UKC

Hi all,

I'm a fairly newly qualified ML. I'm not doing any outdoors work at the moment because I'm still in another job but I'm planning on trying to pick up freelance work once covid is out of the way.

I've also been climbing for several years now, and although I'm only leading HVS I've been getting out on some fairly big and adventurous mountain crags. I feel pretty competent with my rope work. I'm an industrial climber so I've some vertical rescue experience from that and I am also a rope tech on my local MRT.

I'm thinking about doing the MCI training this year - partly thinking about employment for the future but also just for personal development. I enjoyed the process of the ML because it filled in a few gaps in my knowledge but mostly because I confirmed for myself that I was competent, if that makes sense.

On paper I have all the requirements to sign up for the MCI. But - should I be climbing harder? Should I do the RCI first? Should I be looking to get more paid experience as an ML before doing further qualifications?

Obviously its hard to answer these questions without knowing me personally. But any thoughts would be appreciated, particularly from people who've recently completed the MCI. I'd probably be doing it at PYB.

cheers

I'm an MCI in North Wales and have done some videos on MCI stuff including this one:  youtube.com/watch?v=MnZdfgAbwAM&

Climbing HVS you'll be fine on the scheme, whilst plenty of people going through will be climbing harder, the VS pre requisite is all you need to tick (very comfortably).

We also run popular MCI taster courses that may be of interest
https://www.jbmountainskills.co.uk/instructor-training

The required grade is VS 4c and (whilst it is always nice to have a grade or two in hand to reduce stress by the time you come to assessment) if you are happily climbing mountain crags at this grade you will be fine for a a training course

I would always suggest people have done a good volume of ML work (paid or volunteer) to give them that experience of looking after others in a mountain environment. 

The old debate about the RCI rumbles on. It is a good stepping stone and sets good foundations to build from but equally if you have lots of other experience as a rope tech then you probably have good habits already. As a qualified RCI you can get paid/volunteer experience in managing groups prior to MCI which would help with the people management side of things.

As above. To be honest it’s worth registering and getting a booking if you are seriously interested, from what I hear there is quite a big backlog of people waiting for training and assessment courses.

If you have any specific questions feel free to shoot me an email, I recently passed my MCI this year.

Also Jez above and a few others have been running MCI taster weekends to give people an idea of what it’s like, so it could be worth doing one of them to test the waters.

Hi, whilst being quite pricey it's an enjoyable process. here's my thoughts from what you say framed slightly differently - from POV of the assessment week (this is in general not gospel)

day 1 - personal climbing- up to VS - just be comfy guiding people, plenty of gear, organised stances etc,  series/parallel and you should be fine

day 2 rescues - you'll cruise this

day 3 teaching - be slick and smooth, look after your clients - this maybe the hardest day

day 4 scrambling - get good at this, switching modes and moving smartly, looking after your clients

day 5 nav - should be ok if you did ok on your ml.

so really you'll probably need to focus on days 3&4 whilst not ignoring the others.  RCI will help with both in group management , as will ML experience in the hills.  But defo not essential. Also some coaching is now more part of the deal.

Thanks for the advice everyone. I'm thinking about probably not doing the RCI but instead trying to pick up some ML work before the training.

Its worth noting that in the region of 95% of people that do MCI training have passed their RCI assessment. 

I did SPA training before MIA (sorry - the names have changed!). That was worthwhile, I believe.

I think there’s a bit more to it than that. An MCI should already be an excellent ML 😁

As for the RCI, you’re guaranteed to learn something new and you’ll have a great time whilst doing it. 

sure - thanks for your comment not just a dislike

I was deliberately giving an alternative,  left field view of the sorts of things to consider.

Sure if you do 5 years as an ML and 5 years as an RCI  you'll get more experience etc but is that required for the training?  I did my SPA before MIA (RCI/MCI) and it was useful. I didn't do CWA beforehand, should I have done ?    You don't need to go through all the British system to become a  IFMGA/BMG guide, though you may learn stuff and enjoy it.  Maybe he could do the MCI training and decide he needs to invest in the RCI for a few years.

I think it depends on goals,  experience, lifestyle choices, work opportunities etc etc etc.

Plus i am not trying to sell him a few hundreds quids worth of courses

I personally think that's a poor way of looking at these qualifications. 

It should be about progression, development and experience. Not saving a quick buck. 

By doing the RCI it will help those progressing onto MCI and in the long run to produce a more rounded instructor. The jump from SML to MCI is huge, by doing the RCI you're giving yourself an introduction into the world of climbing qualifications and learning along the way. 

As for the BMG, you'll find many guides are also qualified WMCI's, the same as many MCI's are also RCI's. Its not essential but you're only giving yourself the best chance to learn as much as possible and develop your experience to pass these awards and come out the other side a better instructor for it. 

I would highly recommend doing the RCI, it's an excellent award and a great stepping stone towards higher awards. 

my own view isn't that different from yours, but I think its relevant to not be stuck in an echo chamber.

I am well aware of many BMG being WMCIs etc. If RCI is needed for MCI then make it a requirement or exemption.

as probably would I, if it fits the persons profile. Theres a huge difference between someone who's been climbing for 2 years and collecting the qualifications ASAP and someone who has 30 years experience of climbing and teaching and has decided to get some tickets.   I think the current system accommodates that.

I hear you. 

I'm not saying everyone who does the MCI needs to do their RCI. Just that I think it's a really good opportunity to learn before doing the MCI and that it would help with the MCI process.

Regardless if you're building up the experience as you go through the awards or have years in the bank, it's still incredibly valuable. 

I'm not in any position to say whether the RCI should be a pre-requisite to the MCI, I'm sure its been discussed many times by MT and others. 

RCDI and RCI are likely to be a prerequisite in the next few years.