Any info on how long Covid virus remains on various rock types?
No, the scientists have more important things on their plate.
Your being hysterical, if you want to climb go, otherwise stay on the couch.
Just asking!
From what I heard on the radio copper destroys viruses like flu. Perhaps you could try climbing above Coniston. Crags up there might be safer?
Possibly more than 24 but less than 72 hours.
Research has shown definitively that around the roaches it stays for eternity. So best everyone avoids climbing there from now on.
It doesn't spread easily via surfaces - that's the latest CDC advice, take some sanitizer but the chance of the person having used that hold recently are so remote I'd not be concerned. Just avoid putting hands in your mouth as usual.
Hell crack at Stanage might be a bad idea though, I don't fancy grinding the skin that coats the inside of the crack into my hands right now!
> Hell crack at Stanage might be a bad idea though
Was it ever a good idea? I'm sure I still carry the scars, 33 years after doing it.
T.
> Research has shown definitively that around the roaches it stays for eternity. So best everyone avoids climbing there from now on.
Actually, the research stated clearly 'forever and a day'. Please stop peddling falsehood.
gritstone jamming was never a good idea - esp at Black Rocks or higgar !
Better than gritstone laybacking!
Except that Hell Crack (VS 4c) is much easier if at the start, you layback the right hand of the pair of cracks.
But, on Hell Crack you have to use a good but painful jam for the crux move over the overhang. Painful because there's a big crystal that digs into the back of your hand and can draw blood. IIRC. So I'd avoid that.
The only place that is safe to climb at the moment is Horseshoe quarry as even the Covid hates it and won't go there.
I'm going to have to go back and do it sometime to remind myself because I don't remember having to jam on the first overhang bit (and I quite like jamming).
> Any info on how long Covid virus remains on various rock types?
No one knows but it should be noted that the tests on various surfaces were for how long it's still detectable in a lab, not how long it is still viable for an transmissionable dose.
I'm real life conditions I suspect the odds of catching from a surface someone else has touched outdoors is extremely slim unless you're licking holds someone just sneezed on.
Also I find having chalk on your hands significantly reduces the likelihood of putting your hands in your mouth. So really if you want to go climbing I'd go, the risk from surface contact is likely insignificant.
> It doesn't spread easily via surfaces - that's the latest CDC advice, take some sanitizer but the chance of the person having used that hold recently are so remote I'd not be concerned. Just avoid putting hands in your mouth as usual.
Except that if you're seconding or doing the same sport route fo example there's every chance that the same holds will be used! What the transmission risk is? Dunno - not huge I suspect
> Also I find having chalk on your hands significantly reduces the likelihood of putting your hands in your mouth. So really if you want to go climbing I'd go, the risk from surface contact is likely insignificant.
While Trad climbing I found it almost impossible not to use my mouth as a third hand when in tricky situations trying to place gear.
If you are going to catch Covid, you are going to catch Covid. You will probably pass/toutch more infected surfaces on your way to your chosen route than you ever will by playing on that route.
Perhaps the continuing dry weather and Covid threat will see renewed interest in some remoter, more esoteric, mountain crags well away from roadside honeypots?
I didn't jam Hell Crack the first few times either and I quite like jams. The jamming way is a bit harder in my view.
The BMC reported that initial US research indicates the virus doesn't last very long in direct sunlight.
A news report of the source is here:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/inside-secret-dhs-lab-testing-how-long...
"What we have found so far is that sunlight seems to be very detrimental to the virus,” Dabisch explained. “And so within minutes, the majority of the virus is inactivated on surfaces and in the air in direct sunlight.”
I think you and Mike have no right to tick Hell Crack if you have not done it properly...
Sounds like I'll have to do it twice and compare😁, question is do I jam first and then layback, or the other way round?
There was a report on the News today that you are 18 times safer outside compared to inside.
I think it comes from this study which we've known about for 6 weeks.
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.02.28.20029272v2
From HuffPost:
"Exposure to sunshine has been identified as one way of killing off the virus quickly. A study published in The Journal of Infectious Diseases found that 90% of coronavirus particles deactivated within 10 minutes when exposed to ultraviolet light from the midday sun.
Researchers simulated the intensity of the sun at 40 degrees latitude – roughly equivalent to Spain – and then examined viral particles in saliva left on surfaces.
In conditions mimicking the winter sun in Spain, 90% of particles were destroyed in less than 15 minutes, while in conditions simulating summer sun, the virus lasted 6.8 minutes, the Times reported. It had previously been suggested that the virus could last on surfaces for up to 72 hours, so this is quite the reduction.
It’s not the temperature that kills the virus (the World Health Organisation says the virus spreads in both hot and cold climates), rather the ultraviolet light. "
> From HuffPost:
> "Exposure to sunshine has been identified as one way of killing off the virus quickly. A study published in The Journal of Infectious Diseases found that 90% of coronavirus particles deactivated within 10 minutes when exposed to ultraviolet light from the midday sun.
> Researchers simulated the intensity of the sun at 40 degrees latitude – roughly equivalent to Spain – and then examined viral particles in saliva left on surfaces.
So 10 minutes in the midday sun in Spain will dactivate it. That'll be about three years in Scotland then?
Mountain crags are in Scotland (banned), Wales (banned) or the Lakes (sort of banned by the locals)... With the weather like it is, I’d normally he’d somewhere like Cloggy and it would actually be busy there. The Welsh Government has other ideas...
The other issue is we are limited to day trips at the moment. In theory I could go to the Lakes but that’s a lot of driving in one day and a mountain day out is always a long day even without the drive.
Yes but on a serious point I wonder whether the exceptionally sunny spring and the long days with the sun about as high as it will get now are helping.
That's amazingly good news. I think I'm right in thinking that there's a still a lot of UV light when it's overcast, so this will not just depend on direct sunlight. ???
I've climbed it three different ways so I guess two don't count. I tried the jam onsight but it didn't feel sensible for movement. I've evilly jammed plenty of cracks described as laybacks and vice-versa.
> Research has shown definitively that around the roaches it stays for eternity. So best everyone avoids climbing there from now on.
Nice try.
Hate to be a Debby Downer, but I think y'all might be asking and answering the wrong question.
Transmission via surfaces seems to be a low risk---and more and more evidence suggests a very low risk. The main mode of transmission is via inhaled virus particles. So if you have an infected but so far asymptomatic leader above you, breathing hard, then you might be standing in a veritable shower of droplets and aerosols for what? half an hour? I don't think any outdoor analysis has even considered what happens when one person is directly above another person like this for a considerable time. So who knows whether this is bad and if so, how bad?
If you are going to pick up the virus from a surface, it is as likely to be the rope as the the rock, as the rope will be hanging below Typhoid Mary as she huffs and puffs her way upward. This suggests that the moment to apply that 70%+ alcohol hand sanitizer you've got in your chalk bag pocket is when the second arrives and the entire rope has just run through the belayer's hands.
Maybe the leader should be masked to mitigate the deluge on those below and the belayer and any spectators might be well-advised to stay off to the side. Diagonal routes or ones that begin with a traverse off the belay take on a new unanticipated luster.
yes but you're talking as if aerosol droplets are lead weights. If the leader is<= 2m above you then this argument holds some weight - otherwise the slightest puff of wind will carry it all away.
So - crags exposed to sunlight and wind - both helpful
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