UKC

Having climbed on many rock types and in quite a few locations reflecting back I feel like each rocktype has taught me different things about climbing and how to climb "real rock".

I was wondering the ukc collective thinks there is any rocktype, crag or area where if you climb there it will stand you in good stead to be a good climber all round on all other mediums. 

In reply to dinodinosaur:

For me, grit was the key. It forces you to climb with good technique, and with good technique everything else slots into place. After all you can't yard on a positive hold if there isn't a positive hold to yard on!

I'd imagine a lot of granite would be similarly good, and rock types which tend to have positive holds (limestone, gneiss, etc) might be less good for developing good technique and trust in the feet.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

I'm in Finland at the moment, and was thinking how lucky we are in the UK. Here, I was orienteering in granite boulder terrain in the centre of the country. I drove for four hours, and this morning bouldered on granite near the coast. Lots of lovely lakes and forest, but geology could never have been developed as a science here.

Climbing on volcanic could never prepare you for granite slabs, and routes in the mountains don't give you the skills that you need for tidal sea-cliffs. The only things that we are missing in the UK are multi-day mega-long routes, and (yes please) easy overhanging tufa and stalactites.

I personally did my 'Learn to Climb' course in Cornwall ..... Sennen and Chair Ladder certainly tick a lot of boxes, but you need to travel the country to develop your skills on all rock-types.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

In the UK there is only place where you know you have won first prize in the lottery for newbie climbers and that's to be born within chucking distance of Lancashire quarried grit. Steep, pleasingly small edges and satisfyingly deep handjams. After 20 years honing my technique on the county's gems I reached the dizzying heights of becoming a reasonably competent severe leader. At other times I slummed it on granite, limestone, rhyolite and that funny stuff they have at Gogarth.

In reply to Ann S:

Is that a bit like living near the Peak, but crap?

In reply to dinodinosaur:

My vote goes to Font, often nicknamed the laboratory of movement and with good reason, it requires balance, precision, flexibility and core strength. Friction or crimpy slabs, slopers, techy walls, roofs with heel and toe hooks, chimneys, you name it. Admittedly it's a bit lacking in jam cracks, though there's a few gems here and there; I've even managed to train ringlocks and inverted offwidth (OK, on only one problem each...).

In reply to dinodinosaur:

I'm not sure you can learn to climb on one type of rock by climbing on another. Each type will make you good at one thing or another, jamming, crimping, smearing..

In a broader sense though climbing on particular crags can make you a better climber. I remember a contemporary of Dave Cuthbertson telling me that Cubby became he is after spending a summer climbing at Creagdubh. Why? Because it's steep, bold climbing on big pitches. You need to be able to place gear properly then run it out in intimidating situations. 

It teaches your head, not your body.

In reply to Jon Stewart:

Come on John, all those Saturday trips out, ‘where are we going?’, ‘Lancashire quarry youth’

the stuff dreams are made of 😍

In reply to Jon Stewart:

Now now young Jon. I know up in Kendal you're a bit short of decent rock, but check this out for a bit of inspiration and pay us a visit some time. 😊  (All the newbies will be peddling like mad in Wilton 3.)

   https://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/destinations/lancashire-32

In reply to Jon Stewart:

Admittedly, man made holes in the ground don't have the greatest aesthetics but as long as plenty of people keep thinking like this I'll continue to have a super chilled time doing quality routes without queueing 🙂

In reply to Ann S:

One day we drove for 2 hours to a rated Lancashire quarry, and a feast of 3* VSs. Enthusiasm waned slightly when my mate (who, to be fair, is quite tall) realised he could reach the top of the first route we looked at still standing on the ground.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

Nay-that must have been the one next to the landfill site, while they were filling it in. Or did he stand on the rubber tires at Brownstones?

In reply to dinodinosaur:

How about Glen Torridon, especially if you allow the inclusion of Diabaig just round the corner?

In reply to andrew ogilvie:

Good luck learning to climb in the 3 weeks per year the crags are actually in condition!

In reply to dinodinosaur:

As I understand it, North Wales has the most rock types in the smallest area.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

Southern sandstone is where I learnt to climb. Steep, rounded, holds covered in sand and sloping. Friction promised but often not delivered. It is a tough school if you try to progress to 6a without going anywhere else for a sense of perspective.

Grit makes absolute sense after a sandstone apprenticeship, rhyolites seem tractable, granites similar. For me, hard, steep limestone never made any sense after I learned to move on sandstone and I’ve avoided it ever since.

In reply to Ann S:

I started at Den Lane so I know where you're coming from. Unfortunately it's in the wrong county.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

Pexhill teaches you precise footwork and gives you strong fingers and a new definition on what might be called a hold. 

All else, including jamming, is mere detail.

T.

Though possibly with nicer scenery. 

In reply to Tom Valentine:

I think I once enjoyed a visit to Den Lane but can’t find it recorded in my log book. 

In reply to tehmarks:

I'd say you are correct. I met up with a guy in Squamish last year who had redpointed 5.13 (french 7c+) sport in the Rockies. He was new to trad, so I thought I'd be able to help him while he was still a trad punter (knowing he'd probably eclipse me in a matter of hours). The first route was a steep 5.10c (somewhere E1 5b / E2 5c) finger crack, climbed with ringlocks - I've perhaps never heard someone huff and puff so hard! He did manage it though.
But then it was his turn to lead a 5.8 (VS) trad crack. He was required to smear on some slab while laybacking for about 2 hand moves - this was not the crux of the route (this part was probably only S/HS). He vacillated for about 5 minutes, before asking to rest on the gear, re-collected his courage and then finally trying the move (which he managed).

In reply to dinodinosaur:

Fun thread. 

My answer to the OP would be Yosemite. 

Amazing climbing from low grades. If you can climb hard cracks, run out slabs, exposed multi pitch walls and bolted steep stuff then you could easily adapt to anything else worldwide. 

In reply to dinodinosaur:

My outdoor climbing journey began in quarries in Leicestershire, which at the time (probably still) we’re very loose. Because of this I feel I learnt to climb on loose rock quite well and many people I have climbed with since haven’t developed this skill to a degree they seem happy with it.

I feel it’s a skill worth knowing, though hopefully not something you have to pull out of the tool kit everyday.

I also rate Bram Crag Quarry as a great place to learn about people’s own bodies and weird ways to move. There are only a few harder routes but even still a lot of the climbs still involve thought and technique, especially in comparison to the same grades on climbing indoors for example.

A friend who’s been climbing just over 6 months has spent a lot of time there, she’s developed great technique and bodily awareness from it.

Not a great place to learn or practice, intentionally or not about falling off though. It also doesn’t teach you to crank or yard, I’ve found limestone better to pull really hard on stuff.

In reply to Emilio Bachini: surely the main lesson to be learnt at bram would be how to pull really really gently on the holds , how to place your feet really really gently , how to  lower off ...you've got it ... really really gently, If one doesn't learn these things quickly  it likely to be a  very short learning curve.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

One place? For me that would be any place with easy access to as many different rock types and motivated skillfull people to enjoy the rocks with. 

Climbing some grit, some limestone, some other stuff as well for me is crucial for long term development. Different rock types will polish different techniques in your arsenal. Grit slabs and vertical walls are excellent for trusting those feet on nothing, and grit bouldering develops your strength in a pretty specific way. It's a full body workout involving loads of heels and body tension!

Limestone on the other hand kinda teaches you to climb incredibly accurately and place your feet on tiny tiny edges and push off them to the next hold. Any innacuracy and you could be off! It also develops your crimp strength like nothing else Also climbing with a good pace and planning your resting on a route is a much overlooked tactic that is crucial for steep limestone.

Conglomerate makes you trust pebbles and really hits that open strength when you climb on pockets on overhanging ground.

Changing your venues also significantly decreased your chance of finger injury as the stress on your body varies quite a lot with the rock type. 

In reply to Pursued by a bear:

Yep, Pex is a great place to get fit, develop strong fingers and hone wall climbing technique. It all transfers brilliantly to grit and rhyolite - a useful tip given to me as a tyro was 'if you get into trouble on a big wall - think Pex!' There is a view that Pex doesn't transfer so well to steep limestone but the success of ex pekkies on Yorkshire/Peak hard stuff such as Tony Mitchell and John Hart belie this.

In reply to Pekkie:

I was recently reclimbing some routes I'd done 45 years ago when, thanks in part to Pex, I had pretty strong fingers; I don't now.  I was again reminded that basically that's all climbing is about. Strong fingers. 

In reply to mike123:

I've climbed there once, got to a bulgy part, found a nice positive hold, got my feet high, pulled hard... Then the hold came of right in my hand, I ended up upside down, back to the wall about half way down the wall.  Most serious fall I've ever had. Shook me right up but some kind fellas there gave me a drink of their coffee.

It did teach me one thing though.  My head hit the rock pretty hard but I was wearing my helmet so no harm done.  I used to sometimes wear my helmet, after that I always do.  

In reply to pasbury:

Plus 1 for Southern Sandstone. If you can climb well on that, you'll find other rock types a lot more benign. The downside is that, unless you solo it, it won't prepare you for leading, and/or dealing with exposure.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

North Wales probably. You've got mountains, sea cliffs, crags, scrambles, multi-pitch, single pitch, trad, sport, bouldering, rhyolite, slate, dolerite, quartzite, slabs, steep, face-climbs, corners, etc.

To teach solid technique then I'd imagine grit/southern sandstone would work best but stick someone who's only climbed grit on a tidal ledge in Pembroke and see how they get on...

In reply to Trangia:

True but I remember trying 4c on Stanage after top roping Pigs Nose or 5b in the Pass after the Niblick and finding them technically rather easy so at least I could concentrate on the gear a bit more. Stamina was often more of a problem on longer pitches.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

I'm not sure I've really learnt to climb yet, but the Lakes are very good for improving...

- hill fitness
- route finding
- ability to find gear/place fiddly gear
- rope work
- the challenges of routes on imposing crags away from the outcrops and valleys
- dealing with less than ideal conditions

As well as for developing a good repertoire of different moves of different rock features.  Not least because, though you can (as the Lakeland Revial lot put it) get "high and wild", you're never really that far away from a good pub - so it's quite a friendly environment, despite being daunting to begin with.

Finally, it's a good place for learning to really appreciate climbing as an aesthetic, intellectual and imaginative experience. 

In reply to pasbury:

That was often my problem, particularly at Boulder Ruckle, Swanage, where due to the overhanging nature of the cliff I would be leading close to my limit, not due to the technical grades (VS or HVS) but a gradual and increasingly scary loss of strength in my arms. This could become dangerous when I kept going too far above the last bit of gear, because I hadn't the strength to stop and make a one armed placement. Bad I know, and a result of a lack of regular climbing/training, much of this during the pre - indoor wall era, when work intervened.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

any very good climbing/bouldering gym.

Exhibit A: Alex Megos.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

U tube. Watching brave Dave😎

In reply to Ann S:

I was thinking of you the other day! You taught me loads on one of my first days out climbing at a UKC meet. Hope you’re well. 

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

hello Yanis-that's really nice of you to say that. I see you lead HVS-I wish I had taught myself as well as that. I'm keeping well myself but haven't been able to climb for over two years as I'm tied up looking after elderly mum. I hope you are getting out loads and enjoy this summer. 😊

In reply to dinodinosaur:

Hard to beat living in Sheffield, regardless of the available rock.

I say this because in my experience having your own transport is just a bonus, with so may crags pretty much on a bus route, so if you're young, starting out with limited cash you can still get out on rock at every opportunity.

In reply to Ann S:

I’m sorry you’re not getting out more but fair play for looking after your mum. I’m getting out loads thanks - cycling!

In reply to mike123:

Because of the looseness of the rock?

If so, maybe a trip South will broaden horizons of rock quality. Hey, you could even go carry on and climb some chalk in Surrey/Kent/Sussex. 

In reply to dinodinosaur:

I'd say Pembroke

In reply to dinodinosaur:

An area with high youth unemployment and a reasonably generous welfare system. 

There is a reason Oliana has more hard routes than the whole of the US.

In reply to dinodinosaur:

The obvious answer is Dumbarton Rock, the basalt there polishes to a glass like sheen within a few goes and means that only perfection will allow progress. You either have the hold, or you're off. Your foot is in the right place with the right angle and the right weight, or you're off. Immaculate place.