UKC

Hi,

I need to regularly climb a yacht mast, which has fold-out steps.

There is a 10mm halyard/rope connected to the top of the mast (normally used to raise the sail) that can easily be made taut. I would like to be able to connect my safety harness to a device that would stop be falling should I slip on the steps.

I need something that would be easy to operate both going up and coming down, hopefully, something that would be as simple as connect and forget, maybe working on a similar principle to a car safety belt?

I have been looking at things like Petzl Micro Traxion and the Pro, but I am not sure which device would better suit my requirements or if there is anything else that would suit me better.

Any advice gratefully received.

Gary.

In reply to GaryCottam:

Petzl ASAP?

W

In reply to GaryCottam:

If the halyard is taught can't you just slide a normal prusik loop attached to your harness up it? Or if you don't want to fiddle around with a prusik knot then use a Jumar?

In reply to GaryCottam:

Jumar?

In reply to GaryCottam:

Shunt.

In reply to GaryCottam:

Going up is easy, there are marine versions of ascenders available (climbing equipment has a short life in a damp boat locker) but coming down isn´ t, the Shunt has the advantage you can fit a tow-down cord on it which the rest don´ t. Prussiks on a taught, smooth halyard are challenging!
Most of the industrial fall arrest system are very rope-specific.
I always used a Grigri and pulled through as I went up or used it as the lower part of an ascending system and abseiled down with it on yachts without steps, on my own mast with steps I just took care not to slip

In reply to GaryCottam:

First, if not alone, why not attach the halyard to your harness and have your assistant belay you, usually by taking a turn or two around the halyard winch and taking in the slack on the way up, paying it out on the way down. They will be very happy that they are not winching you up!

Second, if alone, why? It is not good practice.

Third, fix a climbing rope to the halyard, hoist it to the mast head and use that for your prussic, Ropeman etc. Presumably, you are just asking it to hold you, while you regain your footing.

In reply to GaryCottam:
I just tie the halyard into my harness with enough tail to make a Prussik. I can then use the system to climb up the mast and lower myself (same system used by tree climbers). if the Prussik 'slips' just pull on the tail and it locks. if you're uncomfortable with the Prussik then substitute the knot for a Grigri.

In reply to GaryCottam:

Interesting question. I have a yacht and I had to recently replace rotten spreader tips, which meant lowering the whole damn mast which was a palaver. I now need to get up it to do more stuff and was wondering how to go about it. To be honest the easiest thing would be just to shin up it and then secure yourself to a harness with a loop of something reasonably stretchy round the mast each time you got past anything which would catch like the cross trees. Not much different from trad climbing in that respect.

But I think that as an alternative to prussiks (should you want some assistance) there is a traditional technique where you make a short loop of rope long enough to go round both ankles and behind the mast and use that to assist you in the shinning up. You could possibly do the same thing around your wrists too. I tried google but couldn't find this, nor can I remember the technical term, so I guess you'd have to scour old books to try to find that particular answer. Alternatively, you could beg, borrow or steal a rope ladder and hoist it up. Back in the day though, people weren't such pussies as we all are now and after they'd climbed however many hundred feet up on rigging, they would shin up the last 15 feet solo...
youtube.com/watch?v=sSuZXlUxwbk&

In reply to myself:

I've just remembered that you have the rope loop the same side of the mast as yourself. This lessens the risk of finding yourself hanging upside down by your feet should you slip, though it probably does not take it away altogether - I still can't remember what this way of doing it is called though. However unless you're a billionaire or a Russian oligarch with a multi-masted schooner or whatever (in which case you wouldn't be doing this yourself) then the diameter of your mast will probably be significantly less that a foot (300mm) in which case shinning up it ought to be pretty easy. The rope loop technique comes into its own on the thicker end of the shinnable mast spectrum - you adjust the length so that your ankles are maybe 3/4 of the way around the circumference but can't go round any further, so you get some tension on the rope-loop which then gives you added friction. As it's an old-school method and no longer widely practiced, there's probably a fair bit of skill involved and so if you're not practiced at it, it could actually make things worse. My advice, assuming you have a 'normal' size mast is either to shin up or improvise some kind of rope ladder, à la aide climbing. I'm assuming here that your fold-out steps don't go all the way to the top but that as with the HMS Ganges video that I posted the link to, there would be a section of mast at the top that would have to be shinned up. If I'm wrong on this and they do go all the way, depending on how they're configured all you need is a rope loop from the loops of your climbing harness, round the mast and back, so that if you slip, it will catch on the next step which probably won't be so far down as to need to worry overmuch about stretch in the rope, but a bit of old climbing rope would be better than say a dyneema sling for obvious reasons! You could even have two loops with carabiner attachments so that as you pass each set of spreaders, you could re-attach one above before unclipping the one below, just like a via ferrata and if you really wanted to be safe, you could adapt a via ferrata sling to absorb fall impact, if you can afford one!

This is actually quite interesting as it's helping me work out my own answer to this problem!

In reply to GaryCottam:

Why do you need to climb the mast regularly? I've also got a yacht, but only had to climb the mast once, I had someone with and just used a climbing harness and the winch.

In reply to Sl@te Head:
Because it's there.

In reply to GaryCottam:

Petzl ASAP is what you want. Works for up and down without needing to attend to it.

In reply to Sl@te Head:


My nephew has to climb masts regularly because his job is to be one of the crew on a rich man's toy and often, the only other person around is the skipper. With a skipper in his 70s and a crew hand who's just about 20 and also a shit hot rock climber, the mast-climbing tends to get done by just one of them and it sure ain't the skipper

In reply to GaryCottam:

Most of the kit people are recommending won't survive life in a marine environment. Petzl Tibloc is I think cast (forged?) in stainless so it will at least survive life on a boat and it could with significant care be used to protect an ascent/descent.

I can't help but suspect there is a standard yachting solution to this problem and climbers, however well intentioned will just be re-inventing the wheel... badly.
jk

In reply to GaryCottam:

Climb a mast???
You need an elevator https://www.yachtingmagazine.com/mirabella-v-stretching-limits

In reply to jkarran:

The standard yachting solution is to have someone winch you up on a halyard. Very hard work for the wincher, and I don't like not being in control of my own safety. Most sailors are surprised to see how easy it looks with a jumar and grigri. And easy to control your descent while doing eg a rig check.

In reply to GaryCottam:
As way of explanation of my reply above.... I have a boat with a lid on it (Westerly centaur) and needed to rewire the navlights, the aerial, place a gps antennae and for good measure replace all the rigging. The easiest and most expensive solution would have been to drop the mast. However being a tight git (and a climber) I chose the system which is very safe and easy to use on my own (I just don't trust anyone on a winch no matter how good they are). So I tied into the halyard with a figure of eight, left enough free to tie in with a Prussik . There is a specific way to tie the knot as apposed to how it's done with a simple sling. this means that the knot can be used to descend and locked off. This method is used by tree surgeons. It means I don't need any climbing specific equipment on board. If you're unhappy with the Prussik then a Grigri is a good and safe alternative. Jumars will chew up the sheaf subject to how many times you ascend.

In reply to pwo:


However big is the mast on the Centaur? You've got an extra 4-5 foot waterline length on my Westerly 22 but how much bigger is the mast I wonder? Whatever the answer to that question, those extra few feet must be very expensive ones! All it cost me to drop the mast on my Westerly was my time and that of El Presidente of our climbing club who came to help me, plus fuel for the car and beer for him. We moored it on a beach hauled close in to the bank, slung a reasonably meaty block and tackle from the mast head to a handy tree and I lowered it down, pivoting on the tabernacle while he guided it. It was quite exciting though, particularly pulling it back up again after various epoxy and yacht varnish applications had been hastily done.



The obvious way to avoid concerns about damaging your halyards is to use a different rope. You can attach that via a carabiner to the halyard, haul it up to the mast head and cleat off the halyard to secure it all in place. That's how I got the business end of the block and tackle I used up to the mast head.

In reply to GaryCottam:
Prior to the centaur I had a 21' Corribee and I could drop the mast easily on my own. Not so with the centaur. I don't have the luxury of any handy trees where she's kept either on her mooring (west wales) or her winter berth (Cardiff). Once ashore the hoist has to be used to lower masts and it's impossible to use if another boat is blocking you in. Hence the climbing escapades (which I thoroughly enjoyed). There's no need for a block and tackle on the head to lift the mast. The same result can be achieved by a sling hoisted up to the spreaders.