UKC

/ Wish you hadn't led

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GridNorth - on 26 Mar 2018

In contrast to the wish you had led thread. What routes have you regretted leading?  I can think of several.

Al

AndySL - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Guytha (Wintours Leap) on 4th July last year.  I fell off awkwardly above the peg and tore my ACL.  Still waiting for reconstructive surgery.  The operation has been cancelled twice.

1
krikoman - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

> In contrast to the wish you had led thread. What routes have you regretted leading?  I can think of several.

> Al

 

Urizen The most boring climb every.

The same move all the way up, bleurgh!

1
alan moore - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Suspension Flake, a faffy, three-Runner shuffle or a perfect fast solo....

MKH - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

"Who needs hair anyway" in Fairy Steps Quarry. 

Put me off leading for months if not years.

trouserburp - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Threadneedle street. Slippy, dark, cold, wet, sandy sandbag nightmare (at least for a Severe) - most of the threads are long gone. Cracks is nice when you get out to it

spidermonkey09 - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

The Swan (E3 5c)

Fell off at the end of the traverse, hadn't slung the tree, massive pendulum ensued. Smashed ankle, swelled to size of watermelon. Sat in car for 6 hours while everyone else carried on climbing (it was the solstice!) Couldn't walk without a limp for several months and cant sit cross legged without discomfort even now.

Moral; sling the tree!

spidermonkey09 - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to trouserburp:

Gets VS now and worth every penny I think. Its like an untravelled gritstone VS which feels particularly sandbaggy next to normal Pembroke grading!

Mick Ward - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to alan moore:

> Suspension Flake, a faffy, three-Runner shuffle or a perfect fast solo....

The perfect solo. Had wanted to do this for decades. Soloed it three times in swift succession. Beautiful. And (one of the hallmarks of a classic) a route which particularly demands respect, irrespective of grading.

Mick

d_b on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to Mick Ward:

I thought I was consistently leading VS when I tried it.  Got spanked.

Mick Ward - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

>  What routes have you regretted leading? 

Tabula Rosa. Langcliffe Quarry.

Failure on pitch two (a strong likelihood, balancing up on collapsing holds with effectively no gear) would have resulted in a Factor Two fall, a ripped belay and certain death for both of us.

We had a blazing row on the belay. I'd deliberately led pitch one (very serious) to get out of leading pitch two. Alas, the ploy didn't work.

A route which has never been graded even remotely accurately and which may have gone 40 years now without a repeat. 

The horror. 'There's someone in my head but it's not me...'

Mick

 

Mick Ward - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to davidbeynon:

Don't feel bad. It's pretty goey. Like a traditional Almscliff 'VS' (most of which seem to be HVS now!) that's snuk a few hundred miles down south and got itself tucked in, quietly awaiting the unwary.

Think of it as a HVS. Go back when you're on a roll and feeling super-confident. Success will be all the more sweet.

It's a wonderful route. So much worthwhile climbing packed into such a tiny space. And commanding such respect.

Mick

 

Greenbanks - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to Mick Ward:

Mmm. Langcliffe. It made Warton Main seem like a trad paradise. Scared me just to look at it.

Trangia on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Meshach at Tremadog because I used the peg on the second pitch traverse as a hold, so I cheated and can't count it as a clean lead. I'm too old now to rectify it.

alan moore - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to Trangia:

> Meshach at Tremadog because I used the peg on the second pitch traverse as a hold,

dont feel bad! It's a wobbly peg. I held it in with my fingers to stop it falling out as I climbed past...

 

profitofdoom on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

1. Leg Slip (E1 5b) as a yoof. Then graded HVS. Hung on desperately for ages, fingers scrabbling, then took a massive peeler. My second then led me up it

2. Scavenger (HVS 5a) as a yoof. Then graded VS. Got very very gripped but got up it

keith sanders - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to Mick Ward:

You should be chuffed you led routes on Langcliffe not many had in the 70/80s

keith s

 

keith sanders - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Come on then Al tell all what we’re your routes

keith s

JJ Krammerhead III - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth: thief of Baghdad gull rock shortly after the rock fall that had erm.. amended the route. Was HVS then became according to ukc E4 5c. Not sure about that but was mortifying, snappy thin holds and ground fall most of the route. Pulled a block off the overlap at the top to add to the fun

 

Heartinthe highlands - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Scary Peruvian snow flutings on unpronounceable mountains. Mind you, considering the belays, seconding them wasn't any better.

Goucho on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Pitches 2 & 4 of Vulture on Cilan Head, closely followed by seconding pitches 1 & 3.

GridNorth - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to keith sanders:

Cenotaph Corner

Black Ice at Long Quarry Point

Frendo Spur (1st time)

Al

keith sanders - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Cenotaph yes Frendo yes

Black ice I’ve done it great route you’ll have to tell me 1 day

keith s

ps on way to Leonidio atm May look at ferry to Kaly also

elliott92 - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

May I ask why cenotaph corner? I don't lead e1 yet but cenotaph has always been a long term goal 

Fredt on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Route 3 (S 4a) Burbage North

Boxing Day 2015. Stood in the triangular pocket, and got my gear tangled. Decided to jump (6' ?) off and start again.

Smashed my heel, not climbed since.

Post edited at 21:16
Gordon Stainforth - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to elliott92:

One of the happiest days of my early climbing life was getting up Cenotaph Corner.

1
Gordon Stainforth - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

This is such an archetypically depressing UKC thread – where the pathetically negative idea 'Wish you hadn't led' garners quite a lot more interest than the original 'Wish you had led' thread.

I can't really recall anything I wish I hadn't led. Not sure what it means. If a climb goes badly, it's typically a very memorable experience that you learn a lot from.

Like many climbers, I probably seconded as least as many routes as I led, probably more, and if I wish anything it's that I wish I'd led more.

7
spenser - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

Interesting point that one Gordon, only route which came to mind was Downes' Crack (VS 5a) because it put me out for most of the winter season due to a stupid decision to climb it in slightly damp conditions and decking out onto the block at the base resulting in a badly bruised heel.

Oddly I don't regret leading The Long Climb (VS) the day after a fatality despite the fact that it nearly led to me giving up climbing.

Gordon Stainforth - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to spenser:

Yes. This is quite a deep subject really. It brings one right back to why one climbs to start with. Is it just to have a nice, enjoyable time? Of course not.

1
DenzelLN - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Everything we climbed at Brimham on Sunday.

 

spenser - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

The realisation that just about every single one of my mates was a climber, that I had picked my job around facilitating me going climbing after work and at the weekends and that the idea of going climbing got me through a working week. Looking back it caused me to get much more involved with the running of my local mountaineering club and dragging the average age down. 

GridNorth - on 26 Mar 2018
In reply to elliott92:

I fell off it in 1966 and nearly died.  I slipped and came onto the only gear that I had in, a thread at about 40 feet, which either broke or pulled through. I fractured my skull, broke a leg and a couple of ribs as well as losing a few teeth. To this day I can't bring myself to lead anything in that area, which means I've missed out on Left Wall, Foil etc.  I've seconded Right Wall but that's not the same. I was overly confident thinking I was an Extreme leader because I had led a few Extremes at Millstone Edge and Brant Direct which believe it or not used to get the E grade.

Black Ice was just bad luck.  A critical hold broke on me and I fell a long, long way.  Luckily nothing broken but I couldn't walk for a month despite climbing an E1 immediately after the fall.

Frendo Spur was my first alpine climb.  I didn't have a clue and the whole experience was a disaster and put me off alpine climbing for a couple of years.  I did it again when I knew what I was doing and it was a totally different and better experience.

I agree with Gordon, pathetically negative.  I wish now I hadn't posted it, it's brought back some bad memories.

Al

JJ Krammerhead III - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

You'e right of course.  I think we just like telling each other horror stories. The devil always gets the best tune. 

Kid Spatula - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Cotton Terror at Anglezarke.  Was climbing well at the time, and had just climbed Comes the Dervish, and Consenting Adults so went for this thinking it would be easy.

A large hold snapped off on me as I neared the top  (the easy bit), I fell and decked out. Luckily a couple of marginal RPs (I think) had ripped slowing me down slightly so I just broke ribs and did something horrible to my wrist. Plus a cut on the back of my head from a bit of rock I'd thrown away so it didn't hit my belayer hitting me.

I've never led above VS since and it's wrecked my lead head for the last 18 years.

 

Post edited at 09:16
Samuele Mattiuzzo - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

Chabito, a 4+ route in Sierra de Toix (Costa Blanca), first pitch.

Terrible description, "abseil descent" is stated but actually there's only a poorly placed wire to descend from. Wire was moving a lot and the bit of rock it was attached to was not enough to let you descend, so had to downclimb the route REALLY SLOWLY.  A bolt was missing or removed, leaving a long run between the third and fifth (new fourth) bolt. On a slab. No thanks.

uphillnow - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to spenser:

I have seen some comments re The Long Climb suggesting people hadn't enjoyed it. Has it changed (rockfall?). My memory of it was a of a nice soft wandering line done on a sunny afternoon, pure pleasure.

d_b on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to uphillnow:

I haven't done it yet but I think it might be a genre thing.  Lots of people like their rock dry, solid and vegetation free. 

I don't think any of these attributes are essential for a fun day out so I expect to enjoy it.

 

spenser - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to davidbeynon:

I like not climbing past fresh bloodstains (the accident occurred the day before I climbed the route).

I don't climb to have the full extent of human mortality impressed upon me when 3 pitches up a big route.

There were some nice pitches on the route, I enjoyed the twin cracks pitch.

d_b on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to spenser:

I didn't spot that.  I wouldn't enjoy that much either.

I have seen a few rants about how horrible it is from people who seemed to be under the impression that they were going to be climbing at Stanage rather than a big mountain face, which is what I was getting at.

Dave Cundy - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to Kid Spatula:

Ooo, that brings back memories. I was leading E1 in the late 80s and tried Cotton Terror one evening.  Having cruised Terra Cotta, of course.  Tottered up to the move onto the final ledge, all the gear being in friable rock and.....couldn't quite reach the peg above the ledge.  Slightly overhanging mantleshelf with 40ft deck-out potential. Not my forte.  I just couldn't commit. Had to wait 15 mins until one of the lads dropped me a top rope.  It scarred me for quite a while (ok, 30 years )  Cotton Terra is almost as bad as the Anglezarke midges after a humid day.......

Post edited at 21:57
Stuart en Écosse - on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

> I fell off it in 1966 and nearly died.  I slipped and came onto the only gear that I had in, a thread at about 40 feet, which either broke or pulled through. I fractured my skull, broke a leg and a couple of ribs as well as losing a few teeth. To this day I can't bring myself to lead anything in that area, which means I've missed out on Left Wall, Foil etc.  I've seconded Right Wall but that's not the same. I was overly confident thinking I was an Extreme leader because I had led a few Extremes at Millstone Edge and Brant Direct which believe it or not used to get the E grade.

I fell off Cenotaph Corner from about halfway up. My foot slipped on what I felt was a good bridge and I decked on rope stretch. Physically I was unhurt though I never regained confidence in my feet. It was the first time I'd fallen off when I didn't expect to, my first time landing on the ground (my climbing partner really) and the biggest plummet I'd ever taken. I'm not sure if I regret going for it or not. On one hand it was within my grade thus perfectly reasonable but on the other it was one of those days when the mojo had stayed in the tent and I wasn't feeling on top form.

pec on 27 Mar 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

> This is such an archetypically depressing UKC thread – where the pathetically negative idea 'Wish you hadn't led' garners quite a lot more interest than the original 'Wish you had led' thread.

> I can't really recall anything I wish I hadn't led. Not sure what it means. If a climb goes badly, it's typically a very memorable experience that you learn a lot from.

I'm with you on this one.

I could say I regret leading Zero gully as I fell off and badly broke my ankle. As a result I've had 6 operations, years of painful arthritis, in total spent over a year on crutches and now have a fused ankle. Clearly with the benefit of hindsight if I'd known what was going to happen I wouldn't have done it!

On the other hand I've never pushed myself on ice since then whereas if it hadn't happened I'd probably have gone on pushing myself to climb harder things and might have ended up dead by now. Always look on the bright side

 

johncoxmysteriously - on 28 Mar 2018
In reply to pec:

 

I agree; there’s nothing I wish I hadn’t led - type 2 fun is part of the fun.

 

Obviously we’d all like to turn back the clock when we get injured, but that’s not very interesting. 

 

jcm

 

krikoman - on 28 Mar 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

> I agree with Gordon, pathetically negative.  I wish now I hadn't posted it, it's brought back some bad memories.

 

Well I disagree, If nothing else it's proved that some people get hurt and still continue to climb, so it's very inspiring. rather than being depressing it's rather uplifting.

And it's given me a laugh

Glass half full, stuff maybe?

 

 

Post edited at 14:07
mutt - on 29 Mar 2018
In reply to krikoman:

> Well I disagree, If nothing else it's proved that some people get hurt and still continue to climb, so it's very inspiring. rather than being depressing it's rather uplifting.

Yep, and whats more all this stuff is balance to the usual bollocks. What would happen if I posted the thread " Which routes do I wish my friends hadn't led?" .... 

Glass half empty stuff I know but in truth bad stuff does happen sometimes and one would be something of a dumb-arse to go climbing without acknowledging that.

That said I've enjoyed every lead i've done. Even when its gone wrong I haven't actually fallen off and injured myself (or worse). The fear is what its all about isn't it? 

 

 

Martin Bennett - on 12 Apr 2018
In reply to GridNorth:

> In contrast to the wish you had led thread. What routes have you regretted leading?  I can think of several.

> Al

First pitch of Aquarius on Pavey a couple of years ago. A poor entry pitch to the main fare of the second pitch which is excellent. There's a thin balancy move right at the top with a 70 foot fall to the ground if you get it wrong. Took me forever but had to do it as I couldn't get down. Only say 4c but .. . . . . y'know?!

Turns out I'd seconded it in 1980 when we did Cascade. Of course I never even noticed it then. It also turns out you don't need to do it - can scramble from the right to the stance. If I go back that's what I'll be doing!

Blue Straggler - on 12 Apr 2018
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

> This is such an archetypically depressing UKC thread – where the pathetically negative idea 

With respect, that is utter tommyrot.

Yes there is a "negative idea" at play here but I like to think that the intention is somewhat positive, and I have enjoyed reading a lot of responses.  They are thought provoking.
There is nothing depressing or "pathetically negative" here. People are gallantly posting about times where things went wrong due to various factors. Didn't you write a multi-prize-winning book about this sort of thing, without ever mentioning that it was "pathetically negative"?

To answer the OP, funnily enough I am struggling to think of true regrets, despite having had a disproportionate number of retreats, and one smashed ankle from falling off something a grade or two below "my grade". Of course there are scary "Type 2 enjoyment" horror stories but as Gordon alludes later, that's part of why we get into this game - a bit of fear to make us feel alive.. 
 

Cumbrian Climber - on 12 Apr 2018
In reply to trouserburp:

> Threadneedle street. Slippy, dark, cold, wet, sandy sandbag nightmare (at least for a Severe) - most of the threads are long gone. Cracks is nice when you get out to it

VS 4c in our opinion for the first pitch and extra exciting due to occasional massive explosions out at sea (some military exercise going on) which seemed to rattle the whole roof in a most alarming manner. The traverse out left was airy but no more than Diff (can’t understand how it warrants a tech grade) and the cracks were, as you say, nice. The whole experience being enhanced by the diagram being wrong in both the CC guides and the Rockfax. Actually thought it a bit of a classic but one we are glad to have done once and will not ever do again - I mean, how long has that cave got before it collapses?!

Post edited at 18:48

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