UKC

/ Rockfall: Castle Rock of Triermain

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JFraser123 - on 10 Mar 2018

Hi Folks,

@ Castle Rock of Triermain

Whilst descending off South Crag yesterday we watched a large rockfall clatter down North Crag. Looked like it initiated high up on the far right of the crag, near where the trees start. Not sure of the exact size but several microwave sized blocks made it all the way down the the culvert, with several others stopping earlier.

Probably just par for the course in the thawing weather, but thought it might be useful info for some. 

Definitely not the large detached section above NCE though. 

Triermain
Route Adjuster on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to JFraser123:

Slightly worrying if this is farther right than the big detached block as those areas are currently considered 'safe' to climb.  Doesn't sound like a helmet would have been much use.

 

Rog Wilko on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to JFraser123:

 

> Probably just par for the course in the thawing weather, but thought it might be useful info for some. 

Glad you weren't intimately involved (with the rockfall, I mean). Thanks for the post, a useful reminder of the greater risk after very cold weather.

Michael Hood - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to JFraser123: there will be nothing micro about the size of any blocks when the bit above NCE goes

 

Rick Graham on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to JFraser123:

I drive past quite a bit ATM.

Will have a look through a telescope to see where the blocks originated.

My guess is at the last pitch to the top of Angels Highway/  Harlots Face, we will see.

Jon Stewart - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to Route Adjuster:

> Slightly worrying if this is farther right than the big detached block as those areas are currently considered 'safe' to climb.  Doesn't sound like a helmet would have been much use.

Meh. No one's going to be climbing there in the depths of winter. And those routes are a little bit loose, some of the big flakes have always been a touch on the scary side. Nothing like as shit as somewhere like Lower Falcon though - now that's what I call a chosspile!

6
MFB - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to Jon Stewart:

Falcon - brilliant crag, Weather - balmy

 

1
Jon Stewart - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to MFB:

> Falcon - brilliant crag, Weather - balmy

Haha. Whether Falcon is brilliant or not is subjective, but we can agree on the objective fact that it is falling down. And yes, today I was indeed out it a t-shirt.

3
MFB - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to Jon Stewart:

It's a bit adventurous,

teeshirt, careful, where you get today

Jon Stewart - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to MFB:

just walking up on the coniston fells, beautiful day!

MFB - on 11 Mar 2018
In reply to Jon Stewart:

Cracking day, raven quite busy

Dave Cumberland - on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to Rick Graham:

Rick, have emailed you.

DC

JFraser123 - on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to Rick Graham:

Let us know what you find Rick! Think it might've been to the right of the tops of those.

Dave Cumberland - on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to JFraser123:

Can you be any more specific about the location in relation to Final Giggle, Drag, Angels Highway? I had a look yesterday but could not see anything.

DC

Trevor Langhorne on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to Dave Cumberland:

The dangerous area is in the region of the upper half of North Crag Eliminate/Overhanging Bastion/Side of the Hill etc. The area that is moving is the size of a Bungalow and will be a spectacular event when it goes. In theory the likes of Angel's Highway should be far enough to the right of the fallout area but the choice of whether or not to climb there is up to the individual. Personally I wouldn't climb on or walk under the N Crag, in fact I wouldn't like to live in one of the houses below the crag.

I have started a new thread with more detailed information.

 

Rog Wilko on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to Trevor Langhorne:

>   in fact I wouldn't like to live in one of the houses below the crag.

I've been thinking that for while, Trevor. I don't think the leat feeding the reservoir will stop anything that big. I wonder how effective the trees might be at bringing that tonnage to a halt.

 

Dave Cumberland - on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to Rog Wilko:

This is the real and present danger for the houses below if one of those bigger blocks gets on a roll:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5SiQqSroIw

Gordon Stainforth - on 12 Mar 2018
In reply to Dave Cumberland:

There's a very strong case, surely, for the Council/National Park/BMC getting together and 'enabling' this inevitable rock fall (with very minor explosives) in the middle of the night, with roads closed as necessary, etc.??

Michael Hood - on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth instead of explosives how about using various hydraulic Jacks

 

Gordon Stainforth - on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to Michael Hood:

Whatever is reckoned to be simplest and best by qualified engineers.

summo on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

> There's a very strong case, surely, for the Council/National Park/BMC getting together and 'enabling' this inevitable rock fall (with very minor explosives) in the middle of the night, with roads closed as necessary, etc.??

Better to do it during the day and with the houses vacated. But yes, if there is a risk to the houses it must be safer to send it on it's way sooner rather than later unexpectedly.

Resources can be in place ready to clear the roads, fix the water course etc.. 

charliesdad - on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to summo: unfortunately our “litigation culture” gets in the way of practical steps like that; any organisation which took steps to solve the problem would face huge costs, because they’d need to guarantee it was totally safe, and/or have almost unlimited insurance cover for every bizarre outcome which a risk assessment identifies; “but what if the rock bounces upward and destroys a jumbo jet full of sick children and puppies?”

 

pasbury on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to Dave Cumberland:

Boulders delivered to (or through) your door!

Dave Cumberland - on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to charliesdad:

Notices have been posted by the landowner and the BMC, although I'm not sure whether they are all fully visible at the moment. So in principle they are legally covered, although the situation with the residents could be more complex.

Interfering with the natural process would have serious legal implications and could have unintended consequences, so I think that is a pretty stupid suggestion. The movement has been monitored for 6 years. It has been a one-way process, that has just speeded up rapidly. At some point it will fail. It is likely to be unpredictable, surprising and sudden.

Prediction would be possible with proper continuous strain gauges, telemetry and a warning system as on railway lines and other slopes, but no one has shown any urgent interest in doing this yet.

I think there are one or two large boulders in the vicinity above the houses, so there is nothing new about the current situation. We live on a dynamic earth where this kind of event is normal. A six-foot boulder at the foot of Via Media tipped over just a few years ago, as Tommy Cooper said, "just like that".

DC

Rick Graham on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to Rick Graham:

> I drive past quite a bit ATM.

> Will have a look through a telescope to see where the blocks originated.

Had a look tonight on the way past, unfortunately at last light.

Only obvious newly exposed roots / rock was at the left hand end of the ledge where Ted Cheasby finishes about 40 metres off the deck.

This will affect access to the ledge at the top of pitch two of Harlots Face.

This event appears to be tree root related and independent of the BIG block at the top of NCE.

 

 

 

summo on 13 Mar 2018
In reply to charliesdad:

> unfortunately our “litigation culture” gets in the way of practical steps like that; any organisation which took steps to solve the problem would face huge costs, because they’d need to guarantee it was totally safe, and/or have almost unlimited insurance cover for every bizarre outcome which a risk assessment identifies; “but what if the rock bounces upward and destroys a jumbo jet full of sick children and puppies?”

No kittens?

If I lived there I might be tempted to visit it in the dead of night with a big jack. If you sleep 8hrs a day, perhaps 12hrs daily in your house as a minimum, those aren't the best odds of being out when it goes.

1
JFraser123 - on 18 Mar 2018
In reply to Rick Graham:

Cheers Rick,

That could well be the area as I didn't see the fall start, only saw it after the first loud bang as it hit a high ledge.

 

Joe


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