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I know what I think, but it would be interesting to see if there is another that might be even harder, that is , what is the single hardest gully climb in Britain. Perhaps the hardest in Wales , the Lakes and Scotland. My contender is E1 5b!
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
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In reply to wilkie14c:
> Classic rock’s Great gully
> VD 6a
Which is the 6a pitch? Not in any of my guides. Is the new Carnedds guide out yet?
In reply to Sean Kelly:
they are all 6a if you get the conditions right (or wrong)
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
This is probably the answer for winter - West Central Gully (VII 8)
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In reply to wilkie14c:
Which great gully is that?
In reply to Michael Gordon:
Probably followed by Raven's Gully on the Buachaille (from what I've heard) and Great Overhanging Gully on Beinn Bhan (which is a tough VI).
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
> That's cheating John!
Of course it's cheating; it's in the name! Having said that, there are some miserable dislikers lurking here!
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Clashhooks Gully, Helsby. Went up it twice in my running shoes this weekend. Second time had to advice a family of four to retreat whilst they still had chance. Greasier than Cecil Parkinson in his prime.
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Hi Tor Gully in rain,solo.vertical mud,almost no solid handholds.Soloed easier e5's
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In reply to steveriley:
Haha. I did this with my sons (4,7,10) last winter and I wet my pants.
They liked it though.
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Minus One Gully on Ben Nevis hasn't been climbed direct, it looks about E3.
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Surely it's mam tor gully when wet, unfrozen choss?
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
When this has been discussed before the conclusion is usually Surgeon's Gully (V 5) which has possibly not been climbed in full yet.
Do we count things like Chocolate Blancmange Gully (none)?
In reply to Sean Kelly:
Probably one still unclimbed but is well known such as Gully A on Cir Mhor, Arran.
In reply to Misha:
Raven's on the Buchaille should get VI (6) for the Original version in my opinion - it's considerably harder than Smith's Gully or Eagle Ridge for instance - especially the final off width. However, being a route that isn't "in" that often, I imagine it's probably thinner than it used to be in the good old days. Goodness what the Direct should be - we backed off it at the point it turns into a wide smooth sided chimney - (apparently you have to bridge this - but that looked desperate). It felt like VI (6) up to that point, so I imagine VII. A 4 star route though - especially the Original. The Direct felt out of keeping as the 2 pitches it comprises are almost entirely on rock.
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In reply to climber34neil:
> Surely it's mam tor gully when wet, unfrozen choss?
Central Gully on Pen y Fan is similar fair, only twice the size. Did it in summer conditions with crampons and ice axes once.
In reply to Sean Kelly:
The answer is West Central Gully.
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Has Inaccessible Gully (Dove) had any Summer ascents of late? Pokey for a winter route, I always thought
In reply to Sean Kelly:
> I know what I think, but it would be interesting to see if there is another that might be even harder
Not in the UK, but Low's Gully on Mt. Kinabalu looks desperate:
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/flouting-the-law-of-the-jungle-they-br...
In reply to Greenbanks:
> Has Inaccessible Gully (Dove) had any Summer ascents of late? Pokey for a winter route, I always thought
Saw it in the seventies when fully iced up and it looked as it should have been about grade 4 , being beginners we did South Gully in great iced up condition. Did Inaccessible Gully a few years back, it was thin and poorly iced and felt like a 5/6.
In reply to paul mitchell:
I was going to say Mam Tor Gully after two weeks of rain, but yeah. XS for sure.
The grisly tale if anyone cares to read.
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1DhNXPaGtkncP7d_3xdEVpFlaiu_We-kUPVd2GAF...
Post edited at 17:58
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Most of you are ppi**ing in the wind on this one. We are talking summer grade, not winter. and harder than E1 5b. Everything I have checked against the guidebook grade and does not measure up. If we recall our history and realise that it was the ascent of gullies that kick-started the sport in this country, mainly because they followed the easier line and not so exposed. But there must be something out there that should a mid 'E' grade!
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In reply to David Alcock:
I think the only people who ever climb Mam Tor Gully solo it when they are pissed off. It's what I did as well.
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Does XS = E1 5b = E5 4a?
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In reply to d_b:
Yeah, I'm sure it's a bigger club than we'd guess.
In reply to Jon Stewart:
Rubble is a fault line, not a gully.
In reply to Misha:
I kind of get what you're saying but given that many gullies are expressions of erosion on fault lines, I suspect that the point you're trying to make needs wording differently if it is to be understood without any confusion.
T.
In reply to Sean Kelly:
> Most of you are ppi**ing in the wind on this one. We are talking summer grade, not winter. and harder than E1 5b
Isn't the answer still going to be Surgeon's Gully complete? Or does that not count because it's possible not been done yet?
I'm guessing the one you have in mind is Central Gully Direct (E1 5b)
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
This is the point I was making. Gully A has been inspected by some historical figures for over a century only to back off. The first easy pitch has been climbed only to back off at the main chamber. The climb next to it April arete was climbed to inspect gully A and the subsequent winter ascent was the same. It might be we will need to wait until the next ice age. Grade impossible at present.
In reply to Stephen Reid - Needle Sports:
> Raven's on the Buchaille should get VI (6) for the Original version in my opinion - it's considerably harder than Smith's Gully or Eagle Ridge for instance - especially the final off width. However, being a route that isn't "in" that often, I imagine it's probably thinner than it used to be in the good old days. Goodness what the Direct should be - we backed off it at the point it turns into a wide smooth sided chimney - (apparently you have to bridge this - but that looked desperate). It felt like VI (6) up to that point, so I imagine VII. A 4 star route though - especially the Original. The Direct felt out of keeping as the 2 pitches it comprises are almost entirely on rock.
Hmm, I had a look, in summer, way back when we went up Ravens Edge (which is lovely) and it did look desperate, can imagine it being even more deperate in winter.
Have the Minus gullies been climbed in summer?
In reply to Pids:
Minus 1 is HVS and the Direct is VS if memory serves me correct.
It's just incredible to think that we have grooves, corners, walls and cracks that are all in the high E numbers but nothing harder than E1 for a gully since 1938, although it all depends exactly what is defined as a gully.!
Then again we might just have some Fowler horrendously loose nightmare down here in the SW that is unrecorded!
Post edited at 15:38
In reply to Sean Kelly:
> Minus 1 is HVS and the Direct is VS if memory serves me correct.
As I wrote yesterday Minus One Gully Direct has not been climbed, there is a very large overhang that looks about E3.
In reply to Pursued by a bear:
> I kind of get what you're saying but given that many gullies are expressions of erosion on fault lines, I suspect that the point you're trying to make needs wording differently if it is to be understood without any confusion.>
I think we all know what a chimney is. Gullies to my mind are wider and less steep, with the hard ones having short steeper bits in them, WCG on Beinn Eighe being a good example of this. A fault can be anything - crack, dyke, chimney, groove, gully etc etc.
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In reply to Michael Gordon:
Fuselage Gully on Beinn Eighe. Probably my contender for scariest summer gully. When it's dry it's a funnel for all the shattered rock above. Scary.
In reply to Sean Kelly:
Not that incredible. Gullies by their nature aren’t that suitable for summer rock climbing. There are some steep ones around with large chockstones etc but a lot of them will be entirely unappealing for rock climbing and the difficulties often aren’t that great anyway in the modern scheme of things.
In reply to JohnBson:
Things like No.3 Gully on the Ben are good examples of something nice and straightforward in winter which then becomes a total death trap in summer (OK that probably applies to most winter gullies!). Quite why anyone would do No.3 in summer is another question entirely.
In reply to Sean Kelly:
The answer depends on when it stops being a gully and starts being a chimney.
If you tilted Hung, Drawn & Quartered (Summer) (E3 6a) back to a lesser angle you could definitely call it a gully.
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In reply to Michael Gordon:
Fuselage Gully in summer was an adventure. A repeat would not be advised Maybe would be a good grade. No harder than 4a for a single move but with torso size blocks trundling down.
In reply to Colin Moody:
> As I wrote yesterday Minus One Gully Direct has not been climbed, there is a very large overhang that looks about E3.
My apologies. I got that grades wrong. MOGD is down on this website and the SMC guide as E1 5b with about a dozen ascents recorded. But is the Gully different to Minus One Direct? The photos on it show that it is certainly no gully, well not in the obvious sense.
In reply to Sean Kelly:
No way does that refer to the gully. Hard to imagine it's ever had more than one or two ascents!
In reply to Sean Kelly:
Minus One Direct is on Minus One Buttress (the buttress to the left of Minus One Gully) it is a three star E1.
Minus One Gully was climbed in 1958 but the direct line was avoided and a few points of aid were used.
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In reply to Sean Kelly:
Has to be Raven's Gully on The Buachaille. Horrible, wet chockstones with unhelpful holds. Not easy to grade but HVS 5a makes a mockery of the grading system.
In reply to Ian Jones:> Has to be Raven's Gully on The Buachaille. Horrible, wet chockstones with unhelpful holds. Not easy to grade but HVS 5a makes a mockery of the grading system.
In some ways similar to Great Gully on Craig y Ysfa.
In reply to Sean Kelly:
Intermediate Gully on Dow Crag Intermediate Gully (MVS 4b).
Upgraded to Mild VS on here and in Lake District Rock, graded 'Severe, strenuous' in the 1938 guide, it will forever be the classic Lakeland Hard Severe gully. (It is generally accepted that Hard Severe is more difficult than Mild VS). Don't be fooled by the technical grade 4a/4b - it's a struggle, even in the dry.
Now deservedly given *** in LDR.
Steve
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