UKC

A complete guide to climbing grades

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 Offwidth 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Martin Haworth:

Why are you copying this?  After a good start, the grade system descriptions are very short and over simplified and contain errors and being short could lead to potential misunderstanding. 

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Removed User 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Offwidth:

Plus the author seems to have shyed away from the murky depths of the UK and Scottish grading systems which removes most of the potential fun from the article!

In reply to Offwidth:

> Why are you copying this?  After a good start, the grade system descriptions are very short and over simplified and contain errors and being short could lead to potential misunderstanding. 

Grades and grading systems are often hotly debated on UKC, so I thought this article would spark some debate, not least the lack of inclusion of the UK trad grading system(except for in the chart).

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 Offwidth 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Martin Haworth:

I wish you said some of that with the link. I don't think debating poor quality work gets us very far.

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 Offwidth 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Removed User:

Given the content elsewhere if they had looked at those systems it might have been worthwhile linking for a good chuckle.

Removed User 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Offwidth:

On a more serious point there is some historical relevance (both in terms of rock climbing and winter mountaineering) I would have thought even if the UK is a bit of a backwater in terms of climbing globally.

Post edited at 11:13
 Shani 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Removed User:

> Plus the author seems to have shyed away from the murky depths of the UK and Scottish grading systems which removes most of the potential fun from the article!

Crucially, he's missed out Froggatt Edge!

In reply to Removed User:

> Plus the author seems to have shyed away from the murky depths of the UK and Scottish grading systems which removes most of the potential fun from the article!

Yes, he could have discussed the subtle precision of such grades as 'Mild Very Severe', which is three grades harder than 'Hard Very Difficult'.

 fred99 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

> Yes, he could have discussed the subtle precision of such grades as 'Mild Very Severe', which is three grades harder than 'Hard Very Difficult'.

Three grades ?

In between there are;  Mild Severe, Severe, and Hard Severe.

That makes Mild Very Severe FOUR grades harder than Hard Very Difficult.

 Ian Parsons 31 Aug 2021
In reply to fred99:

> Three grades ?

> In between there are;  Mild Severe, Severe, and Hard Severe.

> That makes Mild Very Severe FOUR grades harder than Hard Very Difficult.

Hah! You're forgetting that Mild Very Severe is, of course, easier than Hard Severe.

 Barrington 31 Aug 2021
In reply to Martin Haworth:

And no mention at all of "HVV" - Hard Very Vegitated.....

In reply to fred99:

> Three grades ?

> In between there are;  Mild Severe, Severe, and Hard Severe.

> That makes Mild Very Severe FOUR grades harder than Hard Very Difficult.

>

I'd completely forgotten about Mild Severe, to be honest. In my mind there's just Severe and Hard Severe. The way I always saw the grades was: Mod, Diff, (Hard Diff, maybe, but really the same as Mild V Diff), Mild V Diff, V Diff, Hard V Diff (same as Mild Severe), Severe, Hard Severe, Mild V S , VS, Hard VS [far too narrow, distinctions being made by e.g. 'low' or 'high in grade'], E1, E2, E3, etc, etc (which all work just fine). But there is a certain charm in O G Jones's wonderful old adjectival system ... which is about as nebulous as wine-tasting connoisseurship.

 fred99 01 Sep 2021
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

Easy to forget Mild Severes - there weren't a lot of them, and I don't see them in the more modern guidebooks. But a quirky little footnote to history.

And of course there's always the strange feature about HVD's that meant they frequently seemed harder than a lot of Severes - maybe because a number of them were (are) just plain awkward and thrutchy rather than requiring elegant climbing.

In reply to fred99:

... whereas Hard Severe seems much harder and is often a rather nasty grade, less 'friendly' than many Mild VSs ... ? 


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