idea to suspend the logbooks during this period. 

There will always be those who think they are bigger than this and wish to willy wave.

Not sharing their antics might prevent others from following their lead and/or being tempted out by reports of great conditions. 

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Ciro 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

Maybe a top 40 selfish ****s feature?

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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Ciro:

Yeah, logbook records could be maintained and a list of shame produced once this bows over. I doubt this would have any great effect on behaviours though, other than get a few backs up. 

Denying them the oxygen of publicity in the first instance may discourage others from mimickery. 

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Luke90 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

If they do that, it might not be very easy to judge when to turn them back on again. Especially if, as has been suggested, we end up with an up-and-down cycle of easing and tightening restrictions to manage case numbers.

There might be times when cautious, local climbing on your own or with a partner is actually a reasonable choice and then isn't again shortly after. If I'm completely honest, I'm still desperately hoping we might be in one of those periods now, though I'm reluctantly coming around to the idea that we're probably not.

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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Luke90:

There are all sorts of whys and wherefores with this. Suspending reporting would be a responsible move. 

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teh_mark 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

If your problem is willy-waving, why  not just have everyone's logbook set to private until such time that things can be returned to normal? I'm still not entirely sure how me driving to an esoteric and deserted crag directly from home, doing things well within my abilities and not interacting with anyone at any point is a problem?

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ianstevens 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

And if people want to update their log books with old data, or are able to get to a drag without interacting with a single human? Ridiculous idea IMO, and utterly pointless.

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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020
In reply to teh_mark:

I am not going to get involved in each individual case, there are enough of those arguments going on.

In the same vein as clubs cancelling meets and closing huts, I think suspending the logbooks is a responsible measure. 

This is not to imply that the current status is irresponsible. This is a developing scenario and it takes time to react. 

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teh_mark 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

'Was thinking about going to Stanage today, but 'ck it, the logbooks are suspended.'

Sounds ridiculous, doesn't it?

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wintertree 22 Mar 2020
In reply to teh_mark:

> I'm still not entirely sure how me driving to an esoteric and deserted crag directly from home, doing things well within my abilities and not interacting with anyone at any point is a problem?

Got an infinite supply of fuel?

Guaranteed not to have an accident or breakdown?

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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020
In reply to teh_mark:

Not if rephrased as, the Ben is in great nick, gemini was climbed yesterday. 

Or, it will be OK to go out to stanage/esoteric grot pile, teh mark went yesterday, if its OK for him then it's OK for us. 

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LeeWood 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

I think its pretty sad that UKC has allied itself with state policing of our activities. They should have stayed neutral. There's been a very even balance of like/dislike of opinion on developments and restrictions discussed but UKC has if anything been against activity than with it  

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teh_mark 22 Mar 2020
In reply to wintertree:

I have a full tank, which is about 900 miles. The Peak is about 10 miles away, and the car is - to my knowledge - in good, sound mechanical condition. It's certainly less likely to  break down than the boat that I legally have to move every two weeks, and CRT don't seem to think that the risk of breakdown is a good reason to overstay on a mooring in these troubling times.

Of course I can't guarantee I won't have an accident in the car or on the crag, but I also can't guarantee that I won't sprain my ankle walking down the towpath or fall in the canal and contract Weil's disease. I'm happy with the probability of all of those things though, based on historical evidence.

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In reply to LeeWood:

> I think its pretty sad that UKC has allied itself with state policing of our activities. They should have stayed neutral. There's been a very even balance of like/dislike of opinion on developments and restrictions discussed but UKC has if anything been against activity than with it  

How do we reconcile that statement with the handful of complaint emails we have received this weekend for being too irreverent in our coverage and proceeding with 'business as usual' because we published a few climbing videos and non-corona news items? Like the BBC accused from both sides of being too left-wing or too right-wing depending where the accuser aligns themself.

We won't be closing logbooks but we have added some notices about banned crags and we may do a bit more of this as things progress. We would very much like people to be able to update their logbooks with historic ticks during the isolation process should they want to considering people may have some spare time.

Alan

Post edited at 20:36
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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

Alan, my suggestion is to suspend the reporting not the recording facility.  So no routes logged during this period visible to other users, until the crisis has passed. Pausing the weekly top ascents thread would also help. 

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Robert Durran 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

>  ….....handful of complaint emails we have received this weekend for being too irreverent in our coverage and proceeding with 'business as usual' because we published a few climbing videos...…..

Good grief, surely sitting at home watching climbing videos is exactly what we SHOULD be doing for the next few months! Keep them coming please.

Post edited at 21:08
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misterb 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

Good idea there are plenty of routes with no descriptions on the log books and we will all have plenty of time to update them i suspect

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Presley Whippet 22 Mar 2020
In reply to misterb:

Way off topic but that sounds like plagiarism by proxy. 

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LeeWood 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

In my opinion UKC would have deserved ctiticism had it -

posted an article 'Where to climb while covid-19 is on the loose'

posted The Top Climbs this week (... after legislation )

or Another 9b+ for Sampson Strong

BUT as the scenario has evolved UKC has been one step ahead slapping peoples wrists for logging climbs; The logbook system is after all automatic - keeping it online does not condone what goes in to it. 

Its barely a week since our new mentor Levi Yant proclaimed these unforgettable words in his resumé of virus risk:

'Climb outside. Go somewhere beautiful and remote.' Was that pure sadism - knowing that the outdoor scene was about to collapse or does he really know that there is ZERO risk outdoors ?!

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Tradical 22 Mar 2020
In reply to Presley Whippet:

The UK's paragliding cross country league has shut down with respect to the crisis.

http://www.xcleague.com/xc/index.php

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Blue Straggler 23 Mar 2020
In reply to teh_mark:

> doing things well within my abilities and not interacting with anyone at any point is a problem?

I am posting this after your publicly stated departure from the forums so obviously you won’t see it, but for the benefit of others who might be reading this:

it is quite possible to have an accident and injury whilst doing things well within your abilities, and to assume otherwise is infantile, arrogant and hubristic . I broke my ankle in a lead fall on a route “well within my abilities” 

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lithos 23 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

are you going to suspend the RF App? or extend the licence?

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Presley Whippet 23 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

Good to see the action has been taken. 

Enjoy your alternative hobbies of choice. 

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In reply to lithos:

> are you going to suspend the RF App? or extend the licence?

No, the app will continue as is. Judging by the increase in activity over the last week or two people are keen to keep their inspiration levels up.

Alan

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OliverR17 23 Mar 2020
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

I assume the Lifts and Partners area of the forum will also be closed?

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