This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
"Like many of you, I receive a lot of penis enlargement spam—lately, even more the usual. Unlike many of you, I don't need it.
Ha, ha! That's only a “little” joke to get me started after a hiatus spent building pyramids, writing symphonies and having three-legged races with myself.
Where I meant to take the penis-spam remark is to compare it to other mail that I've received lately, also in vaster quantities than usual. That is, British climbing propaganda, especially DVDs."
Andrew Bisharat lets rip: http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=1602
Ha, ha! That's only a “little” joke to get me started after a hiatus spent building pyramids, writing symphonies and having three-legged races with myself.
Where I meant to take the penis-spam remark is to compare it to other mail that I've received lately, also in vaster quantities than usual. That is, British climbing propaganda, especially DVDs."
Andrew Bisharat lets rip: http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=1602
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
eh? What's his point? What's your point by making an article from his blog post? So keen film makers and keen climbers are putting together lots of movies with some good climbing in 'em and....that's a bad thing? no one's forced to buy them. only scanned it once but what a crock of shit. Think you should stick to spraying about how many million people have read the articles by other poeple this week rather than trying to come up with new ones.
eh? What's his point? What's your point by making an article from his blog post? So keen film makers and keen climbers are putting together lots of movies with some good climbing in 'em and....that's a bad thing? no one's forced to buy them. only scanned it once but what a crock of shit. Think you should stick to spraying about how many million people have read the articles by other poeple this week rather than trying to come up with new ones.
In reply to Steve Ramsden: Completely agree. I've no idea what he was trying to argue!
"crock of shit" sums it up well.
"crock of shit" sums it up well.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Just getting bitter and twisted because not enough people are making films of Americans standing in slings and holding on to their gear by the sound of it!
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Ive read it twice now, I thought I may have missed something but no, why is that news?
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Wish I could have gotten away with saying that. PMSL. will check out his blog for sure!
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I reckon Andrew Bisharat is the finest climbing writer around at the moment. This isn't his absolutely best work though. Still ... some nice lines:
"We all know who Dave Birkett is, yet we've never understood a single thing he has spoken."
"It's like having one word for food. Imagine going to a restaurant, and the only items on the menu are Food 1, Food 2, Food 3 ... all the way up to Food 11, which combines the highest price with the “best taste” (nutrition doesn't get factored in). "
A couple of my favourites from Andrew:
(Deep Water) Zeitgeist
http://www.rockandice.com/inthemag.php?id=12&type=featart
Zen and the Art of Jeep Maintenance
http://www.rockandice.com/inthemag.php?id=24&type=tnb
I reckon Andrew Bisharat is the finest climbing writer around at the moment. This isn't his absolutely best work though. Still ... some nice lines:
"We all know who Dave Birkett is, yet we've never understood a single thing he has spoken."
"It's like having one word for food. Imagine going to a restaurant, and the only items on the menu are Food 1, Food 2, Food 3 ... all the way up to Food 11, which combines the highest price with the “best taste” (nutrition doesn't get factored in). "
A couple of my favourites from Andrew:
(Deep Water) Zeitgeist
http://www.rockandice.com/inthemag.php?id=12&type=featart
Zen and the Art of Jeep Maintenance
http://www.rockandice.com/inthemag.php?id=24&type=tnb
In reply to tobyfk: I think it should be pointed out to Andrew that because they have what are generally called "big cliffs" in the US, as opposed to British "little cliffs", it is actually really hard work and loads of faff with abseiling and anchors and all that sh*t to get the camera angles for US movies. This is very much unlike, say, Burbage where it takes on average approximately 17.3 seconds to walk from the bottom of your chosen E10, to the grubby descent gully next to it, clamber the 25 feet to the top and reposition your camera there for the next shot. Hell, by the time your average leader has managed to place one bit of gear, you can normally get from the bottom of the route to the top having done no more than 'fourth class' climbing.
It's exactly the same reason as why this site is full of thousands of perfectly good bouldering photos, and millions of not so good ones, but not enough good pictures of ice climbers leading.
For this reason alone, Mr and Mrs Macleod should be sponsored by Rock and Ice to get Green Cards to make the next 'great American climbing movie', after their gargantuan efforts of slogging up and down Ben Nevis a thousand times to both climb and make the movie of Echo Wall. This is patently NOT Burbage. Whether Andrew can understand Dave and Clare is another matter, but the Yanks seem to like Sean Connery so I'm sure they will be fine.
It's exactly the same reason as why this site is full of thousands of perfectly good bouldering photos, and millions of not so good ones, but not enough good pictures of ice climbers leading.
For this reason alone, Mr and Mrs Macleod should be sponsored by Rock and Ice to get Green Cards to make the next 'great American climbing movie', after their gargantuan efforts of slogging up and down Ben Nevis a thousand times to both climb and make the movie of Echo Wall. This is patently NOT Burbage. Whether Andrew can understand Dave and Clare is another matter, but the Yanks seem to like Sean Connery so I'm sure they will be fine.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I thought that was quite funny, I particularly like the line "I'm quite rather gripped here...".
Piss taking is good for you and there should be more of it in my opinion.
I thought that was quite funny, I particularly like the line "I'm quite rather gripped here...".
Piss taking is good for you and there should be more of it in my opinion.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: you're right its not news but that's probably why its in the articles section? calm down as well cos he's only having a laugh. did your sense of humour get buried in the snow??
In reply to tobyfk: 'I reckon Andrew Bisharat is the finest climbing writer around at the moment'
I've no complaints about the subject matter of his writing - I thought the op ed linked to by Mick was amusing and made some very good points. Technically, however, he has yet to come to terms with the structure of the English language. One short extract from the DWS article contains the following infelicities - 'a small white beach sparsely festooned with the burnt mounds of naked, stinking flesh that belonged to German tourists' 'He exploded into the air and was sucked into the sea with foreboding speed and force' 'though she claims that climbing is no longer that big of a deal to her'.
Obviously he's learned some of the elements of his prose style from the Gonzo journalism of Hunter Thompson and I've nothing against that. But Thompson did have a basic grounding in the rules of grammar. One has a right to expect that from someone who makes his living from writing.
I've no complaints about the subject matter of his writing - I thought the op ed linked to by Mick was amusing and made some very good points. Technically, however, he has yet to come to terms with the structure of the English language. One short extract from the DWS article contains the following infelicities - 'a small white beach sparsely festooned with the burnt mounds of naked, stinking flesh that belonged to German tourists' 'He exploded into the air and was sucked into the sea with foreboding speed and force' 'though she claims that climbing is no longer that big of a deal to her'.
Obviously he's learned some of the elements of his prose style from the Gonzo journalism of Hunter Thompson and I've nothing against that. But Thompson did have a basic grounding in the rules of grammar. One has a right to expect that from someone who makes his living from writing.
In reply to tobyfk:
I agree, his writing makes my R&I subscription worthwhile on it's own, and I always look forward to receiving a new TNB email.
> (In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com)
>
> I reckon Andrew Bisharat is the finest climbing writer around at the moment.
>
> I reckon Andrew Bisharat is the finest climbing writer around at the moment.
I agree, his writing makes my R&I subscription worthwhile on it's own, and I always look forward to receiving a new TNB email.
Quite a good article me thinks. Yes, it is OTT satire, and pretty funny at times. But the general underlying points are quite bang on IMO. Some recent British achievements have been blown embarrassingly out of proportion both in videos and in the magazines. And on this site.
Even Hard Grit has embarrassingly melodramatic narration at times. This seems totally at odds with the traditional British stiff upper lip and understatement, it’s almost American, FFS.
What we need to do is wind our necks in a little.
I think gritstone is the main culprit amongst the reems and reems of hyperbole presented to us in the media. I remember watching Hard Grit when I first started climbing – it blew me away. Until, that is, I actually went climbing on grit – underwhelmed would be an understatement: a proliferation of dumpy, contrived non lines and two move wonders.
Even Hard Grit has embarrassingly melodramatic narration at times. This seems totally at odds with the traditional British stiff upper lip and understatement, it’s almost American, FFS.
What we need to do is wind our necks in a little.
I think gritstone is the main culprit amongst the reems and reems of hyperbole presented to us in the media. I remember watching Hard Grit when I first started climbing – it blew me away. Until, that is, I actually went climbing on grit – underwhelmed would be an understatement: a proliferation of dumpy, contrived non lines and two move wonders.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Pure poetry. The Charlie Brooker of the climbing world?
In reply to John2:
I'd love to be able to nod in agreement, John, but sadly my own command of grammer is not 100% and I suspect much of the UKC audience are (or should that be "is"?) similar. Would you mind rewriting AB's offending sentences for us so as to illustrate your point?
Meanwhile it would of course be unkind to point out the irony that you - an Oxbridge-trained grammatician and classicist - earn your crust through programming computers - whilst Mr Bisharat - an illiterate colonial - gets paid to write.
> Technically, however, he has yet to come to terms with the structure of the English language. One short extract from the DWS article contains the following infelicities - 'a small white beach sparsely festooned with the burnt mounds of naked, stinking flesh that belonged to German tourists' 'He exploded into the air and was sucked into the sea with foreboding speed and force' 'though she claims that climbing is no longer that big of a deal to her'.
I'd love to be able to nod in agreement, John, but sadly my own command of grammer is not 100% and I suspect much of the UKC audience are (or should that be "is"?) similar. Would you mind rewriting AB's offending sentences for us so as to illustrate your point?
Meanwhile it would of course be unkind to point out the irony that you - an Oxbridge-trained grammatician and classicist - earn your crust through programming computers - whilst Mr Bisharat - an illiterate colonial - gets paid to write.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Some people won't get it, but they're probably the same ones who engage in endless debates on here about James Pearson, "how can *whatever* be E10" and "what colour rope should i buy?" (real thread).
Andrew Bishsharat is an excellent writer. His Tuesday Night Bouldering column is better than anything I ever read in a British mag. His very obvious and clear points about the overhyping of grit (amongst other things in the UK) are just common sense. WHat's the point of his article? That's obvious too: he's taking the piss.
x
Andrew Bishsharat is an excellent writer. His Tuesday Night Bouldering column is better than anything I ever read in a British mag. His very obvious and clear points about the overhyping of grit (amongst other things in the UK) are just common sense. WHat's the point of his article? That's obvious too: he's taking the piss.
x
In reply to The Flying Giraffe:
And it often seems to fall on the yanks to point this out:
"Have you ever seen the gritstone?" Geoff Birtles asked me. I hadn't. We were in Sheffield, England, where I was visiting with Birtles, the editor of High Mountain Sports magazine, on a brief working tour of the country for The American Alpine Journal. With two hours remaining before my departure, I jumped into his Citroen, and we careened down the narrow streets, the rolling countryside greeting us as we emerged from the industrial pallor of Sheffield's roads. Parking among a row of neatly filed cars, we set off. The trail dropped into a depression, where we soon encountered a low swath of dark-gray stone, mottled with holes, cool to the touch. I followed Birtles, waiting to see the fabled grit. A couple of climbers were racking up, curiously enough, for a twenty-foot crack. Farther on, another pair was doing the same thing, racks of nuts on Perlon and giant hexes clanging at their sides. They must be out on their inaugural climbs, I thought, practicing as they were on these boulders. Suddenly it dawned on me that these boulders were the fabled gritstone. Dear Lord, I thought, the poor island and its inhabitants."
http://www.alpinist.com/doc/ALP08/editors-note-monsters
[Posted here before but surely worthy of a regular showing?]
> I think gritstone is the main culprit amongst the reems and reems of hyperbole presented to us in the media.
And it often seems to fall on the yanks to point this out:
"Have you ever seen the gritstone?" Geoff Birtles asked me. I hadn't. We were in Sheffield, England, where I was visiting with Birtles, the editor of High Mountain Sports magazine, on a brief working tour of the country for The American Alpine Journal. With two hours remaining before my departure, I jumped into his Citroen, and we careened down the narrow streets, the rolling countryside greeting us as we emerged from the industrial pallor of Sheffield's roads. Parking among a row of neatly filed cars, we set off. The trail dropped into a depression, where we soon encountered a low swath of dark-gray stone, mottled with holes, cool to the touch. I followed Birtles, waiting to see the fabled grit. A couple of climbers were racking up, curiously enough, for a twenty-foot crack. Farther on, another pair was doing the same thing, racks of nuts on Perlon and giant hexes clanging at their sides. They must be out on their inaugural climbs, I thought, practicing as they were on these boulders. Suddenly it dawned on me that these boulders were the fabled gritstone. Dear Lord, I thought, the poor island and its inhabitants."
http://www.alpinist.com/doc/ALP08/editors-note-monsters
[Posted here before but surely worthy of a regular showing?]
In reply to tobyfk:
Clearly neither is your spelig...
> but sadly my own command of grammer is not 100%
Clearly neither is your spelig...
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I wish I was american too.
I wish I was american too.
In reply to tobyfk: How very dare he. Burbage North is one of the World's great crags!
In reply to tobyfk:
Now that's good writing. Perhaps I've not read the best of this Bisharat guy - he just seemed to be trying too hard. Some funny lines, though.
Now that's good writing. Perhaps I've not read the best of this Bisharat guy - he just seemed to be trying too hard. Some funny lines, though.
In reply to tobyfk: Since you ask - 'a small white beach sparsely festooned with the burnt mounds of naked, stinking flesh that belonged to German tourists'. The 'the' in the phrase 'the burnt mounds' is redundant since the tourists themselves are not identified.
'He exploded into the air and was sucked into the sea with foreboding speed and force'. Foreboding is generally used as a noun, and I suspect that he thought that he was using it as an adjective with a meaning equivalent to 'forbidding'. If he was attempting to use it in a humorous manner as a noun he should have put a comma between it and 'speed'.
'though she claims that climbing is no longer that big of a deal to her'. The of is redundant.
Regrettably I do earn my crust by programming computers, and the main result of my linguistic training is merely to provoke pedantic irritation when I read prose such as this. I'm afraid the result is that I find it difficult to get to the end of articles that are so consistently badly written. I repeat though, I thought the original op ed was very good - I haven't heard anyone make the point about dynamic belaying making Sonny Trotter's falls less painful than Dave Macleod's before.
'He exploded into the air and was sucked into the sea with foreboding speed and force'. Foreboding is generally used as a noun, and I suspect that he thought that he was using it as an adjective with a meaning equivalent to 'forbidding'. If he was attempting to use it in a humorous manner as a noun he should have put a comma between it and 'speed'.
'though she claims that climbing is no longer that big of a deal to her'. The of is redundant.
Regrettably I do earn my crust by programming computers, and the main result of my linguistic training is merely to provoke pedantic irritation when I read prose such as this. I'm afraid the result is that I find it difficult to get to the end of articles that are so consistently badly written. I repeat though, I thought the original op ed was very good - I haven't heard anyone make the point about dynamic belaying making Sonny Trotter's falls less painful than Dave Macleod's before.
In reply to Richard123:
And of the complacency of US film makers, the last bit about the lack of grass roots films being produced is a nice touch
> (In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com)
>
> Very good; very funny. A nice piss take of the Brits.
>
> Very good; very funny. A nice piss take of the Brits.
And of the complacency of US film makers, the last bit about the lack of grass roots films being produced is a nice touch
In reply to John2: How utterly tedious...
In reply to Removed User: Look, I only expanded on my original comment because Toby asked me to. My original complaint stands - I find Bisharat's longer articles unreadable.
In reply to John2:
>
Or maybe 'ominous', in which case what would the problem be?
http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/foreboding?view=uk
>
>
> and I suspect that he thought that he was using it as an adjective with a meaning equivalent to 'forbidding'.
> and I suspect that he thought that he was using it as an adjective with a meaning equivalent to 'forbidding'.
Or maybe 'ominous', in which case what would the problem be?
http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/foreboding?view=uk
In reply to John2:
sounds silly to me. Nothing wrong with trying to use language imaginatively but that is like saying the something is stuffed empty.
> sparsely festooned
sounds silly to me. Nothing wrong with trying to use language imaginatively but that is like saying the something is stuffed empty.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
An entertaining read.
But why, Mick, do you post it as an article and not just post a link to the original blog as a forum post?
An entertaining read.
But why, Mick, do you post it as an article and not just post a link to the original blog as a forum post?
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Fantastic satire for a Seppo. In fact I'm amazed most of that didn't go over his own head. Good stuff.
The Ent
Fantastic satire for a Seppo. In fact I'm amazed most of that didn't go over his own head. Good stuff.
The Ent
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
He's slating the size of our cliffs, but big cliffs are over-rated anyway. I don't want to have to spend a week living off a portaledge every time I go climbing. Noooooo, I much prefer a big slap-up breakfast followed by 2 quick routes of no more than diff in standard and 10m in height, lunch in the pub, and if motivation is still present (and if it's not started raining) a couple of VDiffs in the afternoon. This is followed by a night in the pub, obviously.
Why would anyone want it any other way?
He's slating the size of our cliffs, but big cliffs are over-rated anyway. I don't want to have to spend a week living off a portaledge every time I go climbing. Noooooo, I much prefer a big slap-up breakfast followed by 2 quick routes of no more than diff in standard and 10m in height, lunch in the pub, and if motivation is still present (and if it's not started raining) a couple of VDiffs in the afternoon. This is followed by a night in the pub, obviously.
Why would anyone want it any other way?
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I know its meant to be a piss take. But its simply not funny.
Grit grit grit, blah blah blah
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
I know its meant to be a piss take. But its simply not funny.
Grit grit grit, blah blah blah
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
In reply to Mick
Why not commission, or write, your own? You have a natty turn of phrase when provoked.
Why not commission, or write, your own? You have a natty turn of phrase when provoked.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I quite liked it...but mostly for the unintended (I think) ironies.
I quite liked it...but mostly for the unintended (I think) ironies.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Haha, brilliant! Good humour.
In reply to Derbyshire Ben:
Indeed. I don't think I suggested otherwise.
> (In reply to Martin76)
> The Alpinist column was written by Christian Beckwith I think?
Indeed. I don't think I suggested otherwise.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Sweet revenge, considering how many non-American films we get to see here in the UK.
Amusing article. I trust he doesn't take himself too seriously - mebbe I should read one of his "in-depth features."
Y
Sweet revenge, considering how many non-American films we get to see here in the UK.
Amusing article. I trust he doesn't take himself too seriously - mebbe I should read one of his "in-depth features."
Y
In reply to Anonymous: Takes me back to when some American friends of mine came to the UK . They used to refer to it as your soggy island , and the crags as lumps of petrified mouse shit !!
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Hello
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
brilliant!
classic piss taking.
a great article, keep em coming.
brilliant!
classic piss taking.
a great article, keep em coming.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Nicely provocative article to put up Mick. In my view there is certainly a shoegazing attitude amongst the climbing community in the UK, as opposed to the stadium-rock of the U.S..
Jim.
Nicely provocative article to put up Mick. In my view there is certainly a shoegazing attitude amongst the climbing community in the UK, as opposed to the stadium-rock of the U.S..
Jim.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Nothing to get too flustered about. Maybe his English grilfriend has just left him? Maybe he just needs a hug?
Nothing to get too flustered about. Maybe his English grilfriend has just left him? Maybe he just needs a hug?
In reply to John2:
"the main result of my linguistic training is merely to provoke pedantic irritation when I read prose such as this. I'm afraid the result is that I find it difficult to get to the end of articles that are so consistently badly written."
Your loss (and maybe a good reason for people to be careful with linguistic training). It's obviously beneficial when useful or interesting prose is very well written but the fairly trivial points you've raised hardly distort the 'core meaning' (or lack suitability for the main target audience). Rejecting something good because of annoyance with the 'window dressing' is pretty stupid behaviour (even if pointing out the faults is useful).
"the main result of my linguistic training is merely to provoke pedantic irritation when I read prose such as this. I'm afraid the result is that I find it difficult to get to the end of articles that are so consistently badly written."
Your loss (and maybe a good reason for people to be careful with linguistic training). It's obviously beneficial when useful or interesting prose is very well written but the fairly trivial points you've raised hardly distort the 'core meaning' (or lack suitability for the main target audience). Rejecting something good because of annoyance with the 'window dressing' is pretty stupid behaviour (even if pointing out the faults is useful).
In reply to Offwidth: I disagree entirely. Toby was claiming that Bisharat was the best writer currently writing about climbing or some such. Patently he is not a good writer. He is like a child with a colouring book, wildly splashing the brightest colours in his paintbox about without bothering to ensure that he fills in each shape without encroaching into the shape next door.
In reply to John2:
You've read a lot of his work then John?
I agree with Toby FK actually. I get R+I each month and always enjoy his features.
Good, entertaining writers who cut through the crap are very rare in the climbing world. Andrew is one of these writers in my opinion - but like music or any of the arts we all won't agree.
Mick
You've read a lot of his work then John?
I agree with Toby FK actually. I get R+I each month and always enjoy his features.
Good, entertaining writers who cut through the crap are very rare in the climbing world. Andrew is one of these writers in my opinion - but like music or any of the arts we all won't agree.
Mick
In reply to John2:
If someone was looking to read that in the worse possible way, they could come away with the impression that you are a very boring and pedantic person.
Those who always "keep within the lines" might be perfectly good, workaday writers, but they are unlikely to be the most interesting.
> without bothering to ensure that he fills in each shape without encroaching into the shape next door.
If someone was looking to read that in the worse possible way, they could come away with the impression that you are a very boring and pedantic person.
Those who always "keep within the lines" might be perfectly good, workaday writers, but they are unlikely to be the most interesting.
In reply to jazzyjackson:
Yeah I may be missing something but it just looked like nonsense to me.
(I did like his faux-intense portrait photo though).
> Bisharat is a bonafide purveyor of gibberish.
Yeah I may be missing something but it just looked like nonsense to me.
(I did like his faux-intense portrait photo though).
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: I've just attempted to read Toby's links. As others have pointed out, the guy is trying too hard. He sprays words about without stopping to think what they mean. The content of his writing may or may not be interesting - I've no idea because his style is so irritating that I can't get to the end of his longer pieces.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Like it.
I liked it more though when I didn't read carefully and thought it was written by you.
Pity he said he was taking the piss...
Like it.
I liked it more though when I didn't read carefully and thought it was written by you.
Pity he said he was taking the piss...
In reply to John2:
I've no idea because his style is so irritating that I can't get to the end of his longer pieces.
He's a Yank, what do you expect...
I've no idea because his style is so irritating that I can't get to the end of his longer pieces.
He's a Yank, what do you expect...
In reply to anabaric:
I expect you'd find my two children irritating, just because they are Yanks.
Jeez.... some people!
> (In reply to John2)
> I've no idea because his style is so irritating that I can't get to the end of his longer pieces.
>
> He's a Yank, what do you expect...
> I've no idea because his style is so irritating that I can't get to the end of his longer pieces.
>
> He's a Yank, what do you expect...
I expect you'd find my two children irritating, just because they are Yanks.
Jeez.... some people!
Hi
Thanx for the great feedback on my blog post. I've enjoyed reading everyone's comments.
I wanted to make one small point of clarification, that won't be important to anyone but me (and my nefarious life partner: my own ego). I write a weekly blog for Rock and Ice, an e-mail that gets sent out to a big list of people that tends to love, hate or not give a shit about what I say.
I spend about an hour writing the blog/e-mail on Tuesday morning over coffee. No one edits it, or checks it. It's often misspelled, full of dangling participles, and sometimes the point is moot and doesn't make sense. It's embarrassing. After I'm done writing it, I put it out of my head and focus on all of the other work I do that consumes more of my time and passion.
Mick saw "The British Invasion" on my blog, and asked me if he could post it here. At first, I said no--but when I realized he was paying me a nice, rare compliment that someone of my talent doesn't often receive, I agreed. It's surprising to me that anyone takes anything I write seriously. As someone pointed out, I probably know as much about grammar as I do the British climbing scene.
But to me, good writing just means crafting something that's interesting to read--even if some of the rules are broken along the way. Also, I think the best writing takes real confidence. And by that, I mean the confidence to listen to the voice in your head and translate the words onto paper without holding back. That's what I try to do that--sometimes it works, most of the time it doesn't. We live in modern, digital age when a person is judged by first drafts and blogs. It's probably a mixed blessing.
So, anyway, even though I take my work seriously, I don't expect anyone else to. If there's anything more absurd than spending all of your time climbing up rocks, it's spending all of your time reading (or writing) about climbing up rocks.
Ok ... thanx again for the interesting feedback--I'm truly grateful for what has been written here. You can subscribe to the weekly eBlast by going here.
http://rockandice.com/tnbemail.php
I also would encourage everyone to subscribe to Rock and Ice magazine since the writing in the magazine is way better. Plus you get to look at all of the pretty pictures. I've also heard that a subscription to Rock and Ice actually makes you a better climber and may prevent cancer.
https://bigstonepub.com/rockandice/subscribe.php
Peace,
AB
Thanx for the great feedback on my blog post. I've enjoyed reading everyone's comments.
I wanted to make one small point of clarification, that won't be important to anyone but me (and my nefarious life partner: my own ego). I write a weekly blog for Rock and Ice, an e-mail that gets sent out to a big list of people that tends to love, hate or not give a shit about what I say.
I spend about an hour writing the blog/e-mail on Tuesday morning over coffee. No one edits it, or checks it. It's often misspelled, full of dangling participles, and sometimes the point is moot and doesn't make sense. It's embarrassing. After I'm done writing it, I put it out of my head and focus on all of the other work I do that consumes more of my time and passion.
Mick saw "The British Invasion" on my blog, and asked me if he could post it here. At first, I said no--but when I realized he was paying me a nice, rare compliment that someone of my talent doesn't often receive, I agreed. It's surprising to me that anyone takes anything I write seriously. As someone pointed out, I probably know as much about grammar as I do the British climbing scene.
But to me, good writing just means crafting something that's interesting to read--even if some of the rules are broken along the way. Also, I think the best writing takes real confidence. And by that, I mean the confidence to listen to the voice in your head and translate the words onto paper without holding back. That's what I try to do that--sometimes it works, most of the time it doesn't. We live in modern, digital age when a person is judged by first drafts and blogs. It's probably a mixed blessing.
So, anyway, even though I take my work seriously, I don't expect anyone else to. If there's anything more absurd than spending all of your time climbing up rocks, it's spending all of your time reading (or writing) about climbing up rocks.
Ok ... thanx again for the interesting feedback--I'm truly grateful for what has been written here. You can subscribe to the weekly eBlast by going here.
http://rockandice.com/tnbemail.php
I also would encourage everyone to subscribe to Rock and Ice magazine since the writing in the magazine is way better. Plus you get to look at all of the pretty pictures. I've also heard that a subscription to Rock and Ice actually makes you a better climber and may prevent cancer.
https://bigstonepub.com/rockandice/subscribe.php
Peace,
AB
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
this article is great it made me laugh.
its funny because its true.
get a sense of humor
this article is great it made me laugh.
its funny because its true.
get a sense of humor
In reply to andrewbisharat:
I thought it was hilarious and love the irreverence. No one likes to be taken the piss at, thats why you got so much stick, but laughing at yourself is good
I thought it was hilarious and love the irreverence. No one likes to be taken the piss at, thats why you got so much stick, but laughing at yourself is good
In reply to John2:
Nicely put, John! Perhaps you should be pitching for a writing gig somewhere too?
Still ... not sure I agree with your thesis. Jackson Pollock, anyone?
> He is like a child with a colouring book, wildly splashing the brightest colours in his paintbox about without bothering to ensure that he fills in each shape without encroaching into the shape next door.
Nicely put, John! Perhaps you should be pitching for a writing gig somewhere too?
Still ... not sure I agree with your thesis. Jackson Pollock, anyone?
In reply to tobyfk: I think the article just proves the point, yanks can't do irony!
In reply to tobyfk: Ah, Jackson Pollock. I'm a Pollock fan actually, though I'd prefer it if you didn't ask me to articulate the reasons why I like his paintings.
In reply to John2: Nothing like a fresh Lundy Pollock with chips and peas.
In reply to Al Evans:
Your comprehension of the words "think" and "irony" may be different to mine, Al ...
> (In reply to tobyfk) I think the article just proves the point, yanks can't do irony!
Your comprehension of the words "think" and "irony" may be different to mine, Al ...
In reply to tobyfk: I've been thinking about Jackson Pollock all morning as a result of this discussion. Have you ever looked seriously at a painting like this http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://z.about.com/d/gonyc/1/0/h/F... (in the flesh, not in reproduction)?
There are obvious repeated motifs that you can see even in this small scale reproduction, but the painting is actually a three dimensional object built up from a number of different layers, each fastidiously constructed from a repeated motif at a particular scale and carefully arranged in order not to obscure the layer below. The colours used harmonise with each other and in certain instances one can see from the colours used that Jackson had been looking recently at the work of another painter, for instance Matisse - the dissimilarites with Bisharat's writings are legion.
There are obvious repeated motifs that you can see even in this small scale reproduction, but the painting is actually a three dimensional object built up from a number of different layers, each fastidiously constructed from a repeated motif at a particular scale and carefully arranged in order not to obscure the layer below. The colours used harmonise with each other and in certain instances one can see from the colours used that Jackson had been looking recently at the work of another painter, for instance Matisse - the dissimilarites with Bisharat's writings are legion.
In reply to tobyfk:
Hmmmm! you might just be right there.
> (In reply to Al Evans)
> [...]
>
> Your comprehension of the words "think" and "irony" may be different to mine, Al ...
> [...]
>
> Your comprehension of the words "think" and "irony" may be different to mine, Al ...
Hmmmm! you might just be right there.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Lets hope he never gets to watch Fogles Extreme Dreams then!
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Genius! This is the best thing I've read in ages. Maybe a return to understatement and self-deprecation is worth a few fewer DVDs. Then again ...
Genius! This is the best thing I've read in ages. Maybe a return to understatement and self-deprecation is worth a few fewer DVDs. Then again ...
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I liked the article, very entertaining. Its good to see someone with an opinion who is prepared to express it fully.
I don't read much climbing literature but in terms of sport in general our media are generally far too scared they upset UK top sportsmen and women. Look at the BBC coverage of the Olympics - any runner messes up and its not to worry, you tried your best. If you want say-it-as-you-see-it insightful comments then its Michael Johnson you listen to. In tennis its John McEnroe. Is it the same in climbing - only 'outsiders' are prepared to criticise where it might actually be appropriate??
In true American style, I like the way he has to point out that he is taking the piss.. he should have smiley faces in place of canned laughter after all the funny comments
FOR ANY AMERICANS I AM JUST TAKING THE PISS ALSO. No offence.
I liked the article, very entertaining. Its good to see someone with an opinion who is prepared to express it fully.
I don't read much climbing literature but in terms of sport in general our media are generally far too scared they upset UK top sportsmen and women. Look at the BBC coverage of the Olympics - any runner messes up and its not to worry, you tried your best. If you want say-it-as-you-see-it insightful comments then its Michael Johnson you listen to. In tennis its John McEnroe. Is it the same in climbing - only 'outsiders' are prepared to criticise where it might actually be appropriate??
In true American style, I like the way he has to point out that he is taking the piss.. he should have smiley faces in place of canned laughter after all the funny comments
FOR ANY AMERICANS I AM JUST TAKING THE PISS ALSO. No offence.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
He's right, except for this fatal flaw: he doesn't WANT to understand a) E grades, b) E grades, or c) E grades.
He's right, except for this fatal flaw: he doesn't WANT to understand a) E grades, b) E grades, or c) E grades.
In reply to jhenryb:
I cant work out if this whole article is a joke or not(??!!) Firstly has anyone seen the amount of rubbish that goes into his mag these days? I'm sure there are penis enlrgement ads in there some place, standing firmly between the Creatine supliments and the fat strippers...(i'd rather have a slim one but each to their own).
..But then again what would i know as i have stopped buying ALL of the American climbing mags. Not because i have a racial hatred for our brothers from another mother across the pond (thats cool american ganster/climbing editor speak) but because i believe they are far too opinionated,combined with Jonny Bravo bravardo that ooses from every word...so much so its a turn off for me.
Last year a friend of mine started climbing and got her hands on some of your USA editorial delights and asked me "are all climbers D#cks?" My reply was obviously no and a swift swich from USA to UK meterial later and she's reading how to tye figure 8's, place gear, traerse like a pro and the great achievements across the globe.
The point i'm trying to make (badly) is this, dont overlook our UK material to get your afternoon coffe break kicks.
I cant work out if this whole article is a joke or not(??!!) Firstly has anyone seen the amount of rubbish that goes into his mag these days? I'm sure there are penis enlrgement ads in there some place, standing firmly between the Creatine supliments and the fat strippers...(i'd rather have a slim one but each to their own).
..But then again what would i know as i have stopped buying ALL of the American climbing mags. Not because i have a racial hatred for our brothers from another mother across the pond (thats cool american ganster/climbing editor speak) but because i believe they are far too opinionated,combined with Jonny Bravo bravardo that ooses from every word...so much so its a turn off for me.
Last year a friend of mine started climbing and got her hands on some of your USA editorial delights and asked me "are all climbers D#cks?" My reply was obviously no and a swift swich from USA to UK meterial later and she's reading how to tye figure 8's, place gear, traerse like a pro and the great achievements across the globe.
The point i'm trying to make (badly) is this, dont overlook our UK material to get your afternoon coffe break kicks.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
This is so LOL funny I think you should mark it as not work safe.
This is so LOL funny I think you should mark it as not work safe.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Cock.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: Master Bisharat. I'm sure the self important twit will be checking the forums after his little tirade. I like the British climbing scene. I like the great effort British climbers and film makers are going to so that we mere mortals can catch a glimpse of their, let's not down play it, extreme lives. I like the staying power they have in a highly competitive field. I like the rate of production of British climbing films, the complex but understandable E grading system. I like the passion these people have for what they are doing every day of their lives. It's not common to see it during the monotony of a nine to five. What I don't like is conceited journo's spouting controversial pap just to get a reaction. Which he's obviously done! If you don't like your job, Master Bisharat, give it up. I'm sure there's room on the grit for another top professional climber.
In reply to andrewbisharat:
Feckin nice one mate. These forums are sadly lacking humour these days.
Bill D
Feckin nice one mate. These forums are sadly lacking humour these days.
Bill D
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I thought the article was quite funny but no where near as some of the over defensive reactions its produced. I wonder if any of those who whinged about this piece are the same people who describe Americans as lacking in irony and not getting the British sense of humour (precious little of which is being demonstrated on here).
re. Dave Foster: Wow, where do you start with an over reaction like that?
I thought the article was quite funny but no where near as some of the over defensive reactions its produced. I wonder if any of those who whinged about this piece are the same people who describe Americans as lacking in irony and not getting the British sense of humour (precious little of which is being demonstrated on here).
re. Dave Foster: Wow, where do you start with an over reaction like that?
In reply to Tyler: I assumed Dave Foster's response was a bit of satire - it's almost as funny as the article itself!
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
Brilliant, very funny. Has captured the essence of many of the rants on the UKC pages. ie Baiting the gullible and taking the piss
Well done, keep it up
Brilliant, very funny. Has captured the essence of many of the rants on the UKC pages. ie Baiting the gullible and taking the piss
Well done, keep it up
In reply to YBW:
What also gives me hope is that this article is heavy on the text and low on images.
It has been viewed and commented on many times.
Who says people can't or aren't interested in reading and that many only pay attention to images and video?
But there again, some fail to comprehend Andrew's massive piss take, sarcasm and irony; that is a little worrying.
Mick
What also gives me hope is that this article is heavy on the text and low on images.
It has been viewed and commented on many times.
Who says people can't or aren't interested in reading and that many only pay attention to images and video?
But there again, some fail to comprehend Andrew's massive piss take, sarcasm and irony; that is a little worrying.
Mick
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:
I enjoyed this article of Andrew's and I'd be more than happy to try and explain the nuances of the E grade to him if he would return the favour and explain why Budweiser bills itself the King of Beers... Naturally, I'd insist that we both dress as giant owls for the debate.
I enjoyed this article of Andrew's and I'd be more than happy to try and explain the nuances of the E grade to him if he would return the favour and explain why Budweiser bills itself the King of Beers... Naturally, I'd insist that we both dress as giant owls for the debate.
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com: "some fail to comprehend Andrew's massive piss take, sarcasm and irony; that is a little worrying"......An American with sarcasm and irony?? Now i've seen it all!!
This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Elsewhere on the site
Loading Notifications...