UKC

Hi gorgeous climbers! 

I hope life is going well.

I have been struggling with my trad “career” and I thought that maybe putting in here aloud where I can have some feedback/advice/spiritual guidance could be super helpful.

I started trad climbing around Christmas time and I felt in love! I have done 2 small different trad climbing courses in how to put the gear and be aware about safety when you put a belay, etc. I had also an instructor for a weekend helping me to improve and it was fantastic!  I was able to fully lead on my own a Dif. That really gave me a lot of confidence and set my trad foundations.

 So now…  I am ready to move on and don’t do more beginners courses as I have already the foundations… but…

Now I feel stuck in the middle: usually the people I know are experienced climbers and they are great and kind, but they have to drop the level for me (that I appreciate.. but I felt bad). On the other hand…I also don’t have the confidence yet to go with people of my level (that is low, Diff-VDiff) I found that I don’t feel comfortable and having partner that has also started can be a disaster…many times we need guidance and help…(the difference between an Italian hitch and a clove is really thin…hahahha).

So now I want to climb and grow…but not sure in which direction to move…

Thanks for reading and arriving to the end of my strugglings… if you have any suggestion, I would love to read you.

Take care!

You could join a club or go to an event like Women's Trad Fest. Facebook groups for your area can be a good way to meet people too, likewise climbing walls can be good too.

Climbing is a partnership. If the experienced climbers you go out with aren't prepared to take it in turns so you can gain experience leading at your own level then they're not worth climbing with. But you should be confident about your right to lead the routes of your choice and not feel bad about it. We were all beginners once and the only way to improve is with practice. The absolute worst thing you can do is talk yourself out of leading, for whatever reason, and end up eternally seconding - however much time you spend on the blunt end it will never make leading feel any easier or less intimidating as a newbie.

I think there are plenty of climbers out there with years of experience that are happy just to get out for the day, climb some easy routes and pass on their knowledge and skills. I've posted online many times looking for partners for low grade routes and have always received replies from experienced climbers.

I'd post for more experienced climbers to climb with, and try not to worry about grade/experience mismatch - let them worry about that! If they're not into climbing with a relative novice and sharing some skills for a day, then they won't reply; on the other hand, if they do reply then presumably they're happy to climb with you on that basis - the problem kind of looks after itself

It would probably help if you fleshed out your profile a bit, give climbers an idea whether they might enjoy your company - at least, make it clear what area/crags are local for you.

The wonderful thing about trad, is that the difficulty doesn't matter. I absolutely love days doing classic easy routes, perched on the top of a gritstone edge taking in the view while belaying my partner who is very new to climbing....just as much as trying hard at my limit with other climbing friends.

Most trad climbers are the same, in my experience! 

Hi.

Yeah I'd just echo everyone else and keep putting the messages out there for experienced partners. Don't necessarily need to climb hard to have experience. I have friends who have climbed longer than me who are perfectly happy plodding up S and HS all day but that's their choice and it's what they enjoy doing (and to be honest they have a point when the weather is as hot as it has been recently). I climb with people of all abilities but then again I'm more motivated by quality rock and routes nowadays instead of hard climbing all the time. Welcome to the Trad club anyway

Take your time and don't be ashamed to lead lower grades. But, you may also be able to work on your movement skills in safe/comfortable contexts, e.g. climbing walls, sport climbing or outdoor bouldering, which can help build your confidence. Unlike others, I think it can be beneficial to second routes that are harder; but it is important to keep leading so you continue to feel motivated by autonomous desire. The perfect partner in crime is always just around the corner - don't worry!

p.s. everyone makes mistakes: the secret is to learn from them.

I agree with this post re fleshing out your profile Maria.  Perhaps mentioning on this thread where you are based would help.  Your list of climbs suggests you are based in The Lakes but perhaps that is where you did your courses.

Definitely locating a experienced partner helps accelerate your trad apprenticeship but that being said if you have other keen new climbers around you then definitely get out with them. learning to trad climb and sharing that journey with someone else equally psyched is a fantastic experience. You get to share so many emotions, goals and experiences that you can't quite do when climbing with someone who just cruised up your dream tick in their approach shoes. 

If climbing with another new climber you can build trust by workshopping stuff e.g spend 30 min at the start of each trad climbing day just building anchors at ground level. Have a more experienced climber to come on your first trip out with them to help you both figure out your system. make sure you are both happy to give and receive honest feedback. Build up the grades slowly and get plenty of mileage.

Just because you feel bad for the climbers who "have to drop a level", does not mean they feel bad.  And don't forget, they can always say no !

The main requirement for me is that any climbing partner is safe, their climbing ability is secondary.  Happy to lead at my grade then second something easier as long as the other climber is safe in their practices. Sure it’s the same for many, no matter their lead grade.

I didn't mean to imply seconding harder stuff isn't beneficial - it can be great for confidence and improving skills. I went on a UKC meet as a newbie climber and getting the chance to second low extremes had a hugely positive impact on my climbing confidence. It's just that I know quite a few people who've spent a long time seconding, waiting for some mythical point where they'll suddenly 'feel ready' to lead and it seems like totally the wrong approach. In my view it makes the transition harder as not only does the aspiring leader still need to build confidence in their gear and ropework, they're probably also frustrated by having to drop their grade to something way below their climbing ability. It's also something that seems much much more commen in women, possibly due to lower confidence generally or a tendency towards people pleasing (i.e. not wanting to put out their partner by insisting on leading something easy) which is why I mentioned it specifically to this poster.

Totally agree about the second point about autonomous and positive engagement in the climbing partnership being crucial for remaining motivated. Choosing your crags and routes, swinging leads, being an equal partner are really important. 

Yes, I completely agree with all this

I just wanted to post my own experience, as you might find it helpful. I lead up to about HVS/E1 and am reasonably experienced. I have a few partners who are just starting out with their trad, and I love climbing with them. To me, it is about the person you are spending the time with, not just the grades you're climbing. If I like spending time with the person, the grade doesn't matter so much. I find it super rewarding to climb with people just starting out, as you feed off their joy and psych. When someone leads their first severe and they're pumped and you can congratulate them, to me that's way more significant than just following your mate up some VS. I also love teaching people new things and tricks and offering advice, so this is another plus.

The other great part about climbing with someone below your own level, is that you kind of get to have a little rest seconding them (not to belittle your ability at all...). I like climbing with people who climb harder than me as well, but it can sometimes be a real chore when I'm blown from seconding their sustained 5c/6a and then realise it's my lead next. 

Another plus is that there's no danger of them saying "hey I was looking at getting on that absolute classic 3 star route you have your eye on today". 

In fact, I'd say the worst people to climb with are people climbing a similar level to you, as they steal the routes you want to do! You're also much more likely to get what I call 'Second Syndrome', where you're put off leading a certain grade as you found their climb tricky on second. You don't get that so much seconding easier things, and you more expect to find hard things hard so are not as deterred seconding routes above your grade. 

Thanks a lot for all your kind messages! They help a lot! I appreciate all the comments and above all from the experience climbers encouraging to continue and explaining it is not always about the grades! I have to say that my friends have been always quite supportive but it is more me thinking that if you climb super hard, you will find boring climb something way below your grade.... but there is beauty and challege in every route

My suggestion would be to improve your climbing level outdoors to the point where you feel confident seconding harder routes (e.g. HS or VS). You can achieve this by climbing outdoor sports routes at around 5+/6a level.

At that point you will have lots of leaders who will be happy to take you out and you can learn from their leads.