UKC

/ Over hand knot in bottom rope set up .

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discosucks - on 16 Apr 2018

At the weekend I was out with out club doing a bottom roping day for new members . And I noticed members from the club doing something iv never done in my set ups . 

The typical set up is 2/3 stakes , static rope going over the edge , a master point ( maybe a double bunny ears ) and two locking crabs which the climbing rope runs through . 

However the others were adding a over hand knot maybe 2 meters back from the edge and then placing those two strands over the edge .  Iv never done this so asked why they do it . They said it was how they were shown in the SPA training . I'm not spa trained . 

The reason they gave for it is so both stands of rope go over at the same place , and that perhaps this is easier to protect from Sharpe edges . 

Iv never done this and it seems to add more unnecessary complexity to the system .

Other points I was thinking about were .

1 : sometimes having two strands coming from different orientations could be good , if one part of the cliff is sharp , protect that side and if the other side is not , don't project it .  

2 : tying the over hand knot closer back increases the angle of the system , in some cases I seen at the weekend the angle on there system was close to 80/90 degree's where it would have been more like 50/60 degrees if they had not used the over hand . 

3 : Adjusting the system to move route takes longer and adds more faffing about . 

My question is should I be using their method or is there anything wrong with what I'm doing ? 

 

jkarran - on 16 Apr 2018
In reply to discosucks:

> 1 : sometimes having two strands coming from different orientations could be good , if one part of the cliff is sharp , protect that side and if the other side is not , don't project it .  

Best to always protect the rope and that's generally easier if it runs over the edge in one place though obviously it's possible to protect multiple strands. If one of your V shaped strands running over the edge abrades and breaks (pretty much the only way ropes fail) there could be a big swing. With the knot forming the V back from the edge that's very unlikely. That said the ropes shouldn't be rubbing with either set up!

> 2 : tying the over hand knot closer back increases the angle of the system , in some cases I seen at the weekend the angle on there system was close to 80/90 degree's where it would have been more like 50/60 degrees if they had not used the over hand . 

True but still plenty strong enough either way.

> 3 : Adjusting the system to move route takes longer and adds more faffing about . 

Potentially.

> My question is should I be using their method or is there anything wrong with what I'm doing ? 

It has its uses. It's not one or the other, it's picking the most appropriate rigging for each route/task. Stick the idea in the box of tools you have for solving rigging problems then use it when needed.

jk

bpmclimb on 16 Apr 2018
In reply to discosucks:

A second, higher knot is useful when you want the two ropes to run parallel down a groove in the cliff edge (when the groove is deep the ropes are likely to end up that way whether you want it or not).

jezb1 - on 16 Apr 2018
In reply to discosucks:

Most RCI (new name for SPA) course providers, like myself, will show a variety of ways of setting stuff and make it clear that there are many safe ways of achieving the same outcome.

What you describe certainly works well in certain situations. I wouldn't say one overhand adds much in the way in terms of complication

discosucks - on 16 Apr 2018

Nice one lads !! clears that up


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