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"The British can be a bit self-congratulatory over our
trad ethics (ignoring that the same tradition remains
important not only across much of the rest of the
English-speaking world, but also in other parts of
Europe such as Scandinavia), but what the
October/November edition of Vertical shows is how
strong trad climbing remains elsewhere in the
mountains of Europe."
TobyA gives us his view
http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=280
trad ethics (ignoring that the same tradition remains
important not only across much of the rest of the
English-speaking world, but also in other parts of
Europe such as Scandinavia), but what the
October/November edition of Vertical shows is how
strong trad climbing remains elsewhere in the
mountains of Europe."
TobyA gives us his view
http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=280
In reply to JoH - Editor: Voi perkele*, that was a good review. Had similar thoughts as those Toby expresses so well when I read the first issue of Vertical.
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* My finnish is limited to 6-7 swearwords I picked up at the swedish-finnish crag Niemisel.
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* My finnish is limited to 6-7 swearwords I picked up at the swedish-finnish crag Niemisel.
In reply to jwi:
Good article TA, nice one. To prove your point, Vertical clearly communicated to me, as I found its focus on big routes climbed free extremely inspiring. Hurry on summer!
Good article TA, nice one. To prove your point, Vertical clearly communicated to me, as I found its focus on big routes climbed free extremely inspiring. Hurry on summer!
In reply to JoH - Editor: Good review. Nice to see Didier Berthod (the Swiss crack specialist) mentioned - he 'starred' in First Ascent (a film shown at Kendal) and came across as such an endearing character (funny, philosophical).
In reply to Toby
As I said in my review of the first edition (http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=221 ) French gear reviews in the old Vertical & elsewhere are so dreadful they are no loss although something along the lines of Andy Kirkpatrick's reviews or those in the old Mountain Review would be a useful addition.
As for the rest of Europe being 'sterile' I've often got the impression that us Brits probably have a lot in common with the Spanish - I've barely climbed there but from looking at the guidebooks & the odd copy of Desnivel plus some ski mountaineering trips using Spanish huts it seems they have lots of 'trad' or near trad routes in the mountains & an attitude to the mountains quite similar to the UK
Another problem with Vertical which Toby didn't mention is the lack of a website for information on subscriptions & the lateness of edition 2 - hardly a way of attracting new readers.
As I said in my review of the first edition (http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=221 ) French gear reviews in the old Vertical & elsewhere are so dreadful they are no loss although something along the lines of Andy Kirkpatrick's reviews or those in the old Mountain Review would be a useful addition.
As for the rest of Europe being 'sterile' I've often got the impression that us Brits probably have a lot in common with the Spanish - I've barely climbed there but from looking at the guidebooks & the odd copy of Desnivel plus some ski mountaineering trips using Spanish huts it seems they have lots of 'trad' or near trad routes in the mountains & an attitude to the mountains quite similar to the UK
Another problem with Vertical which Toby didn't mention is the lack of a website for information on subscriptions & the lateness of edition 2 - hardly a way of attracting new readers.
In reply to JoH - Editor:
Anyone know if issue 2 is available anywhere in Sheffield at the moment? It seems hard to track down.
Anyone know if issue 2 is available anywhere in Sheffield at the moment? It seems hard to track down.
In reply to amf37:
Does anyone know where to get hold of a copy in Manchester, still not tracked a retailer that stocks them.
Does anyone know where to get hold of a copy in Manchester, still not tracked a retailer that stocks them.
In reply to JoH - Editor:
Is the title "Vertical Magazine - un magasin pour l'union européenne" a play on words or a spelling mistake??
Cheers
Is the title "Vertical Magazine - un magasin pour l'union européenne" a play on words or a spelling mistake??
Cheers
In reply to gimmer: 'Magasin' is French for 'a shop'. Think the French use *our* word 'magazine' for magazine! (funny, the more I type 'magazine' the weirder the word seems)
In reply to Marc C: Tout a fait correct
'Magazine' is yet another example of the creeping anglicisation of the language of Racine, Moliere etc (a tangent I know but I had a look at the website of the newly launched 'France 24' (the French answer to CNN which Chirac insisted be created) last night - complete with adverts in English !)
But I guess only Toby knows what he meant
'Magazine' is yet another example of the creeping anglicisation of the language of Racine, Moliere etc (a tangent I know but I had a look at the website of the newly launched 'France 24' (the French answer to CNN which Chirac insisted be created) last night - complete with adverts in English !)
But I guess only Toby knows what he meant
In reply to Doug: But interestingly the French use 'magasin' for the original English meaning of 'magazine', a place to store arms or a container of bullets.
In reply to Doug: My French is rubbish so I checked in a dictionary and an online translator. I also asked my missus who does speak French if it sounded right and she said 'yeah', but that might just prove how much attention she pays to me!
Jo picked it out as the title, I just had it as a throwaway line in the review. If the French is wrong, it should just be chopped away, I was just trying to make a vaguely humourous point about EU multilingualism where everything needs an official translation into 17 different languages or whatever it is now!
Jo picked it out as the title, I just had it as a throwaway line in the review. If the French is wrong, it should just be chopped away, I was just trying to make a vaguely humourous point about EU multilingualism where everything needs an official translation into 17 different languages or whatever it is now!
In reply to TobyA: 'But who edits the editors?'
In reply to Marc C: 'But who edits the editors?'
Surely you meant 'Quis custodiet ipsos custodes', old chap?
Surely you meant 'Quis custodiet ipsos custodes', old chap?
In reply to TobyA: Google Translate still gives magasin as the translation in French for Magazine - so it Google wrong? Wouldn't be the first time!
Having just checked another 99p English-French dictionary, that suggests google is wrong, and magasin that is a gun's magazine and the French should have been "magazine"!
And my better half said she never would have told me that and I'm obviously thick.
Having just checked another 99p English-French dictionary, that suggests google is wrong, and magasin that is a gun's magazine and the French should have been "magazine"!
And my better half said she never would have told me that and I'm obviously thick.
In reply to JoH - Editor: Sorry sweety. We shall both blame Mr Ryan then shall we?
I will remain resolutely mono-lingual in future reviews.
I will remain resolutely mono-lingual in future reviews.
In reply to John2: Well I was making a play on that, but lacked the Latin to do it justice!
In reply to TobyA: Do you realise that your linguistic solecism could attract the attention of a roving Daily Mail reporter, and be used as a 'damning' argument against European Union? "'Bullseye' Archer misses the target - UKC's Finnish Ambassador can't tell difference between butchers and magazine"
In reply to TobyA: another fault with Google - but then its probably an American plot to undermine the French language
In reply to Doug:
Anyone seen isuue 3 out and about yet? I went looking yesterday, but Borders on Charing Cross Rd were still only selling issue 2. Another 3 week delay?
AJM
Anyone seen isuue 3 out and about yet? I went looking yesterday, but Borders on Charing Cross Rd were still only selling issue 2. Another 3 week delay?
AJM
In reply to Doug:
Oh not probably, definately. Chirac himself would tell you so I'm sure.
> probably an American plot to undermine the French language
Oh not probably, definately. Chirac himself would tell you so I'm sure.
In reply to AJM: I think I now have a subscription and I don't have no.3 yet so they don't seem to be posting them out yet either.
In reply to JoH - Editor:
Is there really any point in publishing reviews of magazines over 7 weeks after they hit the newstands?
Anyone who is interested will already have read it and forgotten most of the articles by now!
Is there really any point in publishing reviews of magazines over 7 weeks after they hit the newstands?
Anyone who is interested will already have read it and forgotten most of the articles by now!
In reply to TobyA: When was No 3 due to be published ?
In reply to Doug:
come on guys, where can you buy a copy. Ellis Brghams dont sell it , they gave me a number in Belgium to ring , that was in French.
Has anyone got any idea where i can subscribe/buy a copy from in the Mnachester/North Wales area .
come on guys, where can you buy a copy. Ellis Brghams dont sell it , they gave me a number in Belgium to ring , that was in French.
Has anyone got any idea where i can subscribe/buy a copy from in the Mnachester/North Wales area .
In reply to TobyA:
Nice review. You make it sound like it's worth buying!
"The magazine lacks some of the features that we have grown used to in the British mags; no gear reviews, no training article and none of the gossipy local news. This may be considered a strength or weakness depending on what you are looking for."
Diplomatically put. Have you noticed that all the best mags. never have gear reviews?
Nice review. You make it sound like it's worth buying!
"The magazine lacks some of the features that we have grown used to in the British mags; no gear reviews, no training article and none of the gossipy local news. This may be considered a strength or weakness depending on what you are looking for."
Diplomatically put. Have you noticed that all the best mags. never have gear reviews?
In reply to Doug:
The back of issue 2 said the 25th September, which I assumed to be a typo since 2 didn't come out until the start of October.
I guessed that 2 months later was their intention and that it should have been out the 25th Nov.
Its a fantastic magazine, the only one I've considered subscribing to (except maybe Alpinist, which this seems to be a scaled down version of in some respects), but their inability to get it out on time, and the pathetic range of shops which stock it, are beginning to bug me..........
AJM
The back of issue 2 said the 25th September, which I assumed to be a typo since 2 didn't come out until the start of October.
I guessed that 2 months later was their intention and that it should have been out the 25th Nov.
Its a fantastic magazine, the only one I've considered subscribing to (except maybe Alpinist, which this seems to be a scaled down version of in some respects), but their inability to get it out on time, and the pathetic range of shops which stock it, are beginning to bug me..........
AJM
In reply to AJM: Do you have a copy to hand ? do they give an email address where we could ask when its due ?
I've tried (yet again) looking for a website & there's nothing and the website for the publisher ( http://www.niveales.com/ ) has no mention that they now own Vertical or an email address
As you say, very frustrating - they ought to be reading this & the 2 or 3 related threads concerning its lateness & the difficulty of finding it
I've tried (yet again) looking for a website & there's nothing and the website for the publisher ( http://www.niveales.com/ ) has no mention that they now own Vertical or an email address
As you say, very frustrating - they ought to be reading this & the 2 or 3 related threads concerning its lateness & the difficulty of finding it
In reply to Doug: You could try this one http://www.intermagazines.com/?rubrique=21&numero_titre=441
In reply to Doug:
claude@vertical-magazine.com is the email for the editor.
neil.b@ will give you Neil Brodie, the (UK I'm almost sure) deputy editor
Those seem to be the most relevant ones.
It says they should be out on the bimonths of Jul Sept Nov Jan Mar May, so, it being over a week into December, number 3 should be about really........
I am a bit tied up now, but might email them later, unless you're likely to be able to do it first?
AJM
claude@vertical-magazine.com is the email for the editor.
neil.b@ will give you Neil Brodie, the (UK I'm almost sure) deputy editor
Those seem to be the most relevant ones.
It says they should be out on the bimonths of Jul Sept Nov Jan Mar May, so, it being over a week into December, number 3 should be about really........
I am a bit tied up now, but might email them later, unless you're likely to be able to do it first?
AJM
In reply to AJM:
Yes. Since "High" expired, and Climb became a glossfest which declares its intention to concentrate on the sub-HVS audience, there's not much about for the aspiring punter mountaineer (who struggles with E1 but likes long days of S in big boots at altitude.)
Alpinist is more aspiring than punter, not cheap, and US-centric (as far as I can see from a few glimpses.) If Vertical can get its sh1t together, it could fill the gap.
Y
Yes. Since "High" expired, and Climb became a glossfest which declares its intention to concentrate on the sub-HVS audience, there's not much about for the aspiring punter mountaineer (who struggles with E1 but likes long days of S in big boots at altitude.)
Alpinist is more aspiring than punter, not cheap, and US-centric (as far as I can see from a few glimpses.) If Vertical can get its sh1t together, it could fill the gap.
Y
In reply to all
I've just had a reply from the editor Claude Gardien
"Désolé, nous sommes encore en retard ! Le nouveau Vertical en 4 langues est assez complexe à réaliser, et nous avons découvert petit à petit les problèmes que cela posait. Nous espérons mieux maîtriser tout ça dès le Nr4 mais ce n'est pas gagné !
Il y a des problèmes de distribution dans plusieurs pays. Ce n'est pas non plus très facile à faire évoluer car nous nous adressons à des entrreprises spécialisées et le détail des opérations est difficile à suivre.
J'ai tous les Mountain de l'époque de Ken Wilson chez mioi !! J'adorais.
Merci pour votre compliment.
Claude Gardien
or for the linguitically challenged a quick & rough translation.
"Sorry we are again late. The new Vertical in 4 languages is somewhat complicated to produce & we are discovering, little by little, the problems that poses. We hope to better control all that from No 4 onwards but its not easy.
There are distribution problems in several countries. Its not very easy to improve as we use specialists in distribution and its difficult to follow in detail.
I have all the Mountain from the time of Ken Wilson at home, I love them.
Thanks for your compliments"
For completeness here's my email to him
J’aimais le 'new look' Vertical, j'ai même écrit ça sur un site web Britannique ( http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=221 ) mais ou se trouve l'édition décembre/janvier ? Vers le fin de la dernière Vertical vous avez écrit 'novembre 25' mais nous sommes déjà le 14 décembre et, au moins à Paris, rien dans les bacs.
Aussi, je ne sais pas si vous lisez le Web, mais il semble que vous avez un problème de distribution l'autre côte de la Manche - voir
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=216053
Mais bon chance, comme Britannique mais vivant en France je trouve le perspective européenne, presque mondiale, très bon, beaucoup mieux que le ancien Vertical et peut-être aussi bon que 'Mountain' sous le direction de Ken Wilson.
Cordialement
Doug
I've just had a reply from the editor Claude Gardien
"Désolé, nous sommes encore en retard ! Le nouveau Vertical en 4 langues est assez complexe à réaliser, et nous avons découvert petit à petit les problèmes que cela posait. Nous espérons mieux maîtriser tout ça dès le Nr4 mais ce n'est pas gagné !
Il y a des problèmes de distribution dans plusieurs pays. Ce n'est pas non plus très facile à faire évoluer car nous nous adressons à des entrreprises spécialisées et le détail des opérations est difficile à suivre.
J'ai tous les Mountain de l'époque de Ken Wilson chez mioi !! J'adorais.
Merci pour votre compliment.
Claude Gardien
or for the linguitically challenged a quick & rough translation.
"Sorry we are again late. The new Vertical in 4 languages is somewhat complicated to produce & we are discovering, little by little, the problems that poses. We hope to better control all that from No 4 onwards but its not easy.
There are distribution problems in several countries. Its not very easy to improve as we use specialists in distribution and its difficult to follow in detail.
I have all the Mountain from the time of Ken Wilson at home, I love them.
Thanks for your compliments"
For completeness here's my email to him
J’aimais le 'new look' Vertical, j'ai même écrit ça sur un site web Britannique ( http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=221 ) mais ou se trouve l'édition décembre/janvier ? Vers le fin de la dernière Vertical vous avez écrit 'novembre 25' mais nous sommes déjà le 14 décembre et, au moins à Paris, rien dans les bacs.
Aussi, je ne sais pas si vous lisez le Web, mais il semble que vous avez un problème de distribution l'autre côte de la Manche - voir
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=216053
Mais bon chance, comme Britannique mais vivant en France je trouve le perspective européenne, presque mondiale, très bon, beaucoup mieux que le ancien Vertical et peut-être aussi bon que 'Mountain' sous le direction de Ken Wilson.
Cordialement
Doug
In reply to JoH - Editor:
Sorry to bump this thread back up, but does anyone know where my best bet is to find a copy in London? Ellis Brigham (site of the launch of the English edition) somewhat confusingly doesn't sell them and one of the chaps in there said WHSmiths was my best bet. I've ventured into a couple of WHS's without success.
So, is there a London Smith's selling these, or do any of the London walls?
Ta
Adam
Sorry to bump this thread back up, but does anyone know where my best bet is to find a copy in London? Ellis Brigham (site of the launch of the English edition) somewhat confusingly doesn't sell them and one of the chaps in there said WHSmiths was my best bet. I've ventured into a couple of WHS's without success.
So, is there a London Smith's selling these, or do any of the London walls?
Ta
Adam
In reply to adamtheclimber:
The Borders on Charing Cross Road (walking south from Tott Ct Rd station towards Leics Sq, on the LHS) does it. If you go in and find issue 3 is out, please let me know.
AJM
The Borders on Charing Cross Road (walking south from Tott Ct Rd station towards Leics Sq, on the LHS) does it. If you go in and find issue 3 is out, please let me know.
AJM
In reply to adamtheclimber: Smiths in Manchester certainly sell it.
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