/ Delicatessen Line

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Did Delicatessen (E2 5c) yesterday and took what I seemed to remember as the line from the last time I did it in 1988. However I notice that the BMC guide has it following a slightly lower line to reach the Debauchery stance.

https://www.ukclimbing.com/photos/dbpage.php?id=327896

The line we took fits with a E2 5b/c sort of grade. The lower one looked pretty thin on gear after you leave Lyme Cryme but was certainly climbable at around 5b/c. 

Can anyone remember the line they took?

Alan

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poeter210 - on 17 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

Did the lower one, but maybe climbing more on the wall slightly on the left of the line in the topo before stretching over right to the stance on Debauchery. I managed to get some good gear in to protect the moves up  (though i reckon you'd be in for a big swing if you missed or didn't place it) and it would be a fair old lob if you fluffed the easier moves above going to the stance. Felt pretty 5c ish to me but not particularly experienced at 5c.

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In reply to poeter210:

Thanks. Someone has emailed me with this confirmation as well. The higher line is probably closer to 5b which explains why I thought the 5c grade for this pitch was a bit over the top, however I can see that the lower line is probably more elegant, involves less of Lyme Cryme and is probably the original line.

I am a bit puzzled by the 5c for the traverse on the last pitch as well though since that certainly didn't feel anything like as hard as the '5c' crux of Darius which we finished up.

Overall I'd go for Delicatessen E2 5b, 5b, 5b going my higher way and splitting at the Lyme Cryme belay. May well be worth 5c though for what I suspect is the proper way on the middle pitch.

Alan

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GridNorth - on 17 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

It's a long, long time since I did it, 1971 ish, but I'm fairly certain I took the lower line and at that time I thought 5c seemed a reasonable grade.

Al

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Mike505 on 17 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

I completely missed the crux, I didn't traverse at the right point. Instead I continued up Lyme Crime then spotted the Debauchery stance below me, traversed right and then down climbed (Robert Brown?) to the ledge. Probs only 5b this way

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ashtond6 - on 18 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

I did the lower and it was the pitches crux seemed 5c. I thought the second pitch was always 5b but sustained

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Alkis - on 20 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

> I am a bit puzzled by the 5c for the traverse on the last pitch as well though since that certainly didn't feel anything like as hard as the '5c' crux of Darius which we finished up.

If that's the top crux of Darius, honestly, the "E3 6a" variation going straight up is easier... :-s

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In reply to Alkis:

> If that's the top crux of Darius, honestly, the "E3 6a" variation going straight up is easier... :-s

Interesting. It didn't 'look' easier last week when I was standing under it. Seemed to be a dearth of decent footholds and just the one good left-hand hold to get up on to grab the undercut. Above that there was nothing very substantial to go for. However I didn't try it since the left-hand method felt quite natural with regard to what we had climbed below. If Chris had put the bolt further to the left then the direct finish might never have existed!

Alan

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Pedro50 on 20 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

Didn't someone once famously say that you could climb anywhere on High Tor at 6a (or was it 6b?)

"What next a route in the shape of the first ascentionist's initials?" Crags mag I think. 

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Chris Craggs - on 20 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC

> If Chris had put the bolt further to the left then the direct finish might never have existed!

> Alan

I just enlarged the original hole, there had been a golo in there I think,

Chris

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ashtond6 - on 20 May 2019
In reply to Pedro50:

Quite a number of routes need a re-grade then....

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Pedro50 on 20 May 2019
In reply to Chris Craggs:

> I just enlarged the original hole, there had been a golo in there I think,

Indeed, "a decade-old bolt" as Paul Nunn elegantly put it. 

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Cake on 20 May 2019
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

I did it two years ago and both pitches felt like E2. I'm sure I took the lower line, going up a thin crack or line of weakness with not enough gear on hard moves to the belay. Then pitch 2 is 5b, but it's s scary traverse on incredibly rough rock. If you fall off, you'll bleed

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